[turtle777]

Originally Posted by Nodnarb

I second the waiter thing. I work at a Ruth's Chris and on slow night's I make about $150 in tips all the way up to $200-$300 on a really busy night.

Are you serious ? How many hours is that shift ? Is that a high class restaurant ?
Otherwise, I have to cut my tipping.

Seriously, I think 15% is too much. Just imagine a check of $ 40, you give 15%, that'll be $6. Now, how much "dedicated time" did you get out of that waiter ? Maybe 15 min, tops. That would be an hourly tip of $ 24 ! Gotta go back to 10%

-t

[budster101]

Ruth's Chris is awesome! At least that's what I hear. Never been there and we have one near O'hare Airport, which was down the street from were we used to live..

I hear they bring the steak still sizzling to your table............. I'm hungry.

It's a pretty Hoy-falut'n restaurant that's for sure.

[Railroader]

Originally Posted by turtle777

Are you serious ? How many hours is that shift ? Is that a high class restaurant ?
Otherwise, I have to cut my tipping.

Seriously, I think 15% is too much. Just imagine a check of $ 40, you give 15%, that'll be $6. Now, how much "dedicated time" did you get out of that waiter ? Maybe 15 min, tops. That would be an hourly tip of $ 24 ! Gotta go back to 10%

-t

Are you serious? I usually tip 20% and often more. If I get horrible service I usually tip 10%. What's $6 really.

[Salty]

Originally Posted by Railroader

Are you serious? I usually tip 20% and often more. If I get horrible service I usually tip 10%. What's $6 really.

Maybe Christians are just more generous... aside from Mennonites... bloody cheap Mennos!

Anyway, yah... I've actually tipped nothing before at Apple Bee's cause we got such awful service there. But most of the time I tip above 15 percent. I've tipped as much as 5 dollars on a 15 dollar meal

[turtle777]

Originally Posted by Railroader

Are you serious? I usually tip 20% and often more. If I get horrible service I usually tip 10%. What's $6 really.

$6 for 10 minutes of service time is a $36 hourly wage.
It's not worth it, plain and simple. We are talking about a freakin' Mac job, no qualification required. Heck, I don't make $36 / hour, so I for sure won't pay that to someone just walking my food and looking cute...

-t

[nonhuman]

Originally Posted by Salty

Maybe Christians are just more generous... aside from Mennonites... bloody cheap Mennos!

Anyway, yah... I've actually tipped nothing before at Apple Bee's cause we got such awful service there. But most of the time I tip above 15 percent. I've tipped as much as 5 dollars on a 15 dollar meal

Hey, I'm not Christian and I always tip well ...if it's a chick.

[Y3a]

<< I'm a student, I am going to be doing a pastoral internship with my church this coming year. That said... marketable skills? What do you mean by that? >>

Why don't you try doing DJ stuff at local churches to make bucks?

You have NO OTHER marketable skills. Learn some!!!
learn teh concepts of digital photography
and
after you've read 8-10 books on the subject
get a camera
and find a job doing advertising photos for use in ads etc.

Yard work?
painting?
Dog Walking?

[Millennium]

The best jobs are, without a doubt, the ones you love doing. Unfortunately, it doesn't sound like this is entirely possible yet in your case. If you go to college, you might be able to get something through their internship program; this will only be temporary, but you may be able to get them to hire you on a permanent basis once the internship is done. Internships don't often pay much, but they can get your foot in the door.

If this isn't an option, though, then waiting tables is a valid option. My sisters did this when they were in high school; they didn't like it all that much at first, but it grew on them very rapidly. They later went into hotel and restaurant management in college, and both now manage restaurants at the new Wynn resort in Las Vegas. Then again, for them this also counts as something they love doing.

If this doesn't appeal, though, and you'd prefer something a bit more mundane, you might want to check out Costco (a wholesaler) if there are any near you. I don't know what the situation is like with them in Canada, but in the States they're a well-kept secret when it comes to student jobs. They have excellent pay and benefits, even for part-timers, though with part-timers you have to be there a certain amount of time before qualifying. Of course, they can't guarantee your hours if you work part time, but they may be worth considering anyway; the pay may help to make up for it.

