[Proxi]

It�s hard to believe but March 24 will be a bad day for Apple.

Everyone who has been looking forward to a new stable and fast OS will be disappointed. Besides the already known missing features of OS X Apple is lacking a clear strategy.

On the one hand they are selling iMacs with 64 MB, computers that are not ready for OS X. On the other hand they sell the PB G4 with DVD drive and OS X is not ready for this computer.

What happens to the "digital hub" when all those promised features are not supported?

Who thinks people who earn their money with a MAC are willing to reboot into OS 9 everytime they want to access a DVD Movie to digitize information ?

I�m really angry about Apple who is missing this chance. Maybe Apple�s last chance.

Wake up Steve and stop this build of OS X until it�s really finished.

I have been waiting for OS X for 2 years now and I�d rather wait another 3 month instead of getting a semi finished OS.
I�m not a Linux user and don�t have the time to search the web for OS add ons every day.

I know this isn't a solution to Apple's troubles, but why not just wait until summer and get the Puma build for yourself then? Just use OS9 until then and you'll have your own personal 3 month layover .. =)

[mattfong]

I think everyone needs to take a more measured approach and look at the truth of the situtation. Everyone expects this to be the 'miracle' OS, but this is simply not the case. The end of the world will not occur because not every feature makes it!

Like any operating system, it is a work in progress -- always! Even Windows! Bear in mind this is also a 1.0 release. Does any one remember System 4.0? The along came System 4.2? Then 6 and 7? To the curent MacOS 8 and 9? The OS eventually got better and better, adding features and refinement over time.

This same applies to OS X. We should be estatic that there is pre-emtive multi-tasking and memory protection. The new drawing engine finally does justice to a printed page. There is now a great Java implemetation. I could go on and on about what is great and what is not great, but to get back to the point, everything will make it in due time.

Besides, if you are an enthusiast, you'll use it, no matter what. If you are more cautious, wait a few carbonization cycles for applications, that is, wait until all the kinks get worked out and the OS is streamlined and polished a bit more.


mattfong

[mr_sonicblue]

Yes, on March 24th Apple should be releasing the "perfect" operating system!, but isn't.

</sarcasm>

The fact is that we're trading features that can easily be recovered for features that OS 9 couldn't possibly have! By the end of the year, hopefully you'll know what I mean.

EDIT: added the </sarcasm> tag so people don't think I have split-personalities....

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"Choo-choo, and that is the truth."

[This message has been edited by mr_sonicblue (edited 03-02-2001).]

[ArkadyChicago]

Oh, *@&#$*&@*!

The SKY is falling, the SKY is falling! Panic in the streets! Sell your stock! Buy a lot of bottled water, withdraw all your cash, and move to Death Valley! The whole world is gonna explo.......

I thought we got rid of all the @#^$@^* FUD with Y2K. I'm sorry to see I was wrong.

How many bad days does Apple have to have before you realize that it's NORMAL? Apple is not blessed with a laminated hall pass, unconditional immunity, or the like. Apple struggles, screws up, does something "Insanely Great (tm)", screws up some more, gets lambasted, praised and eulogized in the space of twenty-four hours, and this happens ALL THE TIME.

Get over it. Buy the freakin' OS when it ships, or don't, but STOP THE FUD!

I now return you to your regularly-scheduled neuroses and paranoia. Thank you.

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"Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read." -- Groucho Marx

On the other hand they sell the PB G4 with DVD drive and OS X is not ready for this computer.

Please tell me you're not implying that OSX won't work on a PB G4 just because it has a DVD drive. My PB500 works just fine with OSX Public Beta the DVD drive in it hasn't caught fire or exploded or stopped working for CD access. One feature is missing. And yes DVD play will actually show up by summer--its not as if something left out from the March 24th release is a feature lost forever. You really need better medication.

[havannas]

Originally posted by Proxi:
Who thinks people who earn their money with a MAC are willing to reboot into OS 9 everytime they want to access a DVD Movie to digitize information ?

What? How would one make money by ripping DVD's? What are you selling Divx discs or something? Unless you mean taking a screen shot. Either way, doesn't make much sense.

You have to remember that this is the [i]1.0[/1.0] release of Mac OS X. Apple amazes me in the amount of work that it has gotten done on this while listening to user feedback, adding new features, and bug squashing. A couple missing features is a disappointment but this lack of certain features should have been anticipated. And then their is the fact that nobody has seen the final build yet. While I'm sure not much will change, I ask you to at least reserve judgement until March 24th. We're all anxious about this release, but waiting a few more months for extra features to role out does not spell the end of the world. Apple has done what it needs to by getting OS X out the door. Once this summer roles around, we'll have our applications and then the party will begin.

