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You are here: MacNN Forums > Community > MacNN Lounge > Political/War Lounge > Making a Murderer - Legal vs Justice System?

View Poll Results: After viewing the documentary, what say you?
Poll Options:
Steven Avery is GUILTY 0 votes (0%)
Steven Avery is NOT GUILTY 0 votes (0%)
Brendan Dassey is GUILTY 0 votes (0%)
Brendan Dassey is NOT GUILTY 2 votes (100.00%)
The police FRAMED Steven Avery 0 votes (0%)
The police did NOT FRAME Steven Avery 0 votes (0%)
Brendan Dassey had EFFECTIVE COUNSEL 0 votes (0%)
Brendan Dassey did NOT have EFFECTIVE COUNSEL 2 votes (100.00%)
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 2. You may not vote on this poll
Making a Murderer - Legal vs Justice System?
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OAW
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Jan 8, 2016, 01:17 PM
 


This seems to be one of the most popular shows on TV right now. So for those who have actually watched it ... what say you to the poll question? Did Steven Avery receive a fair trial? Did the police try to frame him? Did the police take advantage of Brendan Dassey's youth and cognitive disabilities? Did he have effective counsel?

More broadly, do we have a "Justice" system? Or do we have a "Legal" system?

Discuss!

PS: "Guilty" vs. "Not Guilty" above is in the legal sense. For instance, if you think the guy did it but it wasn't proven beyond a reasonable doubt you should vote "Not Guilty".
     
BadKosh
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Jan 8, 2016, 02:08 PM
 
This is a TV show? Fiction of course.
     
Cap'n Tightpants
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Jan 8, 2016, 02:15 PM
 
They wouldn't try to doctor the info themselves, just to make a controversial TV series, would they? Of course not. Yet again we have people confused about the difference between news and entertainment.
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Chongo
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Jan 8, 2016, 02:45 PM
 
Originally Posted by BadKosh View Post
This is a TV show? Fiction of course.
I have not seen the series but from the news coverage on the series:
Avery was convicted of rape and spent 18 years in prison, then was exonerated by DNA. He sued and won big money. He's claiming the county framed him because he won the lawsuit for wrongful conviction.
     
OAW  (op)
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Jan 8, 2016, 03:52 PM
 
Originally Posted by Chongo View Post
I have not seen the series but from the news coverage on the series:
Avery was convicted of rape and spent 18 years in prison, then was exonerated by DNA. He sued and won big money. He's claiming the county framed him because he won the lawsuit for wrongful conviction.
Pretty close. He sued and was close to getting $36 million but he had not won just yet. Some say the county framed him in retaliation and because the local government and many in the town strongly dislike the Avery clan. He ended up settling for $400K in order to pay his attorneys to fight the murder charge.
     
OreoCookie
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Jan 13, 2016, 08:34 PM
 
I haven't finished watching the series yet, but every episode successfully manages to churn my stomach.
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
     
design219
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Jan 14, 2016, 11:41 AM
 


I found it to be very gripping, and I was sure he was framed after watching the whole thing. But, now I'm seeing more and more on the web about the documentary not telling a complete story, so I'm less sure.

The kid, Brandon, is just a victim of low IQ and low self esteem.

Oh, and the cat. Animal abuse by a teen is not a good sign for adulthood.
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design219
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Jan 14, 2016, 11:48 AM
 
I'm not 100% sure of his complete innocence because of the nature of editing a documentary, but...

 
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design219
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Jan 14, 2016, 11:57 AM
 
By the way, can this thread be moved to the main lounge? I don't think it is political and might get more discussion there.
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OAW  (op)
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Jan 14, 2016, 10:17 PM
 
Originally Posted by design219 View Post
I'm not 100% sure of his complete innocence because of the nature of editing a documentary, but...

 
Agreed!

OAW
     
OAW  (op)
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Jan 14, 2016, 10:19 PM
 
Originally Posted by design219 View Post
By the way, can this thread be moved to the main lounge? I don't think it is political and might get more discussion there.
Not a bad idea. If a mod would please move this thread to the regular lounge I'd greatly appreciate it.

OAW
( Last edited by OAW; Jan 15, 2016 at 02:36 PM. )
     
Cap'n Tightpants
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Jan 15, 2016, 02:03 AM
 
His fiance says he's a monster and can believe he did what they claim he did.

'Making a Murderer' Subject's Ex-Fiancee: 'He's Not Innocent' | Rolling Stone
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OreoCookie
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Jan 15, 2016, 02:43 AM
 
Originally Posted by Cap'n Tightpants View Post
His fiance says he's a monster and can believe he did what they claim he did.

'Making a Murderer' Subject's Ex-Fiancee: 'He's Not Innocent' | Rolling Stone
It's not about whether you think Avery is guilty, it's whether he had been treated fairly (in both, the legal and the moral sense) and should have been convicted based on the evidence.
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The Final Dakar
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Jan 15, 2016, 06:27 PM
 
Originally Posted by OreoCookie View Post
It's not about whether you think Avery is guilty, it's whether he had been treated fairly (in both, the legal and the moral sense) and should have been convicted based on the evidence.
You can think he's guilty while admitting they didn't meet the burden of beyond a reasonable doubt. That's how I see Zimmerman's case, after all.
     
Chongo
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Jan 15, 2016, 08:13 PM
 
OJ is another example.
     
OreoCookie
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Jan 16, 2016, 01:19 AM
 
Originally Posted by The Final Dakar View Post
You can think he's guilty while admitting they didn't meet the burden of beyond a reasonable doubt. That's how I see Zimmerman's case, after all.
Precisely that's the point here: OAWs question in the poll (which was clarified in his post) was not whether you believe he was guilty in the OJ sense, but whether he should have been convicted.
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Cap'n Tightpants
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Jan 16, 2016, 05:52 AM
 
Originally Posted by The Final Dakar View Post
You can think he's guilty while admitting they didn't meet the burden of beyond a reasonable doubt. That's how I see Zimmerman's case, after all.
Yep. Being found Not Guilty isn't the same as being innocent.
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Chongo
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Jan 16, 2016, 07:45 AM
 
My brother is watching it now. He's had experience with our court system here in AZ. I'll see what he thinks once he's finished.
     
design219
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Jan 22, 2016, 12:28 PM
 
Okay, we now have a VERY interesting alternate theory. If you are interesting in this case, you should watch this vid.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BU94...ature=youtu.be
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