[lee vieira]

It seems like the forum is having technical issues...the last 6 pages of the 'Flat Screen iMac' thread are unviewable

Given that its only 4 days until Macworld NY, and that I don't have an ETA on when the problem will be fixed (could be 5 minutes from now, could be never), I encourage everyone posting on the topic of LCD iMacs to post in this thread.

I apologize for the technical difficulties... apparently other forums on the MacNN site have been affected as well.


--lee

[ 07-14-2001: Message edited by: lee vieira ]

[Nimisys]

i think apple might be able to do a 15" LCD, i can do a 750 Duron with decent specs for 1050 before tax/shipping, but had a 10% margin. using 128mb ram and only a cdrom it can be done for 880$ @ 10% or 1002$ @ 25%, a dvd model would run 887.7 & 1008.75 with 10 and 25% margins, a cd-r model at 920.7 & 1046.25 and the SE (DVD-CDR, 256mb 40GIG hdd) at 1030.7 & 1171.25.

if you want to see the specs ask me and i'll post them. i used off the shelf PC parts as the pricing guide as they will be similar in price to the MAC equivalent, and besides they are the only thing we have to judge the prices by.

question is, Is apple willing to do it. persoanlly i see a new cube alike with a 15" LCD standard using a G4 and one PCI avaialbe inside. it gives apple a mid range product with some upgradability (the cubs down fall, along with price) allows the low range G4 and keeps the iMac as the value entry machine, without sacraficing the Tower.

i have a mock up of what i think it'll look like, but unfortunity, photopoint is down, and i don't have any place else to link the pcture too... sorry.

[The Ancient One]

From Think Secret:

"The "dirt" on LCDs. It's interesting to note that supplies of Apple displays are unusually low, but we've been informed that this is due to Apple dumping them into education sales. In fact, one school district, we're told, made a significant Power Mac G4 purchase, and got new Apple 17-inch LCD monitors with them at under $200 each -- around 80% off MSRP. Perhaps LCDs can be sold by Apple at a much lower price than popularly believed? Another reader refutes that, attributing it to Apple's discounting methods, and says that the actual cost for Apple is higher."

So why not a 15" LCD iMac? It might be worth it to Apple to fiddle with the numbers to get market share up.

[ 07-14-2001: Message edited by: The Ancient One ]

[BRussell]

It's interesting to look at where this "rumor" got started. It started when Steve said that Apple was the first company to sell only LCD monitors, when they introduced their 17" LCD and stopped selling their last CRT monitor. But in the context, he was clearly referring to stand-alone monitors, not iMacs.

There has never been any insider information on an LCD iMac. It was never a rumor, it was wishful thinking.

People on these boards, and elsewhere, started saying they wanted a new iMac, and they fantasized an LCD screen. Then, it became a rumor, as if someone in Apple had leaked it.

Nope. It was always just an invention - like the 17" iMac for the past two years, the G4 iMac for the past year, Apple PDA for the last 3 years, and on and on.

People like us who frequent these boards are disappointed after every single MacWorld for just this reason.

[lee vieira]

This is from MOSR.com, posted by them just yesterday.

What's interesting about it to me is that it is almost exactly what I had posted several days prior to MOSR, in the original Flat Screen iMac thread(the only major difference being that I had the bottom model as a CRT):

----------------------------------------------------------

iMac (Flat Panel Display)
-------

* PowerPC 750CX-series G3 processors at 533, 600, and 733MHz. All versions to have 256KB on-chip L2 cache.
* 133MHz main bus with standard PC133 SDRAM
* 4X AGP graphics bus with RAGE 128 Ultra 16MB graphics on entry-level model, midrange and high-end to sport GeForce 2MX graphics cards, possibly with 16MB of graphics RAM instead of the 32MB included on the PowerMac version of the GF2MX.
* 14-inch flat panel display with 1024x768 resolution is the widespread prediction, and despite a long list of other possibilities, we still believe it the most likely specification.
* Merge a 15-inch Studio Display with the G4 Cube, shake vigorously, and you've got the concept for the new iMac's enclosure. Thing is, Apple has been playing it fast and loose with its prototypes, often including no enclosure or sending out several different versions of the plastics to different testing sites....so nobody really knows which of the futuristic looks we've been seeing is the right one.

What we do know is that the basic shape of the unit is vertically oriented, that it still employs a degree of translucency, and that it is extremely thin - the polar opposite of the present iMac's bulbous enclosure. Some degree of color is in nearly every prototype enclosure we've heard of, so although at least one model may be whitewashed like the new iBook, bland is not a word we'd use to describe what we're expecting here.

