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ryter221 · Aug 8, 2006, 09:16 PM

Hi, I'm really just looking for some advice from the pros.

I'm entering 10th grade this year at a Science and Tech high school. Over the past year, I've found that having a laptop is incredibly helpful for almost everything. I was planning to buy either a Macbook or a Macbook Pro after WWDC, just in case, but I've reconsidered.

Considering the rate of new computers coming out, would it be safer, and more worth it, to purchase a refurbished iBook G3 with 800MHz, 640MB of memory and an Airport card for $550? It's almost twice as less, and all I'd be using the computer for is listening to music, word processing, web surfing, and IMing.

Would the slowness of the machine get to me, or would it be fine for the tasks I'd be doing? I have an 2.0 GHz iMac G5 with 512MB that sometimes can seem slow to me.

I figure this way, I can have a laptop now without having it be replaced tomorrow, and save up for the next few years for a brand new Macbook Pro (or whatever they'll be calling it) to get before I go to college.

Thanks!

mduell · Aug 8, 2006, 09:48 PM

"It's almost twice as less"

How about a $500 iBook and a $50 English grammar book?

Seriously though, I suggest a $500 used G4 iBook. The G3 just feels so decrepit these days.

imitchellg5 · Aug 8, 2006, 10:00 PM

$550 for a G3 iBook sounds a bit high. I am sure that you could find a G4 iBook 800MHz at least for $500. An iBook G4 would be a more stable machine than the G3.

Tuoder · Aug 8, 2006, 10:18 PM

I see two red flags.

1.iBook G3s have logicboard issues.
2.iMac G5 seems slow sometimes.

I regularly use a Powerbook G3-333Mhz with 192MB of RAM. It works just fine for the same application that you will be using.

ghporter · Aug 9, 2006, 11:46 AM

G4 iBook, all the way. They're still fairly well supported (my wife's 800MHz G4 iBook is going strong and works for all the technical things she needs it for as well as being a great surfer), and there are a ton of them out there. While a G3 iBook may "work just fine," you'd be getting a computer on its last legs (even if it lasted for years), while a G4 machine is still "in its prime" and will be for several years.

imitchellg5 · Aug 9, 2006, 05:40 PM

The iBook G4 800MHz seems like a beast even now. Right now I am on an iBook G4 800MHz with 640Mb of RAM and it is very quick, way faster then my PowerBook G4 867. The iMac G5s are fast if you upgrade the RAM!

imitchellg5 · Aug 9, 2006, 05:51 PM

Oh by the way, that iBook that I am using has 10.4.7 Tiger running on it very smoothly.

amazing · Aug 9, 2006, 06:37 PM

Techrestore.com has a 12" iBook G4/800/Combo for $580, with a 3-month warranty, meaning that the G3 iBook is overpriced.

http://techrestore.com/xcart/product...cat=254&page=1

You'd be better off with the MB. Amazon.com has $100 rebate, and Apple has refurb MBs...

ryter221 · Aug 9, 2006, 09:03 PM

OK, OK, so me being the stupid kid I am, didn't realize how cheap iBooks G4s were, mostly because Apple still sells them for a (now I see) ridiculous $949.

So now my question is: Macbook or iBook G4? I'd really prefer to spend $500-650 on the iBook leaving money for RAM and a (hopefully being updated soon) iSight stand-alone camera which I could use with both the iBook and my non-iSight iMac.

Is that a better decision, or should I spring for the Macbook (which my parents want me to buy) with the (fun, but not necessary) built-iSight and (easily downloadable to put on other Macs) Front Row with Apple Remote (I have the Griffin AirClick for PCs)?

