[freudling]

Meaning, someone who thinks they are overly special and smart because they did a Graduate or Doctorate Degree. I have had to work with a few guys over the past few weeks on some projects and they meet the aforementioned definition. They seem to have some sort of Elitist complex, like everyone is less of a person, even though one may have the same education or better than them...

One guy last week... He TALKS DOWN TO YOU. He TALKS OVER YOU. Guess what his Doc is in? Psychology.

[Amorya]

But... that's the only reason I'm doing my PhD! You can't take away the sense of smug self-satisfaction, or what would be the point?

Amorya

[MacosNerd]

I think you can run into Elitists in any sector, or segment of life. I've run into a number of them, where they look down at you if you voted for a certain candidate, or come from a certain section of the country. They believe that if your not from the northeast or the west coast, you must be an uneducated ignorant sop who has no right to vote.

[OreoCookie]

I don't want to be nitpicky here, but nobody holds a `post doc degree', a being a post doc simply means he was conducting more research after his PhD.

On the other hand, elitists are not necessarily people with PhDs, it's something that can happen in any group where you need experts of kind. Auto shops, IT support, lawyers, etc.

[design219]

It's relative.

[mindwaves]

My coworker constantly brags about his PhD in material science. I don't like him for that very reason.

[osiris]

My ex was a wise ass hot ass MBA from the #1 biz school in America where she graduated #2 in her class. And everyday she made me aware of it.

[Jawbone54]

Academic elitists have a way of talking down to everyone they encounter. Not everyone with a master's or doctorate are snobs, but quite a few believe their education lifts them to some plane of awareness that anyone with a simple bachelors or no college degree at all are incapable of comprehending.

There's a family I'm fairly close to that constantly have this smirk on their faces when I speak about educational issues, especially the irrelevance of college in particular fields. They always kind of smile and start their response with, "Well, it'd be nice if it worked that way, but..."

I've learned to ignore it, but every once in a while it does grate on the nerves.

[Chuckit]

Heck, I've known people who were that way with bachelor's degrees. That's just downright weird. "Oh, I've got a BA in art history. I bet none of the rest of you have anything like that. Oh, you do? Uh…well…mine's better."

[Dakar the Fourth]

I like to get Elitist about my Bachelors in Art.

[Railroader]

My brother-in-law was quite the elitist after earning his doctorate in clinical psychology and then interning/fellowshipping at Dartmouth University. He'd attempt to play mind games with everyone. Eventually everyone simply ignored him. Then, when he went actual job hunting and seeing what his final wages were going to be, including his job insecurity... let's just say he's a bit more humble than most "educated" people.

EDIT: Regarding what people said about elitism in everything. Near where I grew up, there's a high school district that for years has been bragging about their "far superior" education for decades. Someone did an semi-informal check on post-HS education degree attainment and it came out that the number of people earning doctorates was three times higher at a school that was long considered "inferior". People can be elitist in ANYTHING. Your liable to see it far more than is prudent. I mean, c'mon, I use a MAC, not a winblow$ peecee.

[Chongo]

Education≠ Intelligence
Some of the stupidest people I have worked with have PHDs.

[osiris]

I get all elitist with my high school equivalency diploma from DeVry.

[Chuckit]

Originally Posted by Chongo 

Education≠ Intelligence
Some of the stupidest people I have worked with have PHDs.

And Jobs, Wozniak and Gates were dropouts.

[osiris]

That is one amazing fact. The world pretty much changed because of those three.

[Dakar the Fourth]

Originally Posted by Chuckit 

And Jobs, Wozniak and Gates were dropouts.

Of course, look where they dropped out from.

[wolfen]

I think we can all relate to the elitism trait in some way. I think I'm better than anyone who watches the Jerry Springer Show, for example. BECAUSE I AM!

But seriously, I've found the best way to bring academic elitism down a notch is to recognize that these guys typically have a narrow window of expertise, and everything else is just opinion. You call them on it by simply asking "Oh? What kind of research have you done on that?" whenever they start going on about their opinions. It's polite, non threatening, and makes it clear that you respect their views only so far as they are INFORMED views and not just opinion.

I ask that a few times, and they stop boasting around me because they don't wanna be called on it. If they start to talk about how they haven't done research "But I know what I'm talking about" then they set the bar for you nice and low. And your opinions become as reasonable as theirs. The most important thing that irks such people is if you stay really calm and inquisitive.

