[fizzlemynizzle]

Mmmmm, now where have I seen that before? Oh, yes, when the Afghan mujahedin was busy shooting Soviet aircraft out of the sky with American Stinger missiles, they were brave freedom fighters, and when they were flying aircraft into American buildings they were cowardly terrorists.

not a very equivalent act - mujahadeen vs. armed russian military compared to terrorists vs. a bunch of people on airplanes and sitting in office buildings.

you'd have done better if you'd equated the mujahadeen's bombing of apartment buildings in moscow during the russian occupation of afghanistan to sept 11.

[voodoo]

I am constantly amused how the USAsians OVERESTIMATED the USSR

Why the CIA wasn't dissolved after the truth came out is beyond me.

Back in the 80s the USSR was liberating Afghanistan much like the USA liberated Iraq last year.

At least you could have cleaned the mess up when you left Afghanistan.

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally posted by voodoo:
I am constantly amused how the USAsians OVERESTIMATED the USSR

Why the CIA wasn't dissolved after the truth came out is beyond me.

Back in the 80s the USSR was liberating Afghanistan much like the USA liberated Iraq last year.

At least you could have cleaned the mess up when you left Afghanistan.

Why should they?

They have us to clean up for them.

And as for well-placed bombs - yes, we all ran, tail between legs, when a busful of German soldiers was blown up.

You will find that support of the invasion of Afghanistan was pretty much unanimous the world over.

Afghanistan - Iraq: two different countries, two different wars, two different situations.

Comprende?

-s*

[roger_ramjet]

Shame on Spain

By EDWARD LUTTWAK
From Tuesday's Globe and Mail

POSTED AT 12:57 AM EST
Tuesday, Mar. 16, 2004

It must be said: Spanish voters have allowed a small band of terrorists to dictate the outcome of their national elections. It is a shameful downfall, and very surprising: That is not how democracies react when they are attacked by fanatics. Americans were visibly united and hardened by Sept. 11; the Italians overcame deep political differences in their determination to crush the Red Brigades; Israeli cohesion has only been increased by decades of terrorism. That is the normal reaction of democratic political communities based on respect for the will of many when they are threatened by the violent few.

That is not what happened in Spain. Before the Madrid bombs, all the polls forecast a victory for Mariano Rajoy of the Popular Party, for the very good reason that he was the chosen successor of Prime Minister Jose Maria Aznar, who has led Spain on the path of modernization and prosperity, with almost universally acknowledged success.

Three days before the elections, Mr. Rajoy seemed to be headed for victory over Socialist Jose Luis Rodriguez Zapatero, whom not even his mother would describe as a charismatic leader, and who certainly lacks a plausible economic policy.

What he does have is a foreign policy: to withdraw the 1,300 Spanish troops from Iraq, not merely to avoid more casualties, but to affirm that the Iraq war was an act of imperialist aggression that Spain should never have supported.

Mr. Zapatero is hardly alone in thinking that. On March 20, anti-war rallies are scheduled all over Western Europe. As the marchers deplore the war, which the Pope also condemned, they have one consolation: Saddam Hussein is alive and in good health, so that no irreparable damage has been done. He could still be restored to power, to resume ruling Iraq just as he did before, with mass graves and torture chambers. Even those who view the Iraq war as a strategic error for the United States, as I do, cannot take seriously the Zapateros of Europe, who seem bent on validating the crudest caricatures of "old European" cowardly decadence...

[voodoo]

Originally posted by Spheric Harlot:
Why should they?

They have us to clean up for them.

And as for well-placed bombs - yes, we all ran, tail between legs, when a busful of German soldiers was blown up.

You will find that support of the invasion of Afghanistan was pretty much unanimous the world over.

Afghanistan - Iraq: two different countries, two different wars, two different situations.

Comprende?

-s*

I was talking about the 80s but ok.

[roger_ramjet]

Originally posted by Spheric Harlot:
... Afghanistan - Iraq: two different countries, two different wars, two different situations.

Comprende?

Comprende? 200 dead in Madrid and you are STILL making your silly distinctions. Al Qaeda doesn't see a difference, do they?

[theolein]

Originally posted by roger_ramjet:
You honestly don't know the difference between those two actions, do you? And, btw, the people who flew those planes into our buildings weren't Afghani.