[themax]

You are right, I think,

but I don't know if the media are so nice to Apple
and they can effect the "normal" mac user....


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The MaX : All about Macs

Everyone here is either breaking out in hives or throwing ****ing temper tantrums about this old-news no-biggie article. The media will simply react to our reaction. If you don't want these so-called news sources to **** on OS X, then you have to control your own behavior. You (meaning anyone here) are part of the hype.

This is overhyped already. Jesus Christ, you'd think Apple just went bust. Everybody can use a Valium right about now. The only thing I'm surprised about is how many people are crying like chicken little. Get a grip!

[gorgonzola]

New iMacs w/ 128 MB across the board will be available at MWNY.

New iBooks w/ 128 MB across the board will be available at MWNY.

DVD playback will be available at MWNY.

An OS X 1.1 update will very likely be available at MWNY.

Hmm, come to think of it, goddam preloading begins at MWNY.

Coincidence? I think not.

The preloading date is the important one. This is for early adopters who are willing to use an OS that doesn't implement 100% of all possible features. They have to make cuts here and there, you know. It's good, not perfect.

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the oddball newsletter
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it's only after you lose everything that you're free to do anything

I think the reason people are blowing this story up is that it's just one tiny part of a much larger set of problems with Apple and Mac hardware/software today. We really didn't need another little kick to the groin from Apple. Period.

Apple and Mac users need sub-par OS X releases, hardware glitches, and bad press like a hole in the head.

[gorgonzola]

NOOOO!!!!!!!!

856 posts and no doubles!! AND NOW THE DOUBLE!

*hangs head in shame*

(at least I'm not one of those triple or quad guys )

[This message has been edited by gorgonzola (edited 03-02-2001).]

[gotterdamm]

Here�s my view of the story so far.
How it began:
A while back we were promised a better OS. We where shown a brighter future than we had imagined. We got wrapped up in the new possibilities opened to use. Somewhere along the way we convinced ourselves that we would be getting the perfect OS. It would descend from heaven and appear on our hard drives bringing us an unparalleled level of speed, beauty and stability. It would fill every possible niche and make every other OS obsolete.
Fast-forward one year:
We find out that while the OS will be the best we�ve ever had, it will not be perfect. Like everything else made by man it will have it�s flaws. We react with complete denial. �Cnet must be wrong.� �Steve still has other secrets.� �There are secret builds hidden in Asgard being anointed by the gods.� Then shock and disgust �damn Apple.� �What was Steve thinking?� Finally it sets in that while it will lack a few features we had expected, it is still the best thing going. By summer all complaints will be addressed and all potholes will be filled.
The big picture:
We shouldn�t have expected it to be perfect. There will initially be some things you won�t be able to do at first. If those things are important to you then just wait about four months, then jump aboard.
Some of us have been waiting for this moment for years now. The first brick of Rome has been laid. Don�t expect the whole thing built by this afternoon.

[GraphiteBoi]

Gorganzola's got it right....it's easy don't buy the OS if you dont want it....but those features like DVD and such will be availible soone enough through software update.....

[bleen]

MWNY will be the real determinate for Apple. Steve has said over and over again that spring will be a slow release of Carbon/Cocoa Apps. You'll probably see Apple Applications updated to Carbon/Cocoa either within a few weeks of OS X's release, around the time of WWDC, and Announced at MWNY.

If Apple fails to get it's own stuff up to par for MWNY, Apple will be in a very bad position. And that will be the Disaster day.


[This message has been edited by bleen (edited 03-05-2001).]

[PMG4DP]

We could possibly see DVD playback and iTunes(if it's not in the final) by WWDC. It's in May right? If not..MWNY is my first MacWorld..and it's going to be one hell of an expo!

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"One World, One Web, One Program" - Microsoft Promotional Ad
"Ein Volk, Ein Reich, Ein Fuhrer" - Adolf Hitler
Translation..."One people, one empire, one leader"

[gorgonzola]

I don't think WWDC counts. They might do OS X Server 2.0 (please note, you Apple whiners, that they need people working on Server 2 as well, which is no joke since the base of the additional functions is being updated 4 times daily!) release, but I doubt they'd do a consumer OS X update at the dev conference.