* The entry-level and midrange models will have CD-RW drives, the high-end version a combo DVD-ROM/CD-RW.
* The built-in Harmon Kardon sound system has reportedly been updated to fit in the new enclosure with optimum audio response; reports from the grapevine suggest the quality of the sound output has improved, but from the evidence at hand that would appear to be in the enclosure as opposed to something like the addition of larger speaker diameters or the addition of a standard subwoofer.


-------------------------------------------------------

This leads me to believe that Ryan Meader and the MOSR 'sources' really don't have any inside LCD iMac info, they're just guessing like everyone else, and, like me, have gravitated to the 'most reasonable guess'.

Sigh.

--lee

[ 07-14-2001: Message edited by: lee vieira ]

[lee vieira]

Originally posted by BRussell:
<STRONG>
There has never been any insider information on an LCD iMac. It was never a rumor, it was wishful thinking.

People on these boards, and elsewhere, started saying they wanted a new iMac, and they fantasized an LCD screen. Then, it became a rumor, as if someone in Apple had leaked it.

Nope. It was always just an invention - like the 17" iMac for the past two years, the G4 iMac for the past year, Apple PDA for the last 3 years, and on and on.

People like us who frequent these boards are disappointed after every single MacWorld for just this reason.</STRONG>

You're right, I don't think anyone really has any 'inside info' on an LCD iMac, no matter how much the rumor sites protest otherwise. I mean, how else can they get hits, except by claiming to have the inside scoop?

(don't get me wrong, past experience has shown that the rumor sites CAN get inside info; but usually only a couple of days before the show, and only with hit-or-miss accuracy. Appleinsider.com, for example, was totally humiliated in their predictions preceeding Macworld Tokyo).

The one thing that makes me think that we might see an LCD iMac at MWNY is that it'd be the single best way to make Mac users upgrade their hardware. Its just such a radical and cool change in form factor, and Steve wants us to throw out our old iMacs and buy new ones, so, other than a screen change, what's going to do that?

I mean, yeah, I might drool over spec changes like DDR-RAM, a 133 bus, GeForce 2 MX, combo drive...but most people are not me. They react visually, and a change to LCD is the most visual thing you could do to the iMac. It's practical too-- takes up a lot less desk space, especially if the drives are oriented vertically.

So, its Apple's bottom line that makes me think it could happen, not the rumors. But if the Stevenote rolls around, and all we get is a bunch of spec bump'd CRT iMacs, I won't drop dead of shock.

--lee

[Macintosh]

Posted by Lee.

The one thing that makes me think that we might see an LCD iMac at MWNY is that it'd be the single best way to make Mac users upgrade their hardware. Its just such a radical and cool change in form factor, and Steve wants us to throw out our old iMacs and buy new ones, so, other than a screen change, what's going to do that?
I mean, yeah, I might drool over spec changes like DDR-RAM, a 133 bus, GeForce 2 MX, combo drive...but most people are not me. They react visually, and a change to LCD is the most visual thing you could do to the iMac. It's practical too-- takes up a lot less desk space, especially if the drives are oriented vertically.
So, its Apple's bottom line that makes me think it could happen, not the rumors. But if the Stevenote rolls around, and all we get is a bunch of spec bump'd CRT iMacs, I won't drop dead of shock.


This sounds practical (as lee always is) and reasonable. But can Apple capitalize? I think if anybody Apple can and they will. I can't wait! I wont say it.....ok....only four more days and Freds report to hold me over!

[Macintosh]

Here is my reason for LCD iMacs coming at MWNY. The old iMac designs were last effort attempts to generate money.


I do not think you can call a product release a distraction...but a release can be made for a specific time. Apple could have released the new iBook later by a week or earlier by a week or more. Apple knows how to milk a product for everything its worth, (except the Cube) the iMac new designs were not mere distractions but a way to generat interest and yet more money. Now that the iMac is not interesting Apple will release a new one that retains its interest level for maybe 2-3 years with speed bumps and designs. A marketing idea that is revolutionary to say the least.
If Apple does not release a new iMac then serious trouble is in store. It would make my rant look bad too.
I have faith!

