[meagain]

(EDIT: If I could change the title of this thread, I would. It's been 3.5-4 days and am now officially in love with the Mac os x interface)

I'm really frustrated right now. The computer is beautiful, but I'm new to Mac and am stunned there is no manual for the software, and no simple tutorial dvd. Nothing. Zero.

My main problem is opening a web browser window. Um Safari only opens a current window that's already in use. How is this at all useful? I loaded Firefox and it does the same thing. Despite setting both of them to open in a new window. I literally cannot open a new window to do a web search. Much less open more than one. Or at the same time. I also find it incredulous that I cannot easily close applications/windows as I'm used to simple toggling between windows with a mouse click.

I guess I just needed to rant. I did expect in paying almost $2k for a computer, that there would be some semblance of a manual! I must be dreaming - right? And boy do I miss my Outlook Express. Can't use my hotmails. LOL

[Tomchu]

I guess "File --> New Window" is too hard? Or maybe Command-N?

One thing you have to realize is that Mac OS X is not Windows. They behave differently, and hence are used differently. On a Mac, for instance, you don't start the same application multiple times ... you simply create new "documents" under the same instance of the application.

Also, closing an application's "document" does not quit the application.

The Help system probably introduces you to all of this.

[WOPR]

Is the OP real???

[meagain]

OK - Both those open a new wiindow. This is good. But is there no way to simply do this with one click of the mouse like explorer? So far browsing seems far more cumbersome than explorer. More clicks and more keyboard intensive. I feel like I'm going backwards here. This seems like a weak link and I miss explorer big time.

[Thinine]

You use keyboard shortcuts. Or just turn on tabbing, and you can create a new tab with Command-T. Also, you can select the address bar by hitting Command-L.

And there should be at least a small manual in the box, in the little packet with the restore DVD. And you should also checkout the Help menu.

[seanc]

Trust me, it's better on OS X. Using Windows feels cluttered and ridiculous.

[Chuckit]

Hold in apple and hit N. Fast as it can be on any platform.

Oh, also, the "manual" for OS X comes in the form of Mac Help. Look in the Help menu in the Finder.

[analogika]

I have a lot of friends who've switched from Windows (and yes, they're still friends).

The first three weeks are really tough, mostly because you have to get your head around the fact that there is always an easier way. The really big difference between Windows and the Mac is that the Mac actually assumes that you AREN'T stupid. Windows just assumes that you're never going to understand the system and belittles you with wizards to try and alleviate the fundamental structural problems.

The Mac has a design concept, and everything follows from that. Give it a chance.

A couple of basic pointers:

- It's usually the obvious solution. Want to import photos from your digital cam? Just connect it. Want to burn a CD? Just insert one.


- If you want to put ANYTHING anywhere else, try dragging it there with the mouse. That applies to documents into applications, file paths into open/save dialog boxes, highlighted text onto the desktop to save a text clipping, pictures from Safari onto the desktop to save them to disk, music into iTunes, etc., etc., etc. I've had calls from switchers desperately searching for the command that would open the series of dialog boxes to let them import something..."Have you tried just dragging and dropping it into the window?" - Click...click "Oh".


- Drag and drop works across applications, across formats, across the application switcher (Apple-Tab for the equivalent of Windows' Alt-Tab), and across Exposé (F9 thru F11; there's a preference for it in the System Preferences - use Exposé, you'll love Exposé, seriously...)


- Mac dialog windows aren't like Windows dialogs. There's only about one-tenth as many as one Windows ("You're about to do this" - OK, "Are you sure you want to do this" - YES, "I'm now doing this" - OKTHX, "Successfully done!" - SMASH), and the ones that do come up are meant to be read. The Mac will generally only throw up a dialog if it's important, so the ones that do come up are important. Read them.


- The menu bar always follows a very strict hierarchy.

the Apple menu contains everything that pertains to the entire user/login/computer: System preferences, Dock preferences, shut down, restart, software update, sleep, log out, etc.

The Application menu contains everything that pertains to the entire application you're using: Version info, application preferences, hide, quit.

The File menu contains everything pertaining to an individual document or window: new document/window, print, save, document-specific settings.

The Edit menu contains everything relating to the *currently selected objects* within the frontmost document: copy, paste, select all, etc.

Wherever applicable, you'll have a "View" menu that changes how documents or windows are displayed.

The rightmost menu is always the "Help" menu, which will take you to the Help Viewer application, where you can search individual help files for keywords or switch to different help files ("Library" menu) to browse.

