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You are here: MacNN Forums > Software - Troubleshooting and Discussion > macOS > What about OSX to Windows switchers?

What about OSX to Windows switchers? (Page 2)
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juanvaldes
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Jul 30, 2002, 05:58 AM
 
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Originally posted by moki:
<strong>This is a pretty good article in PC magazine on the whole Switch thing:

<a href="http://www.pcworld.com/features/article/0,aid,102528,00.asp" target="_blank">http://www.pcworld.com/features/article/0,aid,102528,00.asp</a></strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">I am so amazed that they printed that.
The spirit of resistance to government is so valuable on certain occasions, that I wish it always to be kept alive.
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losta
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Jul 30, 2002, 08:49 AM
 
PC's are so cheap now. Get one to do what the Mac won't and keep the Mac for what you love.

I live in both worlds, Currently I have 4 PCs- 2 desktops, 2 laptops and 2 Macs- an iMac and an iBook. I'm a network admin so I like to set up neworks with different OS's and do testing on my own.
Thanks in advance.
     
dfiler
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Jul 30, 2002, 09:32 AM
 
5.1 audio out is the reason I've been considering buying a PC. (only as my DVD player though)

I have an LCD projector hanging from my living room ceiling that is currently being fed by S-video from my reciever. Using its XGA input produces a _much_ clearer image with less ghosting and pixelation. However, I'm not willing to give up Dolby Digital and DTS and switch back to Pro Logic in exchange for the better image quality.

Digital Hub my Ass! What kind of digital hub has only analog stereo sound? (I have USB audio input on my reciever but its still only stereo sound.)
     
Gee4orce
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Jul 30, 2002, 11:16 AM
 
I spend all day infront of a PC. If there was nothing else to use when I'm doing it in my own time, I'd probably be a chicken farmer or something.

I suppose, if I used Macs at work, I'd buy a PC for home <img border="0" alt="[Hmmm]" title="" src="graemlins/hmmm.gif" />
     
Marc Nadene
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Jul 30, 2002, 11:25 AM
 
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
<strong>I'm absolutely sick of hearing about the price/performance issue between PCs and Macs! I work at a university and have been known to help people out when purchasing computer systems. I try to be as fair and understanding to the end computer user. When a Windows system is the best fit, I recommend it (even though it kills me). I'm so tired of people saying "I would like to buy the fastest PC out there!" When I ask them what they will be using it for, I usually get "Surfing the web, sending email and writing papers/reports."

Obviously they need a 2.6 GHz system with a Gig of ram for that... </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">No, but they need an OS that is responsive and can keep up with their typing, for crying out loud. Whenever I use MS Word, or any other app, it can't keep up with my typing. It's not me-specific, either. I know plenty of people who have this problem. This is rediculous for an OS that is promoted as being so great for education.
loldehyde:

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Marc Nadene
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Jul 30, 2002, 11:32 AM
 
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Originally posted by losta:
<strong>PC's are so cheap now. Get one to do what the Mac won't and keep the Mac for what you love.

I live in both worlds, Currently I have 4 PCs- 2 desktops, 2 laptops and 2 Macs- an iMac and an iBook. I'm a network admin so I like to set up neworks with different OS's and do testing on my own.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Same here, and you're right. PCs can do what your mac can't, and then some. Try encoding DivX on a mac. MP3 encoding is literally 10x faster on my PC with gogo. Of course, apple tries to claim that their non-standard 1-pass-only MPEG4 codec is better than DivX, but we know that's not the case. Honestly, I bought the iMac as an intellectual experiment. I had been bitching about how macs suck for so long, and then OS X comes out, so I had to see what all the fuss was about. It has done some good stuff for me, thus far with audio recording and the like. Basically, it's PC for real work, mac for messing around, listening to tunes, etc.
loldehyde:

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wingdo
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Jul 30, 2002, 11:47 AM
 
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Originally posted by Shame:
<strong>I $witched.

I got a great PeeCee with awesome gaming at a better price, awesome rendering speeds, awesome sound, awesome internet browsing speeds, awesome multitasking speed, awesome boot up time...
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Wow, your new peecee sounds awesome.
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theolein
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Jul 30, 2002, 08:47 PM
 
I'm an unwilling switcher to Windows. The place I'll be working at is a Windows only shop and I need a laptop that can run the Navision ERP/CRM software under windows and run all the usual windows crap such as Office /Outlook etc (I'm going to have fun with Outlook, that I can see already). The network is Novell and it looks like I'm going to have to programme the intranet stuff with ASP, since the custom ISO CMS stuff runs on a Windows server.