Actually, I do know the difference between those two actions, and I'm also surprised that an American is capable of realising that the 9/11 attackers were not Afghan (or Iraqi for that matter).

The reason I posted that is because I thought that if you're posting some bullsh1t soundbytes on events in Spain, then I may as well post some bullsh1t soundbytes on events that concern America.

What YOU don't realise is that you are nicely in the process of making yet another international opponent, as if you don't have enough already. Nice going.

So when are you going to invade and bomb Spain?

[ghost_flash]

Originally posted by theolein:


So when are you going to invade and bomb Spain?

Why should the USA have anything to do with Spain now? They are not supporting us in Iraq and have pulled their troops. They made their bed, let them lay in it. The terrorists have influenced their election. Spain just commited national suicide.

Just like France.

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally posted by roger_ramjet:
Comprende? 200 dead in Madrid and you are STILL making your silly distinctions. Al Qaeda doesn't see a difference, do they?

Yes, I'm sorry - you're right.

Al Qaeda no longer distinguishes between Iraq and Afghanistan.

Your stupid invasion saw to that.

-s*

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally posted by ghost_flash:
Why should the USA have anything to do with Spain now? They are not supporting us in Iraq and have pulled their troops.

THEY HAVE!?

What's it like in the future?

any terrorists around? Who won the election?

(you apparently missed that they're actually STAYING if under the UN umbrella - which for some strange reason, the USA is suddenly pushing as well, as of today)

Originally posted by ghost_flash:
Spain just commited national suicide.

Just like France.

Just like you just committed credibility suicide.

It's okay, though, in a couple of hundred years, *maybe* you'll have grasped the basic tenets of democracy.

Maybe.

-s*

[Wiskedjak]

Originally posted by ghost_flash:
Why should the USA have anything to do with Spain now?

Apparently Spain is now a terrorist nation (since many proclaim that terrorist won the election). Perhaps Spain needs to be "liberated"

[fizzlemynizzle]

Originally posted by Wiskedjak:
Apparently Spain is now a terrorist nation (since many proclaim that terrorist won the election). Perhaps Spain needs to be "liberated"

Nobody has said anything of the sort, the socialist party in spain had nothing to do with the attacks. their election was legitimate and fair.

what -was- bad about what happened is the popular part went from having a significant majority in the polls to a complete upset in 4 days because of fear over more terrorism. the voters let themselves be influenced by fear and voted in a kneejerk manner in order to appeal for the bombings to stop. that encourages more terror because those who would use it to get what they want now believe it's effective.

[theolein]

Originally posted by ghost_flash:
Why should the USA have anything to do with Spain now? They are not supporting us in Iraq and have pulled their troops. They made their bed, let them lay in it. The terrorists have influenced their election. Spain just commited national suicide.

Just like France.

National suicide???? Wow! Pulled their troops???? Wow! Not only have you visions of the future, since Spain has not yet pulled anything, except for their unqualified support for the US, but you are also now predicting the death of nations.

So that is how it works over there. I always wondered how your country managed to make so many enemies. First you call them cowards, then you say they are commiting national sucide, then you accuse them of being a nation of national suicide bombers and then suddenly they're terrorists. Voila, and you have a new enemy. Cool.

So, again, when are you going to bomb them, or will it be France first?

[roger_ramjet]

Originally posted by theolein:
... The reason I posted that is because I thought that if you're posting some bullsh1t soundbytes on events in Spain, then I may as well post some bullsh1t soundbytes on events that concern America...

At least this time you're half right. You're making progress!

[roger_ramjet]

Originally posted by Spheric Harlot:
Yes, I'm sorry - you're right.

Al Qaeda no longer distinguishes between Iraq and Afghanistan.

Your stupid invasion saw to that.

That's right. Everything is our fault.

[dcolton]

Originally posted by theolein:
So, again, when are you going to bomb them, or will it be France first?

I vote for France!

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally posted by roger_ramjet:
That's right. Everything is our fault.

I don't recall saying that.

Ever.

I do partly blame you for David Hasselhoff, though, whom I was shocked to see singing "Love Me Tender" on the "Elvis Mania" show just now. The vocal track oozed pitch correction, but that doesn't surprise.