A $999 14.1 inch lcd iMac is possiblecheck this out

Base iMac specs:
600mhz G3
133fsb
128mb ram
20gb hd
CD-RW
16 mb Geforce 2
$999

Top iMac
733mhz G3
256mb ram
40gb hd
Combo drive$1299

[Face Ache]

There's a point.

We wouldn't have seen the new iBooks a few weeks ago if there was nothing up Steve's sleeve for this MacWorld. He would have saved 'em.

Those new iBooks were pretty cool, so whatever is coming should be better, no?

[mememe]

i vote for new flat screen iMacs

for the imac the blue dalmation and flowerpower were the last ditch efforts to get the imac selling agin in its current state.
the speed bump to 600 didnt do much to help the sale either. why just up it again? time for a big change.. a wow! lets get that for christmas... lol

and now the new monitor craze is flatscreens and apple is not a company who lags behind the trends (as shown with movinh the displays to lcd)

everytime i give an opinion on something its just another chance at being wrong

[lee vieira]

Hmm, time to think a bit more broadly about this.

Things to consider:

* current $899 CRT iMac has NOT been EOL'd
* current $1199 and $1499 CRT iMacs apparently HAVE been EOL'd
* if the Microcenter info is accurate, Apple is introducing four new iMac models, two at the $999 pricepoint, and two at the $1299 pricepoint.

One thing that's odd to me is, why keep a $899 model if you're going to introduce two $999 models in a week?

The only way that makes sense to me is if the $899 CRT model is going to undergo a price cut to $799. Given falling component prices, this seems possible, if the bottom iMac remains spec'd exactly as it is now ('cept maybe a jump to 128MB RAM, to run X).

- - - - -

Far as the $999 and $1299 model intros, its interesting that there's two of each. That could mean either

a) two colors of each model, or
b) a CRT and an LCD at each pricepoint.

If it's 'a', then that $999 pricepoint becomes interesting. Is it going to be two colors of an LCD iMac, or is it going to be two colors of a CRT iMac?

- - - - -

The final interesting question:

What, no $1499-range iMac? None was mentioned in the Microcenter information, and the current model is being EOL'd.

Again, this could mean one of two things:

a) the $1499 model isn't ready yet, it could be waiting on a number of things, like a vertically-oriented, slot-loading combo drive, or 733MHz 750CXe G3 chips from IBM, or

b) There isn't going to be a $1499 iMac model anymore...the new iMac pricepoints, in an effort to grab marketshare, are going to be $799, $999, and $1299.

If 'b', this would also likely mean that the low-end tower is going to come down in price to cover that pricepoint, something many people have wanted.

Damn, but the speculation is getting interesting

--lee

[ 07-15-2001: Message edited by: lee vieira ]

[ 07-15-2001: Message edited by: lee vieira ]

[jblakeh1]

It would make sense to me if they keep a crt version around for awhile... the bottom-of-the-line, barebones iMac, no choice of colors... mainly for education. They've done that for several years now. At least until they can get the LCD price point lower, it would make sense...

[Sawtooth2000]

lee vieira -

Your last post makes sense and I hope it is right.

Good idea to lower price points. An indication of this came with the new iBooks. Low end price on the iBook changed from $1499 to $1299. iMac and towers could follow...

[GraphiteBoi]

lee, you make some great points. It would be interesting if Apple released 2 iMacs at each price point where one was CRT and one was LCD. I don't know if that would make much sense though, but you never know. ALl I know is that I cant wait until they are actually released. I am losing my mind over this and its exciting as hell!

[lee vieira]

Thanks, GraphiteBoi.

Of course, there's one possibility I didn't cover: All four models are just CRT iMacs in 2 different colors at 2 different pricepoints.

Oh, the hue and cry among the faithful if that happens

--lee

[Visnaut]

Originally posted by lee vieira:
<STRONG>Of course, there's one possibility I didn't cover: All four models are just CRT iMacs in 2 different colors at 2 different pricepoints.</STRONG>

This might not be so bad if it meant an LCD iMac would take over the $1499+ pricepoint. That is, if they even call it an iMac...


[ 07-15-2001: Message edited by: Visnaut ]

[KidRed]

With all the points being made (speculation of course) what if-

CRT iMac
$999 (more or less)

CRT iMac
$1299 (more or less)

LCD (iMac/Cube)
$1499

If no LCD iMac will be intro-ed or any LCD all in one for that matter, maybe that's why no $1499 at Microcenter and why everyone is saying no LCD iMac Wednesday. OR, maybe it isn't an iMac at all, maybe it's a new unit all together. Anyone see if Microcenter has a SKU for a totally new product?

