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You are here: MacNN Forums > Hardware - Troubleshooting and Discussion > Mac Notebooks > Help me school this fool -)

Help me school this fool -)
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Lattimer
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Oct 22, 2003, 02:47 AM
 
My buddy and I are always debating our different views, and now that I'm a "Switcher", he's giving me crap about my 15AL. Here's his last email to me:

"HAHA!!!
Ok...lets break it on down!
First...watch this again...
http://www.ugo.com/channels/games/fe...ch/default.asp
Then continue with my email....

1. The only good game your powerbook will be playing
is Quake3, Warcraft3 and Pong...because most game
developers are smart enough to realize that Macs SUCK
for gaming. That 64MB stripped Mac version of the 9600
is nowhere near a comparison to the 9800 PRO. Does
your 9600 score over 420 frames per second in Q3? Its
more comparable to my old 64MB Geforce 3 as far as
games go. Worthless for tomarrows apps. Well..at least
Halo is finally coming to the Mac. Too bad it will
play like doodoo on the Powerbooks resolution...and
too bad I finished it over a year ago on my Xbox.

2. Your 1GB of PC2700 ISNT overclocked on a 200mhz
front side bus....hence becoming DDR400. Also...your
timings are not 5,2,2,CL2. Besides, whats the point of
having that much Ram when you:
a. Dont play games. Not only are the game choices
extremely slim...but playing at your native screen
resolution would be horrid.
b. Dont do serious Photoshop/Video editing.

3. Your 80GB hard drive is NOT a ATA-133, 7200RPM with
8MB CACHE! The speed of yours is comparable to the old
20GB 5400RMP drives. When talking hard drives...speed
matters...not size. Anything over 40 is worthless to
me. If I ever have a need for over 40GB...I would get
a Serial ATA RAID array....something that is NOT
available to your feeble "power" book.

4. Hmmmm..1.25Ghz. Sure..mhz doesnt mean
everything...but your Powerbook runs equivelent to my
2 year old Athlon that has been handed down to my
wife. Mac has lost ALL its advantages with the
exception of "neato" and overused brush metal
interface. Period. I hope you realize that someday.
The fad will end.
btw...my Athlon clocked at 3200+ speeds will whallop a
P4 3Ghz. Hmmmm..A P4 3GHZ has already been proven to
wallop the TOP OF THE LINE new G5. Therefore...your
powerbook is pretty much fodder in comparison.

5. Superdrives are already outdated. Writing DVD's at
2x is a total joke today in the PC world. Its
embarrasing. Not to mention that they only support ONE
format...its also an embarrassment. You could pick up
a the PC drive that writes at 4x for UNDER 100 bucks.
http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduc...106-914&DEPA=1
You could pick up the MUCH SUPERIOR, TWICE as fast
Sony DRX510UL for under 250!! Your superdrive is
nothing to brag about anymore. I dont have a DVD
burner...because I have no need. I have three
computers now...networked. If I need to backup
data...Ill move it to my file server.

6. Fiberoptic keyboard???? What the heck is that all
about. My keyboard works fine. What the heck would I
want to pay extra for a "fiberoptic" keyboard for.
Waste of money! Does it clean your fingernails for
you?
I guess it sure will look cool when your looking glow
under your DVD movie that your watching on the
airplane.

Wow...turns out that "Power"book is really just a
OVERpriced hunk of outdated hardware...that pretends
to be 37337!
"

Since I'm new to mac world, I don't have the usual ammo to use against him...let's fight for our powerbook's respect!
"God bless America. Let's save some of it." --Edward Abbey
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lunaticbunny
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Oct 22, 2003, 03:14 AM
 
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!! Fiber Optic Keyboard? Good one! Who else has one of these already? I'm gonna go order mine right now from the apple store.

Seriously, i never quite understood why PC ppl liked to throw around all these specs for... an ATI 9800 pro is just over $500cdn! $500 for a video card!! For what? to play video games?
     
Crusoe
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Oct 22, 2003, 03:30 AM
 
This guy is comparing a laptop to a desktop. Have him either find a comparable PC laptop with all the goodies, weight, size and price of the AlBooks or compare each his points to a Dual G5 which has the fastest bus, SATA 7200 HDs, 4x DVD-R an oh the 9800pro if you so desire, etc, etc.

It's a silly comparison unless you said your AlBook would smoke his "I have a small penis but a fast desktop PC."
If a group of mimes are miming a forest and one falls down, does he make a sound?
     
bfurtado
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Oct 22, 2003, 03:30 AM
 
Originally posted by lunaticbunny:
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!! Fiber Optic Keyboard? Good one! Who else has one of these already? I'm gonna go order mine right now from the apple store.