So if you're looking for a setting that pertains to the way the entire GarageBand application deals with audio, you'll find it under the "GarageBand" menu --> Preferences.

Make sense?

The great advantage to this rigorously implemented structure is that, even if you've never used a program before, you can more or less find your way around in a matter of minutes, without ever having touched a manual.


- The keyboard commands are printed right next to the commands in the menus. If those aren't enough, you can invent your own, on a per-application basis or globally, in the Keyboard prefs in the System Preferences.


- USE THE HELP MENU. It's good.


Welcome to Macintosh.

Enjoy your stay.

-chris.

[Simon]

Congrats Chris, that's a great summary! I'm sending the link to a just-switched colleague here at my lab. He can use it.

[Luca Rescigno]

If you love Windows so much and hate the idea of things behaving differently, why on earth did you get a Mac?

[analogika]

Originally Posted by Luca Rescigno 

If you love Windows so much and hate the idea of things behaving differently, why on earth did you get a Mac?

You know, if I were a switcher, that kind of comment would make me want to switch right back.

Moron.

[chrismear]

There's a lot of attitude coming from the big posters here that isn't very friendly towards new users. The Mac windows/application/dock paradigm is very different to the Windows windows/quick-launch/taskbar paradigm, and it takes some getting used to. The Dock in particular is a very confusing piece of work -- sometimes it makes new windows, sometimes it just switches applications. Once you get it, it makes perfect sense, but it's still a lot more inconsistent than the way Windows separates app launching and window switching.

Just because someone doesn't get it immediately doesn't mean that they think your precious Mac OS is stupid. They're just trying to learn. I don't see why we can't just provide help without pouncing on people with phrases like "I guess "File --> New Window" is too hard?"

To meagain: If you're looking for more written help, Apple has a couple of excellent mini-sites in their Support section: Mac 101 and Switch 101. If you like having printed documentation to refer to (I know I do sometimes), Switching to the Mac: The Missing Manual is supposed to be excellent.

I'm a geek through and through, and it still took me a while to get used to the Mac OS having moved from Windows. Now that I have, I definitely prefer the way it works. I love the fact that I can close all the windows of an app without actually closing the app. I love that I can bring all of one app's windows to the front with a single click on the Dock. It works well. But it is hard to get your head around at first.

[fisherKing]

in safari preferences (menu bar, under safari name), turn on tabbed browsing..it will change your life (well, a bit).

you can have one window open, with multiple tabs; great for surfing, comparison shopping, etc.
much simpler than multiple windows.

be patient! explore a bit, post questions on forums like this (try a search first!).
explore the help pages in applications (or the main mac window, the 'finder').

it's all there, and pretty straightforward stuff.

the 24" imac is an amazing machine, but the reason to have one is OS X.

enjoy it.

[gooser]

apple wants people to switch from windows, however after they do apple does a piss poor job of explaining the basic differences. a very small written manual could have eliminated the need for this thread in the first place. here that steve?

[rickey939]

I'll buy your 24" iMac for $100 to get it off your hands. I'll even pay shipping.

[discotronic]

Originally Posted by gooser 

apple wants people to switch from windows, however after they do apple does a piss poor job of explaining the basic differences. a very small written manual could have eliminated the need for this thread in the first place. here that steve?

I agree with you. Chrismear mentioned a few books in another post above. David Pogue has another great book that I would recommend to any switcher. Here is a link:

Amazon.com: Mac OS X: The Missing Manual: Books: David Pogue

It is a very easy read and it explains the differences that you mentioned. When I convinced my brother to switch, back in the days of Jaguar, I bought this book for him.

Any new Mac user could use this book.

[gooser]

pogue writes good stuff. should be included with a $2,000.00 machine.

[Atheist]

Originally Posted by gooser 

apple wants people to switch from windows, however after they do apple does a piss poor job of explaining the basic differences. a very small written manual could have eliminated the need for this thread in the first place. here that steve?

To a certain extent, I have to agree. chrismear pointed out some great resources however with all of the emphasis that Apple places on comparing OS X to Windows, I would think they concentrate on addressing switchers more prominently. I would suggest that the first time the computer is turned on, the user should be provided with an option to view detailed instructions geared specifically to a switcher. The first time my partner used OS X he hated it... I know all you fanboys out there think the interface is the greatest thing since sliced bread, but for someone who has been using Windows for a decade, it's confusing.

meagain, although I understand your frustration, your expectations seem a little out of whack. Did you even do any research before you switched?

[meagain]

Hi. I wrote a post last night but when I went to post, it just timed out till this morning when I closed it. I think I had a connection issue.