[lee vieira]

Originally posted by Nimisys:
<STRONG>i think apple might be able to do a 15" LCD, i can do a 750 Duron with decent specs for 1050 before tax/shipping, but had a 10% margin. using 128mb ram and only a cdrom it can be done for 880$ @ 10% or 1002$ @ 25%, a dvd model would run 887.75 & 1008.75 with 10 and 25% margins, a cd-r model at 920.75 & 1046.25 and the SE (DVD-CDR, 256mb 40GIG hdd) at 1030.75 & 1171.25.

if you want to see the specs ask me and i'll post them. i used off the shelf PC parts as the pricing guide as they will be similar in price to the MAC equivalent, and besides they are the only thing we have to judge the prices by.

question is, Is apple willing to do it. persoanlly i see a new cube alike with a 15" LCD standard using a G4 and one PCI avaialbe inside. it gives apple a mid range product with some upgradability (the cubs down fall, along with price) allows the low range G4 and keeps the iMac as the value entry machine, without sacraficing the Tower.

i have a mock up of what i think it'll look like, but unfortunity, photopoint is down, and i don't have any place else to link the pcture too... sorry.</STRONG>

Thanks for doing all that research, Nimi. You may be a PC guy, but you back up what you say

I just have two observations to add:

1) DEAR GOD! A DVD-ROM only adds seven bucks to the price over CD-ROM??? I knew it was low, but not that low.

2) (and I blame myself for not thinking of this earlier) Wouldn't we need to provide a margin % for BOTH Apple AND the dealer?

If so, you'd have to double your margin estimates. Or more, if they work as multipliers of each other

Example:

Far East contractor ships completed LCD iMac, assembled out of cheap PC parts, to Apple at a contract price of $1000/unit.

Apple immediately slaps on a 25% margin (which is probably fair, considering Apple does all R&D, design, compatibility, and advertising work), bringing it up to $1250.

Then it gets shipped to a dealer, who slaps a further 25% margin on it (which we hope is fair, since the dealer sells, supports, demo's, and explains the product...well, in good stores, anyway), thus bringing it up to $1562.50.

Does that sorta make sense?

It certainly does explain how Apple makes so much more off of Mac purchases done at the online Apple Store...no dealer to pay off, and Apple Store Macs sell for the same price as they would at a dealer, so Apple pockets its own margin AND the dealers', in this case, a hypothetical $562.50.

Also explains how 'build it yourself' PCs are always considerably cheaper than, say, Compaqs or Sonys or HPs, and why Dell has an edge in that it is 100% online.

Doesn't really explain why eMachines sucks so much arse, though

--lee

[ 07-15-2001: Message edited by: lee vieira ]

[OddManOut]

Let's hope MOSR is right. Some sides are predicting no new iMac at all as the new units are not ready yet

[Matsu]

I VOTE FOR LOWER PRICES AND BETTER/WOW FEATURES!

Look at the current iBook. It got sexier and cheaper. Now Apple can't build them fast enough. If they can lower the price of the iMac to 1299 at the top end, and make it sexier (LCD, faster, Combo drive) at the same time, then look for another winner.

Apple's outright goal is to make money through a careful balance of margins and market share. I think they've realized that the increase in sales from slightly lower margins more than offsets the lost per unit profits. With more market share, comes more developer enthusiasm, games, exposure, and less FUD. That's important, if they can get people to buy that first mac, they'll likely keep buying them.

[lee vieira]

Originally posted by OddManOut:
<STRONG>Let's hope MOSR is right. Some sides are predicting no new iMac at all as the new units are not ready yet</STRONG>

I beat MOSR in predicting those specs by a week:
http://forums.macnn.com/cgi-bin/ulti...5&t=004469&p=8

Only major diff is that I see the bottom iMac as being CRT for awhile longer, they don't.

It seems to me that MOSR is, like me, just taking an educated guess and doesn't really know yet. They gotta get their hits, and the way you do that is by acting like you've got the inside scoop even when you don't.

Look for the TRUE info about the new products to leak out no more than 24-48 hours before the Stevenote. That's been the pattern of the last few shows, pretty much.

--lee

[Face Ache]

The only way we are going to see LCD iMac's is if they're also cheaper (read: ain't gonna happen).

Would Apple confuse the market by releasing two different computers called "iMacs"? No.

Cheaper CRT iMacs all round (mebbe two models). Has to be.

