[Simon]

Ever since I installed the 10.5.7 upgrade my X11 has started behaving weird. Sometimes windows can't be activated, the cursor doesn't update, etc.

And just now I realized that copy/paste between Aqua apps and X11 apps is broken. I used to use this all the time and it worked just fine. Now it's totally broken, neither direction works. Anybody else experience this? Any ideas?

With TM I'd go back and get the 10.5.6 version of X11, but the app package alone won't solve the issue. Too many things in /usr have been changed as well. The X11.app is more like a wrapper.

[besson3c]

What version of XQuartz/X11 are you running? You can download the latest version here: XQuartz

[Simon]

I'm running the version that came with 10.5.7.

[besson3c]

Then are you running the virgin X11 that shipped with Leopard. Update.

[Simon]

So you are saying I should abandon Apple's default X11 installation even if it's as up to date as Apple offers?

[besson3c]

It's not as up-to-date as Apple offers. The URL I gave you is to the most up-to-date version that Apple offers. X11 is not a part of the core OS X, remember how it was offered as an optional add-on install to OS X? For whatever reason, X11 is not managed by Software Update. Therefore, it will not be updated along with OS X updates, and it won't be updated on its own through Software Update.

[Simon]

OK, so now I see. Thanks. I'll give it a try.

[Simon]

Great advice, Besson. Thanks!

My X11 now works perfectly again. Even the xterm bell that I somehow lost with another 10.5.something update is back again.

It's great to see also that the XQuartz X11.app has a whole lot more preferences than Apple' built-in X11. You can for example very accurately control the syncing behavior between X11 clipboard and OS X's pasteboard.

Why is there this difference? Is XQuartz developed entirely independent from Apple? And if not, why doesn't Apple include the current XQuartz version with their OS X updates? I understand X11 is not considered a core OS X part, but nevertheless, once a user installs it there's a receipt to show it's there and SU could conclude that this user consideres X11 a part of his OS installation.

[besson3c]

Glad to help!

I've often wondered the same thing myself... Not to be a broken record, but I suspect that this runs into our conversation about Apple's open source efforts, since X11/XQuartz is indeed an open source project of Apple's. In short, Apple's open source development efforts seem very half baked, fragmented, and lacking resources. It could be that these guys don't even talk with the rest of Apple enough to get X11 pushed out into Software Updates, that the QA doesn't extend into X11? I don't know, exactly, but obviously it would be ideal for X11 to be managed via Software Update.

I use X11 all the time for running Linux apps and utilities of all kinds via SSH X11 forwarding. I know I'm not the only one that uses this app fairly heavily, so therefore I'm pretty sure that you aren't the only one that would have no idea to go to this website for X11 updates, Simon.

[Cold Warrior]

Could an older version of X11 affect WINE (darwine)? I had some troubles installing a Windows app the other day and with darwine stalling.

[besson3c]

I believe so. I would imagine that the WINE OS X developers are working with the most recent versions of X11.

[Simon]

Originally Posted by Cold Warrior 

Could an older version of X11 affect WINE (darwine)? I had some troubles installing a Windows app the other day and with darwine stalling.

It's definitely possible. If you take a look at the XQuartz bug tracker you'll see that people have already reported bugs with certain apps under WINE. However, the last one I looked at definitely seemed to be a bug within WINE and didn't have anything to do with X11.