I hope they webcast though, I like WWDC.

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it's only after you lose everything that you're free to do anything

[Proxi]

Hey PMG4DP

Please change your signature. The Hitler quotation is really disgusting.


[This message has been edited by Proxi (edited 03-03-2001).]

[Gametes]

ummm...that's the point.

[Gregory]

Marketing. No one will write a driver until 1.0. Apple changes things right into the FC/GM stage that can cost (lose) lots of work that needs to be redone.

I think Apple marketing and engineers - like any technology company - pulled in two directions. Which one was shocked by 100,000 copies of OS X PB being sold? Or put the expriation into the PB? and the "ship" date of March 24th? Or "shipping now" only to have 6-12 week delay and backlog adn supply problems, and scarcity of the "best" models?

IT departments wait for SP1, take months to evaluate and test and are rolling out or buying PCs with Windows 2000 now.

I just think Apple should have but couldn't afford to wait until it was "ready" for prime time.

How fast to write Cocoa apps? How fast to "carbonize"? Longer than they'd like you to believe. When Microsoft ships Windows for OS X - THAT will probably mark the "official" OS X event. Sad, huh?

Gregory

[ArkadyChicago]

Proxi.... where to begin...

If you read my earlier response to your original post, you'll see the phrase "STOP THE FUD!"

Now, that can be interpreted one of two ways... as a request that you not be a Chicken Little; or, as an attempt to censor other posters because I don't like what they have to say. Unfortunately, one probably could make the argument that they're the same thing. So, let me clarify. I hate Chicken Littles, and FUD. But you go ahead and say whatever it is you have to say. And while you're at it, have the courtesy to let everyone else do the same, eh? The Hitler sig may disturb you, but PMG4DP has a right to his opinion, too. Get a clue.

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"Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read." -- Groucho Marx

[dark3lf]

I'd like to take this time to ask a really stupid question. When Apple says that they will be shipping OS X on the 24th, does that mean that we will get it on the 24th or that they will start sending them out on the 24th? According to The Mac Observer's iBrother, there is a question on what this actually means. I've ordered mine from Outpost and I've refrained from getting illegal copies, but if I don't have the Mac OS X CD in my hot little hands on the 24th, I might jump into IRC and w4r3Z myself a l33t copy. By Bill Gates, I swear I will.

[zos]

When Apple says that they will be shipping OS X on the 24th, does that mean that we will get it on the 24th or that they will start sending them out on the 24th?

I think this answers the question:

Subject: Apple.com: 22 days until OS X "ships"...
Poster: iBrotha (3/3/2001, 07:38 am EST)

Dammit, I was right.

If you go to Apple.com, you will see a graphic that ways "22 days until OS X ships." Damn, you Apple.

The inhumanity! Oh, the inhumanity!

Thanks to Daman Bahner for pointing me to this.

Oh, and, Gregg Scott? As my friend Mac Daddy would say: "you nasty" :-)

This was the reason I went with Fedex shipping over UPS from the Apple Store. Also, I figured with educational discount plus the $30 off from buying the beta (woohoo) I may as well.

Now, if they would just send me new CD's when they release the extra features/software (hah!). My poor analog modem can't take it otherwise.

[Pale Rider]

Originally posted by dark3lf:
I'd like to take this time to ask a really stupid question. When Apple says that they will be shipping OS X on the 24th, does that mean that we will get it on the 24th or that they will start sending them out on the 24th?

Well, outpost.com says this:

Pre-order NEW OS X TODAY and receive FREE Overnight Delivery on Saturday March 24, 2001.

I was advised that outpost.com expects delivery of the OS on 3/23 so they can ship it for 3/24 delivery [who knows if the person I was talking to actually has a clue]. That, of course, means Apple has to deliver.

So, I have orders in from three different places [copies for each of my Mac users], and just to jinx myself as much as possible, an Install Party scheduled for 3/24.

[jack daddy]

an install party? your a *(^*&%*& geek. unless your trying to hit on a geek chick at your "party"....you are goddamn pathetic. go shine that pocket protector dude.

[krove]

Originally posted by jack daddy:
an install party? your a *(^*&%*& geek. unless your trying to hit on a geek chick at your "party"....you are goddamn pathetic. go shine that pocket protector dude.

Geez, have a little tolerance of others man!

krove

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*The next sentence is entirely true...
*The previous sentence is most decidedly false...

