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Bill Gates inspires me more than Steve Jobs
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The Godfather
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Apr 15, 2012, 03:13 PM
 
Bill Gates on energy: Innovating to zero! - YouTube
Mosquitoes Released by Bill Gates @TED - YouTube

Surely both guys are inspiring in their own ways, just like one can appreciate the virtues of cats vs dogs, but Bill has been doing these amazing work and getting little credit, a true, ongoing, un-selfish humanitarian deed, after leaving the keys to the kingdom to the less inspiring #2.

Not a Jobs bashing in any way. Just giving credit to the man Bill (despite the inferior OS).
( Last edited by The Godfather; Apr 15, 2012 at 03:31 PM. )
     
Waragainstsleep
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Apr 15, 2012, 06:45 PM
 
I don't have time to watch those, did they release those GM mosquitos that will self eradicate or are these new ones that just don't carry Malaria?
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
PB2K
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Apr 15, 2012, 08:02 PM
 
I agree totally, Jobs killed all philanthropic projects at Apple after his return. It's an awfully corporate organization ever since.

Gates, on the other hand, has shown his best after gaining incredible richness. i truly admire him !
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Apr 15, 2012, 10:38 PM
 
Jobs was a better businessman, Gates is a better person. No big surprise there. I wonder if Steve will pull a Marley on Cook in 9 years.
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Apr 15, 2012, 11:01 PM
 
Woz should play The Ghost of Christmas Present.
     
Camali
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Apr 16, 2012, 12:09 AM
 
steve jobs is gone... you'd have to wonder if he was around to retire if he'd be just as philanthropic as bill gates. no one will ever know.
     
FireWire
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Apr 16, 2012, 02:19 AM
 
Bill Gates a better person? People seem to forget how he was before he retired.. The way he practically "stole" DOS, the way he ripped the company he bought IE from "sure you'll get royalties.. we only forgot to tell you we were giving it for free, thus you get nothing!", the whole "either you join us or I'll employ hundreds of programmers to destroy your company" attitude.. The whole antitrust case. etc etc etc.

It's easy to donate money you acquired while being a villain... it doesn't erase what you did!
     
Lateralus
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Apr 16, 2012, 02:44 AM
 
Eh... I think 21st century Apple has been more villainous than Gates' Microsoft ever was. They've just gone under the radar until recently because they weren't omni-dominant.
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Shaddim
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Apr 16, 2012, 05:35 AM
 
Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
Eh... I think 21st century Apple has been more villainous than Gates' Microsoft ever was. They've just gone under the radar until recently because they weren't omni-dominant.
This. Also, I can't see Steve being the full-time philanthropist, he didn't have the heart or conscience for it. Not to say that he was "evil", just driven to complete obsession.
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Waragainstsleep
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Apr 16, 2012, 12:33 PM
 
Apple have been ruthless in business in the 21st centruy but they haven't resorted to the sort depths M$ did.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
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Apr 18, 2012, 03:49 AM
 
Was a great presentation.
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Spheric Harlot
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Apr 18, 2012, 05:08 AM
 
Originally Posted by Camali View Post
steve jobs is gone... you'd have to wonder if he was around to retire if he'd be just as philanthropic as bill gates. no one will ever know.
We also have no idea what he did while he was still alive.
     
Atheist
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Apr 18, 2012, 07:57 AM
 
Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot View Post
We also have no idea what he did while he was still alive.
We do know what was mentioned in his biography (no significant mention of any charitable activity) and I can't think of any reason why Jobs would hide his charity if it existed. He was completely uninterested in his wife's charity work. I suspect it wasn't very high on his list of priorities. He was most concerned about his legacy in building Apple (and "amazing" products).

Who knows, maybe his wife will announce some major personal donations and claim it was all Steve's idea before he died. She stuck around his crazy ass a long time, she may want to build him up as a way to justify her commitment.
     
SierraDragon
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Apr 18, 2012, 02:50 PM
 
Originally Posted by FireWire View Post
Bill Gates a better person? People seem to forget how he was before he retired.

It's easy to donate money you acquired while being a villain... it doesn't erase what you did!
Exactly (emphasis mine). Gates was just a mean, entitled dealmaker, almost zero innovation. His unethical and often illegal dominance held back many real innovators. For a long while every real innovator with a tech idea was in constant fear of what MS would do: Steal it? Buy it for half value? Kill it with back-room deals that cut off potential buyers/partners/investors/etc.? Kill off your biz by bundling a competing app "free" with the DOS that Gates bought and IBM made dominant?

