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Jew FTW (Page 3)
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Doofy
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Jan 25, 2011, 03:25 PM
 
Originally Posted by CRASH HARDDRIVE View Post
And notice the irony here; the only people offended and getting thier panties in a bunch over what other people choose to do, is you and Doofy.
I'm not getting my panties in a bunch, ducks. Says a lot for your country's culture that you think someone having a conversation is getting bunched. Are you that much of a bunch of pussies that this bunching occurs on such a regular basis, thus you expect it?
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Doofy
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Jan 25, 2011, 03:31 PM
 
Originally Posted by CRASH HARDDRIVE View Post
The point is, Doofy is ignorant of the fact that all over the world there are plenty of places where people hyphenate themselves in the native country, and have ties to another 'homeland' where they came from.
Not three generations on like your idiots do.
Of course, there's exceptions - the German and Welsh speaking enclaves in Brazil, for example. And they still don't call themselves "German-Brazilian" or "Welsh-Brazilian"... ...it's simply "Brazilian".
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OAW
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Jan 25, 2011, 03:32 PM
 
I would comment again on this tangent the thread has taken, but then again .... I can't make it any more plain than I've already have. Besides, Crash seems to be making the point quite nicely interestingly enough.

More on topic ....

It appears that the Illinois Supreme Court has not only agreed to hear Rahm Emanuel's appeal ... it has issued a temporary injunction against the Appellate Court ruling and ordered that the mayoral ballots include his name. One could argue that this order is a sign that the Illinois Supreme Court is leaning toward overturning the Appellate Court decision and agreeing with the Chicago Board of Elections and the lower court decision. Why order the city to print ballots with his name on it only to turn around and rule that he is ineligible? But you never know ....

Supreme Court will hear appeal of ruling knocking Emanuel off ballot - Chicago Sun-Times

OAW
     
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Jan 25, 2011, 03:44 PM
 
Originally Posted by Doofy View Post
It may seem incredibly arbitrary, but it's actually incredibly valid when one observes society.



I'm loose already. Why are you thinking I'm wound? Problem with your country's culture perhaps?



History says otherwise.



No, I'm not. I'm having a conversation. No need to be so defensive.
If I have a conversation about grapes am I fixated on grapes? No - it's just a conversation.

Your responses, of course, stem from Amerika's other main social disease - patriotism.
Usually people who have a serious conversation about pseudo-intellectual topics don't do so with one-liners. Any defensiveness on my part I think arises from my sense that you are simply picking part single sentences without necessarily considering what I am saying. I'm not sure how patriotism enters into this. I'm not telling you that America is a model of race relations or that in the UK you are doing it wrong. I'm just telling you how it is, and I think it's a bit silly for you to say, in effect, "well that's not how it should be, stupid Americans" without acknowledging that there are serious reasons for the status quo. When I say you are "fixated on American culture" I mean that you are fixated on a particular dynamic (race) without acknowledging some understanding of those larger factors. I think you have a cartoonish view of how Americans perceive race and how it impacts their actions. I think your reading of history is fundamentally flawed in that do not acknowledge that the role of identity in conflict is fluid and not always self-determined (for a great case study, I suggest Prime Time Crime, about the media in the former Yugoslavia).

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SpaceMonkey
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Jan 25, 2011, 03:46 PM
 
Originally Posted by OAW View Post
I would comment again on this tangent the thread has taken, but then again .... I can't make it any more plain than I've already have. Besides, Crash seems to be making the point quite nicely interestingly enough.

More on topic ....

It appears that the Illinois Supreme Court has not only agreed to hear Rahm Emanuel's appeal ... it has issued a temporary injunction against the Appellate Court ruling and ordered that the mayoral ballots include his name. One could argue that this order is a sign that the Illinois Supreme Court is leaning toward overturning the Appellate Court decision and agreeing with the Chicago Board of Elections and the lower court decision. Why order the city to print ballots with his name on it only to turn around and rule that he is ineligible? But you never know ....
Because given the timing, it's easier to remove someone's name from existing ballots than it would be to print new ones later.
( Last edited by SpaceMonkey; Jan 25, 2011 at 04:00 PM. )

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Laminar
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Jan 25, 2011, 03:49 PM
 
Originally Posted by SpaceMonkey View Post
Usually people who have a serious conversation about pseudo-intellectual topics don't do so with one-liners. Any defensiveness on my part I think arises from my sense that you are simply picking part single sentences without necessarily considering what I am saying. I'm not sure how patriotism enters into this. I'm not telling you that America is a model of race relations or that in the UK you are doing it wrong. I'm just telling you how it is, and I think it's a bit silly for you to say, in effect, "well that's not how it should be, stupid Americans" without acknowledging that there are serious reasons for the status quo. When I say you are "fixated on American culture" I mean that you are fixated on a particular dynamic (race) without acknowledging some understanding of those larger factors. I think you have a cartoonish view of how Americans perceive race and how it impacts their actions. I think your reading of history is fundamentally flawed in that do not acknowledge that the role of identity in conflict is fluid and not always self-determined (for a great case study, I suggest Prime Time Crime, about the media in the former Yugoslavia).
tl;dr
     