Anyway, I just got this yesterday evening and yes, the interface might be something I'll grow to love in general but the 'net surfing thing really shot me down. My crap PC and crap Laptop broke within 1 day of each other a week ago and I needed/need to get up and running ASAP. I sell on Ebay and am losing money so I wanted to just be functional instantly and was frustrated to see that wasn't/isn't happening.

Yes, I do think Apple should include some mini-booklet or fun little DVD to get one started just for the basics so one can at least get to the Help screens, etc.

I'm trying to triage my situation as best I can and the top of the list is web browsing. The tab concept is cool and all but not if you want these windows open at the same time on the screen.

Stepping back from it, am I the only one who finds it odd that to open a new webpage, one must use the keyboard or go to 'safari' then 'file' then 'new window' as opposed to mouse-clicking an icon once? It just seems archaic to me. Like a step back in time.
Is there no way to program a mouse button to do this in one step?

[Big Mac]

People who have tremendous trouble switching from Windows to OS X (or vice versa) should have their GUI licenses revoked.

[Macola]

Originally Posted by meagain 

Stepping back from it, am I the only one who finds it odd that to open a new webpage, one must use the keyboard or go to 'safari' then 'file' then 'new window' as opposed to mouse-clicking an icon once? It just seems archaic to me. Like a step back in time.
Is there no way to program a mouse button to do this in one step?

Is there a reason that you want to keep opening new windows? I've been using PCs for many years, along side my Macs, and have never done this on either platform. Maybe I'm missing something obvious in your post, but like the others said, just use tabs instead.

[draggerman11]

Originally Posted by meagain 

Stepping back from it, am I the only one who finds it odd that to open a new webpage, one must use the keyboard or go to 'safari' then 'file' then 'new window' as opposed to mouse-clicking an icon once? It just seems archaic to me. Like a step back in time.
Is there no way to program a mouse button to do this in one step?

I switched last December, about a year ago. I had used Windows all my life up until that point. It took me about a week to get used to OS X but I have never looked back since.

I never found it odd and, indeed, I found it a faster and more logical way to open a new window. In Windows if you need a new browser window you tend to have one already up, and thus maximized across the screen as Windows likes to do. So to get to the IE shortcut on the desktop you must minimize the open window and then click the shortcut. Going to file --> New Window or New Tab does not take very long at all. I mean it literally takes me half a second to go to File --> New Window.

If this is the only problem you are having so far, then you're not doing too bad. You'll acclimate to the new way of doing things.

[King Bob On The Cob]

The keyboard is your friend.

Command-Tab until you get to Safari.
Command-N.

It usually is faster than mousing to the dock anyways.

[meagain]

Dragger - If your windows is properly set up, you'd have a small IE icon next to the start button at all times. All I had to do is click on it once to bring up a new window.

In Firefox AND Safari, I have to:

Keyboard:
1. Select Firefox or Safari
2. Lean over to my keyboard hit/hold command.
3. Look at the keyboard to find "N" or "T" and click it.

Or for mouse:
1. Make sure I'm somehow in Safari or Firefox by selecting it.
2. Mouse up to a File (tiny word WAY up in the left corner) - click on it.
3. Pull up a dropdown box.
4. Find and Select New or Tab.

LOL! Please tell me I have this wrong.

[draggerman11]

Originally Posted by meagain 

Dragger - If your windows is properly set up, you'd have a small IE icon next to the start button at all times. All I had to do is click on it once to bring up a new window.

In Firefox AND Safari, I have to:

Keyboard:
1. Select Firefox or Safari
2. Lean over to my keyboard hit/hold command.
3. Look at the keyboard to find "N" or "T" and click it.

Or for mouse:
1. Make sure I'm somehow in Safari or Firefox by selecting it.
2. Mouse up to a File (tiny word WAY up in the left corner) - click on it.
3. Pull up a dropdown box.
4. Find and Select New or Tab.

LOL! Please tell me I have this wrong.

Provided you already have a Safari window open, no, you don't. I just don't find it as annoying as you do I guess to open a new window that way.

As far as Windows being properly set up, I always found those quick launch buttons next to the Start button annoying so I had them shut off. Took too much space away from the taskbar.

[kikkoman]

Start using tabbed browsing. Once you get used to it you'll never go back to having multiple browser windows. It's already on in Firefox but you'll need to switch it on in Safari. I'll let you figure that out It's such a great feature Microsoft put in IE7.