[Shaddim]

Originally Posted by turtle777

$6 for 10 minutes of service time is a $36 hourly wage.
It's not worth it, plain and simple. We are talking about a freakin' Mac job, no qualification required. Heck, I don't make $36 / hour, so I for sure won't pay that to someone just walking my food and looking cute...

-t

It makes up for the 20% who don't tip at all, and the 30% who tip <10%. Quit being such a cheapskate.

Edit: sorry, got the figures backwards.

[Doofy]

Don't waste your time worrying about Chick's job folks. He just wants a moan, not a job. Trust me on that.

[turtle777]

Originally Posted by MacNStein

Quit being such a cheapskate.

WTF ?

Why would I pay someone with no skills more money than I make with many years of education and experience ? I already give 10-15% of my income to charities, but I definitely don't tip because I feel charitable !

-t

[Shaddim]

Originally Posted by turtle777

WTF ?

Why would I pay someone with no skills more money than I make with many years of education and experience ? I already give 10-15% of my income to charities, but I definitely don't tip because I feel charitable !

-t

You don't think being on your feet all day, serving obnoxious, cheapass, ungrateful louts like you is a skill? Most servers in the better restaurants have many years of experience, and it shows. If the extra $5 is going to impoverish you, you shouldn't be out eating in the first place. Buy some Ramen.

[turtle777]

Originally Posted by MacNStein

You don't think being on your feet all day, serving obnoxious, cheapass, ungrateful louts like you is a skill? Most servers in the better restaurants have many years of experience, and it shows. If the extra $5 is going to impoverish you, you shouldn't be out eating in the first place. Buy some Ramen.

You're an ass. But you don't try to hide it. Ah well

-t

[Railroader]

Originally Posted by turtle777

You're an ass. But you don't try to hide it. Ah well

-t

You are in no position to be calling him that. You're cheap. I'd rather be an ass than a cheapass. Go buy some Ramen. Make sure you tell your wait staff you'll be tipping very little before you go out next time. Hell, be a man and ask them what they think they deserve.

Quit being a whiner.

[Shaddim]

Originally Posted by turtle777

You're an ass. But you don't try to hide it. Ah well

-t

Yup, but at least I'm not a skinflint.

If I were your server (I did that for a bit in college) I would have been tempted to dump the soup in your lap, for being cheap on the tip the last time I served you.

[turtle777]

Originally Posted by Railroader

You are in no position to be calling him that. .

Oh yes, he called me an obnoxious, cheapass, ungrateful louts. So yes, I'm entitled to call him names, too.

Originally Posted by Railroader

You're cheap. I'd rather be an ass than a cheapass. Go buy some Ramen. Make sure you tell your wait staff you'll be tipping very little before you go out next time. Hell, be a man and ask them what they think they deserve.
Quit being a whiner.

Who said I wouldn't tip at all ?
I only said that I think 15% or more is overrated if I get a couple of minutes service.

As I said before, I give extensively to charities and churches, but I don't consider waiters 501(c) organizations.

-t

[turtle777]

Originally Posted by MacNStein

Yup, but at least I'm not a skinflint.

Oh, great. So how much do YOU give to charities each month ? Since my cheapass gives only a minimum of 10% of my income and this apparently makes me a skinflint, you surely must be giving a heck more...

-t

[budster101]

People live off of their tips. A good waiter will make that kind of money because he does the following.
(Given this is a fine dining establishment)

- Insures everyone is happy with their food and if he senses not, makes it up to them.
- Insures every glass is filled, coffee too. (If not the bus staff does this, and they get part of that tip)
- Is presentable, well spoken, and only shows up when something is needed, otherwise, he/she's a ghost.
- Bread Basket is always full
- Cordial at the least, and entertaining at the most... One doesn't go to a fine establishment to be bored. It's an experience. The food, the atmosphere, and the people.
- When he/she brings the change back, he'll round DOWN the change to the nearest dollar, as he neither expects a big tip, nor does he worry about the change. He/she also won't bring back huge bills only thereby assuming you'll leave a decent tip.

This is where the tip should be going. Not just a percentage of the bill.

