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Simon · May 29, 2008, 03:21 AM

Originally Posted by Randman

Always repair permission before AND after such an update. Saves many a headache.

Yeah, and throw in a little voodoo dance too. You never know.

analogika · May 29, 2008, 03:34 AM

Originally Posted by Randman

Always repair permission before AND after such an update. Saves many a headache.

You do know that repairing it *before*hand is COMPLETELY irrelevant?

The installer overrides ANY permissions set or changed beforehand - that's why you're giving it your admin password.

Randman · May 29, 2008, 03:56 AM

Well, I don't repair before but I do after and have never had problems with an install.

- - e r i k - - · May 29, 2008, 04:05 AM

Originally Posted by Randman

Well, I don't repair before but I do after and have never had problems with an install.

You wouldn't have had them otherwise either.

Randman · May 29, 2008, 04:15 AM

Some people do.

P · May 29, 2008, 05:24 AM

Originally Posted by Randman

Some people do.

Some people that did not wear a tinfoil fat were hit by lightening. Therefore, wearing a tinfoil hat protects you from lightening. It also protects you from earthquakes, AIDS, and bootup problems with your Mac - all by the same logic.

Note that showing a person that DID get hit by lightening despite wearing his tinfoil hat does not disprove this, because he might have had some other problem.

If you want to repair permissions, go ahead. It doesn't help (at least not to do it twice - if your Mac was somehow messed up by a non-Apple installer or other root-privileged program and you hadn't rebooted until the update came along, then it might not boot again, but it has nothing to do with the update, and I'm not aware of any that bad installers going around since the Puma days), but it also doesn't hurt, and your time is yours to waste.

MacNNUK · May 29, 2008, 08:25 AM

Originally Posted by MacNNUK

Absolutely no probs at all.

Delayed restart till I was ready, then got progress bar, not seen that before, then restarted OK

420mb installation.

Not noticed any difference since upgrade, except iMac did seem to start up quicker.

XBench Summary show similar results (120ish), faster memory etc, slower disc access.

Just updated my other iMac, virtually the same, except for no Superdrive, only downloaded the 198mb version !!

Go Figure...

Goldfinger · May 29, 2008, 08:42 AM

Apparantly it fixes the Time Machine/Aperture incompatibility. Will test it later today.

Wiskedjak · May 29, 2008, 08:48 AM

If repairing permissions is so important, shouldn't Apple mention that little tid-bit at the beginning of the update installation process or, even better, build permissions repair into the process? That they don't say anything about it suggests that Apple is either negligent or doesn't believe permissions repair is necessary.

Personally, I think most problems result from people downloading the update as soon as possible and uncovering bugs.

Horsepoo!!! · May 29, 2008, 09:22 AM

Originally Posted by Wiskedjak

If repairing permissions is so important, shouldn't Apple mention that little tid-bit at the beginning of the update installation process or, even better, build permissions repair into the process? That they don't say anything about it suggests that Apple is either negligent or doesn't believe permissions repair is necessary.

Personally, I think most problems result from people downloading the update as soon as possible and uncovering bugs.

But repairing permissions is not important. In fact, it does nothing to prevent problems.

Someone that repaires permission 6 times before an update and 4 times after the update still has the same amount of chance to encounter a problem than someone that has not repaired permissions at all.

edit: forgive me, I misunderstood your post...I see now that you're trying to explain the same thing I'm saying

benz · May 29, 2008, 09:35 AM

i tried both, same error window appears

benz

Todd Madson · May 29, 2008, 11:10 AM

Installed on a G5 2.5 dual and a G4 1.25 ghz lamp imac with no problems.

I will have to see if I notice any substantial changes/problems when I return to the
house later today.

Hal Itosis · May 29, 2008, 11:30 AM

Originally Posted by TETENAL

Unfortunately you still can not sort search results by size.

The lack of size and date modified view options is stunning. It's so basic... so useful.

I can't decide which would be more annoying:

somehow they can't get it working, or
they willfully will never add it back (until we beg/scream/etc).

Truly dumbfounding... either way.

I'll probably wind up buying Leap, but still... that much should be there by default.

stoneage · May 29, 2008, 12:55 PM

.........and I am unable to run Software Update since the update. It won't start from the Apple menu at all and is grayed out in About This Mac. This only happened on the iMac, not the MacBook.

voodoo · May 29, 2008, 01:20 PM

The install process worked fine from this end and Leopard is running smoothly. As it was in 10.5.2 and in 10.5.1.