[Railroader]

Originally Posted by wolfen 

I think we can all relate to the elitism trait in some way. I think I'm better than anyone who watches the Jerry Springer Show, for example. BECAUSE I AM!

But seriously, I've found the best way to bring academic elitism down a notch is to recognize that these guys typically have a narrow window of expertise, and everything else is just opinion. You call them on it by simply asking "Oh? What kind of research have you done on that?" whenever they start going on about their opinions. It's polite, non threatening, and makes it clear that you respect their views only so far as they are INFORMED views and not just opinion.

Indeed. My way of handling them when they go on and on about how great they are is to sometimes ask them what they think of some topic that is far removed from their education. For example, if I am talking with a MBA, I ask what they think about the research on cellular structures of steel involving various alloys and resulting strengths or weaknesses for one over the other (or some other such nonsense, not that I know anything about the topic, hopefully they never call my bluff.) I usually just get the blank stare.

[Jawbone54]

This is probably going to receive a TL;DR from someone, but you get the point.

Famous college dropouts:
Steve Jobs
Steve Wozniak
Bill Gates
Rush Limbaugh
Michael Dell
Ted Turner
Woody Allen

Look HERE for some billionaire dropouts.

Famous elementary or high school dropouts:
Ansel Adams
Jane Austen
William Blake
Humphrey Bogart
Sonny Bono
Marlon Brando
Simon Cowell
Princess Diana
Celine Dion
Nick Faldo
Henry Ford
Benjamin Franklin
Laird Hamilton
J.B. Hunt
Louis L'Amour
Jerry Lewis
Dean Martin
Frank Sinatra
Herman Melville
Florence Nightingale
Pele
Nora Roberts
Quentin Tarantino
Walt Whitman
Peter Jennings

Not all of them are noted for their intellectual prowess, but at least they were successful. There are MASSIVE lists to be found out there.

[Dakar the Fourth]

Can you really count people from before the turn of the 20th century, artists, or athletes?

[lexapro]

PhDs know more about their topic then most. Calling them smug elitists when they don't entertain your pseudo-science position is just you going back into your cave and licking your wounds.

[Jawbone54]

Originally Posted by Dakar the Fourth 

Can you really count people from before the turn of the 20th century, artists, or athletes?

Sure.

[Dakar the Fourth]

Originally Posted by lexapro 

PhDs know more about their topic then most. Calling them smug elitists when they don't entertain your pseudo-science position is just you going back into your cave and licking your wounds.

Thanks for stopping by.

[Jawbone54]

Originally Posted by lexapro 

PhDs know more about their topic then most. Calling them smug elitists when they don't entertain your pseudo-science position is just you going back into your cave and licking your wounds.

Is that you, Doctor?

[Dakar the Fourth]

Originally Posted by Jawbone54 

Sure.

Why is that? Is there some great boon college would have done for Faldo's golf game or Pelé's soccer game? Dean Martin and Frankie's voices would have been EVEN better?

We're talking about intellectual elitists here. You're missing the point.

[Jawbone54]

Ha..whoops. [EDIT]

[Andy8]

Originally Posted by Chongo 

Education≠ Intelligence

I dropped out of school at age 16.

I joined Mensa some years ago

[Dakar the Fourth]

Originally Posted by Jawbone54 

Ha..whoops. [EDIT]

Don't worry, I caught that anyway.

[Dakar the Fourth]

Originally Posted by Andy8 

I dropped out of school at age 16.

I joined Mensa some years ago

This is so going in the Halo thread for mockery purposes.
Not really.

[Jawbone54]

Originally Posted by Dakar the Fourth 

Why is that? Is there some great boon college would have done for Faldo's golf game or Pelé's soccer game? Dean Martin and Frankie's voices would have been EVEN better?

We're talking about intellectual elitists here. You're missing the point.

Perhaps a lot of the names there could've been left out, but the point is that people can be successful (and even not ignorant) without having years upon years of schooling.

I've met quite a few people who were totally detached from society (and very awkward) because they've spent their lives buried in academia. It's one thing to read about life; it's another to live it.

Obviously some fields require extensive education. I wouldn't want a high-school dropout performing my surgery next week, but I wouldn't mind hiring a dropout graphic designer to construct a web-site for me.

