[fire3500]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

Yeah, what do I know. I'm only a former professor of music technology turned record producer turned rock star.

"...and I'm a magician and my dad is in the SAS and is the only person ever to swim the channel underwater in 25 minutes holding his breath..."



I have to call BS on that dude... if you're *really* a rock STAR then name yourself... otherwise you sound like the kid with all the gear and no idea

"rock star"

[subego]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

turned rock star

Well, who are you then?

Edit: apparently I'm seconding the question.

[Lateralus]

I generally pace myself in everything that I do as to deflate other people's expectations of me.

Because I'm lazy.

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by fire3500 

I have to call BS on that dude... if you're *really* a rock STAR then name yourself...

Not gonna happen.

Originally Posted by fire3500 

otherwise you sound like the kid with all the gear and no idea

Of course. If I had an idea, I wouldn't say that GB was a toy, would I?

[subego]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

Not gonna happen.

You need to prove it somehow.

How about a half-dozen rapid-fire drummer jokes?

Good ones.

[subego]

Oh, and as for the GB vs. everything else argument.

GB is a crayon. You can do awesome things with a crayon if you know what you're doing.

Part of knowing what you are doing is that you shouldn't try and make a crayon be a set of oil paints, and vice versa.

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by subego 

You need to prove it somehow.

No, I don't. You only think I do.

Originally Posted by subego 

How about a half-dozen rapid-fire drummer jokes?

Good ones.

Except for the ones you already know (which *everyone* knows, let's face it), the only ones I know only work when the drummer is standing there in front of me. And include words like "tupperware", "lump hammer" and "dillhole".

Originally Posted by subego 

GB is a crayon. You can do awesome things with a crayon if you know what you're doing.

Part of knowing what you are doing is that you shouldn't try and make a crayon be a set of oil paints, and vice versa.

That crayon analogy doesn't work for me at all.

I hear that there's one or two people making art out of their own poop though. That's more like it.

Or, if you like, GB is a paint brush with only three bristles. And a handle covered in treacle.

[subego]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

No, I don't. You only think I do.

Thanks for walking over my setup. Though by doing so you demonstrate proper rock star attitude.

Originally Posted by Doofy 

Except for the ones you already know (which *everyone* knows, let's face it), the only ones I know only work when the drummer is standing there in front of me. And include words like "tupperware", "lump hammer" and "dillhole".

That was good.

Originally Posted by Doofy 

I hear that there's one or two people making art out of their own poop though. That's more like it.

I poop crayons.

[Dakar the Fourth]

Originally Posted by subego 

I poop crayons.

Stop eating them.

...or have you been trying a 'creative' way of drawing?

[fire3500]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

Not gonna happen.

Now why does this not surprise me?

Originally Posted by Doofy 

Of course. If I had an idea, I wouldn't say that GB was a toy, would I?

No, frankly you wouldn't... I'm a qualified engineer but I don't ridicule someone maintaining or adjusting equipment with something less than a Snap-On wrench... if a Halfords spanner will do the job to a satisfactory standard then there's no need to get pissy about it.

The thing with *pro* is it's not about what tools you use, it's how you use them... in each pound you earn you'll get a penny for turning the screw and ninety-nine pence for knowing which one to turn and how far. Same goes for computers, software, musical instruments or whatever. Your tools are a means to an end, not the end in itself, especially in music a true artist will weave magic from banging a cellphone against a glass jar and recording it on a 4 track Tascam... but being a professor of the science of "teh musics" I'm sure I'm telling you nothing new....

If you're insecure enough that you need to validate yourself and your *expert status* on here with a bunch of strangers... well I guess that your present biggest problem is not going to be, "where do I hang my platinum records?"

[subego]

Originally Posted by Dakar the Fourth 

Stop eating them.

I don't.

Doesn't really matter what I eat though.

If I eat lightning, I crap crayons.

[Dakar the Fourth]

Originally Posted by subego 

I don't.

Doesn't really matter what I eat though.

If I eat lightning, I crap crayons.

You were born for Youtube.