I have figured one thing about Apple's idea of updates to its system. It is really (really) not to improve (in the established sense of the word) the system released, but to make it as good as it should have been when it was released according to their own ideas. We are beta-testing.

Essentially, this means that 10.5.x will all be updates on Time Machine, Spaces, RAW imaging, wireless backups etc etc. The focus points of Apple at the moment.

Apple's message is clear: What was, is passed. Was is passed will never be. What is, rules.

analogika · May 29, 2008, 02:15 PM

Any substantially new functionality would have to be paid for, anyway, since the SOx Act.

Of *course* the primary focus of point updates is going to be bugfixes...

seanc · May 29, 2008, 04:25 PM

On a C2D MacBook with 10.5.2 installed it's 420mb for me as well.

OAW · May 29, 2008, 04:25 PM

I tried to upgrade using Software Update. It downloaded fine but when it tried to install it would hang at the "Configuring Installation" stage. Reboot and retry resulted in the same. Twice. So I tried the Combo Update. A larger download, but it installed properly the first time. So far so good.

OAW

larrinski · May 29, 2008, 04:41 PM

After about 3 hours of hanging on the blue screen, I hit the power button, and it rebooted and started the install just fine. I don't know what caused the hang up, but I am up and running fine now.

The big one for me that was fixed, was that my iSub works again along as I have a set of USB speakers plugged in at the same time. That has been busted on the intel Macs since Leopard came out. If they would only allow it to run with the internal speakers I would be laughing...

AKcrab · May 29, 2008, 05:03 PM

Originally Posted by OAW

So I tried the Combo Update. A larger download, but it installed properly the first time.

IMO this is the safest way to guarantee a successful update. (As opposed to repairing permissions.)

voodoo · May 29, 2008, 05:23 PM

Originally Posted by analogika

Of *course* the primary focus of point updates is going to be bugfixes...

Of course, but I have noticed through the years some aniticiaption with each minor OS X update for new features.

As for that sox act, well that's another thread entirely.

ghporter · May 29, 2008, 06:12 PM

Software Update handled it for me yesterday with a 198MB download for my late 2007 aluminum iMac. No sweat at all. I have come to expect the double restart, and it was otherwise uneventful. I haven't found anything new in 10.5.3.

I'll update my MBP (mid 2005, Core Duo) tomorrow.

DCJ001 · May 29, 2008, 06:45 PM

Originally Posted by benz

i cannot update to 10.5.3 in my MBP (from 10.5.2), the dmg can be downloaded but error window appears : " installer cannot validate the contents of "macos10.5.3update" package" , what is this and any solution ?

Originally Posted by turtle777

Did you do Software update, or download the combo installer from Apple ?

I'd try the latter (again).

I recommend doing the former.

MartiNZ · May 29, 2008, 07:40 PM

Gosh darnit. The 'menubar isn't necessarily in the same app as the user' bug persists.

However, given that it seems to happen mostly with Microsoft Entourage when clicking desktop notifications, it's probably an MS issue. Annoying either way.

voicebox · May 29, 2008, 07:53 PM

Originally Posted by AKcrab

IMO this is the safest way to guarantee a successful update. (As opposed to repairing permissions.)

Hi Akrab
Good advice, I did the same and downloaded the 536 MB combo, I installed the update and I have had no trouble whatsoever.
By the way, I never use Software Update, I always download updates direct from the Apple site.
Best
voicebox

turtle777 · May 29, 2008, 07:55 PM

Originally Posted by Wiskedjak

Personally, I think most problems result from people downloading the update as soon as possible and uncovering bugs.

Utterly irrelevant.

1) Some people here report problems about the *DOWNLOADING* and *INSTALLING* the update. That has nothing to do with the content, and possible bugs in the updated OS.

2) The Update is NOT continuously updated by Apple. It *DOES NOT* matter if you install it the same day it comes out or three weeks later. NONE of the issues go away by just waiting a couple of days before downloading.

-t

MartiNZ · May 29, 2008, 07:59 PM

Not to mention if there were anything that actually might be fixed within a few days, it's better to have more people installing, testing and reporting such.

msuper69 · May 29, 2008, 08:27 PM

And the string of successful updates continues. 8.1 to 10.5.3

And what is this "repair permissions" of which you speak?