Science and medicine requires extensive education. Anything business or art-related is best learned through experience. Much of what I learned in all of my fine arts classes could've been discovered through a quick google search.

[Jawbone54]

Originally Posted by Dakar the Fourth 

Don't worry, I caught that anyway.

Me = not surprised.

You and your lightning refreshes.
Bet you didn't learn THAT in school.

[Dakar the Fourth]

Originally Posted by Jawbone54 

Obviously some fields require extensive education.

Bingo. These people are arrogant about the time, effort, and money they have invested. This doesn't make them any less assholish for being condescending, but to a certain degree I see where they are coming from.

[Dakar the Fourth]

Originally Posted by Jawbone54 

Me = not surprised.

You and your lightning refreshes.
Bet you didn't learn THAT in school.

If it had been truly lightning, I would have gotten that post ahead of yours, rather than after it.

[Jawbone54]

Originally Posted by Dakar the Fourht

Bingo. These people are arrogant about the time, effort, and money they have invested. This doesn't make them any less assholish for being condescending, but to a certain degree I see where they are coming from.

Compensating for their lack of true self-esteem, which they didn't find in years of study?

[Dakar the Fourth]

No, just naturally feeling a sense of accomplishment and pride for all their hard work. Unless you're under the impression every condescending person lacks self-esteem.

[Jawbone54]

Originally Posted by Dakar the Fourth 

No, just naturally feeling a sense of accomplishment and pride for all their hard work. Unless you're under the impression every condescending person lacks self-esteem.

So feeling accomplishment and pride can only be expressed by some people by treating others like peasants?

Not every condescending person lacks self esteem, but in my experience many do.

Nitpicker.

[lexapro]

Originally Posted by Dakar the Fourth 

Thanks for stopping by.

My point proven perfectly.

[Dakar the Fourth]

What pseudo-science position of mine weren't you entertaining?

[Dakar the Fourth]

Originally Posted by Jawbone54 

So feeling accomplishment and pride can only be expressed by some people by treating others like peasants?

I see what you did there. HAHAHAHA. Only.

You know the real answer to this.

Originally Posted by Jawbone54 

Not every condescending person lacks self esteem, but in my experience many do.

Nitpicker.

Just a Realist.

Look at it this way: There are many arrogant people in this world, these people just stand-out because they have a leg to stand on.

[finboy]

Originally Posted by OreoCookie 

I don't want to be nitpicky here, but nobody holds a `post doc degree', a being a post doc simply means he was conducting more research after his PhD.

On the other hand, elitists are not necessarily people with PhDs, it's something that can happen in any group where you need experts of kind. Auto shops, IT support, lawyers, etc.

Right. He's conducting more research after finishing his PhD, just as ALL PhDs are expected to do.

And, folks are too right, elitists are everywhere. In retail, IT, auto repair, tree surgery, bait shacks (!), everywhere.

[Wiskedjak]

Elitism isn't limited to academics; just take a look at the typical McDonald's manager relative to his/her employees.

[freudling]

Good comments everyone.

True, it takes much effort and money to get advanced education, and I have had to go through it. The interesting thing is when you have to work with people from all different areas of study on something that is sort of unrelated to what we all studied. As I have experienced in the past two weeks, to couple "elitists" simply are not easy to work with in this capacity and slow things down. It is not surprising as they have existed in some narrowly confined academic enclave. However, they best start stretching out and take notice that there are other people who come from different backgrounds with different goals and approaches.

Unfortunately, they may remain, for the rest of their lives, in their little boxes. The rest of us see reality for what it is, not through some narrowly confined academic filtration system. Why are some more adaptable and flexible than others? That is, why are some "elitists" and others not, particularly when the comparison is between those with academic parity?

[Dakar the Fourth]

I think the real question is whether they are gigantic pricks to each other, particularly with the same set of credentials in a given field.

[MarkLT1]

Some perspective from a person who earned a PhD..

Yes, there are PhDs with huge egos. Yes, there are PhDs who try to use their title outside of its scope. I have run into my fair share. But as others have pointed out this happens in almost every group out there.

Due to the field I obtained my PhD in, many people become curious and start asking questions. The subject I studied, happens to be something I am quite passionate about, and is something I am now very knowledgeable about (who wouldn't be after devoting one's life to a subject for 6 years). This, coupled with the fact that I am quite proud (and shocked by) the fact that I did accomplish my PhD, I will talk at length, with a certain air of authority for that particular subject (when asked of course). It is not a matter of being arrogant, or boastful, but is simply is due to the fact that 1) I do know a great deal about the particular subject, and 2) it happens to be something I am very interested in.