If you go to a movie and it's horrible, do you just leave or ask for your money back?
I ask for the money back, or a credit.
Same goes for Dining out.
I save the great tips for the great experiences, and for places that I'd like to go back to.

If a person is not good at their job, they don't get a great tip, but it isn't terrible either.
Everyone has bad days, at least give them that.

This is my philosophy on dining out.
----

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by Railroader

You're cheap.

Originally Posted by MacNStein

Yup, but at least I'm not a skinflint.

Sorry but I'm gonna call you both out for that.
Why?

Think of a guy who might be on the breadline but wants to take his wife out for their anniversary as a nice gesture. Maybe he's scrimped and saved all year for that one night and he's managed to get enough for the meal and taxi fare - but he can't afford a large tip for the server.
What is he supposed to do? Are you going to tell him to stay home on that special night because he can't tip as well as others? Should he take his wife to KFC instead?

It's all about circumstances.


Oh. And MacNStein - pol lounge.

[Salty]

Some people have families to take care of and they wait tables because they enjoy doing it, they're good at it, and because they want to pay the bills. I can't stand it when I go out with people and they look at me funny when I leave a good tip. Especially when we had a great server. Frankly if I were waiting tables I'd want people to tip me... why wouldn't I do the same thing?

[budster101]

I have actually told a waiter/waitress when I couldn't give a tip that I had hoped to give as the meal came out to be a bit more than I expected. This has happened a few times and it is no fault of theirs, though in part they may have sold that desert too well and we went for it.

I tell them, we'll come back and ask for them next time, and make it up to them, because they deserve more, we just can't give it right now. I then quietly tell the manager on duty, (MOD) for you in the biz, how well our waiter/waitress was and they are the reason we will be coming back, not just the great food.

Edit:

Once to my embarrasment, I gave zero tip, because I barely made the check, but I actually came back the next night, found the waiter and gave him a good tip.

In some contries the culture is not to tip at all:

I think Canada is one that comes to mind... I'm liking that place more and more!

[Shaddim]

Originally Posted by turtle777

Oh, great. So how much do YOU give to charities each month ? Since my cheapass gives only a minimum of 10% of my income and this apparently makes me a skinflint, you surely must be giving a heck more...

-t

Last month, $2185 and change... not counting a few dollars dropped into various buckets at convenience stores and such. Some months it's a bit more, some it's a bit less. Most of it goes to local charities but some are Int'l; Knoxville Area Rescue Ministries, Project Safehouse, Knox County Shelter for Battered Women, East TN Children's Fund, VFW, Christian Children's Fund, etc..

[E's Lil Theorem]

I'm more practical about my tipping habits. If the server was okay or better, 20%, otherwise, about 15%. Sales tax here in Cali is about 8%, so if the server didn't do that well of a job, I simply double the tax to get the tip. If they were all right or down right excellent, I divide the total by 5 and, bam, there's your 20%. Now, if I'm traveling, no matter what, it's always 20%.

[turtle777]

Ok, so let's have that discussion from a different perspective.
What do you think is a reasonable hourly tip wage a waiter should make ?

$15 ? $ 20 ? $ 40 ?

-t

[Shaddim]

Originally Posted by Doofy

Sorry but I'm gonna call you both out for that.
Why?

Think of a guy who might be on the breadline but wants to take his wife out for their anniversary as a nice gesture. Maybe he's scrimped and saved all year for that one night and he's managed to get enough for the meal and taxi fare - but he can't afford a large tip for the server.
What is he supposed to do? Are you going to tell him to stay home on that special night because he can't tip as well as others? Should he take his wife to KFC instead?

It's all about circumstances.


Oh. And MacNStein - pol lounge.

That's understandable, and I could sniff that out a mile away. You can usually tell because there's a hint of embarassment when they pay the check, or maybe they were very careful when looking at the menu and talking about the prices. Then, it's just a smile and a "Happy Anniversary", and I'd make sure they got a comp dessert and coffee.

However, that's not the situation that was presented, and I don't see Turtle as a person standing on any breadlines.

