[Sakino]

I must say she treated my like ****, and was a total bitch. From what I have gotten out of that ADC department it worthless. Everytime I call that ADC department they say you should be thankful you got 20% off your purchase, and you got your computer for really cheap? UMM HELLO?! You offer this for a reason, dont give me some bullshit about how I got off lucky by being a developer.
Well anyways I reported the following problems with tech support.
-1.30 batter life with powersave on and brightness at 2 bars. Light usage.
-70% of keys touching the screen.
-heat issue
-ticking hd
-5 white spots
-latch problems

Well she said that doesn't seem that bad, and that a repair would suit my needs. I said well I am a student and that I need my computer for university school work. I am a compsci/med major and need a computer around me at all times.
She then asked me what type of work I do?
I stated that I work on programs, test software and use it for school work. SHE spoke up loudly, "Well the purpose of the ADC PURCHASE program for DEVELOPERS who are TESTING AND BUILDING SOFTWARE." You do not fit in this category, like most other students who purchase thru ADC.
She flat out said she would not replace my laptop, and left it at that. I was pissed but kept my cool the whole time. I just said well thanks anyways, and have a nice day.

its seems as if I always get a rude additude from the people in the ADC purchase department because I got a computer for cheap. That really pisses me off. So far apple hasn't made a good impresson, as far as me bring a first time switcher.

A second note, a guy form the tech department was going to talk with someone higher up to see if he could get me a replacement. We talked about this earlier in the week, and he said he would call me back by Friday.

I just hope this **** gets squared away. I mean if you were in my situation with all those problems would you be asking for what I am asking? Hell I dropped 3000$ on a computer, ipod, mouse, printer, the least they could do is show some respect.

[Mithras]

Sorry mate, but if you have US$3000 to spend on the computer, you can buy it like the big kids do.

And while I make no apologies for the rep being a b!tch, she has a point -- they're looking to cultivate developers who will write great programs for the Mac. For regular students, well, there's the educational prices.

[Sakino]

Originally posted by Mithras:
Sorry mate, but if you have US$3000 to spend on the computer, you can buy it like the big kids do.

And while I make no apologies for the rep being a b!tch, she has a point -- they're looking to cultivate developers who will write great programs for the Mac. For regular students, well, there's the educational prices.

Well see some people need to get themselves thru school. Which last I recalled was on average 17k a year. Its not like I drop 3 grand her and there. Hell I saved up 2 summers to buy this thing.
And there is no reason why they should treat me like they do. I am in the learning process right now, and enjoying testing and building with difference codes. The last thing they should be doing is ****ing bitching me out, because I could be one of the many thousands of students that would help develope them in teh future.

[Luca Rescigno]

Originally posted by Mithras:
Sorry mate, but if you have US$3000 to spend on the computer, you can buy it like the big kids do.

And while I make no apologies for the rep being a b!tch, she has a point -- they're looking to cultivate developers who will write great programs for the Mac. For regular students, well, there's the educational prices.

Enough of that crap. If Apple didn't want him to take the ADC discount, they shouldn't have let him have it in the first place. Either way, you still paid lots of money for your computer and you should receive the same support as everyone else.

[Nessie]

I worked at a call center for a couple years. Whenever I have to call tech support or customer service, I assume that I'm not dealing with the real company but with an outsourcer (if that's a word), and that the representative is probably overworked and undertrained. Maybe Sakino just got a lousy rep. on the phone. Call back and get someone else hopefully more professional. As we used to say, call centers are the new sweatshops.

[dialo]

Why are you talking to ADC people about this? Wouldn't you call the applecare line?



Maybe that's part of the reason she's ticked.

My firewire port died a week after I got my GhzTi from ADC, I called applecare and they fixed it in two days. Professional and smooth.

Did you try calling applecare?

[Sakino]

Originally posted by Nessie:
I worked at a call center for a couple years. Whenever I have to call tech support or customer service, I assume that I'm not dealing with the real company but with an outsourcer (if that's a word), and that the representative is probably overworked and undertrained. Maybe Sakino just got a lousy rep. on the phone. Call back and get someone else hopefully more professional. As we used to say, call centers are the new sweatshops.

Actually when I called it was right to her main phone. Basically it was her office phone, I didnt go thru any 1800 numbers or extensions. So she had to be someone far up if she had her own phone line? Maybe?

