[finboy]

Originally Posted by ghporter 

The one major thing left out of the article you cite, Doofy, is what it was about that vaccine that triggered the child's problem. Was he highly sensitive to mercury-and was the vaccine preserved with thimerosal? Was it the vaccine contents themselves and he was sensitive to their culture media? What was it?

I guess they wouldn't know if he was highly sensitive to mercury until he had a reaction - why would you know that about a 13-month-old. Even if he WAS highly sensitive, doctors may not have considered that important - you know those vaccines save lives!

Thimerosal wasn't withdrawn from children's vaccines until after this child had his, so yeah, I'd bet he had mercury.

But the questions you pose are important: we probably won't ever know those answers, even with court cases like this. The totality of the impairment may not be obvious until years later, though other things (sleep pattern changes, dietary preferences, behavioral changes such as self-stim behaviors) can serve as a tell-tale in retrospect.

Once they've had the shot, there's not much you can do about it. That's the b*tch of it all.

[ghporter]

Thimerosal was never a significant source of mercury that could be absorbed, but as a compound it seemed to be an irritant to a number of people. On the other hand, it was used to preserve contact lens solutions for decades and nobody's ever noted any mercury issues with lens wearers either. There has simply never been a full-scale study to see what thimerosal actually does in the human body for us to have any sort of yardstick to say "here is how you tell if this is a problem." And there's no solid evidence that anyone has any provable sensitivity to thimerosal either, just a lot of "right after the shot, this happened" reports-reports that seldom include any really useful information. For all we know, the child could have had an adverse reaction to a contaminant in his food or water. And as I pointed out, he could have been sensitive to a whole lot of things and had the reaction because of any one of them. Eggs, agar, iodine...lots of things can cause reactions.

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by ghporter 

The one major thing left out of the article you cite, Doofy, is what it was about that vaccine that triggered the child's problem. Was he highly sensitive to mercury-and was the vaccine preserved with thimerosal? Was it the vaccine contents themselves and he was sensitive to their culture media? What was it?

Even if they know, you don't think that a government's going to allow someone to publish it, do you? If it were a really common ingredient, you'd hit a zero vaccination rate overnight.

[ghporter]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

Even if they know, you don't think that a government's going to allow someone to publish it, do you? If it were a really common ingredient, you'd hit a zero vaccination rate overnight.

Or they'd issue warnings "if you are sensitive to shellfish, eggs or sodium salts, do not use this vaccine..." Which is pretty common. The influenza vaccine is generally cultured in an egg medium here, and the first question they ask is "are you allergic to eggs?"

[Rev-O]

Originally Posted by ghporter 

And there's no solid evidence that anyone has any provable sensitivity to thimerosal either, just a lot of "right after the shot, this happened" reports-reports that seldom include any really useful information. For all we know, the child could have had an adverse reaction to a contaminant in his food or water. And as I pointed out, he could have been sensitive to a whole lot of things and had the reaction because of any one of them. Eggs, agar, iodine...lots of things can cause reactions.

Correlation does not necessarily mean causation. Case in point is was the autoimmune/silicone breast implant issue.

[ghporter]

Originally Posted by Rev-O 

Correlation does not necessarily mean causation. Case in point is was the autoimmune/silicone breast implant issue.

Precisely.

[olePigeon]

Originally Posted by Rev-O 

Correlation does not necessarily mean causation. Case in point is was the autoimmune/silicone breast implant issue.

I tried that already with tunafish and breast milk. That is another good example.

[Eriamjh]

Revive dead thread:

Medical journal: Study linking autism, vaccines is 'elaborate fraud' - CNN.com

I believe that even if they could have shown autism had a 100% undeniable link to vaciination, that the risk of NOT being vaccinated is far worse than the risk of autism from it.

[finboy]

Originally Posted by Eriamjh 

Revive dead thread:

Medical journal: Study linking autism, vaccines is 'elaborate fraud' - CNN.com

I believe that even if they could have shown autism had a 100% undeniable link to vaciination, that the risk of NOT being vaccinated is far worse than the risk of autism from it.

Nothing new here. Wakefield is probably an idiot. Given what I've seen, he doesn't know how to manage his public image in any event. The original journal editors were MORONS to publish a study with 12 subjects (Jeebus, they had almost as many authors as test subjects!).

As for having an autistic child: It's kind of a "seeing is believing" phenomenon, and until you have to deal with it, daily, most people have an inadequate frame of reference.

[lpkmckenna]

Originally Posted by finboy 

I know that doesn't fit well into your narrow socialista brain...

Yes, vaccines are a socialist tool. finboy can always be trusted to bring the crazy.

[olePigeon]

Originally Posted by Eriamjh 

Medical journal: Study linking autism, vaccines is 'elaborate fraud' - CNN.com

I was going to post that, but people like finboy already made up their minds. It's pointless.

[ghporter]

Originally Posted by finboy 

Nothing new here. Wakefield is probably an idiot. Given what I've seen, he doesn't know how to manage his public image in any event. The original journal editors were MORONS to publish a study with 12 subjects (Jeebus, they had almost as many authors as test subjects!).

As for having an autistic child: It's kind of a "seeing is believing" phenomenon, and until you have to deal with it, daily, most people have an inadequate frame of reference.

Define "adequate frame of reference." Does this require having a child with a disability? Does it require having significant education and study in the subject of juvenile disabilities? Does it require contact with a variety of children with a variety of diagnoses including Autism Spectrum Disorders and many others? Or does it require merely being a scared parent without significant education on the science of autism and brain function, only to EXclude persons who do have that education?

I've worked with a very large number of children "on the spectrum," and with few exceptions, their parents' entire education on how the disability works and what its implications are has been from the (wildly misleading and full of falsehood) Internet or from other parents who are just as uneducated.

Take a look at the high number of deaths from measles in recent years, and then consider how the parents of those children feel about vaccination now.

[cjrivera]

Medical News: BMJ Reveals Money Trail Behind MMR-Autism Claim - in Pediatrics, Vaccines from MedPage Today

Report Alleges Money Motivated Doctor Behind Autism-Vaccine Scare

MMR Doctor ‘Planned to Make Millions,’ Journal Claims