[The Final Dakar]

Why does Russian state media have better access to the Oval Office than US media?

[subego]

In regards to that, this was handed to the Press Secretary.

We write to protest the limits on access currently barring photographers who cover the White House. We hope this letter will serve as the first step in removing these restrictions and, therefore, we also request a meeting with you to discuss this critical issue further.

Journalists are routinely being denied the right to photograph or videotape the President while he is performing his official duties. As surely as if they were placing a hand over a journalist’s camera lens, officials in this administration are blocking the public from having an independent view of important functions of the Executive Branch of government.

To be clear, we are talking about Presidential activities of a fundamentally public nature. To be equally clear, we are not talking about open access to the residence or to areas restricted, for example, for national security purposes.

The apparent reason for closing certain events to photographers is that these events have been deemed “private.” That rationale, however, is undermined when the White House contemporaneously releases its own photograph of a so-called private event through social media. The restrictions imposed by the White House on photographers covering these events, followed by the routine release by the White House of photographs made by government employees of these same events, is an arbitrary restraint and unwarranted interference on legitimate newsgathering activities. You are, in effect, replacing independent photojournalism with visual press releases.

I imagine everyone's figured out the twist by now. This was from 2013.

[The Final Dakar]

Would it be unfair to point out that the entire Oval Office/Russian Photographer thing would be something the right would have crucified Obama if it happened under him?

Edit: I should clarify I'm talking about both the security risk and being surprised the photos were published

[Laminar]

Originally Posted by subego 

I imagine everyone's figured out the twist by now. This was from 2013.

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by subego 

I imagine everyone's figured out the twist by now. This was from 2013.

Is there a point to posting this? I agree its bullshit no matter who does it, but asides from a tedious "both sides" argument, I think it misses the reasoning behind the criticism re: Trump.

[subego]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

Is there a point to posting this? I agree its bullshit no matter who does it, but asides from a tedious "both sides" argument, I think it misses the reasoning behind the criticism re: Trump.

I apologize. This wasn't my cleanest drive to the basket.

I'm not trying to tar the Democrats. I was attempting to present a case the threat on display may not be existential.

[andi*pandi]

The sense I get from 2013 example is the press were complaining the white house was less about obstruction or hiding things, but omg, the white house PR dept is releasing their own nice pictures instead of letting news photogs in to take nice pictures, which get picked up by the AP and thus get photographers PAID. The obama white house had great pix they used on social media.

Were obama's pix curated for best image/PR? sure. Is it possible they were hiding things/being obstructionist? Maybe.

But I don't feel it's the same as blocking press/ info entirely, only allowing certain news media to have press conference access, walking out of interviews, or arresting journalists for asking questions.

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by subego 

I apologize. This wasn't my cleanest drive to the basket.

I'm not trying to tar the Democrats. I was attempting to present a case the threat on display may not be existential.

Ah. Good explanation. Now let me give you mine: Closing the meeting with the country your accused to having ties with looks shady. But it gets better. Compared to the photos Russia released, the White House read out and in house photos that were released AFTER Russia's fail to disclose Trump met with Kislyak - the same guy Trump claims he never met before, that Sessions forgot to mention in his confirmation hearing, that Flynn and Kushner met in December and forgot to disclose, that Carter Page also met.

We only know he was at the White House because RUSSIA posted the photos. It's unreal. That's why the lack of access is troubling.

If there's nothing there, it's a really bad look.

[Laminar]

It would look as bad as some repeated DNS queries.

[The Final Dakar]

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[subego]

Originally Posted by andi*pandi 

The sense I get from 2013 example is the press were complaining the white house was less about obstruction or hiding things, but omg, the white house PR dept is releasing their own nice pictures instead of letting news photogs in to take nice pictures, which get picked up by the AP and thus get photographers PAID. The obama white house had great pix they used on social media.

Were obama's pix curated for best image/PR? sure. Is it possible they were hiding things/being obstructionist? Maybe.

But I don't feel it's the same as blocking press/ info entirely, only allowing certain news media to have press conference access, walking out of interviews, or arresting journalists for asking questions.

I agree there are fundamental differences in the examples, but if this was a tiff over royalties, it's exceedingly sleazy for them to pull out the "press access is fundamental to democracy" card.