LCD Digital Hub Thingy. Has to be.

LCD pad proto's running Windows are getting hyped now (virtually daily links on MacSurfer).

Do you want Windows running your house?

Do Apple have a place in an ease-of-use iHome type marketplace?

Do Apple need to be seen at the forefront of innovation?

Do Apple like putting new technology in peoples hands?

HELL NO, yes, yes and yes.

And the geek factor.... tru da roof! I hope in a few days time Steve's opening and closing curtains, turning lights on and off and running a blender from the comfort of an armchair via his LCD Digital Hub Thingy.

It'll cost ya, but you'll buy one anyway

[WakaWakaWaka]

Something I'm surprised hasn't been mentioned more: the tablet. For 1299 what are the chances of a tablet with a cradle/charger/docking station? I envision something fairly flat and compact: all it has is a slot to drop the tablet into (so that it sits vertically and can be used as a monitor), some usb and firewire connectors and the power taps. Basically analogous to a cradle for a cordless phone.

Probably a pretty hard squeeze but it would one-up MS and definitely pull in the eyeballs and wallets. A well thought-out system would slaughter PDAs in an office/interior environment. It would the fabulous for students.

If so, why keep the low-end imac? Schools still need a cheap all-in-one.

I'm not holding my breathe but....

Waka

[Face Ache]

The Ancient one wrote:

So why not a 15" LCD iMac? It might be worth it to Apple to fiddle with the numbers to get market share up.

Apple's market share a few years ago was around 5%.

Then they released the iMac and that changed everything, didn't it?

Now their market share is, erm... around 5%.

So who did they sell iMacs too? Us, silly. Mac users.

People go for price, not pretty looks. That's why we don't all drive flash cars.

Cheaper iMacs all round please and an LCD "DHT" for the rich folk.

[Nimisys]

Originally posted by lee vieira:
<STRONG>

Doesn't really explain why eMachines sucks so much arse, though

--lee

[ 07-15-2001: Message edited by: lee vieira ]</STRONG>

actually i didn't figure in the dealer margins conscioncly, but then again it is figured in the price points, (i got lucky) because all the part pricing is based off of the resale price from pricewatch, so those prices there are reflecting the delaer markups as well. and yes DVD only costs 5$ more originally (cd 52x = 25$, 8x DVD = 30$) but the markups add to it.

with that being said there is no reason for Apple NOT to put DVD in all products, except that Apple wants to capatalize on the percieved difference in price for them. reality is that Apple can enable DVD on all models for basicly free, but unfortunitly the marketing ploy wouldn't generate as much money as takng advantage of the percieved price difference would.

as for eMachines that's easy, taking the cheapest of the generic ****e parts pile them together, add a dose of ****e for good measure, score a deal with an ISP and send themn out to unsuspecting customers. its really sad. but experibce will teach them from doing that again.

Experiece is the best teacher, but oh those tutition costs.

[Face Ache]

Great idea Waka. Why didn't I think of that?

[M�lum]

Originally posted by Face Ache:
<STRONG>The Ancient one wrote:

Apple's market share a few years ago was around 5%.
Then they released the iMac and that changed everything, didn't it?
Now their market share is, erm... around 5%.
So who did they sell iMacs too? Us, silly. Mac users.
People go for price, not pretty looks. That's why we don't all drive flash cars.
Cheaper iMacs all round please and an LCD "DHT" for the rich folk.</STRONG>

Ummm, marketshare..... here we go again.
Market share is a PERCENTAGE of, in this case, the amount of computers sold or hold.
That figure has increased in 5 years, so the 5% of that figure is not the same amount of computers sold, but more..

To increase the marketshare Apple should
-a.produce a miracle

or
-b. The pc world should slow down (actually it is slowing down) with the exception of Apple (is slowing down too?)

[lee vieira]

Originally posted by Nimisys:
<STRONG>

actually i didn't figure in the dealer margins conscioncly, but then again it is figured in the price points, (i got lucky) because all the part pricing is based off of the resale price from pricewatch, so those prices there are reflecting the delaer markups as well. and yes DVD only costs 5$ more originally (cd 52x = 25$, 8x DVD = 30$) but the markups add to it. </STRONG>

Well, ok, but I'm not entirely sure that a parts seller would be charging the same markup as a dealer(the 25%). Especially an online parts seller.

I mean, if a 15" LCD all-in-one for $1k were possible, how come the PC makers who've tried it can't seem to break $1260? Are you spec'ing good parts, or 'eMachines'-quality parts?