[dampeoples]

Originally Posted by fire3500 

Now why does this not surprise me?



No, frankly you wouldn't... I'm a qualified engineer but I don't ridicule someone maintaining or adjusting equipment with something less than a Snap-On wrench... if a Halfords spanner will do the job to a satisfactory standard then there's no need to get pissy about it.

The thing with *pro* is it's not about what tools you use, it's how you use them... in each pound you earn you'll get a penny for turning the screw and ninety-nine pence for knowing which one to turn and how far. Same goes for computers, software, musical instruments or whatever. Your tools are a means to an end, not the end in itself, especially in music a true artist will weave magic from banging a cellphone against a glass jar and recording it on a 4 track Tascam... but being a professor of the science of "teh musics" I'm sure I'm telling you nothing new....

If you're insecure enough that you need to validate yourself and your *expert status* on here with a bunch of strangers... well I guess that your present biggest problem is not going to be, "where do I hang my platinum records?"

Best post of this argument

[Aquataris]

My cellphone would break if I banged it on a glass jar. It would break if I stared at it without giving it warning of an impending blink. However, maybe banging a cowbell on a glass jar...

[subego]

Originally Posted by Dakar the Fourth 

You were born for Youtube.

Leave Youtube alone.

[Railroader]

Originally Posted by fire3500 

Now why does this not surprise me?



No, frankly you wouldn't... I'm a qualified engineer but I don't ridicule someone maintaining or adjusting equipment with something less than a Snap-On wrench... if a Halfords spanner will do the job to a satisfactory standard then there's no need to get pissy about it.

The thing with *pro* is it's not about what tools you use, it's how you use them... in each pound you earn you'll get a penny for turning the screw and ninety-nine pence for knowing which one to turn and how far. Same goes for computers, software, musical instruments or whatever. Your tools are a means to an end, not the end in itself, especially in music a true artist will weave magic from banging a cellphone against a glass jar and recording it on a 4 track Tascam... but being a professor of the science of "teh musics" I'm sure I'm telling you nothing new....

If you're insecure enough that you need to validate yourself and your *expert status* on here with a bunch of strangers... well I guess that your present biggest problem is not going to be, "where do I hang my platinum records?"

Your analogy does not relate well and proves your ignorance. We aren't talking about "slot a goes into tab b" stuff here. Using your analogy, are all engineering measuring devices consistent and usable in all circumstances? Would you use and architect's scale to measure a cam shaft's lobes?

We're talking about software that can mix and blend musical tracks accurately and consistently. GB has some major flaws. People don't buy much superior software because they want to waste money.

[abe]

Originally Posted by subego 

Gotcha. Thanks.

Thanks for asking.

And in reference to uncle Doofy's post where he said that Logic only costs 250 Quid. I was unfamiliar with what a Quid is so I Googled it and found that a Quid = a GBP (British Pound).

Then the conversion.

250.00 GBP = 497.114 USD

United Kingdom Pounds United States Dollars
1 GBP = 1.98846 USD 1 USD = 0.502903 GBP

Posted here as a public service.

[dampeoples]

You completely missed the point.

If you can use an architect scale to measure a camshaft lobe, so be it, why use something else if it's not handy? He didn't say to only use GB, that was the end all be all, he said the end result is what matters, and it is.

[Aquataris]

Originally Posted by Railroader 

Your analogy does not relate well and proves your ignorance. We aren't talking about "slot a goes into tab b" stuff here. Using your analogy, are all engineering measuring devices consistent and usable in all circumstances? Would you use and architect's scale to measure a cam shaft's lobes?

We're talking about software that can mix and blend musical tracks accurately and consistently. GB has some major flaws. People don't buy much superior software because they want to waste money.