The reason I contacted ADC was because I was told to by a Tech Support Person.

Thats why I probably have 2 things oign on right now, 1 thru adc and the other thru tech.

[11011001]

Originally posted by Mithras:
Sorry mate, but if you have US$3000 to spend on the computer, you can buy it like the big kids do.

And while I make no apologies for the rep being a b!tch, she has a point -- they're looking to cultivate developers who will write great programs for the Mac. For regular students, well, there's the educational prices.

I think the Student ADC program is there as an incentive for students to get into mac development. If they are someone like a comp sci major, I would say they fall under the category of student developer. Besides, if they take part in the student program, it would be encouragement for them to continue mac development later on in their careers.

The topic poster is a comp sci student.

I think he has every right to be in this program.

The rep does not have a point, she is instead being narrow minded.

Grr, if this is Apple's attitude towards student developers I don't think I will purchase the membership that I was planning too. (btw, I am a comp. sci. major, and actively develop mac software at work)

man, what a b�t<h

[hengx]

OMG, that's a lousy service you get. If you qualified for ADC Student Developer Membership, then it doesn't make any f*cking sense that she questions you about your position and workflow. She can't know whether you actually will develop and test software or if you just use the ADC SDM to get the 20%. Therefore it doesn't make any sense.
What a dim-witted ill-bred ignorant stupid bitch.

And for those 20% off the price shouldn't turn you into a second citizen. Keep fighting for getting proper service. You don�t deserve that kind of treatment.

I also ordered mine through ADC SDM with 20% off the price, and God help them if they treat me like you if I get in the same sad situation as you. I haven�t got my PowerBook yet though.

[CobraNT]

There is no valid reason to be treated this way by anyone at Apple or any other company. For future reference if you don't like the way you are being treated ask the person for their name and employee number. Then ask to speak to their manager or supervisor. Once you have their name etc. call the customer relations dept. and file a formal complaint and ask that a manager of the CR dept call you back. Apple or any other company cannot resolve issues with customer reps being rude without knowing who is causing the problem. Your the customer, without you they have no job.

[hazelnutcoffeeg]

S,

I feel for you. I am a flight attendant. I deal with pissed off people everyday. Before this I was an ER nurse. I dealt with pissed off sick people and their pissed off families everyday. I used to have to call other hospitals and inpatient psych and what I found was if the doc (the male docs) called, they didn't have a bed or they gave him attitude. If I called, I usually got a bed for the patient. Smetimes within 30 minutes of when the doc had called.

What you need is a liasion. I am assuming you are male. Perhaps you have a female friend who could call for you. Sometimes when women call up these faceless places, they get better results. I know this sounds sexist, but hey, what's to lose giving it a shot.

And have you gone back to the Apple store with all the new problems that have cropped up? They can document all that is wrong. A second pair of eyes is a very good thing and perhaps they can call the applecare or the ADC people for you while you are in the store.

If none of this works, and that guy doesn't get back to you on Friday, I would seriously consider getting some important looking letter head and writing a letter kindly asking for a speedy resolution of your complaints or you'll get small claims court involved.

Good Luck,
Amanda

[xylon]

Originally posted by hazelnutcoffeeg:
What you need is a liasion. I am assuming you are male. Perhaps you have a female friend who could call for you. Sometimes when women call up these faceless places, they get better results. I know this sounds sexist, but hey, what's to lose giving it a shot.

I definitely agree Sakino. From the posts I've read, you are extremely pissed which you are allowed to be to a certain extent. I've also noticed that, despite your best efforts to the opposite, you let this pissedness seep through your posts. Of course I have no idea how you held yourself in your conversation with the Apple rep, but I think hazelnutcoffeeg has a decent proprosal. Try to get one of your friends to call in for you (perhaps one that's a little computer savvy) to eliminate the possibilty that you are simply rubbing these reps the wrong way.

[Super Glitcher]

That sucks man.. I'd see what develops through tech support and definitely try apple care (hear great things). You should call that chick up with a bunch of fake problems and be all serious.. you know, random and psychotic. he he..

I'd probably call her back and repeat the first call, see if she handles it differently (be special ed clear) if she is the same say it's bs + ask for her manager, boss or whoever pays her and then get some resolution and slam her.