Seriously, i never quite understood why PC ppl liked to throw around all these specs for... an ATI 9800 pro is just over $500cdn! $500 for a video card!! For what? to play video games?
Better was his comparison between a 9600 and a 9800 Pro. Well of course the 9800 pro is faster, but not because its on a PC. i can get a mac version of the 9800 Pro too.

Brian
     
doubtingtom
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Oct 22, 2003, 04:00 AM
 
I agree with the above two, plus:

What is the point of having that much RAM? So you can run all the apps you like without fear of them crashing... That way you can burn with your 2x drive, and keep doing what you want to do with your computer without fear of wasting a DVD-R if it crashed...

Fiber Optic is for a lighted keyboard... they use fiber optics... which is just a technology that lights up when you pass charge through it (if I'm not mistaken)

No need for over twenty gigs? Tell him your sorry that it takes three of his networked computers to do the backup power of your one Powerbook, plus the 7k60, 7200 RPM drive is only $200 or so dollars away from being in your powerbook...

And maybe backing up isn't important on the PC because you aren't creating anything, but with the free iPhoto, iDVD, iMovie and such on your Mac, you can actually use it as a tool.

How can he say the PC is better than the Mac at games because he played a game on his Xbox... Talk about Apples and oranges. Buy an Xbox for your games, and tell him you use your computer to produce things, not distract yourself from a world of Registries, incompatibilities and beige boxes.

Tell him, in life, you get what you pay for...

Or just forget about it and enjoy the computer. If the mac fits your needs, very few have used both and turned back to windoze...
12 Powerbook rev. B
17 LCD
     
SplijinX
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Oct 22, 2003, 08:43 AM
 
I think your friend is trying to justify to himself why he doesn't need to get a cool powerbook for himself. It's like when your buddy gets a cool gadget and you want one too, or maybe something even better - maybe his wife won't let him get anything

Don't see how comparing desktops and notebooks are fair by any means, he definitely needs to go spec out some notebooks. If I'm not mistaken, there hasn't been any wide-screen PC laptops that aren't "desktop replacements" and a large heap of plastic crap.

Sure games are not Apple's forte, but sometimes you have to grow up and do some work.
Are those free-ranged animal crackers?
     
PoisonTooth
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Oct 22, 2003, 08:54 AM
 
Since this clown is comparing what might be the best notebook in the world to what appears to be a desktop machine, introduce him to Mr. Dual G5 and that'll be the end of that.
     
riverfreak
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Oct 22, 2003, 03:33 PM
 
Originally posted by Lattimer:

2. Your 1GB of PC2700 ISNT overclocked on a 200mhz
front side bus....hence becoming DDR400. Also...your
timings are not 5,2,2,CL2. Besides, whats the point of
having that much Ram when you:
a. Dont play games. Not only are the game choices
extremely slim...but playing at your native screen
resolution would be horrid.
b. Dont do serious Photoshop/Video editing.
Ooh yeah, the only applications that require lots of RAM are gaming and photoshop. Right! Well, I don't do either but I easily manage to use a full gig of ram just crunching data. That's why i usually use a machine with 8 gigs of ram and 18 gigs of swap. But I guess it's not gaming so it isn't really important.
     
filmmaker2002
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Oct 22, 2003, 03:38 PM
 
Wow, your friend needs a life...
It's just an ordinary day and it's all your
state of mind, at the end of the day, you
just gotta say it's alright!
     
ASIMO
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Oct 22, 2003, 04:17 PM
 
Jealousy bites.

Do not preoccupy yourself with your friend's inanity. It does you no good. Just nod and agree with him/her, but do not do so condescendingly, and remain friends. Enjoy your Mac, love your PB, whatever, but let the stupidity subside.

I think most young"ish" switchers experience this kind of backlash to various degrees. I did, some years back. Soon you will wear an armor of "I am too old to give a shiite about what others think of my platform of choice."
I, ASIMO.
     
HotSoup
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Oct 22, 2003, 04:50 PM
 
The guy is a jealous douche. Listen, f*** the comparisons, do YOU like the speed? Have you had many slow downs? Also, he is victim to the old and tired Megahertz Myth thing.