[00101001]

Originally posted by jack daddy:
an install party? your a *(^*&%*& geek. unless your trying to hit on a geek chick at your "party"....you are goddamn pathetic. go shine that pocket protector dude.

Really dude, chill out. Mac OS X is by far the greatest thing to happen to mac users in a long time, so if the man wants yo have an install party, he has my blessing.
Plus I will have an install party too...(if only I could get some mac-using friends before March 24th... )

[Pale Rider]

Originally posted by jack daddy:
an install party? your a *(^*&%*& geek. unless your trying to hit on a geek chick at your "party"....you are goddamn pathetic. go shine that pocket protector dude.

Hmmm, lessee, I'm married with three daughters; I'm an exec at a company with a mixed environment of Macs and PCs, though most of my team members are Mac fans. I've been using computers since 1978, a Mac since 1988, and so waiting for a really robust OS for a long time. I have a wirelsss network at home; that plus some good catering and beer should make for a fun party for the Mac fans I know. Some of this *might* qualify me as a geek, but most of the team members I work with wouldn't think so.

You don't know me jack daddy, so I can only assume that you vented on me because the thought of someone having fun on the Mac OS X release date causes you aggravation for some warped reason. Maybe it's the fact that AOL is your ISP. Or perhaps you are just the jerk you seem to be. Whatever the reason, I'll thank you to show a little common courtesy; or crawl back into whatever uncivilized hole spawned you.

Cheers! I'll be thinking of you on 3/24 while a gaggle of Mac fans are having fun.

[This message has been edited by Pale Rider (edited 03-04-2001).]

[Milio]

Hey! I'm a geek dammit! I've got the slide rule to prove it! Wanna make something of it?

[This message has been edited by Milio (edited 03-04-2001).]

[gorgonzola]

Originally posted by Milio:
Hey! I'm a geek dammit! I've got the slide rule to prove it! Wanna make something of it?

[This message has been edited by Milio (edited 03-04-2001).]

You still have a slide rule?

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it's only after you lose everything that you're free to do anything

[gorgonzola]

Originally posted by Gregory:
When Microsoft ships Windows for OS X - THAT will probably mark the "official" OS X event. Sad, huh?

Do you mean Office? I hope so...

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the oddball newsletter
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it's only after you lose everything that you're free to do anything

[Milio]

Originally posted by gorgonzola:
You still have a slide rule?

Damn straight. A couple of them actually, for different tasks. Way faster than a calculator, and better UI, price, weight, and power consumption than a computer.

[gorgonzola]

Originally posted by Milio:
Damn straight. A couple of them actually, for different tasks. Way faster than a calculator, and better UI, price, weight, and power consumption than a computer.

UI is kind of a funny word to describe a slide rule, but hey, it works.

I know what you mean. But I'm sure you could go even faster on an abacus. It all depends on what you're used to.

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the oddball newsletter
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it's only after you lose everything that you're free to do anything

[Milio]

Originally posted by gorgonzola:
But I'm sure you could go even faster on an abacus.

Hey now. I'm good, but I don't think even I could do it faster on an abacus.

[moreno]

quote:
...to believe but March 24 will be a bad day for Apple.

Maybe. Why? The first point, because is the version 1.0 - The second because implies the payment of $129...
Why this things?
1):The System is slow (yes, its), if don't support all recent apple hardware - sorry, this is a beta.
2) The payment of $129 (to get a beta?) to get continuity on your Mac applications is a joke.

All MacUsers can wait for the final version after 24th March.
The bad, is mark goals that won't be reached.

[Drizzt]

MacOS X? Slow?

They've done a LOT of work since beta you know.. and I really believe it's almost as fast as MacOS 9.1 now..

It's gonna ben a REAL good OS.. I just hope the sleep problem is going to go away so I can operate my iBook with 3 months uptime (until 1.1 goes out )

[gorgonzola]

Originally posted by Drizzt:
MacOS X? Slow?

They've done a LOT of work since beta you know.. and I really believe it's almost as fast as MacOS 9.1 now..

It's gonna ben a REAL good OS.. I just hope the sleep problem is going to go away so I can operate my iBook with 3 months uptime (until 1.1 goes out )

As long as it can keep up to Milio and his slide rule, it's all good.



(sorry)

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the oddball newsletter
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it's only after you lose everything that you're free to do anything

[krove]

Where did this so-called "sleep problem" materialize from? In 4K17, 33, 48, and others, I have seen no problems and have been ectatic over the success of the instant-on way sleep works in OS X...