[subego]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

Ah. Good explanation. Now let me give you mine: Closing the meeting with the country your accused to having ties with looks shady. But it gets better. Compared to the photos Russia released, the White House read out and in house photos that were released AFTER Russia's fail to disclose Trump met with Kislyak - the same guy Trump claims he never met before, that Sessions forgot to mention in his confirmation hearing, that Flynn and Kushner met in December and forgot to disclose, that Carter Page also met.

We only know he was at the White House because RUSSIA posted the photos. It's unreal. That's why the lack of access is troubling.

If there's nothing there, it's a really bad look.

These are all good points. I wasn't considering the Kislyak angle.

[subego]

Rumored Spicer 2.0.

[Cap'n Tightpants]

A psilf?

[The Final Dakar]

I feel like that was floated a while back.

[Chongo]

Originally Posted by subego 

Rumored Spicer 2.0.

Prolly not. Trump is contemplating ending the daily pressers.

In other news, it looks like Callista Gingrich will be named ambassador to the Holy See.

[subego]

Originally Posted by Chongo 

Prolly not. Trump is contemplating ending the daily pressers.

He's welcome to try I guess.

[andi*pandi]

Ways to look like a dictator, step 1: End daily pressers

[subego]

Originally Posted by andi*pandi 

Ways to look like a dictator, step 1: End daily pressers

Dictators end the daily lives of people in the press.

Likewise, this is turtling. The way to look like a dictator about to get sandwiched between two foreign armies is to turtle.

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by subego 

Dictators end the daily lives of people in the press.

Likewise, this is turtling. The way to look like a dictator about to get sandwiched between two foreign armies is to turtle.

Poor response. You don't jump from free press to murdered journalists, though. It's a slow boil.

[Laminar]

Originally Posted by subego 

Dictators end the daily lives of people in the press.

Oh, like this?

[andi*pandi]

I imagined actually killing the free press would be somewhere around step 17? After arresting them but way before outlawing the poor owning property.

[subego]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

Poor response. You don't jump from free press to murdered journalists, though. It's a slow boil.

I'll withdraw my poor attempt at language policing and will endeavor to replace it with a better one.

Trump is entertaining the idea of cancelling pressers as a response to being so staggeringly incompetent he tripped over his own dick.

Multiple times.

Any resemblance to actual dictatorships, either living or dead, is purely coincidental.

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by subego 

I'll withdraw my poor attempt at language policing and will endeavor to replace it with a better one.

Trump is entertaining the idea of cancelling pressers as a response to being so staggeringly incompetent he tripped over his own dick.

Multiple times.

Any resemblance to actual dictatorships, either living or dead, is purely coincidental.

He's tripping over his dick because he lies. You cancel the pressers so you don't get called out on your lies. Same in a dictatorship.

[andi*pandi]

"Donald, the Bumbling Dictator" sounds like a farce movie from the 30s.

[Snow-i]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

He's tripping over his dick because he lies. You cancel the pressers so you don't get called out on your lies. Same in a dictatorship.

Dictators usually have their own PR departments, much like Obama did when he kept free press photo journalists from taking pictures instead favoring his own PR approved pictures. By your metric, Obama was a dictator?

I'm not making the case he was, I'm making the case that your rhetoric isn't supported by the situation.

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by Snow-i 

Dictators usually have their own PR departments, much like Obama did when he kept free press photo journalists from taking pictures instead favoring his own PR approved pictures. By your metric, Obama was a dictator?

Actually, that's your metric.

[Snow-i]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

Actually, that's your metric.

Really? Where did I introduce it? As far as I can tell, doing the same things as a dictator de facto makes you one according to your last 2 posts. Or did I misread your implication that canceling the daily pressers = dictatorship?

[andi*pandi]

I said that, and was being only slightly hyperbolic.

[subego]

Originally Posted by andi*pandi 

"Donald, the Bumbling Dictator" sounds like a farce movie from the 30s.

The Bigly Dictator (1938) - IMDb

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by Snow-i 

Really? Where did I introduce it? As far as I can tell, doing the same things as a dictator de facto makes you one according to your last 2 posts. Or did I misread your implication that canceling the daily pressers = dictatorship?

I bolded where you introduced it. That post.

[The Final Dakar]

[subego]

Assuming the leak to the Russians thing doesn't get its own thread.

This is pinging to me as oversold.

I'm not defending Trump. I'm not saying it's good. I'm saying the Post is overselling it.


Edit: it's things like "highly classified", which is kind of a meaningless term AFAICT.

[P]

There is a Russian Connection thread, maybe that's he better place to put this, but...