Actually the analogy does work. We aren't talking about dissimilar tools that aren't meant for the purpose it's being used for. We aren't arguing whether a hotdog is better at doing taxes than a calculator. The point is, if GB does what a person wants and that person has done some pretty demanding things with it then GB is a perfectly usable tool. I don't understand why this is such a heated debate. I use GB, others use GB. We don't use it as a toy, we use it to make music. I don't care what Doofy uses to make music, the fact is they all work or they wouldn't be on the market. And before someone says that GB technically isn't on the market because it's in iLife, realize that it has many upgrades in it's history and is therefore considered a valid enough application by many people to warrant upgrades.

A guitar can be a toy to some, and to those who use it well enough or want to use it better it as an instrument.

Is that a good enough analogy for you? An instrument or program can be a toy to anybody who hasn't relied on it or used it for it's true purpose.

Photoshop is a pretty good program to reference. Moms use it to add speech bubbles to babies. Pixar uses it to make movies.

[abe]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

(There ya go Abe, that's my other thing I enjoy doing but do less than perfectly - arguing with lamers on the Internet. If I was better at it I'd have broke him in a single post. )

I'd say you performed at better than a GB level. Frankly I think your heart wasn't really behind breaking him as much as bloodying him. But what do I know? I can't even figure out how to make GB work. LOLOL

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by fire3500 

Now why does this not surprise me?

No way I'm throwing my identity out to this place - it's where I come when I want to be anonymous.

Originally Posted by fire3500 

No, frankly you wouldn't... I'm a qualified engineer but I don't ridicule someone maintaining or adjusting equipment with something less than a Snap-On wrench... if a Halfords spanner will do the job to a satisfactory standard then there's no need to get pissy about it.

But we're not talking Halfords spanner. We're talking one of those plastic jobbies you used to get with your pre-school plastic Mechano set.

Originally Posted by fire3500 

The thing with *pro* is it's not about what tools you use, it's how you use them... in each pound you earn you'll get a penny for turning the screw and ninety-nine pence for knowing which one to turn and how far. Same goes for computers, software, musical instruments or whatever. Your tools are a means to an end, not the end in itself, especially in music a true artist will weave magic from banging a cellphone against a glass jar and recording it on a 4 track Tascam... but being a professor of the science of "teh musics" I'm sure I'm telling you nothing new....

You wouldn't believe how crap a 4-track sounds these days when you've been used to DAWs.

Oh, and get a Fostex, not a Tascam. Much better facilities even if the build quality is lower.

Originally Posted by fire3500 

If you're insecure enough that you need to validate yourself and your *expert status* on here with a bunch of strangers...

Who's validating themselves?
I said GB is a toy.
Someone who wants to get married to it decided to argue with me.
I argued back.
Simple.

Originally Posted by fire3500 

well I guess that your present biggest problem is not going to be, "where do I hang my platinum records?"

Yeah, that's not a problem - I have plenty of wall space.

[Dakar the Fourth]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

No way I'm throwing my identity out to this place - it's where I come when I want to be anonymous.

That and you don't need the pile-on of all the people telling you your music sucked.

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by Aquataris 

if GB does what a person wants and that person has done some pretty demanding things with it then GB is a perfectly usable tool.

Demanding things? Sweet - I didn't know you could write sysex to control your TVAs and TVFs with GB. Must give that a go.

Originally Posted by Aquataris 

I don't understand why this is such a heated debate.

It's a heated debate because you're getting your panties in a wad at the thought of the software you use not quite being as good as you thought it was.

GB is that first little freebie crack hit the dealer gives you to get you a taste for it so you go buy more (i.e. Logic Express, Logic Studio, Mac Pro with 16 Gb). It's not intended for any proper work to be done on it - IIRC, Jobs even hints at this in the keynote where GB was introduced. Accept that and move on.

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by Dakar the Fourth 

That and you don't need the pile-on of all the people telling you your music sucked.

Well, that too.

[Aquataris]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

Demanding things? Sweet - I didn't know you could write sysex to control your TVAs and TVFs with GB. Must give that a go.



It's a heated debate because you're getting your panties in a wad at the thought of the software you use not quite being as good as you thought it was.