Athens
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Jan 25, 2011, 03:52 PM
 
Space Monkey, short simple sentances from Doofy are only to accommodate the lowest common denominator of readers here. Case in point

Originally Posted by Laminar View Post
tl;dr
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Laminar
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Jan 25, 2011, 03:57 PM
 
Spelling too poor; didn't read.
     
Doofy
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Jan 25, 2011, 04:07 PM
 
Originally Posted by SpaceMonkey View Post
Usually people who have a serious conversation about pseudo-intellectual topics don't do so with one-liners. Any defensiveness on my part I think arises from my sense that you are simply picking part single sentences without necessarily considering what I am saying. I'm not sure how patriotism enters into this. I'm not telling you that America is a model of race relations or that in the UK you are doing it wrong. I'm just telling you how it is, and I think it's a bit silly for you to say, in effect, "well that's not how it should be, stupid Americans" without acknowledging that there are serious reasons for the status quo. When I say you are "fixated on American culture" I mean that you are fixated on a particular dynamic (race) without acknowledging some understanding of those larger factors. I think you have a cartoonish view of how Americans perceive race and how it impacts their actions. I think your reading of history is fundamentally flawed in that do not acknowledge that the role of identity in conflict is fluid and not always self-determined (for a great case study, I suggest Prime Time Crime, about the media in the former Yugoslavia).
I can go with single liners or I can go with 500,000 word dissertations which fringe all aspects of the interconnected universe. Not much in-between.
To be frank, the 500,000 dissertation is a waste of both your and my time. You should probably assume that whatever I come out with isn't actually cartoonish and that I'm really quite bright. It'll make it easier for you.

And don't quote the Balkans at me. I've already mentioned the root of the problem they have down there. See if you can spot it.
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ebuddy
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Jan 25, 2011, 08:48 PM
 
Originally Posted by SpaceMonkey View Post
In this day and age, you are unlikely to offend anyone of African descent in the United States by calling them black.
This is pretty much what I've found. To be honest, in my circles I'd almost feel like the pink-toed dork who's trying too hard by saying African-Americans.
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Jan 25, 2011, 09:14 PM
 
Me, I just say "Africa". I refer to people from Germany as German, people from Ireland as Irish and people from Africa as African. If I know their country of origin, I'll use that instead.
     
CRASH HARDDRIVE
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Jan 27, 2011, 12:23 AM
 
Originally Posted by Doofy View Post
Not three generations on like your idiots do.
Of course, there's exceptions - the German and Welsh speaking enclaves in Brazil, for example.
In other words, that's the long-form way of you admitting you're dead-wrong. Gee, now why would there be enclaves of people speaking languages from another homeland in another country? Pretty much EXACTLY what we've been talking about, and you've been in denial about! You're just obessed with labels, rather than the actual SUBJECT!

And they still don't call themselves "German-Brazilian" or "Welsh-Brazilian"... ...it's simply "Brazilian".[/QUOTE]
... and you're not even right about that!

Yes, there are German-Brazilians. And yes, they've preserved elements of their original identities and 'homeland' in Europe.

German immigrants preserved their language more than any other group of immigrants in Brazil. This was mainly due to shared cultural identity and the desire to recreate in Brazil an environment with characteristics of the country they believed they would never return to.
As I said, this sort of thing is important to people all over the world- it is in fact the WORLD norm. Thanks for bringing it up in the case of German Brazilians and further illustrating my point.

Next up: someone trying to float there's no such thing as French Canadians. As idiotic as this conversation has become, it wouldn't surprise me.

You're just obsessed with ascribing to America things that aren't actually uniquely American, both out of A: blazing amounts of ignorance combined with equal parts arrogance, and B. your obvious obsession with America.

The America of the Doofyverse doesn't actually exist.

Sure, your Internet fantasy world is entertaining at times, but you can be really annoying when actual FACTS are being discussed and you're still in fantasyland. You should turn your obsession toward the REAL planet earth, which would mean actually bothering to LEARN some actual facts about REAL places and people. You might have to come down from your Internet fantasy universe for a few minutes to achieve that though.
     
Doofy
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Jan 27, 2011, 12:33 AM
 
Originally Posted by CRASH HARDDRIVE View Post
... and you're not even right about that!