<STRONG>with that being said there is no reason for Apple NOT to put DVD in all products, except that Apple wants to capatalize on the percieved difference in price for them. reality is that Apple can enable DVD on all models for basicly free, but unfortunitly the marketing ploy wouldn't generate as much money as takng advantage of the percieved price difference would.</STRONG>

Ok, I agree, but question...if DVD-ROMs are such a small price premium over CD-ROMs, how come Dell wants $50 more when you configure a comp at their online store with DVD instead of CD?

<STRONG>as for eMachines that's easy, taking the cheapest of the generic ****e parts pile them together, add a dose of ****e for good measure, score a deal with an ISP and send themn out to unsuspecting customers. its really sad. but experibce will teach them from doing that again.

Experiece is the best teacher, but oh those tutition costs.</STRONG>

I cannot really argue with that. If I did, hordes of disgruntled ex-eMachines users would find me and kill me

--lee

[ 07-16-2001: Message edited by: lee vieira ]

[Face Ache]

....and so 95% of people still go for value.

Don't forget, a lot of PC people were buying their second/third PC too, so the market hasn't "increased" all that much really. There's only a certain percentage of society that can actually afford a computer in the first place. The ones that can't aren't stalling until a $2000 24Ghz machine comes out. They still couldn't afford one.

Wouldn't it be a different internet if everyone could get on.

You do get more mileage from a Mac, it's true. Us Mac users tend to keep our old machines. The PC'ers sell theirs, leading to a great second hand PC market.

The reason the PC market has slowed is because those of us who can afford computers have already bought our second one. We can already do everything we need to (with the exception of a few professionals).

Gushing about faster, faster, gizmo, gizmo, won't increase the market either. You just want a faster computer than you already have. It's a consumer society. Shame on you. But you are one of the 40% of our glorious Western society that can actually afford a computer in the first place.

If Apple want a revolution and increase market share, they can forget about you for a minute and think about "the rest of us".

Or they can do both, by releasing a cheaper iMac for us and an LCD Thingy for you.

[Judge_Fire]

So if the iMac gets LCD, how would you differentiate it from the iBook, in consumers' eyes?

As these are 'consumer' machines, geek-talking about 'G4 with more Mhz and faster bus' might not cut it.

So an LCD iMac would have to focus on the quality of the digital hub 'experience' provided by it, wouldn't it?

- Better sound (using extra enclosure space for subwoofer)
- Better display card
- larger screen

(than iBook)

And things along those lines. So, can Apple improve these audiovisual quality factors within the quoted price points? I'd find it kind of sad if the 'digital hub' came with mediocre speakers, screen and display card by default. Of course it creates a great market for add-ons, but here, 2 of those 3 items aren't that easy to add-on to the iMac.

Why make an all-in-one, if it looks and sounds 'mediocre', especially as the hype and emphasis revolves around desktop video, which particularly benefits from big sound and picture?

[M�lum]

Originally posted by Face Ache:
<STRONG>....and so 95% of people still go for value.

Don't forget, a lot of PC people were buying their second/third PC too, so the market hasn't "increased" all that much really. There's only a certain percentage of society that can actually afford a computer in the first place. The ones that can't aren't stalling until a $2000 24Ghz machine comes out. They still couldn't afford one.

Wouldn't it be a different internet if everyone could get on.

You do get more mileage from a Mac, it's true. Us Mac users tend to keep our old machines. The PC'ers sell theirs, leading to a great second hand PC market.

The reason the PC market has slowed is because those of us who can afford computers have already bought our second one. We can already do everything we need to (with the exception of a few professionals).

Gushing about faster, faster, gizmo, gizmo, won't increase the market either. You just want a faster computer than you already have. It's a consumer society. Shame on you. But you are one of the 40% of our glorious Western society that can actually afford a computer in the first place.

If Apple want a revolution and increase market share, they can forget about you for a minute and think about "the rest of us".

Or they can do both, by releasing a cheaper iMac for us and an LCD Thingy for you. </STRONG>

FGS!

I'm sorry but I think you're slightly of in your, uuh, thoughts.

"The reason the PC market has slowed is because those of us who can afford computers have already bought our second one". LOL!

[wild9]

Try THIS picture on for size!!!

Cool looking iMac! http://www.macanonymous.com/content/enter.html

[newportnews]

I would much rather see a 15" viewable CRT with 1280 X 1024 Resolution than a 1024 X 768 14.1" LCD iMac display.