Where things get sticky, is that there are a bunch of armchair quarterbacks out there who think they know a great deal about the particular subject. They will go on, and on based on something they read off the interweb, or that their father-in-law's uncle told them. Many of the "facts" they present show a complete lack of knowledge of the subject. What is annoying, is that when I attempt to explain why something they present is simply not the case (typically in a very non confrontational way), I start to run into hostility, and the kinds of personal attacks like "Just because you have a PhD, doesnt mean you know all." etc.. I'll be the first to admit that there is a whole lot more in this world that I dont know or understand, but I do know the subject I studied for 6 years (10 if you include undergrad).

If that makes me an arrogant prick to some, so be it. I took 6 years of my life to study something that interests me greatly. And if you ask about my opinion on the subject, I'll give it, and back it up.

[freudling]

MarkLT1:

You are missing the point: forget about discussing things with people in relation to what you studied, and start thinking about how you would react when you are put on a project with people from all different backgrounds working on something unrelated to all of these backgrounds. It is now not so much about what you studied, but how well you understand the project's objectives and how well you get on with people. The problem is that academic pricks map on their feeling of "authority" onto everything else they do.

I have said this many times. Unless we are really doing some pressure cooker job, like surgery, cancer research, engineering, etc., work is not that hard. It is people that always get in the way. Always the friction. There is always some prick around the corner. In this case, there are two academic pricks messing up the project.

[Dakar the Fourth]

Did you get a PhD in creating suspense?

[Jawbone54]

Originally Posted by Dakar the Fourth 

Did you get a PhD in creating suspense?

Seconded. I kept reading each paragraph hoping for that moment of revelation.

[wolfen]

Originally Posted by freudling 

There is always some prick around the corner. In this case, there are two academic pricks messing up the project.

Unless you're curing cancer or solving world hunger, just give them lots of rope and chill out. No use blowing a vein over it.

Defer to their wisdom, play dumb, and let them take all the credit when it turns to poo. I do that at my internship all the time when 3 staff are pulling me 5 ways.

[ghporter]

I think I may have a minor bit of an explanation for why so many people with advanced educations are snobby. I had to work hard to get my minor changed from math to "American Studies" when working on my BS. I'm VERY glad I did. I had to take a couple of literature and history classes, and I had to take an ART class! My "art" class was "Appreciation of Music," which sounds like underwater basketweaving without the snorkel but it was anything but that. The prof was an actual Swing musician who'd done pickup gigs with Benny Goodman. The guy had a degree in music history, and another in music theory, and he was teaching a night class in "this is what to listen for, this is what this means, this is why they did this..." for a bunch of undergrads. I loved it! I also got history to help me put stuff in perspective, and a class called "American Studies" which may have been better called "Socialism in America in the 19th and 20th Centuries." LOTS of perspective there, from where the labor movement came from to what it really meant 50 years ago and today.

In other words, I got a "well rounded" education in college.

Now, look at what your average MBA gets. Accounting. Business planning. How to build financial support. Advertising. Not one non-business reading assignment. No liberal arts at all. NO SCIENCE. They get a TECHNICAL DEGREE, and think they are special because it's a post-grad degree. Physicians can be that way too; the physician that has been humbled BEFORE med school often makes a better healer than one that was "top of his/her class" in everything for this reason.

All of my professors right now have a broad and varied background BEFORE getting their PhDs, or a specialty area of practice and no PhD. Likewise, the good ones in the school I got my prereqs for this program were well rounded people who provided more than just the facts, but context and perspective. Without perspective, all you get with an advanced degree is a very well focused idiot.

[BRussell]

But ghporter, everyone who goes on to an advanced degree, be it MBA or PhD or MD, gets that Bachelor's degree first. And all advanced degrees are highly focused technical degrees.

I'm a professor and a PhD, and I think it's the job that does something to your ego. You're at the top of the food chain in your own little fish pond, you have no real boss to put you in your place, and every day you have people hanging on every word you say and writing it down. It's not the best environment to keep you humble. Physicians are in a similar situation, and also are well-known for having many egotistical pricks among their ranks.

Maybe there's a support group for highly-educated egotistical pricks.