Not only are you legit, but you need a replacement. Don't give up- squeaky wheel gets the grease

[fhammond]

Originally posted by Luca Rescigno:
Either way, you still paid lots of money for your computer and you should receive the same support as everyone else.

Exactly: which means getting the computer fixed, not replaced.

I think I hear the waaaaaam-bulance coming to pick up Sakino. Apple's policy is to repair a computer and he hasn't given them the chance to do this. Frankly, if he wanted to get a replacement while his computer was being fixed, he should have bought a Dell or IBM: both companies offer an insurance policy where if there's something wrong with your computer, they'll replace it and send you a new one overnight (even if the "something wrong" is your fault: a can of soda on the keyboard, for example). Several people I know have used this policy with Dell or IBM and it's worked perfectly. Apple doesn't offer that and they don't pretend to. If you're going to spend $3000 on a computer, you should do a little more research on things like this.

I've found that Apple is generally very quick to make repairs. I don't buy his comment about not being able to do without a computer. What did he do *before* the PowerBook arrived? Is there no one in his class that doesn't have a computer? Man, you'd think that the computer is needed for life support...

Lastly, while I think it's fine for Sakino to get a cheap(er) computer via student ADC, he doesn't deserve any special treatment because he's in ADC...especially because the only reason he's in ADC is for the cheap computer. ADC provides lots of great goodies for developers - student or othewise - but special treatment for hardware problems ain't one of them.

Sakino should quit whinning, send the computer to Apple and let them fix it. If it's still not working right, then complain.

[s0litude]

Originally posted by CobraNT:
There is no valid reason to be treated this way by anyone at Apple or any other company. For future reference if you don't like the way you are being treated ask the person for their name and employee number. Then ask to speak to their manager or supervisor. Once you have their name etc. call the customer relations dept. and file a formal complaint and ask that a manager of the CR dept call you back. Apple or any other company cannot resolve issues with customer reps being rude without knowing who is causing the problem. Your the customer, without you they have no job.

I completely agree. Get that persons name and register a complaint. That's just not professional. Regardless of how you bought your apple, education discount or ADC or whatever, you are still the consumer, and that entitles you to some rights. Thats such a shame that one random representative is ruining your experience with apple, especially with someone so high up.

[LfGrdMike]

Call AppleCare or some other service and talk to them about it. Keep doing this and complaining until something happens. I just got a call related to my iMac and they want me to renew the warranty. I need to think about it though because i purchased full applecare on my powerbook.

[Eug]

1) That support person sounds rude.

BUT

2) Sakino shouldn't get a replacement just because he asked for one. Sounds to me like it would warrant a repair, not a replacement. Why should he get special treatment?

[LfGrdMike]

I agree with Eug.

[Tomster]

In dealing with Apple over the years, I can understand the repair/replace issues with new computers. One instance that came to mind was a DOA iMac. Dead out of the box - fried/distorted monitor. Apple offered to repair it or replace it with a refurb. I was upset because I got ZERO use out of it. For some weird reason they would not exchange it for me. I then told the rep I did not agree to any of the software licensing on the product. I figured they would take it back. They said they were alright with me not abiding by any of those agreements. No matter what I did, I could not get them to give me a functioning unit. In the end, they replaced the logic board and the computer had run perfectly for years. In my mind, that should have been a replacement scenario.

On the other hand, with my first TiSD Powerbook, I had issues with a leafblower like fan. We're talking about loud enough to annoy coworkers. I got great use out of the machine, there was just a defect with the fan. To me that was a repair issue. Sent it out to repair and it came back worse. The fan was louder and there was now an inverter whine. Not good. I thought there would be another repair, but I ended up getting a new replacement. Pretty cool.

I wish Apple's policies were a bit more consistent but I think the experience depends on who you get on the phone.

[HasanDaddy]

Always call AppleCare for tech probs --- never call ADC

if you're looking for a replacement call Customer Relations -- Applecare never issues replacements

[StiZeven]

Special treatment? Why would anyone consider Apple replacing a clearly defective product as special treatment? He's not looking to return the machine simply because he doesn't like it, he wants a replacement because it's defective and he deserves a flawless and good performing machine like the rest of us. The question some need to ask is, why are the NON BTO, or NON ADC customers getting 'special treatment'? Seems like many have it backwards. You offer discounts and custom build products, the support and warranty MUST be the same across the board. There is always an exception to ridiculous policies, you just need to be persistent.