Basically with a 14" LCD @ 1024 X 768 display the new iMac would have almost exactly the same screen area as the current iMac.

Upgrading the current iMac display to 1280 X 1024 would definitely help users enjoy OS X more than an LCD which can make some of the anti-aliased look blurry.

Basically if an LCD iMac is released it will continue Apple's trend toward form over function... A higher resolution would allow more viewing area helping users who need more space while running more than 1 App at a time (something OS X does very well) however if they go the other way they will sell more system because people would rather see a cool looking iMac than a vastly improved model in the same case design.


On a final note... when did the current iMac become so dated? I have still yet to see any computer company release anything close to the iMac in terms of an all in one that has the power of an iMac and still has the little touches (No fan, slot-Load Drives, See-Through, Easy Access Upgrades, H/K audio system, etc.).

I am the proud owner of an iMac SE 600 Flower Power and I will not be getting rid of it anytime soon regardless of what Apple releases @ MW.

[blinkstudio]

"Cool looking iMac! <A HREF="http://www.macanonymous.com/content/enter.html"" TARGET=_blank>http://www.macanonymous.com/content/enter.html"</A>

I am no engineer but this thing is poor. That screen is blatently CRT, if so where are the Rs coming from?

[BrunoBruin]

I am the proud owner of an iMac SE 600 Flower Power and I will not be getting rid of it anytime soon regardless of what Apple releases @ MW.

Good for you, Newport! I myself looked at that exact model the other day and if I can pick one up at a decent price post-MW, I may do it -- just because I want one!

You're right, too -- of course everyone here is screaming for new features and so on, but for the vast majority of iMac users the current machine is probably far more computer than they'll ever really use. Their eyes just glaze over when you start talking about VRAM and bus speeds.

I'd love it if Apple kept the CRT iMac at a low price and introduced an LCD all-in-one model to replace the Cube, priced $1,299-$1,799 or so. Cheap enough that it isn't a huge step up from a high-end iMac, but includes a display and G3 so it doesn't step on the tower.

[rogerkylin]

In terms of real estate, a 14.1" LCD or a 15" would make no difference to me. I would not just want to make all of the fonts, etc. smaller to fit into higher resolution screen.... my eyes can onl strain so far.

What would be a major improvement to me is a flat CRT (I'm not sure if this is what would be assumed in a new imac CRT). I have an ibook at home and previously used a mitsubishi flat LCD and whenever I'd look at the imacs in the store, there screen would seem very round, and hard to look at.

The scenraio I've heard a few times that I like is cheaper CRT imacs and the more expensive LCD Digital Hub Thingy, especially if it is a g4.

[daimoni]

.

[Nimisys]

actualy just about everything came from a mfg i have i used before, in this case samsung and acer for the cd/cd-rw/dvd/combo's. the only thing in the spec that was generic was the memory which is most likely NEC sticks and they are ok not the best fopr OCIng and such but good enough for consumer quality. Keyboard and Speakers were a genric mfg, but any case thats what just about all of them are. my 6$ keyboard works just fine. and you can't tell me the current speakers in the iMAc aren't generic 120watt jobs. the FlatPanel is an eagle, but could just as easily be a Hyundi, KDS or Amptron.


as for why dell charges 50$ extra for DVD, it is the percieved value difference between cd and dvd. people think dvd costs more so dell makes it so it does.

as for why noe OEM below 1260 possibly they can't sell it lower without lowering margins and perceived value as well.

[ 07-16-2001: Message edited by: Nimisys ]

[lee vieira]

Originally posted by daimoni:
<STRONG>

With all due respect, there are some people who do have 'inside info'

</STRONG>

By 'anyone', I obviously mean the rumor sites.

*Someone* has to have inside info, otherwise how the heck do the new models get made, by elves? But it doesn't matter if *someone* has inside info if the rumor sites have no access to said info.

But you're right about Apple's strongarm tactics in preventing leaks. They also do mass disinformation pretty well too.

--lee

[BrunoBruin]

*Someone* has to have inside info, otherwise how the heck do the new models get made, by elves?

You mean they DON'T get made by elves?!!

[foobars]

Originally posted by wild9:
<STRONG>Try THIS picture on for size!!!