It matters because a significant part of HRC did not get elected was her handling of her emails. Comey's little newsletter just before the election really did tilt it - analysis after the fact shows that Florida and Michigan in particular would have gone blue by a significant margin if not for that story popping up again. Now you have Trump being much more careless with classified information. Not even the emails argument is relevant anymore.

It also matters because congressional Republicans are getting really tired of standing by Trump.

[subego]

Wasn't even for a second saying it doesn't matter, I'm saying it sounds overblown.

Like, "highly" classified as opposed to an actual classification level.

The other thing which I question? Too many people are speaking like they know what country is being talked about, which makes me think it was already an open secret.

That doesn't make it okay, but it makes it something the Russians probably know.

[BadKosh]

The POST is getting hammered by several local radio stations over more than a dozen anti-Trump stories have turned out to be wrong in just the last week. Of more interest is WHO is the former Obama Admin appointee who is leaking the stuff, and why aren't they in jail.

[subego]

Anyone want to guess the country?

My top three are Israel, SA, and, I dunno... Egypt or something.

[Laminar]

Originally Posted by BadKosh 

The POST is getting hammered by several local radio stations

Ooo, I bet they're really feeling that burn.

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by subego 

Assuming the leak to the Russians thing doesn't get its own thread.

This is pinging to me as oversold.

I'm not defending Trump. I'm not saying it's good. I'm saying the Post is overselling it.


Edit: it's things like "highly classified", which is kind of a meaningless term AFAICT.

It's in the right wing thread but I'd be happy with a new thread for it.

I don't think it's been oversold because they identify its rarity.

Also: "The president leaking classified info is being oversold" feels like it's missing the point.

[Paco500]

Originally Posted by subego 

Like, "highly" classified as opposed to an actual classification level.

From the Post Article:

Originally Posted by WaPo

“This is code-word information,” said a U.S. official familiar with the matter, using terminology that refers to one of the highest classification levels used by American spy agencies. Trump “revealed more information to the Russian ambassador than we have shared with our own allies.”

Did you consider that either the source did not provide the actual level of classification or the article withheld the info to protect the source? Whatever the reason, I think the paragraph above makes clear why they used the the more pedestrian 'highly classified' rather than the official but more specialised 'code-word information.' People outside or unfamiliar with the terminology would have been in the dark.

Originally Posted by subego 

The other thing which I question? Too many people are speaking like they know what country is being talked about, which makes me think it was already an open secret.

That doesn't make it okay, but it makes it something the Russians probably know.

That's a pretty big assumption that I'm going to assume you are not remotely qualified to make.

[subego]

Hence the qualifier "thing I question".

Rough ****ing crowd.


P.S. Will get back to healthcare. Been super busy.

[Paco500]

Originally Posted by subego 

Hence the qualifier "thing I question".

Rough ****ing crowd.


P.S. Will get back to healthcare. Been super busy.

You questioned. I answered. It's my jam.

[subego]

The answer my hypothesis is incorrect because of who it came from is noted.

[subego]

Originally Posted by subego 

Israel

Ding! Ding! Ding!

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by subego 

Ding! Ding! Ding!

Crazy thought: Israel is taking one for the team here. No one wants the real source discovered and Israel loses nothing here.

Otherwise, I'm at a loss for why anonymous sources in the intel community would reveal the source. What can be gained?

[subego]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

Crazy thought: Israel is taking one for the team here. No one wants the real source discovered and Israel loses nothing here.

Otherwise, I'm at a loss for why anonymous sources in the intel community would reveal the source. What can be gained?

Part of my "overblown" argument is my instincts are telling me practically speaking this information isn't as sensitive as it's being made out to be. If it was, we would have never heard about it. The leakers aren't going to burn a genuinely valuable asset just to score points against Trump.

And as much as I bitch about the media, I don't think the Washington Post would do it either.

[The Final Dakar]

Well, they held back the intel for a reason.

But that doesn't answer what's gained here.

[subego]

Half held-back. Presumably, the rumblings about banning laptops on flights from Europe comes from this.

I'll continue to mull what the gain is.

[The Final Dakar]

*nodding*

[Cap'n Tightpants]

We're reaching the point where we won't know when there's an actual crisis, due to the MSM trying to bill everything Trump does as a crisis. Due to their frenzied zeal to destroy him, they're going to make him almost invincible (and drive themselves crazy in the process). It's almost as if they've never read Machiavelli's The Prince, where this very strategy is outlined. Isn't that still required reading to get practically any Journalism degree?