[Simon]

Originally Posted by OreoCookie 

I don't think Apple will make larger MacBooks, I expect the two notebook lines to merge even closer. With all the attention on using the gpu to do certain calculations, I expect that the next MacBook will have a decent, dedicated gpu with its own memory again.

I was expecting the exact same thing.

And then this morning I saw this. http://www.tuaw.com/2008/10/04/rumor...-october-14th/

So maybe. It sure would be a nice surprise. And it would help make the MB more like just a smaller MBP.

[Eug]

It seems the article is being intentionally vague (even despite their image of a white MacBook). It could just be "MacBook" as in Apple laptops in general.

A dedicated GPU would be nice for a consumer MacBook if its relatively fast and it doesn't increase (or prevent the decrease) of the price of the machine. I would still just prefer a cheaper laptop with a smaller footprint. I would also hope it doesn't eat into battery life too much.

[Simon]

More information on the MB's move to a dedicated NVIDA GPU. Interestingly this rumor indicates it's not just a switch to NVIDIA GPUs, but that actually the entire chipset (minus the Intel CPU of course) would come from NVIDIA. Specifically a MCP7A-U chipset.
http://www.macrumors.com/2008/10/05/...-ocotber-14th/

On a related note, the new MB appears to indeed be the rumored "brick". Apple will be taking back MB manufacturing from Foxconn and the like. Instead they want to do it in their own plants where they plan to use lasers to carve out MB shells from solid aluminum bricks.
http://9to5mac.com/macbook-brick

[Eug]

Yeah, I saw mention of that. The reason I didn't post anything related to that second rumour though was because I don't buy it at all. I could be dead wrong of course, but this quote pretty much sums it up:

"Yes, this sounded a bit crazy to us as well."

However, I do think a new enclosure is possible. Actually, I think it's likely, and it could very well be aluminum. I do prefer white plastic though, at least with previous Mac laptop designs, but we'll see what Apple has come up with this time.

[Simon]

And more info.
http://blogs.computerworld.com/apple...turing_process

[Eug]

Originally Posted by Simon 

And more info.
http://blogs.computerworld.com/apple...turing_process

That blog is based on the same source.

[Simon]

It still offers additional insight.

[darkmatter]

Apple uses already Laser and Waterjet technologies to manufacture some part in each of their products.
I would say (not sure) due to it's nature that the Macbook is the only product that uses the least these
technologies. From common Laser engraving on the iPods and hightech/quality parts on the iPods/iPhone
across to some parts of the Mac Pro/Xserve.

I have always asked myself if the MBA's case is done with molded aluminum (high-vacuum casting?) or rapid prototyping

The costs of aircraft grade aluminum and the manufacturing process involved are indeed low but not as cheap as the low quality plastics in most of "low" priced computers

[Eug]

Originally Posted by Simon 

It still offers additional insight.

Not really. Just more rumour mongering at best, with absolutely nothing to back it up. I think this comment should be interest to some of you though:

I see no advantage to using a billet that is laser-milled over stamping a sheet of aluminum.

In the automotive industry, some parts use billets that are milled, ground, etc. Other parts start as sheet metal are stamped. The billets are used for things like brake calipers and crankshafts. They are too thick to be stamped. Car hoods are stamped. I can’t see anything in my AluPB or TiPB that would be improved by starting out as a billet over a piece of sheet aluminum. Let’s look at the last two new Macs, the iMac and the MBA. Both start out as sheet aluminum. Neither use billets. The MBA actually uses the tricks that car makers use, to stiffen the case, they curve it. Curved sheet metal is far stiffer than uncurved. One could call it a monocoque. There’s nothing of substantial thickness in the laptops that require a billet.

Billets are harder to turn into product, they take time to mill and grind. In this case, the idea is to laser mill and water grind. It’s just not cost-effective. Stamping is fast and easy.

The big problem with Marterallo’s idea is that a mfring site still needs suppliers. Building/assembling your computer using robots is cool, but you still need a supply chain. Moving mfring to Arizona, is fine, but where are the cost savings if the GPU and CPU boards are built in China, or if the LED screen is built in Taiwan?

The problem with Weintraub’s idea is that it makes no sense. A case for a computer is not better if it starts as a billet as opposed to a sheet. And, if this were to impact this quarter’s margins, then this would have to already be producing product. Building a plant is not going to hit gross operating margins. It hits elsewhere.

[Simon]

Originally Posted by Eug 

Not really. Just more rumour mongering at best, with absolutely nothing to back it up.

It's the comments. The article is just quotes of the other stuff I already linked to. What's with all the negativity anyway?