Cool looking iMac! http://www.macanonymous.com/content/enter.html</STRONG>

Sorry but this is a blatent fake for 3 reasons:

a) Apple will most likely NEVER make another albino iMac thanks to the uhhh, "popularity" of Snow
b) the screen is curved and reflects- which LCDs just don't do
c) it's not cool enough

[tomatohead]

Just a thought. I don't really know about LCDs and whether or not Apple can get them cheap enough.
But if you want to get more people to buy iMacs and have them run OS X, it seems to me that they need to have G4s in them.

I know that everybody has been saying that that will make them too much like the pro machines, but the pro machines are in for a revision themselves, and what if the differentiator between consumer and pro isn't the generation of chip, but the number of chips. So for example all towers come standard with two G4s while the iMacs can only have one chip. Now iMacs can run OS X far better, but still cannot hold a candle in performance or expandability to the pro towers.

It seems to me far too much time has been spent on the screen and not enough on the performance of the computer. Just my 2 cents.

[georgius]

Okay�after talking with someone I�ve known for a long time, and has been in this business since the beginning, I�ve come to one or two conclusions.

A CRT / LCD line-up is possible. Definitely. Samsung � the current main suppliers of LCDs to Apple � have cut 15-inch prices even more, certainly making them viable for an iMac design. Secondly, with CRt prices at an all time low, and as Lee says, falling component prices falling, Apple could not produce a G3 a $799�but sell one for just over $599 and get away with it. That would only be possible though if the LCD iMac range were to go G4�and perhaps even if a G5 were to be introduced at Seybold.

Look�we all know that the IBM has beta-ed G5s�they are out there. The G4 could become the next consumer chip�and if Apple really wanted to sell a real <font color = red>killer product</font>, a G3 iMac costing sub-$600 in the current case design would be just that.

But then that is slightly into the future�perhaps just a few months away. Even so, we should continue with the present.

A split line-up�hmmm�I have to think very hard. 90% of me is very against it. Why try to fix it by complicating things if it ain�t broke? Why?

Okay�so you all put very convincing arguments forward for it. If one person says it though�many of you jump on the band wagon. So I�m gonna say stuff stick with what I believe� no split line. Period.

Play it cool

[daimoni]

.

It's nice to see that so many now believe that an LCD is possible.

It's going to happen. Whether it's on an iMac or not is a different question!

I'm going to say this again for the record -- this is going to be the biggest Macworld since Steve returned to Apple. Maybe ever. This is going to be *the* event where Apple shows us how it's going to start grabbing share from Wintel.

Be prepared for several suprises that have been only lightly touched on in these boards... not only for the iMac but for OS X as well.

R

[Macintosh]

Jesus!

[Macintosh]

&lt;Business Man&gt;
unregistered

posted 07-16-2001 07:13 PM ��� �� ��

------------------------------------------------------------------------
It's nice to see that so many now believe that an LCD is possible.
It's going to happen. Whether it's on an iMac or not is a different question!
I'm going to say this again for the record -- this is going to be the biggest Macworld since Steve returned to Apple. Maybe ever. This is going to be *the* event where Apple shows us how it's going to start grabbing share from Wintel.
Be prepared for several suprises that have been only lightly touched on in these boards... not only for the iMac but for OS X as well.

Why would the LCD "thing" not be called an iMac? I don't get it? It would be the Cube disaster all over again. They might as well call the "thing" an iMac because, the general public knows that product already. The event will not cause Apple to grab share from Win-tel if a bad product is released, especially under an unfamiliar name. Go back to school Business Man. Apple will be very careful not to dissapoint at this expo.

[Macintosh]

&lt;Business Man&gt;
unregistered

posted 07-16-2001 07:13 PM ��� �� ��

------------------------------------------------------------------------
It's nice to see that so many now believe that an LCD is possible.
It's going to happen. Whether it's on an iMac or not is a different question!
I'm going to say this again for the record -- this is going to be the biggest Macworld since Steve returned to Apple. Maybe ever. This is going to be *the* event where Apple shows us how it's going to start grabbing share from Wintel.
Be prepared for several suprises that have been only lightly touched on in these boards... not only for the iMac but for OS X as well.

Why would the LCD "thing" not be called an iMac? I don't get it? It would be the Cube disaster all over again. They might as well call the "thing" an iMac because, the general public knows that product already. The event will not cause Apple to grab share from Win-tel if a bad product is released, especially under an unfamiliar name. Go back to school Business Man. Apple will be very careful not to dissapoint at this expo.

[Macintosh]

I need to go back to school for deiierentesy reasones.
Spelling Anyone?