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by MacNStein

That's understandable, and I could sniff that out a mile away. You can usually tell because there's a hint of embarassment when they pay the check, or maybe they were very careful when looking at the menu and talking about the prices. Then, it's just a smile and a "Happy Anniversary", and I'd make sure they got a comp dessert and coffee.

However, that's not the situation that was presented, and I don't see Turtle as a person standing on any breadlines.

Fair enough. Just pointing out that there are many different reasons why someone can be light on the tip.

[Shaddim]

Originally Posted by turtle777

Ok, so let's have that discussion from a different perspective.
What do you think is a reasonable hourly tip wage a waiter should make ?

$15 ? $ 20 ? $ 40 ?

-t

they usually make between $10-20 /hr on avg. Often they only have 1 or 2 tables active at a time.

[turtle777]

Originally Posted by MacNStein

they usually make between $10-20 /hr on avg. Often they only have 1 or 2 tables active at a time.

The restaurants in your town must be quite different from mine.
Here, servers are waiting 5 and more tables, which results in quite some wait time on part of the guests. You often see them only four times: taking the drink order, bringing drinks & taking the food order, bringing food, bringing check. In order to get any additional service, you have to look out for them and raise your hand.

So with that in mind, I don't see why that would be worth rewarding a $30 or more hourly tip wage.

-t

[Shaddim]

Originally Posted by turtle777

So with that in mind, I don't see why that would be worth rewarding a $30 or more hourly tip wage.

-t

They don't make that for an entire shift, that's very misleading. Some hours it's $5/hr, other hours it's $30 /hr. I'm sure it works out to less than $20 in all but the most exreme cases. Otherwise, there'd be more people waiting tables.

[budster101]

What about that table of 6, 8 or even 10?

That isn't just easy work there. Some waiters and waitresses remember all orders without writing them down... and they remember drinks too, so when you run out, they remember what it was without asking. The job is not as transparent as many would make it out to be, but the act of doing it well should be, so maybe that is why y'all think it's so easy... they make it look easy. (The good ones) and they deserve to be rewarded for the hard work.

[buffalolee]

Go abroad and teach English. It will be a lot of fun.

[budster101]

Hmmm. My nephew is in Japan... maybe I can go there and teach English! Got the M.Ed... already...
Where do I apply?

[turtle777]

Originally Posted by budster101

What about that table of 6, 8 or even 10?

That isn't just easy work there. Some waiters and waitresses remember all orders without writing them down... and they remember drinks too, so when you run out, they remember what it was without asking. The job is not as transparent as many would make it out to be, but the act of doing it well should be, so maybe that is why y'all think it's so easy... they make it look easy. (The good ones) and they deserve to be rewarded for the hard work.

Well, with that in mind, all the cashiers at fast food joints and grocery stores must be real lazy asses. I mean, after all, they only make minimum wage. And no one tips them. I guess it must be fair.

BS. My point is: many people work very very hard, and don't even make $ 10 / hour. Why are waiters such an exceptional profession ?
Any of you, don't you think cashiers work hard ? They are making far less than waiters.

I may sound harsh, but the USofA is a CAPITALIST country and society. People get paid what their work is worth in the market place. They are NOT necessarily getting paid for HARD work. And what I see is that for some weird reason (romatics ideals etc...), waiters are treated as they belong into a total different league. I just don't get it.

-t

[budster101]

Oh a cashier that scans crap, remembers nothing, has no personality for the most part, and cannot accept tips by law, is nothing like a person waiting a table. Do they go and get stuff for you? You bring it to them...

It is fair. Stand and just scan crap. If you are there long enough, you do get paid well, and great benefits, and you do even remember everything, but you are rewarded for sticking around. Managers for Grocery stores make upwards of 60k and up! So a Cashier can be promoted and usualy are from within...

Microsoft Programmers are way overpaid...

I've met more people that work as waiters that have their Masters or better or used to work in the Stock Market or some other office work than not. A cashier at a grocery store isn't necessarily going to qualify for a job at a fine eatery... not the same. There are more qualities to being the latter than you have acknowledged.