Are people actually ALLOWING Apple to tell them that they couldn't get their expensive, brand new but defective PowerBooks replaced because they got it for less, or because it was a BTO item? BULLSHITE! Apple loves people like you and it saves them a ton of cash.

Sakino, and anyone else who is getting BS from Apple's reps (who are paid to try to persuade you to have Apple spend as little money as possible to fix your problem), you simply need to make more noise when calling in the issue to be escalated to the next level (Customer Relations). I've returned TWO PowerBooks that were BTO and then I got a 100% refund plus a $100 Apple Store credit at the end because they kept shipping me out replacement with the same or different (worse) issues.

Don't be a sucker, don't feel sorry for Apple as they don't feel sorry for you. You have a voice, use it, be as pilot but as forward as you can, and you'll get the problem resolved. Screw tech support and go right to customer relations. Once you reach customer relations, they know at this point that tech support or the previous level was unable to convince you to keep the item, and they will (and are required to) resolve the issue and in my case literally kiss your ass until YOU the customer is satisfied. They are very nice, well spoken and very professional.

When you slapped down the $3K, you were entitled to a brand new machine with no flaws. Don't let Apple or anyone else tell you that you should be treated as a second-class consumer simply because you have an ADC membership (which wasn't free), and because you have a BTO machine.

If Apple is THAT concerned about returns and the bottom line, then perhaps they should be a little more particular with the machines that leave the factory defective and increase quality control to stop cases like this in the future. They can't have it both ways.

[Angus_D]

Originally posted by Sakino:
"Well the purpose of the ADC PURCHASE program for DEVELOPERS who are TESTING AND BUILDING SOFTWARE." You do not fit in this category, like most other students who purchase thru ADC.
She flat out said she would not replace my laptop, and left it at that. I was pissed but kept my cool the whole time. I just said well thanks anyways, and have a nice day.

You did read the terms and conditions of the ADC hardware purchase program, didn't you?

From the ADC terms and conditions:
6. Participants in the ADC Hardware Purchase Program agree not to resell or otherwise transfer any items purchased for a period of at least one year from the date of shipment, and agree that all equipment ordered under the ADC Hardware Purchase Program will be used only for the purpose of developing software and/or hardware products that will be sold for use with Apple products.

People like you are abusing the system. There are already hefty student discounts available via the Apple Education store, you should have gone with this if you could not abide by the terms set out by ADC.

[Angus_D]

Originally posted by StiZeven:
Don't let Apple or anyone else tell you that you should be treated as a second-class consumer simply because you have an ADC membership (which wasn't free)

ADC membership is designed for developers. Lots of students think that they can just sign up for ADC and get cheap hardware, which is an abuse of the system and will probably lead to Apple withdrawing it.

[HasanDaddy]

I don't think Apple would ever withdraw it --- however, I could see them soon asking for *real* documentation of software development

[amazing]

Actually, the longer Sakino waits to get the white spot problem fixed, the more chance that Apple will have come up with a REAL solution. There are many people who just get white spots all over again on the repaired (or replaced) units.

On the other hand, if Sakino strung together all the time he's spent online talking about it, plus all the time on the phone with various CSRs, he probably would have gotten his pb back from being fixed already.

[Sakino]

Originally posted by Angus_D:
You did read the terms and conditions of the ADC hardware purchase program, didn't you?

People like you are abusing the system. There are already hefty student discounts available via the Apple Education store, you should have gone with this if you could not abide by the terms set out by ADC.

Ohh **** you?! give me a fukn break. I develop software and work on websites. That line is very vague if you ask me. Second there are not hefty discounts. When laptop cost 3000$ and there are laptops very similar to this on the market that are out running this by a long run? Give me a break.

I must say some of you apple people are really anal about certain things with apple.

[Lorinserbenz]

DO you REALLY think Apple sells at a loss to developers?????
Gimme a break... they sell at the price they sell to resellers.. THEY MAKE A PROFIT.... and a good one.. The discount is NOT that great by the time you add tax and whatever you pay to be a developer.