MartiNZ · May 29, 2008, 09:14 PM

No! The 'randomly switch back to the -nasty- default Color LCD display calibration on wake from sleep' bug is still around

.

greenamp · May 29, 2008, 11:29 PM

Originally Posted by analogika

You do know that repairing it *before*hand is COMPLETELY irrelevant?

The installer overrides ANY permissions set or changed beforehand - that's why you're giving it your admin password.

But but, lines of text scroll by and a progress bar fills up!

MartiNZ · May 29, 2008, 11:30 PM

Originally Posted by greenamp

But but, lines of text scroll by and a progress bar fills up!

And much faster than it used to now! Apparently, I haven't repaired since installing yet

.

- - e r i k - - · May 30, 2008, 01:08 AM

Originally Posted by greenamp

But but, lines of text scroll by and a progress bar fills up!

I think you actually nailed the psychological effects this might have on the user. It actually feels like you are accomplishing something and the lines of text and progress bar reinforces this.

analogika · May 30, 2008, 02:26 AM

Originally Posted by MartiNZ

Gosh darnit. The 'menubar isn't necessarily in the same app as the user' bug persists.

However, given that it seems to happen mostly with Microsoft Entourage when clicking desktop notifications, it's probably an MS issue. Annoying either way.

It's not. In fact, it's just got an EVEN WORSE twist:

Just switched between Mail and Safari (in different Spaces) with Cmd-Tab.

Space switched; Safari windows failed to show up; Mail menu bar still at the top.

Clicked on Safari in Dock - Safari windows show up; Mail menu bar still at the top.

Safari window widgets and links are not clickable.

Cmd-Q quits Safari (despite the menu bar never having showed up).

Re-opening Safari and restoring all open windows from last session does the trick.

MartiNZ · May 30, 2008, 04:59 AM

Oh... groovy!

Maybe in another three months?

stoneage · May 30, 2008, 06:03 PM

Originally Posted by stoneage

.........and I am unable to run Software Update since the update. It won't start from the Apple menu at all and is grayed out in About This Mac. This only happened on the iMac, not the MacBook.

#FIXED#
I went to System Preferences/Software Update and it worked fine from there, and then it started to work from the Apple Menu also.

misterdna · May 30, 2008, 07:06 PM

Not that anyone cares, but the download for my 2007 MacBook Pro was 200+ GB, but for my 2008 Mac Pro it was 400+.

ghporter · May 30, 2008, 07:30 PM

Originally Posted by misterdna

Not that anyone cares, but the download for my 2007 MacBook Pro was 200+ GB, but for my 2008 Mac Pro it was 400+.

That's interesting. My 2005 MBP's download was 198MB, just like for my iMac. I wonder if there were updates you were missing...

Hal Itosis · May 30, 2008, 08:18 PM

87 posts so far...

17 posts about 'repairing (or not repairing) permissions'.

12 posts merely to mention the 'size' of the download.

3 posts articulating various sync conflicts.

2 posts detailing flaws with Spaces.

2 posts opining Spotlight's lame results view options.

FWIW.

JellyBeen · May 30, 2008, 08:45 PM

I was really looking forward to this update. I had crashing issues with iCal (weird bug), unrecognized usb devices, TM telling me it ran out of space and not deleting old backups. So, for me, this update was the tipping point. This latest update did not fix any of these problems so I reverted to Tiger which is rock solid. Guess I go back to superduper now...
I'll give apple another 6 months...we'll see what they can do in that time frame.

benz · May 30, 2008, 08:59 PM

yes, i am thinking switching back to tiger in 2007 MBP, as mine main interest in Leopard is TM, but just don't wrk with my external HD, by he way, how can i switch back to tiger, as i am now using Leopard 10.5.2, shall i back up all stuffs and reformatted the disks and install by installed discs with my MBP?
thx

benz

benz · May 30, 2008, 09:00 PM

Originally Posted by JellyBeen

I was really looking forward to this update. I had crashing issues with iCal (weird bug), unrecognized usb devices, TM telling me it ran out of space and not deleting old backups. So, for me, this update was the tipping point. This latest update did not fix any of these problems so I reverted to Tiger which is rock solid. Guess I go back to superduper now...
I'll give apple another 6 months...we'll see what they can do in that time frame.