Carving out of one piece is not nonsense. If you open the current macbook pro, you will see there re many pieces that are spotwelded in place. Every one of those pieces needs to be stamped, bent, and threaded where necessary. This requires a lot of processes, and requires them all to be placed so they can be welded. This causes the cost to go up. My company had a similar product, which was assembled from stamped metal parts, in the long run we found it cheaper to machine the same thing out of one piece of aluminum, since the cnc machines cost less than humans.

Carving a billet with lasers is silly. There's no practical advantage here, and the expense and time would be incredibly wasteful. There's nothing in a laptop case, where laser and water milling provides any significant advantage to the consumer. I have consulted for the largest US provider of controls for the robotics that go into these machines, and in my opinion this rumor is utter nonsense. Stamping sheet aluminum is just as good aesthetically and mechanically, not to mention cheaper and faster.

I see this as the next step for Apple and yes, I have seen 2" aluminum bricks being carved by CNC machines in a small product prototyping shop myself. All product designers dealing with 3D fabrication already know about 3D material subtraction using milling machines and 3D "printing", called rapid prototyping which is an additive process (used only is prototyping).
This is a definite advance in terms of faster product development and design for sure. A single product designer can model something in 3D and have the aluminum piece in their hands after 20 or so hours of computer mill carving. Computer manufacturing vs. manual labor is old news. I'm sure Apple already has a small mill or 4 for their design team. What's new, and the challenge is whether they have gotten hold of machines that can carve ABIT faster to make it $worth$ their while.
Compared to the old aluminum cases were flat patterns pressed into a form in a matter of seconds and machine drilled. The amount of energy carving is alot more. It is also not materially efficient. I'm sure ipod case backs were cast and then machined, which is more efficient. But they were alittle heavy and much smaller so its easier to cut back on machining time. So I'm not seeing the carved brick as a good thing. Its more of a designer's digital fetish and laziness/lack of knowledge about metal bending/pressing/forming.
BUT- Jobs is not dumb, so I'm sure he crunched the numbers before investing in this Ironman-esque fantasy factory.
I visited a plant in RI that makes traditional furniture for college admissions offices using computer controlled lathes and bandsaws. My point: Its a designer's production fantasy, but consumers may not notice. Apple certainty needs to figure out how this adds up in terms of using American labor, managing their own manufacturing, etc.
I do believe it will result in more exciting hardware. But cheaper? Is a prototyping technique now applied to manufacturing production efficient?

[Simon]

Also, what I don't get is this talk about how carving it out of a solid block would make seams and screws unnecessary. Sure, it can reduce the number required, but since you need to put things in the case and quite possibly open it up later, how would do that w/o having at least two parts to the case that are joined and can be disassembled from each other?

And if Apple choses to do the case themselves with a different manufacturing process, why would they also do the assembly themselves? They could have just the cases carved from solid chunks of aluminum and still have Foxconn, Honhai, Asus, or whoever assemble the MBs as they previously did. What do they gain from doing the final assembly themselves?

[Simon]

More news.
http://www.macrumors.com/2008/10/07/...uring-process/

Interestingly enough, both issues I brought up in the post above were addressed. I still don't see how carving the case from solid aluminum should remove all screws.

[I WAS the One]

well, today I received the Netbook G Meso, and let me tell you.... it's great! very fast and very useful!. UBUNTU remix OS it's easy to learn, 5 minutes and I was doing my work in no time.


Click for full size - Uploaded with plasq's Skitch

a true fact:
my Macs came with a feeling that it can't be compare to this Netbook, this netbook feels like a Toy, and Ubuntu recalls Windows 95 in GUI style... not in functionality so... it's cool, and I love it. but in experience sensation, once you go Mac you never go Back. Damn you Apple for not making a Netbook so I won't buy this one instead!

[darkmatter]

Originally Posted by Simon 

I still don't see how carving the case from solid aluminum should remove all screws.

Maybe some kind of the type magnetic or Mac mini like?. Engadget seems to have a leaked picture, the quality of the speaker holes is impressive

[Simon]

Originally Posted by darkmatter 

Maybe some kind of the type magnetic or Mac mini like?. Engadget seems to have a leaked picture, the quality of the speaker holes is impressive

I just started a new thread about the new cases here.

[P]

Originally Posted by Simon 

I still don't see how carving the case from solid aluminum should remove all screws.

Glue. If you have mating areas that aren't wafer thin, you can certainly glue it. Quite a bit of a modern car body is glued together. Doesn't mean that the "no screws" is true, in fact I hope it isn't, but it's possible, sure.