I'm also not a gamer but the one of the two games that I do like, the Homeworld series from Relic/Sierra is PC only and looks like it'll stay that way due to Sierra being pertrified of the Mac as a platform (they lost a lot of money on Macs in the middle 90's and haven't noticed that macs have changed). Homeworld2 will be out next year and the Homeworld series have always been processor hogs when playing large multiplayer matches (watch your machine grind to a crawl when 400 3D spaceships are fighting it out). The other game that I will now be buying since I have a job is EVNova. Moki's baby is being ported to the PC at the moment although I presume it won't be as customisable.

I'm also seriously considering learning some .Net stuff after I've got my Java cert in a couple of weeks.

So, a modern PC laptop is what's needed. It'll be partitioned into a Win2000 partition, an XP pro partition and a RedHat partition.

If I have some extra money next year I'll buy a Mac Powerbook. At the moment it simply doesn't make financial sense. There is a cheapo store here in Switzerland running a special on Compaq Pressario 2800 with 1.6GHz, 256MB DDR, 30Gig HD, a 32MB Radeon 7500 and a 15" screen. They're going for about $1800 or so. The cheapest TiBook costs about $2500 and is far far slower.

I want the Powerbook or even an iBook but it's madness. I don't do video or sound with the computer, but I love OSX and the well thought out and implemented Unix core. Linux will just have to serve my needs from now on.

I wish Apple would give it's whole line a kick on speeds. For most uses it doesn't matter (the guy who was bitching about OfficeX should complain to Microsoft for crippling it) but the public looks at numbers when buying. The new iMac is expensive and that's why it's not selling. The iBook is Apple's only good value for money machine at the moment.

If one just wants to surf the web, send and get email, and type letters then the cheapest and most effective thing to do in the USA is to go to Wallmart's website and buy a Mandrake PC for $399. OpenOffice/Mozilla does that very well. The cheapest thing for someone to do if they just want simple things on their computer. Even my old 450MHz K6-2 PC does all that well with Mozilla and OpenOffice.

But if one's got the money to spend... well, then I'ld get a Mac.
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King Bob On The Cob
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Jul 30, 2002, 09:33 PM
 
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Originally posted by graffix:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">All of you wanting to read on something, there was a fasinating article in Discover magizine about how the shutdown of Napster will eventually make a less honest (more likely to commit petty crimes) society... And so far, they have been exactly on target. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Heheh... and a butterfly flapping it's wings in South America eventually leads to a nuclear bomb detonation in China... it's called chaos theory. If you've ever watched Jurassic Park, Jeff Goldblum's character made it mainstream... it means that you can never really predict how one thing leads into another. Correlations are easy... causation is a real bit�h.
Just think about it... For example, to show you how hard it is to prove causation, everything you have experienced in your life has shaped you into who you are at this moment in time... while each experience may have played either a major or minor role, they ALL have had an effect on you... trying to say that one or two major events caused you to be who you are would be false.
Now apply that to the 'Discover Magazine Theory'. One would think that it would take more than the closure of a single, online (illegal) music trading service for someone to conclude that we should expect a crime wave... quite the logical jump if you ask me.
But then again, I read this thread, and logic is missing in probably 80% of the posts... so why should yours be any different. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Um... It was about how the shutdown of Napster was going to lead to decentralised networks and how the ISP's would begin to cut off service to file sharing but people still wanting free music would just steal CD's and after finding out how easy that is would begin to steal more and turn to other avenues of crime.
Try seeing what I mean before you just blow me off as having no logic.
     
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Jul 31, 2002, 03:14 AM
 
NTSC=720x486,640x480. Anyway you cut it, it's still only 720x486,640x480, Deinterlace it Interlace it Line double it what ever still NTSC.
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With some loud music + a friend to chat nearby you can get alot done. - but jezz, I'd avoid it if I had the choice---- If only real people came with Alpha Channels.......:)
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workerbee
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Jul 31, 2002, 03:16 AM
 
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Originally posted by theolein:
<strong>If I have some extra money next year I'll buy a Mac Powerbook. At the moment it simply doesn't make financial sense. There is a cheapo store here in Switzerland running a special on Compaq Pressario 2800 with 1.6GHz, 256MB DDR, 30Gig HD, a 32MB Radeon 7500 and a 15" screen. They're going for about $1800 or so. The cheapest TiBook costs about $2500 and is far far slower.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Theolein, have you checked <a href="http://www.architronic.ch/" target="_blank">Architronic</a>? They're my el-cheapo store of choice around here (note that their Apple prices are much better than what the mothership asks for... still insanely expensive, though).

Did you read the laptop review in c't earlier this year? PowerBook 800, hi-end (at the time; it's a few weeks back <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> ) wintel laptops. If you didn't, I could send you an html version of the test, since I've just received the c't archive CD.