GB is that first little freebie crack hit the dealer gives you to get you a taste for it so you go buy more (i.e. Logic Express, Logic Studio, Mac Pro with 16 Gb). It's not intended for any proper work to be done on it - IIRC, Jobs even hints at this in the keynote where GB was introduced. Accept that and move on.

How can you be so stupid about music when you are what you claim to be? I have only tried to say one thing over and over again... I have gotten EXACTLY what I want out of it. There are no panties at all, only your ignorance. I have never abandoned anything because GB couldn't do it, because it has been able to do the things I want. I never offended your process, don't pretend you have a full comprehension over what I do with GB. All you know is that I use it and that it does what I want. Accept that and move on. I have tried to put this topic back together but you are such a child that you can't accept that some of us have been successful at using GB.

I don't see how you could be a musician, honestly. You are so worried about tech that you forget that music comes down to people and their instruments. You DON'T need ANYTHING to make the music happen except skill and understanding. I'm starting to think you don't know how to use any instrument and believe that all the studio equipment is necessary to take the errors out of your music. Please read this... I USE GB. IT WORKS. That is all.

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by Aquataris 

I have tried to put this topic back together but you are such a child that you can't accept that some of us have been successful at using GB.

You've been successful at using GB? So, go buy Logic Studio and a faster Mac with the proceeds and offset it against your business tax. Sorted.

Originally Posted by Aquataris 

I don't see how you could be a musician, honestly. You are so worried about tech that you forget that music comes down to people and their instruments.

Yeah, that's what all the boys at toy level say. Reality says otherwise, which is why the average pro guitarist will tell you to go take a jump if you try to force him to play a Squier strat.

[Aquataris]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

You've been successful at using GB? So, go buy Logic Studio and a faster Mac with the proceeds and offset it against your business tax. Sorted.



Yeah, that's what all the boys at toy level say. Reality says otherwise, which is why the average pro guitarist will tell you to go take a jump if you try to force him to play a Squier strat.

Okay, obviously, you have some odd fetish for pretending you're on a pedestal. I accept that. I don't judge people for their fetishes, you can't help what gets you off, but for the love of music, please understand that I use GB and use it well. That is ALL I am trying to put across and it's all anybody here wants you to realize and the fact that you completely tried to glorify yourself instead of verifying that you acknowledge that musicians have existed long before Protools and Logic and therefore are more responsible for quality than an app has made me lose all respect for you at all.

[brassplayersrock²]

Originally Posted by subego 

Leave Uncle Doof alone.

fixed

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by Aquataris 

Okay, obviously, you have some odd fetish for pretending you're on a pedestal.

That, combined with your sig message, tells me that you're running some kind of inferiority complex.

Don't worry. I'd have an inferiority complex too if I were you.

[Aquataris]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

That, combined with your sig message, tells me that you're running some kind of inferiority complex.

Don't worry. I'd have an inferiority complex too if I were you.

I put that sig there four years ago as a joke. And as for inferiority complex, you don't know me. All you know is that I am better than you with GB and for some reason that tiny little speck of my life bothers you. Get over it. From here on out I will ignore any pathetic jab you throw at me. This is getting really really stupid and you seem to feel that since you said you could break me down you can't give it a rest until some little retort from your end gets me to cross a line. That won't happen. You are trying to save yourself after you have made a complete fool out of yourself and it's just sad. You said you have a career in music both as an artist and as a teacher. This means you are likely over 30. I am 23. The fact that you are making yourself appear to be a small child throwing out claims about not only other people but about your own personal life that you refuse to back up makes me feel not only bad for you, but also a little sad that you would be so jaded by a small comment about being able to record music satisfactory to it's artist and to all who have heard it using GB. If you are a real musician than I don't want to know who you are. There is only a very very small chance that I would be a fan of your music, but if you where an artist I enjoy, this type of behavior would make it hard for me to ever respect your work again.

[RAILhead]

Peeing in the toilet -- just ask my wife if you don't believe me.

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by Aquataris 

I put that sig there four years ago as a joke.

Good. I put that comment there a few minutes ago as a joke.

Originally Posted by Aquataris 

All you know is that I am better than you with GB and for some reason that tiny little speck of my life bothers you.