Bill Gates was a very, very unethical guy. There is a reason MS lost all the way to including the Supreme Court and the EEU. Then of course after $$$ contributions the Bush administration essentially let MS off. Bill Gates business as usual.

MS is dying not because Gates left but because the Gates Model of dominate/deal/steal/abuse no longer works for MS, because the US and EEU investigations brought his unethical and/or illegal practices out in the open, and the business practices of Bill Gates do poorly in the daylight.
( Last edited by SierraDragon; Apr 18, 2012 at 03:18 PM. )
     
Eug
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Apr 18, 2012, 03:08 PM
 
That's bull. Gates and MS were huge innovators, but they also kept things going by taking other people's ideas on many occasions too. Much like Apple has done several times over.

Apple has arguably innovated more, but that's a different argument.

---

Meanwhile...

Video: Bill Gates to become comic book hero - The Globe and Mail
     
SierraDragon
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Apr 18, 2012, 05:05 PM
 
I was not talking about simply using others' ideas. The Gates business model was about using back-room deals, money and market dominance to stifle or buy out the innovative efforts of smaller firms.
     
lpkmckenna
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Apr 18, 2012, 05:15 PM
 
Gates abandoned the business world for the charity world because he had nothing left to contribute. He spent his last years at Microsoft wallowing in complete failure: tablets, WinCE phones, smothered in malware, etc.

Giving away your billions doesn't require any skill. I respect his philanthropy, but the fact is, business requires actual skills, but charity is just a choice anyone could make.
     
lpkmckenna
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Apr 18, 2012, 05:17 PM
 
Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
Eh... I think 21st century Apple has been more villainous than Gates' Microsoft ever was.
You should start a thread on that. I wold love to hear you someone try to support that.
     
Waragainstsleep
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Apr 18, 2012, 05:31 PM
 
Originally Posted by SierraDragon View Post
I was not talking about simply using others' ideas. The Gates business model was about using back-room deals, money and market dominance to stifle or buy out the innovative efforts of smaller firms.
And lets not forget that BG got where he did because he was in the right place at the right time and other people (namely IBM, Sculley and arguably Xerox Parc) made some very poor decisions, not because he was especially brilliant.

You might argue that Jobs got a similar break off the back of Woz and his engineering talents but I think business-wise its obvious which of the two was more easily replaceable. Has been for decades now.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
Eug
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Apr 18, 2012, 05:56 PM
 
Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep View Post
And lets not forget that BG got where he did because he was in the right place at the right time and other people (namely IBM, Sculley and arguably Xerox Parc) made some very poor decisions, not because he was especially brilliant.
That's a very poor argument.

It's extremely rare that someone just lucks into this and develops it in to a multi-billion dollar company. In fact, one might argue it has never happened. Gates was in the right place at the right time, AND he was brilliant. He understood the engineering issues around all of this, but saw way past it and how it would change the world. He had no understanding of aesthetics, but luckily for him, at the time that was not necessary.

You might argue that Jobs got a similar break off the back of Woz and his engineering talents but I think business-wise its obvious which of the two was more easily replaceable. Has been for decades now.
Without Jobs, Apple wouldn't exist. However, without Woz, Apple wouldn't exist. Basically all of Apple's early successes were due to Woz's engineering genius.

P.S. I've known people who used to work up in the upper echelons of MS, grunt MS coders, and MS team leaders. They said that Gates knew exactly what he was doing. He could cut through all the bull in seconds, to point the company managers etc. in the right direction.
     
Lateralus
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Apr 18, 2012, 08:25 PM
 
Originally Posted by lpkmckenna View Post
You should start a thread on that. I wold love to hear you someone try to support that.
Nah, I'm cool. The fervor around here is a bit too strong for a well informed, level headed discussion/confession/confrontation session.
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Apr 19, 2012, 07:06 AM
 
Once you have an insane amount of money, donating it to charity is a very noble act. But I don't see how that is "inspiring". I see it as easy. Not having a lot of money and donating your time and effort to charity is inspiring to me.

As for how Gates and Jobs got to their insane amount of money, I find Jobs to be much more inspiring.

So for me Gates may well be the more noble person of the two, but Jobs is the more inspiring to me.
     
The Godfather  (op)
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Apr 19, 2012, 09:40 AM
 
Sir Bill Gates, Knight, to you, sir.

There's charity that makes you dependent like free money and food*, and there's charity that makes you stronger and more independent, like schools (Oprah), health and energy (Bill).

However, there's also the positive market effect that Jobs created in the App system. Thousands employed all over the globe, people who could have gotten a less creative job.
     
   
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