The TiBook is a lot slower than all the P4-based laptops they tested, no big surprise here, OTOH, it also was the only laptop that had true portable battery running time and weight. And, since this is what Mr. Jobs is mainly interested in, it also looks a lot better.
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theolein
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Jul 31, 2002, 07:14 AM
 
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Originally posted by workerbee:
<strong>Theolein, have you checked <a href="http://www.architronic.ch/" target="_blank">Architronic</a>? They're my el-cheapo store of choice around here (note that their Apple prices are much better than what the mothership asks for... still insanely expensive, though).

Did you read the laptop review in c't earlier this year? PowerBook 800, hi-end (at the time; it's a few weeks back <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> ) wintel laptops. If you didn't, I could send you an html version of the test, since I've just received the c't archive CD.

The TiBook is a lot slower than all the P4-based laptops they tested, no big surprise here, OTOH, it also was the only laptop that had true portable battery running time and weight. And, since this is what Mr. Jobs is mainly interested in, it also looks a lot better.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Thanks a lot f�r d'link. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> Nice place and the tradein's they offer make my Lombard G3 suddenly worth something. I could get an iBook for 1700SFr from them. But I need the PC laptop or a PCat home at least. My old K6-2 is not good for much apart from firewaaling and routing etc. At the very least I'd need a normal PC desktop with a new monitor (2000SFr from computer express) (But I might just go for it) 3700 all in all would be affordable and would leave me with an OSX 10.2 Mac and a speed demon PC with all the PC stuff.

Thanks a million for the info. Now I just have to look and see if I can at least copy PC data onto the Mac from the CRM/ERP software...

Edit:The c't article was only on PC laptops wasn't it? Or am I thinking about the iX article?

<small>[ 07-31-2002, 07:22 AM: Message edited by: theolein ]</small>
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dillerX
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Jul 31, 2002, 07:17 AM
 
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Originally posted by moki:
<strong>This is a pretty good article in PC magazine on the whole Switch thing:

<a href="http://www.pcworld.com/features/article/0,aid,102528,00.asp" target="_blank">http://www.pcworld.com/features/article/0,aid,102528,00.asp</a></strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Heheh, thanks Moki for that article.
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gorgonzola
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Jul 31, 2002, 08:36 AM
 
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Originally posted by pmcd:
<strong>The silly switcher ads from Apple surely require that the other side of the story be told. It's hard to get numbers but there must be a large number of Mac users (especially those unhappy with OSX) that have decided to move over to Windows. There are many good reasons to stay or move to OSX, but there are definitely valid reasons to move to Windows. In particular the cost of hardware (particularly outside the US) and the ability to run a variety of OS's that are well supported on x86 are reasons. Finally given the rather strained relationship with MS I wonder how many OSX users would move to Windows were MS to drop or lessen support for Office on the Mac?

philip</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">I think everyone on this side is well aware of the reasons to switch to Windows. And I think that the "strained" relationship with MS is being taken a bit too seriously. MS took a few pot shots at Apple, Apple took a few pot shots at MS. Apple has to compete with Microsoft (and although I think they should have waited until after Jaguar and new PowerMacs were released to start this whole thing), and Microsoft isn't going to drop support for Mac OS because of it. No one over there is so deluded that they think that just because Microsoft makes Office X, Apple isn't going to compete with Windows. And remember -- Apple is not negatively affecting MS's sales of Windows enough for Microsoft to even begin caring. 2%. 90%. You do the math.

To be frank, I think solving the ridiculous situation with Motorola and the Gigahertz Gap would make people a lot more tolerant of smaller problems that go with the platform. OS X is coming together in a big way, and fast, but the hardware situation is pretty pathetic. And when AMD breaks into the market with Sledgehammer, the differences are going to become even more accentuated. Apple needs the equivalent of OS X on the hardware side of things ... ("This was our old, crummy, messed up chip that was never updated, but here comes our new, fast, marketable chip that can actually compare and beat the competition.") Great software needs hardware to run on, after all.

My 2�.
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workerbee
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Jul 31, 2002, 02:34 PM
 
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Originally posted by theolein:
<strong>The c't article was only on PC laptops wasn't it? Or am I thinking about the iX article?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Yes, it was all wintel... exept for one fearless titanium-clad nimble warrior that fought bravely I put up the article <a href="http://homepage.mac.com/philby/FileSharing3.html" target="_blank">here</a> (look for "ct-laptoptest.sit") -- but grab it quickly before I delete it again, I'm sure c't would not really approve of this...

BTW: How much do you want to sell ye olde Lombard for? I might know someone who is interested.