Oops, there you go again.

I said GarageBand is a toy and you turn it into some kind of "I'm better than you" thing. I'm not having a discussion with some kind of hidden AI bot subroutine in GarageBand or something am I? I mean, you seem to have taken it all a bit personally.
Hey, got news for you: you are not the software you use.

And let's get it straight. All we really know for sure is that I've outgrown toys like GarageBand and you haven't.

Originally Posted by Aquataris 

There is only a very very small chance that I would be a fan of your music, but if you where an artist I enjoy, this type of behavior would make it hard for me to ever respect your work again.

Dude, you can't afford a copy of Logic as a career investment, so it's likely that if on the very extremely remote chance you like my stuff you'd be half-inching it off a torrent site or a friend's CD rather than buying it anyways. And pantywaists don't tend to like my stuff. So don't worry about it.

[Aquataris]

Something else I enjoy doing is buying albums. I can't stand having only the files. The only reason this is less than perfect is because of the price. Even worse, some of the more obscure black metal takes forever to get to the US.

[Oisín]

And pantywaists don't tend to like my stuff.

That hurts, man. That really hurts.

[CreepDogg]

C'mon guys, lighten up. If someone were to go and make a brilliant album on GB, it could be done and would sound fine. Likewise, a lot of crap gets created on Logic. The reverse is also true. GB is more than a toy - it's a legitimate tool for amateurs, but it's not the be all end all. There's a reason why the pros look for more, but GB lets you do a lot of things you couldn't do before it without a serious investment. I'm not a carpenter, but I have a hammer. Does that mean the hammer is a toy?

Oh, and I enjoy playing guitar and drums less than perfectly, occasionally recording the results. Generally have used an old cassette 4-track or 8-track, and in later years GB and the basic software that comes with a basic MOTU unit. Great stuff for hobbying!

[Lateralus]

Man...

This thread has become much more fun than its subject can handle.

Simmer down.

[Aquataris]

Double post.

See below.

[Aquataris]

Originally Posted by CreepDogg 

Oh, and I enjoy playing guitar and drums less than perfectly, occasionally recording the results. Generally have used an old cassette 4-track or 8-track, and in later years GB and the basic software that comes with a basic MOTU unit. Great stuff for hobbying!

Gotta love the sound of a guitar solo on 4-track tape. Recently a new thrash metal band Warbringer recorded their debut album on 4-track that was left over from the producers stash of blank tape he recorded Slayer's 80's material on. The result was amazing. I'd like to record like that someday.

[xi_hyperon]

Originally Posted by Lateralus 

Simmer down.

Thank you.

I love the peace of gardening. I am far from great at it, but over the years I've progressed from killing any plant I touch, to moderate success.

[Lateralus]

Originally Posted by xi_hyperon 

Thank you.

I love the peace of gardening. I am far from great at it, but over the years I've progressed from killing any plant I touch, to moderate success.

I'm still young enough that I'd not exactly jump at the opportunity to admit this to friends... but I'd love to start a garden. I've wanted to for some time. But I'm still and have always been an apartment dweller and gardens don't seem to work well in that environment.

If I lived in an upstairs apartment with a secure porch, I'd consider green thumbing. But I don't.

Some day...

(PS: If memory serves, you're a fellow Tulsan, right?)

[xi_hyperon]

It's never too late to start gardening. Just be prepared for some casualties along the way in your endeavors.

I was in Tulsa for much of my life, but relocated with family about 40 miles north of Houston a couple years back. I still visit now and then, mainly to see old friends as well as the parents. But you know, I think it is more difficult to garden in Tulsa, and maybe in the midwest in general, because of the extremes in weather there, temperature-wise. I always had the worst luck in the late summer when it got crazy hot and the sun just baked everything.

[Aquataris]

Originally Posted by xi_hyperon 

It's never to late to start gardening. Just be prepared for some casualties along the way in your endeavors.