Once again, only time can allay all of these fears. Come March 24, the mac community will be more enlightened with all of the errors, bugs, and lack of support for things listed above...

krove

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*The next sentence is entirely true...
*The previous sentence is most decidedly false...

[Gametes]

Ya I don't have any sleep problems.
Don't believe news stories based on rehashed forum posts (ahem: cnet).

[Costique]

Relax, guys!

There is *no* final version of any OS on earth unless its development is abandoned. Evolution is the thing. If an OS is getting better from version to version, the vector of development is OK. That's all there is to it.

[macnetic]

Originally posted by 00101001:
[SNIP]
Plus I will have an install party too...(if only I could get some mac-using friends before March 24th... )

I'll come to your party if you buy me a plane ticket...


macnetic, Norway

[Geobunny]

Originally posted by jack daddy:
an install party? your a *(^*&%*& geek. unless your trying to hit on a geek chick at your "party"....you are goddamn pathetic. go shine that pocket protector dude.

I think you'll probably find that helluva lot of people on this forum are geeks - including yourself otherwise you wouldn't be here! I certainly am, and you know what? I really don't care. I'm happy.

A party's a party whatever the reason. Hell you don't even need a reason to have a party, just get some friends together, some alcohol, some music and you're set.

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Shh! Be vewy, vewy qwiewet! I'm hunting wuntime ewwors

[gorgonzola]

Originally posted by Geobunny:
Hell you don't even need a reason to have a party, just get some friends together, some alcohol, some music and you're set.

Alcohol and Genie Effect don't mix.

drive safe

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it's only after you lose everything that you're free to do anything

[lcohen]

Originally posted by Drizzt:
MacOS X? Slow?

They've done a LOT of work since beta you know.. and I really believe it's almost as fast as MacOS 9.1 now..

It's gonna ben a REAL good OS.. I just hope the sleep problem is going to go away so I can operate my iBook with 3 months uptime (until 1.1 goes out )

As fast as 9.1 ???? Well, right now it is actually very very far away from that, with slow windows, slow menus, slow everyware, ate least on my PowerBook G3 Pismo, 400Mhz, 256Mb Ram, and with the 4Kxx series. I really hope that Apple fixes all those problems, otherwise, 9.1 will be my OS until something happen.....in the X front. It is very frustrating to be waiting nearly 4 and half years and get a turtle OS from Apple. But let's wait and see.....

[This message has been edited by lcohen (edited 03-05-2001).]

SHUT THE F*CK UP! DO THEY SELL PC'S WITHOUT ENOUGH RAM TO RUN WINDOWS2000(THE MOST RELIABLE WINDOWS)? YES.

Get a clue! I can't beleive they sell computers without printers! Holy SH*T - that computer doesn't come with a MONITOR?

GO FREAKING BUY MORE RAM, DUMB*SS. 64 MEGS OF RAM COSTS LESS THAN $50 NOW, WOULD YOU RATHER THEY UPPED THE PRICE $25 MORE ON THE LOW-END STUFF?

[moreno]

a turtle with 1 GB of size. God, what a monster!
Apple force. Go!

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[Stinkfist]

If it bothers you that the OS is lacking a few features, then why not wait until MWNY and buy the "Puma" build or whatever it is? Apple isn't preinstalling until MWNY for a reason. One is that few apps are available now, but it is probably also because Apple doesn't think this OS is ready to force on new hardware buyers. Right now the choice is yours, buy it or wait. I'm waiting, because 9.1 works like a charm on my system. When OS X has matured a little I'll upgrade.

You people are getting your panties in a wad over nothing. So a few apps arent' ready yet. By the time MWSF comes around, a new build of X will be here that not only sports the all of the Apple apps, but also has more bug fixes and is probably more optimized.

[DoctorGonzo]

I think a lot of people who say that there will be no problem if Apple adds the missing features in a few months are missing the point.

If OS X is missing important features it is likely to make a bad first impression.

And we have to look no farther than the Newton and Cube to see that fixing mistakes later on doesn't help much when the damage has already been done.

[Ron Goodman]

If the OS was missing any important features you might have a point, but the DVD player is an application which some people use, some don't, not an "important feature" of the OS. Those who use it will have to wait a few weeks or boot into OS 9. Important features of the OS are SMP, protected memory, pre-emptive multitasking, the BSD underpinnings...