(edit: lombard quote and c't article "best-before")

<small>[ 07-31-2002, 02:41 PM: Message edited by: workerbee ]</small>
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Jerommeke
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Jul 31, 2002, 06:33 PM
 
Indeed. I have the computer as stated below and I'm absolutely mad at Apple for the upgrade policy to 10.2 they made for people who bought 10.1 for a whole lot of money, I mean, I am a student.

But I already planned switching, cause the phrase "Yeah, that's because you have a Mac" is something I heard too much, and with my study start I want to get rid of all those problems...
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glorfindel
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Jul 31, 2002, 07:04 PM
 
Apple right now is a tech toy for people who want a cause. " Microsoft is evil, didn't you know?"

Apple will only be serious when and if they get 15% of the US consumer market which will mean all games, applications, drivers, and peripherals are seamlessly available on a mac.

OS X is bug ridden and slow and Apple feels justified charging money to fix it, even to people who bought a computer a few months ago! Demented business practices.

My advice to people is to look into Apple in 2-3 years when OS X matures and maybe Apple has 10% or so of the US market.

Otherwise it's just a toy for techies with a lot of spare time.
     
theolein
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Jul 31, 2002, 07:16 PM
 
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Originally posted by workerbee:
<strong>Yes, it was all wintel... exept for one fearless titanium-clad nimble warrior that fought bravely I put up the article <a href="http://homepage.mac.com/philby/FileSharing3.html" target="_blank">here</a> (look for "ct-laptoptest.sit") -- but grab it quickly before I delete it again, I'm sure c't would not really approve of this...

BTW: How much do you want to sell ye olde Lombard for? I might know someone who is interested.

(edit: lombard quote and c't article "best-before")</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">The Lombard I'd sell for about 1150SFr. It has a 10GB HD and the old one is in an extra removable bay module (Why did Apple ever stop these bays?). In addition to that I have a Keyspan USB to serial converter which I have no other use for. It has 192MB RAM. It would be nice to be able to give the Keyspan converter away since I don't use it for anything anymore (used to use it for a tablet). The people at Archishop (good PC prices as well for here in CH) would give a 900SFr rebate on a stock Lombard and I reckoned my price on that.
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noisefloor
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Aug 1, 2002, 03:07 PM
 
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Originally posted by glorfindel:
<strong>Apple will only be serious when and if they get 15% of the US consumer market which will mean all games, applications, drivers, and peripherals are seamlessly available on a mac.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Huh? "all games, applications, drivers, and peripherals" aren't even "seamlessly available" on a PC. The only way to have "everything" is to run both. Since nobody really needs to run "everything", having an OS that runs everything you NEED is "serious" enough, thank you very much.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif"><strong>OS X is bug ridden and slow and Apple feels justified charging money to fix it, even to people who bought a computer a few months ago!
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">And since the above comment can apply just as well to Windows, your point is?

Let's be honest. ALL computers are toys for techies with spare time.
     
workerbee
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Aug 1, 2002, 03:21 PM
 
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Originally posted by theolein:
<strong>The Lombard I'd sell for about 1150SFr. (snip)</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">I forwarded your quote and should have a reply soon.
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DougG
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Aug 1, 2002, 04:49 PM
 
One thing that I've never understood, is games on comptuers...Now granted I've got a 43 inch sony tv, but I would never even think about playing 95% of games on a computer. Get a PS2 or Xbox (eventhough it is M$) The only games which I would are things like civ and sim city, and those games are on both platforms. In short, the future of games is on xbox/ps2, not computers....
     
Eug
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Aug 1, 2002, 04:56 PM
 
I betcha a number of you own more than one computer. There's nothing wrong with... errr.. swinging both ways.

As for HPTV, a line doubled 720x480 upsampled image to 1080i WILL look better than the original 720x480 image. However, for 99% of the population, this is irrelevant, and it certainly isn't a reason to switch. If anything, if you need it, it's more a reason to buy a second dedicated small footprint PC.

Anyways, I have 34" widescreen ISF calibrated direct view progressive scan HDTV. Progressive scan DVD is good enough for me for now. Indeed, even line doubled interlaced DVD is good enough for me for now. I don't see the point of the dedicated computer until one gets into large (ie. 50"+) projection HDTVs or higher-end front projectors. If you can afford one of those and want to use a computer for it, you should spend $500 on a dedicated PC IMO.

<small>[ 08-01-2002, 05:05 PM: Message edited by: Eug ]</small>
     
theolein
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Aug 1, 2002, 06:29 PM
 
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Originally posted by workerbee:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Originally posted by theolein:
<strong>The Lombard I'd sell for about 1150SFr. (snip)</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">I forwarded your quote and should have a reply soon.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="1" face="Geneva, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif">Ok, let me know. I've got some CD's with OS 8.x and OS 9 stuff for it as well.
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