I was in Tulsa for much of my life, but relocated with family about 40 miles north of Houston a couple years back. I still visit now and then, mainly to see old friends as well as the parents. But you know, I think it is more difficult to garden in Tulsa, and maybe in the midwest in general, because of the extremes in weather there, temperature-wise. I always had the worst luck in the late summer when it got crazy hot and the sun just baked everything.

Have you been back to see us since the trees shattered last winter?

[Lateralus]

Originally Posted by xi_hyperon 

It's never too late to start gardening. Just be prepared for some casualties along the way in your endeavors.

I always liked the idea of growing my own tomatoes. But from what I hear, it's next to impossible unless you know what you're doing and unless the weather cooperates.

I was in Tulsa for much of my life, but relocated with family about 40 miles north of Houston a couple years back. I still visit now and then, mainly to see old friends as well as the parents. But you know, I think it is more difficult to garden in Tulsa, and maybe in the midwest in general, because of the extremes in weather there, temperature-wise. I always had the worst luck in the late summer when it got crazy hot and the sun just baked everything.

Well, congratulations on getting out! Tulsa seems to be some kind of elaborate trap.

I'm hoping to move along sometime toward fall once my lease expires. Colorado is on my list, though. And I can imagine it might actually be a better gardening state than OK since the weather is at least a little more consistent.

[d4nth3m4n]

pickup basketball with coworkers. got over the embarrassment of sucking and embraced the dog-chasing-a-frisbee aspect of ball games that can't help but get you in shape.

[xi_hyperon]

Originally Posted by Aquataris 

Have you been back to see us since the trees shattered last winter?

Heck yeah...I made a trip up there to help my dad clear tree limbs from around their house. Good times.

Originally Posted by Lateralus 

I always liked the idea of growing my own tomatoes. But from what I hear, it's next to impossible unless you know what you're doing and unless the weather cooperates.

Home grown tomatoes are great, but I never gave them a try myself for the same reason. Good luck with the plan this fall. Colorado sounds good - any part in particular?

[Railroader]

Originally Posted by Lateralus 

I always liked the idea of growing my own tomatoes. But from what I hear, it's next to impossible unless you know what you're doing and unless the weather cooperates.

Not if you're in most of Michigan. Drop a couple seeds and in a few months you'll have more tomatoes than you can buy canning jars. And next year, what you didn't pick will have propagated themselves and started new plants. You have to be very skillful to kill tomatoes there.

[Lateralus]

Good luck with the plan this fall. Colorado sounds good - any part in particular?

Yeah... I'm not that good with the whole planning thing. I've got vacation time coming up sometime this summer and was just gonna drive to 'Colorado' and burn a few tanks worth of gas looking around.

Closer to Denver, preferably. Not quite ready for too much nature, ya know?

But to be honest, I could probably commit to moving wherever my dart lands on a map of North American and be happier than I am in Tulsa.

Originally Posted by Railroader 

Not if you're in most of Michigan. Drop a couple seeds and in a few months you'll have more tomatoes than you can buy canning jars. And next year, what you didn't pick will have propagated themselves and started new plants. You have to be very skillful to kill tomatoes there.

Interesting. Tomatoes don't come to my mind when I think of Michigan. Shows what I know, eh?

Worry not though. You'll not see my kind voyage that far north, no matter how great my love of tomatoes. You're talking to somebody who sleeps with the AC off during mid-summer.

Damn me and my Florida blood.

[osiris]

Cranking up a Marshall stack to 11 and tearing through a couple of Hendrix tunes on a vintage Stratocaster really gets my blood going, and boils the neighbor's blood as well.

[abe]

Originally Posted by Railroader 

Not if you're in most of Michigan. Drop a couple seeds and in a few months you'll have more tomatoes than you can buy canning jars. And next year, what you didn't pick will have propagated themselves and started new plants. You have to be very skillful to kill tomatoes there.

I wonder how this would work. Anyone have first hand knowledge?



https://www.hangingtomato.com/?cid=486260




Topsy Turvy Upside-Down Tomato Planter

[RAILhead]

I've heard those things work great -- but I have yet to order one.