I say ignore him. Let him go on with his petty arguments. BUt I do agree the Mac is NOT a viable gaming platform. If you are a Hard-co gamer, at least have a seperate PC... or get a console. Game designers don't design for the Mac because most gamers on the PC side (naturally) and most of the time it just isn't worth spending the extra money for a Mac version.

P.S. Are you guys rich or something?
P.S.S. In some of his arguments, he is comparing a desktop, Top o line P4 with a laptop G4. THat's just stupid.
     
djjava
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Oct 22, 2003, 04:55 PM
 
just hit him over the head with the 15" Al and shut him up. He's is apparently an undereducated nimrod who likes to compare two items that are just too different. I agree, if he wants to compare a pc to a mc, compare teh top-of-line items, not a top of the line notebook to a top of the line desktop.

This guy sounds like the people who still think Al Gore won the election in 2000... Just shut him up, and tell him to get over it...
http://www.pardonmyenglish.com "Spreading the Conservative Word...In English Only."
RevA PB17 with Panther, Lacie d2 160gb, 4G iPod, Vectorworks 10.5
     
nobitacu
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Oct 22, 2003, 06:29 PM
 
Your friend is a dumb ass by just trying to compare a laptop with PC desktops. Is he on crack? What a dumb ass that really should be smacked over his head. 9800 pro faster than 9600? well, no dumb ass, any kid will even know that. But does PC laptops have a 9800 Pro card in them? HELL NO! Than why is he comparing it to the Powerbook if none of the PC laptops has it? Tell him to find a PC laptop that can out dual the Powerbook than come talk to me. If he wants to compare desktops, the Powermac G5 already does better than top of the line P4. Oh, yea, he is also a dumb ass to not know that a Power G5 2 Ghz will perform like a top of the line P4, if not, better. It's not the number that counts on the CPU, it's what the CPU does that counts. He's a disgrace to all of the people in the computer world. Even more of a disgrace to ex pc users like me who used to built computers for fun and troubleshoot them. Did he say don't do video editing on Macs??? again, is he on crack again? Macs are where most people do their video editing on if he wants to compare desktops! Powerbooks will work with video editing as well. Ask him if he knows anyone int he world who will even think about doing professional video on a PC laptop. What??? we don't have 9800 Pro? is that what he's trying to say? Well... once again, that just proves how much of a dumb ass he is. we DO have 9800 Pro for Powermacs. Wow, I haven't been this mad for quite some time. him!

Damn, if it's one thing I hate most in my life, it would be a computer dumb ass like him. Just shoot him to end his worthless life.

Ming
( Last edited by nobitacu; Oct 22, 2003 at 06:43 PM. )
A Proud Mac User Since: 03/24/03
Apple Computer: MacBook 2.0GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 3 GB Memory, 120 GB HD
     
bigben1024
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Oct 22, 2003, 11:27 PM
 
Ming sooths us with his kind, gentle words... ''

this is a pig: ^(00)^
can you see it too?
<fancy signature here>
     
nobitacu
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Oct 22, 2003, 11:54 PM
 
Originally posted by bigben1024:
Ming sooths us with his kind, gentle words... ''

this is a pig: ^(00)^
can you see it too?
Thanks, I just had to get that out of my system. I'm all better now.

Ming
A Proud Mac User Since: 03/24/03
Apple Computer: MacBook 2.0GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 3 GB Memory, 120 GB HD
     
bigben1024
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Oct 23, 2003, 01:46 AM
 
glad to hear it ming.
we all need to go on a rant every now and then.
I find myself on rants more often than not some days...
Just means I'm thinking critically!
<fancy signature here>
     
The Jackalope
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Oct 23, 2003, 01:49 AM
 
Tell him to suck your dick and you don't have time to reply to his "37337" email because you are ****ing working instead of playing games on your mac. Oh, and tell him his wife is ugly too.

Honestly, who gives a rat's ass what he thinks about it? If games are all he cares about, direct him to an X-Box forum.
     
Sarc
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Oct 23, 2003, 08:34 AM
 
Obviously he is a comparing the AlBook to a High end gaming rig.
They are obviously not comparable.

Tell him in you reply that indeed he is right. So you decided to get a Dual 2 GHz G5 with a 1GHz frontside bus. The Radeon 9800 Pro. 500 GB's of SATA storage, a 23in HD cinema display and 4 gigs of RAM.
:: frankenstein / lcd-less TiBook / 1GHz / radeon 9000 64MB / 1GB RAM / w/ext. 250GB fw drive / noname usb bluetooth dongle / d-link usb 2.0 pcmcia card / X.5.8
:: unibody macbook pro / 2.4 Ghz C2D / 6GB RAM / dell 2407wfp - X.6.3
     
nobitacu
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Oct 23, 2003, 04:19 PM
 
Originally posted by Sarc:
Obviously he is a comparing the AlBook to a High end gaming rig.
They are obviously not comparable.