I realize that Germany shares the blame for that one.

-s*

[fizzlemynizzle]

So that is how it works over there. I always wondered how your country managed to make so many enemies. First you call them cowards, then you say they are commiting national sucide, then you accuse them of being a nation of national suicide bombers and then suddenly they're terrorists. Voila, and you have a new enemy. Cool.

Definitely. It's definitely because of what people say on Internet message boards and not a complex set of economic, cultural, military and political factors.

[itai195]

Originally posted by ghost_flash:
Why should the USA have anything to do with Spain now? They are not supporting us in Iraq and have pulled their troops. They made their bed, let them lay in it. The terrorists have influenced their election. Spain just commited national suicide.

Just like France.

I'm tempted to, but they'd probably want to lie in it instead, like educated people.

This thread is headed downhill anyway

[ghost_flash]

Originally posted by itai195:
I'm tempted to, but they'd probably want to lie in it instead, like educated people.

This thread is headed downhill anyway

They do "lie" don't they?

You can take the hook out of your mouth now. (Educated) lol. You funny.
Sucker.

I kid.

[itai195]

Originally posted by ghost_flash:
They do "lie" don't they?

You can take the hook out of your mouth now. (Educated) lol. You funny.
Sucker.

I kid.

I can't tell if you understood my grammar nazi impression or not, so I'm going to just smile and nod

[swrate]

Originally posted by itai195:
I'm tempted to, but they'd probably want to lie in it instead, like educated people.

This thread is headed downhill anyway

talking about manipulation.....
quitting here

[Developer]

Originally posted by Spheric Harlot:
I do partly blame you for David Hasselhoff, though, whom I was shocked to see singing "Love Me Tender" on the "Elvis Mania" show just now. The vocal track oozed pitch correction, but that doesn't surprise.

Don't talk bad about David Hasselhoff, the man that brought us reunification. The man is a hero in Germany!

[kvm_mkdb]

Originally posted by Developer:
Don't talk bad about David Hasselhoff, the man that brought us reunification. The man is a hero in Germany!

[theolein]

Originally posted by dcolton:
I vote for France!

So tell me, how do you like your nuclear explosions at the breakfast table? Sunny side up or scrambled?

Hint: just in case you didn't understand that, of which there is a definite possibility, I was referring to the fact that France has nuclear weapons, and quite a few of them as well. That is one of the reasons you won't be seeing US air force planes over France any time soon, no matter how much George dislikes Jaques. It's also the reason you won't be seeing US planes above North Korea any time soon. Unlike Iraq, of course.

[benb]

Originally posted by Troll:
Theolein didn't say they were. Read what he said carefully.

Originally posted by Theolin:
Oh, yes, when the Afghan mujahedin was busy shooting Soviet aircraft out of the sky with American Stinger missiles, they were brave freedom fighters, and when they were flying aircraft into American buildings they were cowardly terrorists.

[theolein]

Originally posted by benb:
Oh, yes, when the Afghan mujahedin was busy shooting Soviet aircraft out of the sky with American Stinger missiles, they were brave freedom fighters, and when they were flying aircraft into American buildings they were cowardly terrorists.

*Cough* Quoted from the BBC:

Born in Saudi Arabia to a Yemeni family, Bin Laden left Saudi Arabia in 1979 to fight against the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan.

The Afghan jihad was backed with American dollars and had the blessing of the governments of Saudi Arabia and Pakistan.

He received security training from the CIA itself, according to Middle Eastern analyst Hazhir Teimourian.

While in Afghanistan, he founded the Maktab al-Khidimat (MAK), which recruited fighters from around the world and imported equipment to aid the Afghan resistance against the Soviet army.

Egyptians, Lebanese, Turks and others - numbering thousands in Bin Laden's estimate - joined their Afghan Muslim brothers in the struggle against an ideology that spurned religion.

After the Soviet withdrawal, the "Arab Afghans", as Bin Laden's faction came to be called, turned their fire against the US and its allies in the Middle East.

My original post actually had nothing to with that. It was an allegory to point out that that todays friends can be tomorrows enemies and vice versa and that renaming friends to be enemies seems to be a favourite pasttime in the US.