By the way, it's my savings account being drained, not my parents' (which is why they want me to go for the more expensive model).

mBurns · Aug 9, 2006, 09:33 PM

ryter,

If it makes you feel any better I'm a student also who was in a similiar type situation as you. I was contemplating buying an iBook G3 for $299 (I can give you link to a place that is selling one with an airport card for that price) because the computer industry is changing so quickly. After thinking about it for a little bit and talking to my parents, I decided the G3 wasn't good enough for todays standards. I then thought about buying an iBook G4 but decided that if I'm going to spend $550+, it's not worth investing in old technology that is quickly (excluding G5s) taking more and more of a backseat. I ended up buying a MacBook Pro because I needed something that will last a long time (many years) and because I don't want to keep upgrading. I ended up selling my other Mac to my mom and putting that money towards the MacBook Pro. Before I bought the MacBook Pro I thought about buying a black MacBook but decided that it wasn't worth the extra money since the base model was so much cheaper and it didn't have a dedicated graphics card. I ended up with the MBP because I need something to last me a long time, be reliable (Both MacBooks are), be able to do graphic stuff (getting more into it), and be able to be somewhat quick for years to come (needed better graphics card). Plus, I preferred not to have a glossy display since I may have to bring my MacBook Pro around with me in lighted areas and because I thoght a 13" screen would be a pain in the arse to write anything major on without hurting my eyes and becoming frusturated. Although the price point was much more for the MacBook Pro I ended up getting (see description), I don't regret it one bit and think it was the right decision for me after looking at what I wanted to do, etc. I hope this helps you and if you have any questions about either machines, feel free to PM me or post a message here since I spent COUNTLESS hours in the Apple store talking to mac geniuses and sales people, playing around with all the different machines, and surfing apple discussions and the macnn forum.

Best of luck with whatever you decide to go with. You seem like you are smart and will be able to make the right decision for your needs!

ryter221 · Aug 9, 2006, 10:10 PM

See, the thing is, no matter what I decide now, I'm still going to be either receiving as a gift or buying myself a new, as top-of-the-line as possible, laptop in 3 years.
(Thanks, by the way, everyone, for all your help thus far!)

brassplayersrock² · Aug 9, 2006, 10:21 PM

ryter221, is your moms name cody by chance?

mBurns · Aug 9, 2006, 11:39 PM

If you don't want to buy a machine in 3 years, go with the low end MacBook Pro if you want to have a somewhat fast computer. I would not invest big money in a G4 and I don't think a G3 is going to last you 3 years. You could always stick with your G5 iMac or buy a fancy G5 tower off someone for cheap who is looking to buy a Mac Pro or who has just bought a Mac Pro. Or, you could always go with the MacBook and get the medium range one which will last you 3 years but don't think it will be super fast, especially with how quick the chips in Macs are changing these days.

I should also ask before I keep ranting... what are you planning on doing with the machine? What do you see yourself doing with the machine down the road? Those are key questions that you should answer. If you can answer those for me, I may be able to point you in a good direction!

amazing · Aug 10, 2006, 01:10 AM

Originally Posted by ryter221

See, the thing is, no matter what I decide now, I'm still going to be either receiving as a gift or buying myself a new, as top-of-the-line as possible, laptop in 3 years.
(Thanks, by the way, everyone, for all your help thus far!)

So, here's a thought: you don't need the laptop right away (summertime), but it'll be real handy in the fall. Hold off as long as you can, perhaps the 2nd revision of the MB will come out. If you can wait at the very most until the San Francisco MacWorld next January, you'll have done one more semester with the iMac--but you'll end up with hopefully a more trouble-free revision of the MB. And maybe the MB will come with a choice of a matte screen by then.

Either there'll be some better used laptop deals out there, or there'll be a revision of Apple's laptops.

In any case, if you can't wait, go for the MB--it's sufficient for the computing needs you have listed (and you didn't list gaming...where the MB isn't great.) You'll be able to sell it once you're off to college. At that point, you'll qualify for educational pricing, and it'll undoubtedly come with a free iPod, like Apple's current college promotions.

mBurns · Aug 10, 2006, 12:34 PM

Amazing,

If he decides he wants to game on his laptop, he is going to be stuck. Plus, if he brings his laptop around with him and is typing papers, the glossy screen WILL get annoying. I just feel for typing long papers if your not using an extended desktop, will become a much more daunting task because of the screen. Do you think I'm wrong in my assumption amazing? I'm a student also and I'm just thinking about the reasons I bought the MacBook Pro over the MacBook/iBook.