Tell him in you reply that indeed he is right. So you decided to get a Dual 2 GHz G5 with a 1GHz frontside bus. The Radeon 9800 Pro. 500 GB's of SATA storage, a 23in HD cinema display and 4 gigs of RAM.
That will kick his PC computer's ass for sure!

Ming
A Proud Mac User Since: 03/24/03
Apple Computer: MacBook 2.0GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 3 GB Memory, 120 GB HD
     
beefstu01
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Oct 23, 2003, 05:34 PM
 
So I've gone about trying to find the top of the line PC laptop. I think I found it.

Alienware 51m Extreme Laptop
1-Year AlienCare Toll-Free 24/7 Phone Support with Depot Service
Microsoft� Windows� XP Home Edition
Area-51m Case with 16.1" UltraXGA 1600x1200 LCD Display - Cyborg Green
Intel� Pentium� 4 Processor 3.2GHz 800MHz FSB w/ 512KB Cache
SiS648FX + SiS963L AGP8X Chipset
1024MB DDR PC-2700 - 2x512 SO-DIMMs
Hitachi 60GB 7200 RPM ATA100 with 8MB Cache
AREA-51M ATI Mobility Radeon 9600 Module with 128MB DDR
Sound-Blaster Pro Compatible 3D Audio
2x1x8x DVD-RW / 16x10x24x CD-RW Combo w/Software
Integrated 10/100Mb Ethernet NIC
56K Modem with V.90 Technology
Bluetooth USB Adapter
Microsoft Works Suite 2003
Bonus 12-Month Subscription to Computer Games Magazine!
Free Alienware� T-Shirt - Black
AlienAutopsy: Automated Technical Support Request System

Price: About $3653

My PowerBook

1.25GHz PowerPC G4
512MB DDR333 SDRAM
ATI Radeon Mobility 9600 w/ 64 MB
80GB Ultra ATA Drive@4200rpm
Super Drive (DVD-R/CD-RW)
Country Kit/Airport Extreme
BkLit Keyboard/Mac OS

Price: Mine- $2389, Normally about $2700ish

Okay, now granted I've only got a half gig of ram in there, but that'll be remedied by a little $130 upgrade from Crucial. There are a couple other things to look at too-

Alienware 51m-
1 Type II PCMCIA Slots
3 USB 2.0 Ports & 1 IEEE-1394 (Firewire 400) Port (4 PIN)
Dimensions (W)13.8" x (D)11.4" x (H)1.6"
Weight 7.5lbs without Battery

Apple PowerBook 15"

Size and weight

* Height: 1.1 inches (2.8 cm)
* Width: 13.7 inches (34.8 cm)
* Depth: 9.5 inches (24.1 cm)
* Weight: 5.6 pounds (2.5 kg) with battery and optical drive installed

1 Type II PCMCIA Slot
2 USB 2.0 Ports
1 FireWire 400 port
1 FireWire 800 port
Integrated wireless connectivity

Now, granted I'm comparing Apples (haha... laugh... joke... sorry, bad pun) to oranges here, but you can get the general jist of it. Though the PowerBook may be slower overall (c'mon, there is no way in hell a 1.25 Ghz G4 can beat a 3.2 Ghz P4 overall), it can still keep pace. Also, one is built specifically for gaming, the other for productivity. Probably a better system to compare it to is this one-

Alienware 51m:Sentia Extreme

1-Year AlienCare Toll-Free 24/7 Phone Support with Depot Service
Microsoft� Windows� XP Home Edition
Alienware Exclusive Area-51m: Sentia Case - Cyborg Green
Intel� Pentium� Processor M with 1 MB Cache - 1.7GHz 400MHz FSB
Intel� 855GM+ICH4M Chipset DDR
Intel� PRO/Wireless 2100 network connection
1024MB DDR PC-2100 - 2x512 SO-DIMMs
80GB 4200 RPM ATA100
14.1"SXGA+ 1400x1050 LCD Display
Intel� Extreme Graphics 2 technology
Sound-Blaster Pro Compatible 3D Audio
2x1x8x DVD-RW / 16x10x24x CD-RW Combo w/Software
Integrated 10/100Mb Ethernet NIC
56K Modem with V.90 Technology
Bluetooth USB Adapter
Bonus 12-Month Subscription to Computer Games Magazine!