[stotan]

Originally posted by Lorinserbenz:
DO you REALLY think Apple sells at a loss to developers?????
Gimme a break... they sell at the price they sell to resellers.. THEY MAKE A PROFIT.... and a good one.. The discount is NOT that great by the time you add tax and whatever you pay to be a developer.

actually they sell it for more than they do to the resellers...well at least in canada they do

[zos]

Maybe you should get in touch with this guy and see how he got such miraculous results with customer relations.

[Amorya]

Originally posted by Eug:
2) Sakino shouldn't get a replacement just because he asked for one. Sounds to me like it would warrant a repair, not a replacement. Why should he get special treatment?

If it was like that on arrival, then I know in England he'd be allowed a replacement or full refund (at his choice, not Apple's) by the law.

It'd come under the Sale of Goods act (I think)... white spots on the screen would mean that the computer was not of merchantable quality.

Heck, you can get a refund on a computer with one dead pixel and everything else perfect.

Is there anything like that where you are? If you quote the law, they find it harder to argue


Amorya

[Angus_D]

Originally posted by Sakino:
I must say some of you apple people are really anal about certain things with apple.

I take offence at that. I'm not an "Apple person" - I don't blindly go around following Steve Jobs' every word and praising everything they do because they're brilliant. I'm not even saying that their behaviour in this case is particularly outstanding, and if you are abiding by the terms of the agreement then you would definitely have grounds for complaint. However, if you're not, Apple has every right not to offer you support.

[fhammond]

Originally posted by Sakino:
I develop software and work on websites.

Yeah, sure, whatever.

[Sakino]

Originally posted by fhammond:
Yeah, sure, whatever.

Think what you want, I noticed one thing that it is impossible to prove something to some ignorant asshole on the internet.

[Super Glitcher]

Sakino, a repair will be what you need. Since you are a first time apple guy you don't know yet, but apple will replace the parts- and it will work. I sent in my old 667 ti to get the screen replaced, it was thrashed, they replaced everything including the housing, fan and heat sync. It's a tight company, they'll take care of you, have faith and get it done.

Now the rest of you, you guys are really sounding like f***ing idiots to me.

You can't prove what Sakino does on this message board regardless of what some of you seem to think and know.

But it seems like everyone just 'knows' exactly what everyone else does, at least enough to incite 'system abuse'. WTF is wrong with you idiots? Don't you realize that you have to get accepted into a program before you can get the benefits? It's at Apple's discretion who is allowed to get the discount NOT YOURS. They set up the program, establish the rules and that's it. If they wanted more discretion on who get's the discount, it's up to them to do it.

Irregardless of who you are or what you do if you had 5 issues with your $3000 powerbook you'd be just as flamed. Especially if a customer service rep was lecturing you about details and determining that you weren't elidgeable for service from a 2 minute conversation. That's bad face on Apple's part, or whoever the service company was.

[amazing]

Originally posted by Amorya:
Heck, you can get a refund on a computer with one dead pixel and everything else perfect.
Amorya

I knew that the UK had better consumer protection laws than we do, but getting a pb replaced from having just one stuck pixel is awesome!

Now we know to what country all the perfect LCD screens are sent to! No wonder we have fewer than we should!

[Amorya]

Originally posted by amazing:
I knew that the UK had better consumer protection laws than we do, but getting a pb replaced from having just one stuck pixel is awesome!

Now we know to what country all the perfect LCD screens are sent to! No wonder we have fewer than we should!

Lol

As far as I know, it's a lot of hassle to get a replacement like that, but the law is on your side.

Maybe you're right about where the screens are sent btw - I've never seen a dead pixel - on any computer. My new Powerbook G4 is perfect... my Pismo's screen was great... ditto Powerbook 1400. Various PC'using friends also have perfect screens...

Amorya

[Mac Zealot]

IMHO You got walked all over. Best of luck (if you haven't gotten luck yet)

Apple is VERY stubborn on NOT replacing computers, those who manage to do it are quite talented

Fact is if someone talked to me like that I'd report them immediately. Quite uncalled for, and even if you got the laptop at half price, you're still a paying customer.

She had no business knowing why you got the discount, in fact. Anyway, that was totally against HER policy, especially to use the information to harass you.

If anything call customer relations and hopefully you'll get a better shot. Best of luck ^_^

Oh the other thing, apple tends to walk ALL OVER people in/under 20's. If you sound young, good luck lol.