mduell · Aug 10, 2006, 12:54 PM

The glossy screen is actually quite good... much more readable outdoors than Apple's dim matte screens.

amazing · Aug 10, 2006, 12:56 PM

Well, I'm personally waiting for the MB to come out with the option of choosing a matte screen. There's no way I'd be happy with a glossy screen...but I do think that younger eyes may have less of a problem with that than older eyes. I've had a Titanium (great screen) and now a 12" (screen not so great, but the lighter weight is wonderful!) I'm content with my 12" until matte screens come to the MB (or until a lighter laptop comes out.) The one feature I love in the MB is how easy it is to put in a larger HD--user serviceable, vs not in the MBP. My 60 GB in the 12" is too small...so I've got an external firewire 120 GB case that's the size of a pack of cards...

If he gets into gaming down the road, he can always sell his MB and get what he needs for gaming. Any future model will be better than any current present MBP (first generation's not trouble-free enough for me...)

But if your eyes don't tolerate glossy (eye fatigue etc) then that requirement trumps everything. You're only issued one pair of eyes per lifetime. So, MBP with matte screen is the only way to go at this point--which is why I was urging him to wait awhile. If nothing else, Apple'll hopefully get its quality-control act together.

imitchellg5 · Aug 10, 2006, 01:37 PM

Not the glossy vs. matte arguement again. Just go with an iBook G4. They run good, and last long.

mBurns · Aug 10, 2006, 01:51 PM

I would advise you not to go with a G4. Support will quickly be dropped for these machines and only be left for G5s. Don't buy something that is a dieng technology unless you have money to waste. I agree with amazing in the sense that if you can wait, wait for a MacBook with a matte option. The problem with the glossy screen is when you're constantly moving around with your laptop from the library, school, outside, etc.. it can be hard to concentrate on the screen because the reflection and the condition of the screen is constantly changing. It can become somewhat of an annoyance. To be honest, no first revision apple laptop is going to be perfect so if you're looking for a problem free experience, I would wait for awhile.

ghporter · Aug 10, 2006, 05:51 PM

Originally Posted by mBurns

I would advise you not to go with a G4. Support will quickly be dropped for these machines and only be left for G5s.

?!?!? Apple's history with processor changes is the exact opposite of what you said. When they changed from the 68000 to the PowerPC processor, they kept support for 68000-based computers for many years. There's no reason to think they'll drop PPC support now.

mBurns · Aug 10, 2006, 06:48 PM

I'm not saying they will drop PPC support. If you go to an Apple store, less and less products are easily supported by G4s. I think the G5 is more in the range of what Apple is intending on supporting. You have to remember, the G4 is a fairly old chip. Although the G4 has been the last chip in apple laptops, there has now be 3 new chip releases since then..

imitchellg5 · Aug 10, 2006, 08:12 PM

Originally Posted by mBurns

I would advise you not to go with a G4. Support will quickly be dropped for these machines and only be left for G5s. Don't buy something that is a dieng technology unless you have money to waste. I agree with amazing in the sense that if you can wait, wait for a MacBook with a matte option. The problem with the glossy screen is when you're constantly moving around with your laptop from the library, school, outside, etc.. it can be hard to concentrate on the screen because the reflection and the condition of the screen is constantly changing. It can become somewhat of an annoyance. To be honest, no first revision apple laptop is going to be perfect so if you're looking for a problem free experience, I would wait for awhile.

That is kinda hard because there is not a iBook G5.

ryter221 · Aug 10, 2006, 09:36 PM

Thank you everyone for all your help! I have, however, decided to wait, however long it may be, for the next revision of Apple laptops. What with all the mooing, overheating, and smudging (problems I guess you can understand from a first-revision computer with a new chip), I'd be happy to wait until September, or even January, to get a "problem-free", or at least less-problematic, experience (though I was looking forward to flashing a shiny new laptop to a black, dull-PC-laden school that drools over Macs). Again, thanks!

(Oh, and sorry, but my mom's first name, sadly, is not Cody.)