[Simon]

But doesn't glue imply you can't take it apart? Even if you glue a lot of parts, you would still have to leave some screws for disassembly, right?

[Eug]

MarketWatch: Apple sets up to release new notebook PCs

Apple Inc. on Thursday e-mailed invitations to media members for an event on Oct. 14 at the company's Cupertino, Calif. headquarters where Apple is set to rollout new models of its Macintosh laptop computers. The invitations, which read "The spotlight turns to notebooks," featured a partially obscured notebook PC coming out of shadows with a light upon the Apple logo.

[Eug]

Mockup based on leaked pix. Click image to enlarge.



I wonder why the artist chose black for the keyboard colour.

[P]

Originally Posted by Simon 

But doesn't glue imply you can't take it apart? Even if you glue a lot of parts, you would still have to leave some screws for disassembly, right?

I assumed that the keyboard and most likely the battery would still be removable - they can both be clipped into position. The interesting bit is if they could make it work with only that.

[I WAS the One]

Thank God that Apple don't introduce a netbook... woooshh!!! Now I can enjoy my baby Ubuntu! check it out!


Click for full size - Uploaded with plasq's Skitch


Click for full size - Uploaded with plasq's Skitch


Click for full size - Uploaded with plasq's Skitch

[Simon]

I find it quite amusing that before Oct 14 people saying "there won't be an $800 MB" or "Apple won't do a notebook" were told to shut up and face the overwhelming amount of rumors. Now that we know there will be no sub-$1k sub-$999 MB and/or netbook for the time being all the rumors and news sites are pointing out that there was only one rumor and that one wasn't credible anyway, yadda...

[Eug]

Originally Posted by Simon 

Now that we know there will be no sub-$1k MB and/or netbook for the time being

[Simon]

I'm surprised you didn't mention EDU discounts as well.

<cough>...sales tax...</cough>

Of course none of this changes the fact that Apple simply isn't doing the $799 MB or the $500 netbook I heard so much about just a few days ago. I'm sure the noise will increase as we approach the next refresh date though.

[Eug]

Originally Posted by Simon 

I'm surprised you didn't mention EDU discounts as well.

<cough>...sales tax...</cough>

Moving the goalposts now are we?

P.S. As for the edu discounts... I considered buying an edu, but got a refurb instead. $899 (which is about US$758 now) in Canada, or $849 from the US store. (For once we Canadians catch a break on the price.) Combo drive though, but then again it's actually faster than the new lower end AluMacBook.

[rach]

Last year i waited for ages until i could wait no more and bought a Dell XPS M1330. I wanted to replace the MBP that i owned as i wanted something smaller. I now own a Sony premium carbon SZ7 laptop. I tried out a MB in that time and i was just not all that impressed with it the weight and looks were the things that let it down for me.

Maybe back then last year i might have jumped up and down at the new MacBook's but i am not right now although i do feel that Apple is going in the right direction. These new MB's are very close to what i would like.

Since i have been using my Sony i have got used to excellent battery life and things like mobile broadband. I use 3G WWAN service to access internet on the go [i put a sim into my laptop] and i do not wish to take a step back and start using dongles in this day and age. If i was to use my phone as a modem on the go the battery life (of my phone) would probably last all of 45mins and this is not really a solution.

My current laptop weighs a shade under 4lbs. The Dell XPS M1330 with a 6 cell battery weighs in at about 4.3lbs. I feel that MB still could shed a little weight. I guess i could live with 4.5lbs though.

I think that Apple should just sell this as a pro package and put in an express card slot. I don't care less about firewire. I would like Apple to put in WWAN but i cannot see that happening so i could settle with a express card and get a data card express card for mobile broadband. I know that the PB 12" never used to have an express card/pc card slot but times have changed and moved on and this is now a requirement for many people and especially those that are on the go. For a professional these new MB's are lacking in expansion ports.

Also the battery life of this MB appears to have taken a slight hit.
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2332519,00.asp
I would like to see dual graphics in the MBP 13". I would like it to use both intel's integrated graphics and a dedicated card like several notebooks are using today. This way this allows for maximum battery life. I have only ever used the dedicated card in my SZ to check out a few things. I use the Intel integrated all the time as it runs cooler and it allows for max battery life.

I think that i am going to buy a Sony TZ/TT. I don't need that much power anymore and i think i would like an even smaller laptop for on the go. Those netbooks just look to cheap looking for me and they are not my style. The battery life on the TZ/TT are awesome and plus they are everything that i need in terms of mobile broadband.