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Bionic Mermaids and New Atlantis
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Waragainstsleep
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Sep 23, 2015, 03:43 PM
 
So if you were a double leg amputee or perhaps paralysed below the waist, would you prefer to spend most of your time in a wheel chair, or would you prefer the freedom you could potentially enjoy from having a robotic mermaid-style tail in a water-filled building designed to allow you and others like you to spend long periods of your days working and moving more freely than a chair might allow?

I'm wondering if some of the unconscious movements required of a a tail to facilitate balance and motion might be easier than those required for robot legs which have much more work do in terms of dealing with gravity and balance. I figure it might be possible to get an almost Segway-like control system to work for a tail so that you could go from an upright, treading-water position to forward motion by leaning forwards and letting computers handle a lot of the rest of the work.
You could use your upper body to choose direction and the only controls you would need would be to control the speed of your movement.
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subego
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Sep 23, 2015, 04:12 PM
 
I feel like the prune issue is a big hangup.
     
ShortcutToMoncton
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Sep 23, 2015, 04:43 PM
 
I feel as though I am missing context here because I don't even
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reader50
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Sep 23, 2015, 07:51 PM
 
I admit not having worried much about bionic mermaids.

But, if you are giving up on normal access, wouldn't a wheeled chair be cheaper and closer to normal? One that responds to thoughts, leaning, or other small movements.

I suspect the question is moot. We're close to human-form prosthetics that respond to thoughts already. And I'd take a bionic leg over a bionic tail. However, a water-access home would be cool to show off.
     
Waragainstsleep  (op)
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Sep 23, 2015, 08:04 PM
 
Its certainly true that you can lose a surprising amount of leg and retain a surprising amount of mobility with some quite simple prosthetics, but I think some of these stabilised, computer and thought controlled ex-skeletons are still a way away from being graceful, slender and inconspicuous, then there are power considerations etc.
I'm not convinced of it or anything, but I just have an inkling that you could gain quite a lot of freedom in spite of quite a nasty injury if you were happy to spend lots of time in water. Or under it.
I feel like a tail would require less tailoring (!) to its owner somehow than new legs might. And if I'm right about the reduced command set it should be much easier to calibrate and become highly proficient with.

I did wonder about pruning and other long term effects of spending 8+ hours a day in water.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
reader50
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Sep 23, 2015, 08:21 PM
 
Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep View Post
So if you were a double leg amputee or perhaps paralysed below the waist ...
Oddly, just ran across this story after seeing the thread. A paralysed man has been walking again. Researches used brain-wave pickups, an interpretation computer, and nerve stimulation to bypass the spinal damage. Letting the guy walk with his own legs, after 5 years of paralysis.
     
Waragainstsleep  (op)
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Sep 24, 2015, 05:08 AM
 
The other thing I wondered was whether you could build some kind of adaptor that incorporated a life support system capable of sustaining a real biological fish tail and allow it to be used by a human.
Are fish simple enough that with current or near technology we could sustain a part of one so it doesn't atrophy or rot? Supply oxygen and nutrients to the muscles as needed etc?
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subego
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Sep 24, 2015, 05:20 AM
 
Off-the-cuff thought is it'd be easier to beat the atrophy problem if you used an invertebrate, but I imagine the interface would be more difficult.
     
Waragainstsleep  (op)
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Sep 25, 2015, 06:10 AM
 
Its not an idea you see in sci-fi terribly often, but once we have really gotten the hang of artificial replacement limbs with two-way neural connections, extra, different or enhanced limbs are a next logical step.

Dr. Octopus is probably the best known example of this but the full implications are often glossed over. Outside the comics at least. Whether grafted or engineered biologically or installed mechanically, extra limbs are probably an inevitable path that humanity will go down sooner or later.
This will worry many many people for two reasons: Firstly there will be the mostly irrational fear of anything different;
Secondly, the best way to fully utilise and calibrate these additions or enhancements is to install them as young as possible so the brain just treats them as totally normal. Whether its a bionic eye that can see every part of the EM spectrum and has a zoom feature, a telepathy-like wireless data link or the afore-implied tentacles, wings, tails or even internal organs with exciting new functions. Makes you wonder why The Borg were all bipedal, even if all the donor races started out that way.

So, what enhancements or extras would you fancy? Permanent or removable?
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
Laminar
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Sep 25, 2015, 10:19 AM
 
David Blaine did seven days and nights underwater and saw breakdown and pressure ulcers in his skin.
     
The Final Dakar
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Sep 25, 2015, 10:31 AM
 
Originally Posted by Laminar View Post
David Blaine did seven days and nights underwater and saw breakdown and pressure ulcers in his skin.
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Laminar
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Sep 25, 2015, 10:57 AM
 
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Waragainstsleep  (op)
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Sep 25, 2015, 11:30 AM
 
Interesting. And unfortunate.
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el chupacabra
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Sep 27, 2015, 08:27 PM
 
… .
( Last edited by el chupacabra; Jan 5, 2024 at 02:09 AM. )
     
Laminar
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Sep 27, 2015, 09:16 PM
 
Originally Posted by el chupacabra View Post
I could Enjoy a tail. I wouldnt want to be in a building full of water though, Id want a job where I could be doing work in the lake or ocean for several hours a day. Surfers are often in the water for hours straight.
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Waragainstsleep  (op)
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Sep 28, 2015, 08:40 AM
 
Originally Posted by el chupacabra View Post
I could Enjoy a tail. I wouldnt want to be in a building full of water though, Id want a job where I could be doing work in the lake or ocean for several hours a day. Surfers are often in the water for hours straight.
Certainly plenty of jobs to be had like that. Anything involving diving of course, lifeguarding and research applications. I guess it would open a new sector in below the waterline service work for boats and oil rigs.


Originally Posted by el chupacabra View Post
Figuring out salamander like regeneration is probably right around the corner. Which would make bionics less relevant.
Regeneration works nicely for keeping the limbs you have. Maybe it could be adapted to grow new ones at will and shed them when you're finished?
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
subego
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Sep 28, 2015, 01:28 PM
 
Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep View Post
Certainly plenty of jobs to be had like that. Anything involving diving of course, lifeguarding and research applications. I guess it would open a new sector in below the waterline service work for boats and oil rigs.
I know I'm Mr. Buzzkill on this thread, but for underwater work I'd say gills would be more useful than a tail. Flippers are pretty sweet.
     
Waragainstsleep  (op)
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Sep 28, 2015, 03:22 PM
 
The ability to breath and handle high pressure (differentials) would be more of a game changer than a tail. I think those are easier said than done.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
subego
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Sep 28, 2015, 03:29 PM
 
We'll have pressure nailed relatively soon. It'll be like in The Abyss.
     
Waragainstsleep  (op)
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Sep 30, 2015, 05:48 AM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
We'll have pressure nailed relatively soon. It'll be like in The Abyss.
Really? I know the over-oxygenated water was based on real science and does indeed work for small rodents, but I read that it was impossible to get enough oxygen into the liquid for humans to live on. Though perhaps it's a different liquid?
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subego
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Sep 30, 2015, 06:19 AM
 
It still needs work, but think you could swing it in 20-40 years.

We know it has to happen while there's still okra.
     
   
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