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Eriamjh · Jun 16, 2005, 09:32 PM

Since OSX on Intel is the future, and OS9 booting hasn't been on a selling Mac since 2003 (eMacs I think, were last), who thinks that Apple should give OS9, OS8.5, OS8, and OS7.6 away?

They give away all previous OSes up to System 7.5.3. OS7.6.1 was the last to run on 68030 chips, OS8.1 was the last one to run on 68040s. Does anyone think there would be any harm in finally giving away these old OSes?

I can see them holding out on OS9 for a couple more years because of "Classic", but who are they kidding?

I don't use OS9 or even Classic on my DP800, but many people out there still cling to it like it is their lifeblood. Since they won't upgrade their Macs anyway, why not give it to them?

One more thing: Should Apple make OS9 open source? Why not?

dawho9 · Jun 16, 2005, 09:55 PM

I don't remember the details around this, but I know there is something for schools and having free access to legacy version of the OS.

I remember at one point in time (when we were at about 10.1 or so), that we were allowed to upgrade all of our Macs in our district to 8.6.x for free. It was really nice of them to allow this.

But yeah, either giving it away for free or even open sourcing it would be pretty cool. I don't see them ever doing either, but it would be cool.

dw9

leperkuhn · Jun 16, 2005, 10:41 PM

what is microsoft offered their own version of rosetta but for OS 9, by using the open sourced OS 9 files? i don't know if it's feasible though.

they won't do it if they stand to lose anything. and how would it benefit them? no, they'll continue to release software that, when worked on, improves their position.

TETENAL · Jun 16, 2005, 11:43 PM

Originally Posted by leperkuhn

what is microsoft offered their own version of rosetta but for OS 9, by using the open sourced OS 9 files?

He said "give away", not "open source". Apple gives away Mac OS up to System 7 and they didn't open source it one bit.

leperkuhn · Jun 17, 2005, 12:48 AM

actually, he did ask if they should open source it. read the last sentence.

wataru · Jun 17, 2005, 01:11 AM

I would like to see OS 8.1 given away for free. 9 still seems too recent though.

Meteo · Jun 17, 2005, 01:59 AM

All the classic systems are now downloadable for free from Apple.com
i can't find the link today but i saw it on apple download site.

analogika · Jun 17, 2005, 03:18 AM

Please search out that link, because Apple themselves only link to software up to 7.5.5.

http://www.info.apple.com/support/ol...twarelist.html

OptimusG4 · Jun 17, 2005, 08:04 AM

Yes please do because as of yesterday, calling AppleCare to purchase OS 9 is still $99, which was full price of OS 9 6 years ago.

Rainy Day · Jun 17, 2005, 01:20 PM

Open sourcing OS9 could only breathe new life into it, and Steve Jobs ain't gonna let that happen. He had a difficult enough time killing it in the first place.

(In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if the real reason for the to move to Intel is just to kill OS9 once and for all!

)

leperkuhn · Jun 18, 2005, 12:54 AM

yes. steve jobs draws a $1 salary for the sole purpose of eradicating os 9.

Eriamjh · Jun 18, 2005, 12:51 PM

Jobs did not kill OS9. It was already dead.

Detrius · Jun 18, 2005, 02:31 PM

7.6 is not free because it includes native support for TCP/IP. You need 7.6 to run a remotely recent web browser. This would bring new life into many people's old Macs. Why would Apple do this? These people need new Macs anyway. Why would Apple pay someone to care about System 7.6? or even 8.6?

Eriamjh · Jun 19, 2005, 08:19 AM

So you think Apple draws the line at 7.5.3 because 7.6 allows internet browsing easily?

leperkuhn · Jun 19, 2005, 10:54 AM

I think that apple sees zero benefit from open sourcing any of the old OSes. how would they benefit at all?

Agent69 · Jun 19, 2005, 10:59 AM

And they might have licensed things that will not allow open sourcing. But I do think that it wouldn't hurt to give it away for users of legacy machines.

Eriamjh · Jun 19, 2005, 04:05 PM

Agent69 hit the nail on the head. The USERS would benefit from giving away previous OSes. With OSX moving to Intel, and Classic being eliminated, there is no more technology worth holding back.

Sure, open source would be nice, but many users of legacy machines, especially people preserving older Macs, can benefit from obtaining previous OSes with little effort or expense.

CharlesS · Jun 19, 2005, 05:07 PM

Originally Posted by Detrius

7.6 is not free because it includes native support for TCP/IP. You need 7.6 to run a remotely recent web browser. This would bring new life into many people's old Macs. Why would Apple do this? These people need new Macs anyway. Why would Apple pay someone to care about System 7.6? or even 8.6?

Actually, Open Transport (which the classic OS used for TCP/IP support) was introduced in 7.5.x, not 7.6.1. In fact, 7.5.3 was the first release in which it worked well. And even before that, there was MacTCP, so this is not correct.

Most of the changes from 7.5.5 -> 7.6.1 were bug fixes. 7.6.1 had a slightly improved installer and a new Extensions Manager, and other than that it was basically stability improvements. Not that better stability was unwelcome; 7.5.x was absolutely horrible in terms of bugginess, and that's the reason I wish Apple would make 7.6.1 free.

Rainy Day · Jul 2, 2005, 12:21 PM

Originally Posted by Eriamjh

Jobs did not kill OS9. It was already dead.

Perhaps, but it wasn't dead enough for Jobs; he wanted to kill it some more. Even today, there are people who still cling to it, resisting the siren's call of MacOS X. It's The Nightmare in Cupertino, don't you know?