[Chuckit]

Originally Posted by meagain 

In Firefox AND Safari, I have to:

Keyboard:
1. Select Firefox or Safari
2. Lean over to my keyboard hit/hold command.
3. Look at the keyboard to find "N" or "T" and click it.

I don't mean this to be rude, but you'd really benefit from learning to touch-type. It's not hard, and rather than "lean over" and "look at the keyboard to find N or T," it would just be "press apple-N." It's as fast as clicking the mouse, and it doesn't have the extra time of moving the cursor all the way to a little icon in the corner.

Incidentally, you can make a new tab in Firefox by double-clicking the tab bar. You can also right-click the tab bar in either Safari or Firefox.

[meagain]

Chuckit - your last sentence was helpful to me. Now I'm getting somewhere. Errr - better than 15 minutes ago.
I'll do a google search of "touch-type" cuz I've no clue what that is. Never heard of it.
But it sounds helpful?

[wr11]

meagain,

You can always command()-click a link to open a new window, or tab based on your preferences. command-option-click will open a new window / tab behind your current window as well. I use command-click more often than not, easier than opening a new window or hitting command-tab.

[MarkLT1]

Originally Posted by meagain 

Stepping back from it, am I the only one who finds it odd that to open a new webpage, one must use the keyboard or go to 'safari' then 'file' then 'new window' as opposed to mouse-clicking an icon once? It just seems archaic to me. Like a step back in time.
Is there no way to program a mouse button to do this in one step?

Since most of us are used to the way Macs work, yes, you probably are the only one

But, this may give you a little ray of hope. Try right clicking the safari icon in the dock. There is an option when you right click it to open a "New Window"

Hope that helps.

[meagain]

WR - what link are you referring to? And I'm not sure when I hold the cammand/options buttons where I should mouse click. Cuz this doesn't seem to work.

I'm uploading bootcamp.

[Big Mac]

Sell the computer and buy a Dell, please.

[meagain]

I'm feeling beyond stupid right now. I'm not unintelligent though it seems to be the case.

When I click on Firefox in the dock or on my desktop. Nothing happens. LOL
Same with Safari. Zip. It just opens a current web page.

[TETENAL]

Originally Posted by meagain 

Stepping back from it, am I the only one who finds it odd that to open a new webpage, one must use the keyboard or go to 'safari' then 'file' then 'new window' as opposed to mouse-clicking an icon once? It just seems archaic to me. Like a step back in time.
Is there no way to program a mouse button to do this in one step?

You are the first one I ever hear from complaining about this, but if you really wanted to do this, you could do as follows:

• Open the application Script Editor in /Applications/AppleScript
• Paste in the following script (what is between the horizontal lines):

Code:
tell application "Safari"
	make new document
end tell

• Save the script and in the save dialog select the type "Application" and save it with the name "New Safari Window".
• Drag the "New Safari Window" script application into the Dock.

Now you can click it to create new Safari windows with a single mouse click.

But you could always control-click a link and select "Open in new window". Or just press ⌘N. That's what most people are doing. You need to have your hands on the keyboard anyway to type in the address. So pressing ⌘N is a no brainer.

[seanc]

Originally Posted by meagain 

I'm feeling beyond stupid right now. I'm not unintelligent though it seems to be the case.

When I click on Firefox in the dock or on my desktop. Nothing happens. LOL
Same with Safari. Zip. It just opens a current web page.

Firefox seems to have a weird bug where it just does nothing, Safari is doing as it should.

Are you trying to 'right click' on them? Press and hold the mouse button on them or press control+click the mouse button.

[meagain]

Tetenal - I pasted that text in the appropriate applications window. But the only thing I can do in it is "record" "run" or "compile" Not sure how to save it unless I'm supposed to click on 'record'?

EDIT - Oh. I save it way up in the upper right of the main window. LOL> OMG

[TETENAL]

You save it like in any other application by going to the "File" menu and selecting the "Save" command. In the save dialog you choose as file format "Application" and give it a meaningful name such as "New Safari Window".

[scottiB]

Originally Posted by gooser 

(A) very small written manual could have eliminated the need for this thread in the first place. here that steve?

While I don't disagree with you, Apple does provide online resources:

Mac101

Switch101

The latter may help the OP.

[Annette310]

There's a lot of good info in this thread that will come in handy when I switch! Everyone here is so nice and helpful

[kmkkid]

How about just right clicking on the safari icon and select 'new window'....

Or the one click method - Hold the left click and hover 'new window' and release

This is the ONE thing I hated about IE, having 25 windows open and having to browse them using 'grouping' CM Item. Not to mention 20 of those windows were pop-ups/unders lol.