This machine is also bigger and heavier than the PowerBooks, costs more, and is very comparable to our mobile powerhouses (they also get worse battery lives).

PC or Mac? I like Mac, but let your friend decide. I love my PowerBook and wouldn't get anything else.
     
CobraNT
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Oct 23, 2003, 06:02 PM
 
Someone needs to tell your 'so-called' friend that there is more to computers than video games. I switched to Mac because I got tired of the constant reboots, blue screens, virus issues, and having to buy an upgrade for my OS whenever MS decided it needed to recover the cost of the bug fixes they had been working on.
     
nobitacu
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Oct 23, 2003, 06:51 PM
 
Originally posted by CobraNT:
Someone needs to tell your 'so-called' friend that there is more to computers than video games. I switched to Mac because I got tired of the constant reboots, blue screens, virus issues, and having to buy an upgrade for my OS whenever MS decided it needed to recover the cost of the bug fixes they had been working on.
Very well said, this is also some of my main reasons why I choose to switch over to Mac.

Ming
A Proud Mac User Since: 03/24/03
Apple Computer: MacBook 2.0GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 3 GB Memory, 120 GB HD
     
Lattimer  (op)
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Oct 24, 2003, 06:46 AM
 
My reply to his email:

Dude,

I was planning on counterpointing each item you
brought up, but it just wasn't worth the effort. So
I'm taking this approach:

First of all, you are comparing Apples(tm) to oranges
here. Of course your Desktop is going to be faster
than my laptop, no surprise there....

Second,

If I wanted to play games all day, I'd fire up my P4
2.5 destop running WinXP Pro. I went mac to be more
productive with my time and loose the headaches of
viruses, crashes, and contstant OS updates to fix the
latest "security leak". I've learned that there's
more to life than playing games and making fun little
pictures.

Third,

I EMPLORE you to find a PC laptop that has all the
features of my powerbook (save the lighted keyboard
and slot load drive) and can still weigh under 6 lbs,
run silently, and doesn't burn your skin because its
running so darn hot. All for under 3 grand.

Also,

I would like to add that OSX is the greatest operating
system out there. It's UNIX based (READ:ROCK SOLID),
everything works seamlessly and makes complete sense,
and looks better than anything SANS BRUSHED METAL that
windoze has to offer. As you know, I have plenty of
backround on Windows, Unix, and Linux to know the
differences between MacOS and Windows and speak
smartly on them.

You just need to open your eyes my friend! You're too focused in on this Uber PC
geekiness persona...Bill Gates has successfully
asimilated you into one of his following sheep. Open
your mind to the idea that there might be something
more to Macintosh than you're aware of. Just give it
a fair shot. I know for me it was hard, but once I
analyzed my true needs for a computer, I realized that
Apple had everything I was looking for, right in their
little boutique store in the mall. Trust me when I
tell you that you just need to do some more research
on what you are trying to prove your point on.

Some things to look at:

iLife Apps: iTunes, iMovie, iDVD, iPhoto, etc:
http://www.apple.com/ilife/

Seamlessly integrated- Use music from iTunes to add
to your iMovie, then burn in iDVD and use an iPhoto
picture for the cover of the case. Simple as that.

.Mac:
http://www.mac.com/1/iTour/index.html

Outstanding online service where you can check:

Your Email
Your To-Do list
Your Calendar
Your Online File Storage (iDISK)
Your Home Bookmarks (Favorites)
Tons more!

There's more to life than hardcore gaming.

It's like going from a "Riced Out" Honda Civic (Your
Desktop) to a Porsche Boxter. (Powerbook) I'll take
refinement and class over .2 seconds in the quarter
mile any day.

P.S. The lighted keyboard is one of the most useful
things on my powerbook. Obviosly, you haven't used
one yet. (I say yet because I guarantee that in the
next couple of years, PC Laptops will steal the
technology and implement it)
( Last edited by Lattimer; Oct 24, 2003 at 07:12 PM. )
"God bless America. Let's save some of it." --Edward Abbey
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andretan
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Oct 24, 2003, 09:03 AM
 
Jealously. Definitely sounds like it.

mac.goodies webstore / Switched to an iBook in November 2002. Never looking back.
iBook R.I.P. 20 Nov 2002 - 2 Aug 2005
Hello Leopard! On iMac 17" Intel Core Duo 1.83GHz 2GB, iPod 5th gen 30GB and iPhone
     
   
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