yes, i am thinking switching back to tiger in 2007 MBP, as mine main interest in Leopard is TM, but just don't wrk with my external HD, by he way, how can i switch back to tiger, as i am now using Leopard 10.5.2, shall i back up all stuffs and reformatted the disks and install by installed discs with my MBP?
thx

benz

JellyBeen · 10:41 PM

Originally Posted by benz

yes, i am thinking switching back to tiger in 2007 MBP, as mine main interest in Leopard is TM, but just don't wrk with my external HD, by he way, how can i switch back to tiger, as i am now using Leopard 10.5.2, shall i back up all stuffs and reformatted the disks and install by installed discs with my MBP?
thx

benz

Just use the Archive and Install mode...that will give you a perfect downgrade.

Horsepoo!!! · May 30, 2008, 09:08 PM

Originally Posted by Hal Itosis

87 posts so far...

17 posts about 'repairing (or not repairing) permissions'.

12 posts merely to mention the 'size' of the download.

3 posts articulating various sync conflicts.

2 posts detailing flaws with Spaces.

2 posts opining Spotlight's lame results view options.

FWIW.

Here's a new one: when is Apple going to make this damn OS resolution-independent?

I truly feel sorry for some of the developers that followed Apple's advice for resolution-independence and spent time dicking around resolution independent icons so that they'd be ready for Leopard. ef' you, Apple. Some developers should take this to court because Apple was pushing devs in the back to get the apps rez-independent and Apple never delivered rez-independence and thus wasting development time on stupid GUI tweaks that might never been seen in 10.5.

zerostar · May 30, 2008, 11:23 PM

*CAUTION ADOBE/NETWORK USERS*

Updated a test machine and it ran so smooth I updated my work laptop... wouldn't you know I did 20+ hours of photoshop and almost every file I saved to the server is corrupt! about 12 hours worth are gone for good.

This has been documented on adobe forums and Apple's, widespread problem. Adobe says "we don't support saving across a network" even tho I have had it doing that for 7 years with maybe 3 problems total..... Apple.... says nothing yet... sooo aggravating, need to archive and install for the first time in years

AppleGirl1990 · May 30, 2008, 11:42 PM

Everything is working perfectly for me. The update seems to favor newer machines i guess.

Horsepoo!!! · May 30, 2008, 11:50 PM

Originally Posted by zerostar

*CAUTION ADOBE/NETWORK USERS*

Updated a test machine and it ran so smooth I updated my work laptop... wouldn't you know I did 20+ hours of photoshop and almost every file I saved to the server is corrupt! about 12 hours worth are gone for good.

This has been documented on adobe forums and Apple's, widespread problem. Adobe says "we don't support saving across a network" even tho I have had it doing that for 7 years with maybe 3 problems total..... Apple.... says nothing yet... sooo aggravating, need to archive and install for the first time in years

What's really aggravating is people using Adobe products complaining about problems...as if they weren't asking for trouble.

turtle777 · May 31, 2008, 12:06 AM

Originally Posted by Hal Itosis

87 posts so far...

17 posts about 'repairing (or not repairing) permissions'.

12 posts merely to mention the 'size' of the download.

3 posts articulating various sync conflicts.

2 posts detailing flaws with Spaces.

2 posts opining Spotlight's lame results view options.

FWIW.

Thanks, Hal

I think I'm gonna pull the plunge now.

-t

Wiskedjak · May 31, 2008, 12:50 AM

Originally Posted by AppleGirl1990

Everything is working perfectly for me. The update seems to favor newer machines i guess.

That's generally the case. Older machines get less love from Apple QA.

Homer1946 · May 31, 2008, 03:13 AM

On an older AGP G4 PowerMac with a 1GHz upgrade card I noticed that after updating to 10.5.3 (from 10.5.2) my OpenGL performance (as measured by Xbench) decreased to 1/4 of what it was. The computer still has the original ATI 128GL card.

Anybody else notice this?

benz · May 31, 2008, 05:04 AM

Originally Posted by JellyBeen

Just use the Archive and Install mode...that will give you a perfect downgrade.

hi, by using this " archive and install mode" in installer disc, the old OS stuffs 'll be archived, and a new Os installed, but how can i install back my old stuffs other than the OS, needing pasting back manually from another back up source? please clarify

thx
benz