[seanc]

Well using IE will eventually kill Windows with Spyware. All access to it is turned off to it under the PCs I administer and Firefox is the default and only available.

[meagain]

seanc -Yes, but those with PC's using Firefox just have to click on a firefox icon to get a brand new webpage. I'm emailing with my friends who have it and they can't understand why it doesn't do that on a Mac.

kmkid - when I left click & hold on firefox, I get "keep in dock", "open at Login", "show in finder" :hide" and "quit".

Scotti - I've been to those links and my issues are not findable there.

Tet - I have it saved appropriately but I don't really have anything to drag into the dock. No icon, etc. So I think I set it up right but can't make it actually run. It's just a window on my desktop. I tried dragging that but it doesn't do anything but move around the screen.

[MarkLT1]

Originally Posted by kmkkid 

How about just right clicking on the safari icon and select 'new window'....

Originally Posted by meagain 

kmkid - when I left click & hold on firefox, I get "keep in dock", "open at Login", "show in finder" :hide" and "quit".

Reading is fundamental.

[TETENAL]

Originally Posted by meagain 

Tet - I have it saved appropriately but I don't really have anything to drag into the dock. No icon, etc. So I think I set it up right but can't make it actually run. It's just a window on my desktop. I tried dragging that but it doesn't do anything but move around the screen.

When you have saved it there is an icon of it in the folder where you have saved it. Let's say you saved it to the desktop then there's an icon of it on the desktop. If you saved it to your documents folder then there's an icon of it in the documents folder. Only you know where you saved it. If you don't, then use Spotlight to search for it. You can drag that icon into the Dock and click it to open new Safari windows.
You don't need to have it open in Script Editor any more so you can close the window with the script and quit Script Editor.

[kmkkid]

Originally Posted by TETENAL 

When you have saved it there is an icon of it in the folder where you have saved it. Let's say you saved it to the desktop then there's an icon of it on the desktop. If you saved it to your documents folder then there's an icon of it in the documents folder. Only you know where you saved it. If you don't, then use Spotlight to search for it. You can drag that icon into the Dock and click it to open new Safari windows.
You don't need to have it open in Script Editor any more so you can close the window with the script and quit Script Editor.

Make sure you're dragging it into the RIGHT side of the dock, the side with the trash bin.

Just an FYI meagain: The left side of the dock is for Open applications (they have an triangle) or apps you specifically say you want in your dock all of the time (right click on a running apps icon and select 'keep in dock'. The right side of the dock is for user shortcuts, and minimized windows. Removing and adding shortcuts to the right side is as easy as dragging off or on. Removing apps from the right side is as easy as dragging the apps icon off the dock when not in use (it will still remove it if it's running, but the icon will remain there until the app quits obviously), or right clicking the apps icon and selecting 'remove from dock'.

[TETENAL]

Originally Posted by kmkkid 

Make sure you're dragging it into the RIGHT side of the dock, the side with the trash bin.

I suggested to save as application, so it goes to the left of the separator where the applications live. If you saved it as script file (then it would belong to the right side) clicking on it would just open it in Script Editor again. Not so useful.

[meagain]

Tetenal - I have the icon in the dock. I click on it - boom! Webpage. Click on it again - Boom! Webpage. Ok, it creates a webpage that's behind everything else and I have to find it but.... that's me managing my screens wrong I think.

It works. I love you.

[kmkkid]

Originally Posted by TETENAL 

I suggested to save as application, so it goes to the left of the separator where the applications live. If you saved it as script file (then it would belong to the right side) clicking on it would just open it in Script Editor again. Not so useful.

Ah I missed that part. Just making sure they weren't dragging a shortcut to the wrong side and wondering why it wasn't working

[MarkLT1]

Originally Posted by meagain 

Tetenal - I have the icon in the dock. I click on it - boom! Webpage. Click on it again - Boom! Webpage. Ok, it creates a webpage that's behind everything else and I have to find it but.... that's me managing my screens wrong I think.

It works. I love you.

Change that applescript code to this:

Code:
tell application "Safari"
	make new document
	activate
end tell

[meagain]

Oh Hell Yeah! Thank you so much!
That script editor thing seems pretty easy to deal with. I bet it would have been a nightmare to do the same type of deal on a PC.

I had one more question for anyone before I stop pestering.... In Firefox, when I go to create a new windows tab - it's blank. Shouldn't my home page (CNN) pop up instead? Is there an easy way to make that happen? So bookmarks and the home page pop up? Can't seem to find a preference for this.