[turtle777]

Originally Posted by budster101

I've met more people that work as waiters that have their Masters or better or used to work in the Stock Market or some other office work than not. A cashier at a grocery store isn't necessarily going to qualify for a job at a fine eatery... not the same. There are more qualities to being the latter than you have acknowledged.

Maybe I missed the memo that we are talking strictly fine eateries here
Otherwise, why should I pay for the waiter's masters degree ?

-t

[buffalolee]

Originally Posted by budster101

Hmmm. My nephew is in Japan... maybe I can go there and teach English! Got the M.Ed... already...
Where do I apply?

Do a google with the words "teach english japan." I am sure you will meet a lot of great people there. In fact, one of my college classmates went to Japan to teach English for 4 years because he loved it there. When he came back, all he ever wanted to be around with were Japanese girls.

[budster101]

Re: Waiters with Masters Degrees.... I said they had them, not were getting them...
I was just discussing why one would deserve a hefty tip, that's all. Otherwise 10,15, 20 percent of a $5 -$20 meal isn't going to break you...

Did a Google on "Teaching Japanese in Japan" Thanks.

[Chuckit]

****, I need to hurry up and get my bachelor's.

[turtle777]

Originally Posted by budster101

Re: Waiters with Masters Degrees.... I said they had them, not were getting them... I was just discussing why one would deserve a hefty tip, that's all.

That was exactly my point. Why does the degree someone already HAS have to do ANYTHING with tipping ? I had to work as a regular underpaid sales person for a while. Nobody cared whether or not I had a degree. Heck, my commission was the same as for the high school kid.

-t

[budster101]

Do you guys read into what you want or what?

Why would someone with a Masters Degree work at a fine eatery?
....

$$$

I didn't say they required a Masters, nor did I say anything that linked the two.

---

I know a guy who rakes in the $ while having his HS Diploma only and he sells cars.

[turtle777]

Originally Posted by budster101

Do you guys read into what you want or what?

You didn't answer my question.

What does any degree of the waiter have to do ANYTHING with my tipping ?

-t

[Salty]

I can't teach English in Japan because I need to be in Winnipeg this year But I'll keep that in mind for next year It sounds like it could be fun. There's actually a teaching English as a second language course offered by my school...

[Railroader]

Originally Posted by turtle777

Ok, so let's have that discussion from a different perspective.
What do you think is a reasonable hourly tip wage a waiter should make ?

$15 ? $ 20 ? $ 40 ?

-t

It would depend on the quality of the establishment and the level of service.

How about a comparison.

Let's take the bottom of the barrel mom and pop diner: Lunch for two is about $12, tip is $2.40. So the wait staff isn't going to make much money. Per hour I'll wager they make about $15-18/hr. But the quality of service is going to reflect that. The wait staff won't be very knowledgeable about the food or be able to make any recommendations. And unless you go in everyday they won't know you from the guy who pees on the side of the urinal in the restroom.

Now consider a 4-star establishment: Lunch for two will be about $100, tip will be about $20. The wait staff here probably make about $35-40/hr. You would think that the staff is raking it in. But consider they have less tables, the place will not be as busy, the customers will be occupying the table longer, and they are probably living in a location with a higher cost of living. Plus, the level of service will be exceptional. We ate at a place last year and had a great meal. We told the waitress it was our anniversary and she brought us out a free desert. We tipped her VERY well. Didn't go back again until a year later. We got lucky and had the same waitress. As she introduced herself she wished us a happy anniversary! She remembered what beers I like the drink, that my wife likes water without ice, and that we loved her suggestions from the menu. Guess what, we tipped her even more.

Remember: You get what you pay for.

[The Godfather]

Here's another great tip to help waiters avoid income tax: tip $0.50 with your credit card and the rest of the 15% in cash. Their W-4 in January will be very small.
Why is the tip 20% when the party of 5 people or more? It is not like a 5 person group will spend less than a 4 person group. Oh, I know. It is because of the same/separate check handling. Brain fee.

[anthonyvthc]

bitterwaitress.com
stainedapron.com

[Railroader]

I can't stand the "large party 18% gratuity" mandatory policy. I always tell the manager wait staff that I won't be back because of it and that they would have gotten a larger tip if they didn't have such a policy.