Graymalkin · Jul 3, 2005, 06:15 AM

According to the WWDC numbers only about 10% of Mac users (25-30m?) are running MacOS 9 or earlier. That is ten percent of the existing user base that I'm pretty sure Apple would like to get into new Macs. Say a longtime Mac developer had a relatively successful app that they were spending a lot of money to port to Carbon and eventually refactor for Cocoa. Ten percent of Mac users (their potential customers) can go ahead and keep using non-X versions of the OS for free. That also means they can use old version 6 of said Mac app instead of the new and much improved (OSX native) 7 or 8. That's not a good way to increase WWDC attendance in the future.

kcmac · Jul 3, 2005, 10:34 AM

I can't imagine using 9, much less anything older.

Anyone know what percentage of us Mac users are still using the older systems?

I don't see the point in giving them away. Just encourages some to never change. Don't see any scenario that this could be good for Apple.

NeilCharter · Jul 3, 2005, 11:15 AM

If you need legacy software like that, http://tracker.torrentskickass.com/index.php is probably the best way to go.

Of course it is not legal to download files like that, but if for some reason someone gave you a old mac that didn't come with the original software, it is probably the easiest way to get it.

analogika · Jul 3, 2005, 12:57 PM

Originally Posted by kcmac

I can't imagine using 9, much less anything older.

Anyone know what percentage of us Mac users are still using the older systems?

Yes. one post up from yours.

Superchicken · Jul 3, 2005, 01:46 PM

You actually bought OS 9? How do you not have a copy lying around? You should be able to even just drag over the System folder from any OS X Mac.

Link · Jul 3, 2005, 08:46 PM

hehe. I have OS 9, 8, and 7.6 on CD

timmerk · Jul 4, 2005, 04:38 PM

poop.

Eriamjh · Jul 4, 2005, 08:36 PM

Originally Posted by timmerk

poop.

Good answer. Now, if we only know what you were talking about...

olePigeon · Jul 5, 2005, 02:30 PM

I still have my 8.0 and 8.5 retail boxes. I used to have System 7, but I lost one of the disks so it was useless. I wanna get another one.

mportuesi · Jul 5, 2005, 02:49 PM

Why do you want OS 9 in the first place?

Last summer, while tracking down some web-design bugs for a job I was doing, I rebooted a development Mac (Blue/white G3) into OS 9. What a horrible experience. Compared to OS X, it was dated and grim. Apple has made huge strides with OS X. If they had stuck with OS 9, I'm not sure there would be a Mac today.

Luca Rescigno · Jul 5, 2005, 03:08 PM

I've successfully browsed the internet in System 7.1 on an LC III with a PDS ethernet card using the TCP/IP extensions copied over from a 7.5.x installation.

Perhaps the reason Apple doesn't want to make the newer OSes available is because it would require a lot more hosting space. By limiting it to 7.5.3, Apple reduces the amount of space taken up to a minimum, and also keeps demand extremely low. If you could download 8.6, not only would that take up more space than systems 6-7.5.3 combined, but way more people would download it as well.

I'd like it though. It would be nice to not have to fish around for old system software whenever I get encounter an older Mac.

mitchell_pgh · Jul 5, 2005, 04:24 PM

No, they shouldn't open source it. There is no good reason to do so.

Give OS 9 away... sure. It only runs on old computers.

mitchell_pgh · Jul 5, 2005, 04:26 PM

Originally Posted by mportuesi

Why do you want OS 9 in the first place?

Last summer, while tracking down some web-design bugs for a job I was doing, I rebooted a development Mac (Blue/white G3) into OS 9. What a horrible experience. Compared to OS X, it was dated and grim. Apple has made huge strides with OS X. If they had stuck with OS 9, I'm not sure there would be a Mac today.

No kidding. I was a big fan of OS 9 until around 10.2, that's when it surpassed OS 9 in just about every area for me.

Person Man · Jul 6, 2005, 03:14 PM

Originally Posted by Link

hehe. I have OS 9, 8, and 7.6 on CD

I have 7.1, 7.5, 7.5.3, 7.6, 8.0, 8.1, 8.5, 9.0, 9.1, and 9.2.1 on CD

mitchell_pgh · Jul 6, 2005, 03:27 PM

I have panther and tiger on CD/DVD. I pitch everythign else.

Person Man · Jul 6, 2005, 05:29 PM

Originally Posted by mitchell_pgh

I have panther and tiger on CD/DVD. I pitch everythign else.

I don't. You never know when someone comes across an old Mac and needs help getting it running. I get that a lot.

I even have 10.0, 10.1, 10.2, 10.3, and 10.4 disks, too. Not to mention Rhapsody Developer Previews 1 and 2. I never renewed my Select Developer Membership so I never got Mac OS DP3 or DP4.

I believe you could get 7.5 on High Density floppy disks... 40 of them to be exact. I wonder how many floppies Tiger would need?

Eriamjh · Jul 6, 2005, 07:21 PM

I have many of the old OSes, but I think Apple should release them for those who don't.

greenG4 · Jul 8, 2005, 01:42 PM

Originally Posted by kcmac

I can't imagine using 9, much less anything older.

Anyone know what percentage of us Mac users are still using the older systems?

I don't see the point in giving them away. Just encourages some to never change. Don't see any scenario that this could be good for Apple.

I ended up putting 9 back on my powerbook 400. OS X just seemed to bogg it down. The poor thing. 10.4 on my new iMac G5, though!

greenG4 · Jul 8, 2005, 01:43 PM

Originally Posted by kcmac

I can't imagine using 9, much less anything older.

Anyone know what percentage of us Mac users are still using the older systems?

I don't see the point in giving them away. Just encourages some to never change. Don't see any scenario that this could be good for Apple.

I finally had to put 9 back on my PowerBook G3/400. The poor thing...OS X just bogged it down. 10.4 on my new iMac G5 though!