Yes, there are German-Brazilians. And yes, they've preserved elements of their original identities and 'homeland' in Europe.
Try reading your own link next time.

Today, this population is no longer seen as "foreign" by other Brazilians, but as a modern progressive urban population. The identification as "Brazilians" is also dominant among German Brazilians, since the cultural world of their ancestors was completely changed; it has become unrealistic for them to assert any other ethnic identity than Brazilian.
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Jan 27, 2011, 12:37 AM
 
And again you prove you're stuck on the LABELS, not the actual subject.
     
Doofy
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Jan 27, 2011, 12:58 AM
 
Originally Posted by CRASH HARDDRIVE View Post
And again you prove you're stuck on the LABELS, not the actual subject.
Go read the OP. The whole subject is about labels.
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CRASH HARDDRIVE
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Jan 27, 2011, 01:35 AM
 
Originally Posted by Doofy View Post
Go read the OP. The whole subject is about labels.
The whole point- that yes you have had your panties in a wad about this whole time- is that people ALL OVER THE WORLD identify with 'homelands' other than the country they live in, and find ways to organize themselves based around that identity. If that wasn't true, you wouldn't even be able to point to any German Brazilian community in Brazil in the first place, and of course, that merely to name but ONE example (that YOU brought up). The same things happen virtually everywhere.

You're simply obsessed over what people choose to CALL themselves (and of course only in America) based on this fact, rather than face up to the FACT itself.

Who cares if someone calls themselves by a hyphenation of some original place they came from, or just lives in an enclave that's mostly made up of people from their original homeland? Both are merely different ways of fulfilling the same desire of people to identify with where they came from, and it happens virtually everywhere, not just in your imaginary America.

But the real sticking point: you and some others simply don't like the fact that black Americans have a desire to do this as well, and so choose a label that they may feel gives a sense of identity, just like COUNTLESS OTHER PEOPLE all over the world do also.

Sure, there's often decisive politics based on artificial divisions people have- race certainly being one of them. For example, I think it's beyond silly for some people to insist that sound fiscal policy somehow can't work for someone else based on race, and find it a sham whenever large percentages of people based on race think that they must vote for a certain political party or subscribe only to a certain philosophy , as if at the core, any of these things had anything whatsoever to do with race.

But mere labels that people choose to call themselves, and the normal human desire for cultural identity isn't the real problem with any of that; you're just focused on labels as an easy scapegoat (and now of course as a backpedal to being wrong) and your pretense that there's anything exclusively American about it is just part of your America-obsession.
     
Doofy
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Jan 27, 2011, 01:45 AM
 
Don't worry Crash - I can wait until you gain enough XP to level up your IQ before continuing this conversation.
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besson3c
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Jan 27, 2011, 01:52 AM
 
I feel very fortunate to be able to enjoy Doofy on Crash action in two simultaneous threads now!
     
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Jan 27, 2011, 02:28 AM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
I feel very fortunate to be able to enjoy Doofy on Crash action in two simultaneous threads now!
Probably too subtle for you, but others may notice the weird contradiction between the two Doofyverse 'arguments':

In one thread: "RAHR! You Americans! You never acknowledge anywhere else! You're so nationalistic! All you care about is yourselves! BAH! America! WAH! Americans! WHAH!"

Well, actually some Americans care SO FREAKIN' MUCH about other places, they find it important to NAME THEMSELVES after those other places!

"WAH!!!! You Americans! Why can't you just call yourselves Americans? WAH!!! You're too concerned with other places in the world! WAH! Can't you just focus on America? What's with you wanting to acknowledge other countries and cultures!? WAH!! Americans! WHAH!!!"

So, basically, you just like to bitch about America, even when the 'arguments' are 100% counter to each other?

"BLARRGH!! AMAERCA! WAH!"

     
Doofy
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Jan 27, 2011, 02:48 AM
 
Of course, the argument in reality (in both threads) is: Why are you people being so small and limiting yourselves to associations with territorial entities (an abstract concept in themselves) when you can simply be "human" and enjoy the bounty that being supra-national brings?

Why are you constraining yourselves by sucking at the teat of whatever country it is you call "mom"?

Why are you constraining yourselves even further by self-identifying as a specific ethnic subset of whatever country it is that you call "mom"?

Small thinking from small minds.
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besson3c
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Jan 27, 2011, 03:16 AM
 
I think it's fairly natural to want to become emotionally invested over something that is obviously the subject of our entire political system, and for us to want that thing we are invested in to be good. I just don't understand the competition thing.
     
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Jan 27, 2011, 03:20 AM
 
I also don't understand the lack of interest in looking at what other countries are doing to challenge our preconceived notion that whatever we are doing is the best.
     
Athens
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Jan 27, 2011, 02:12 PM
 
Originally Posted by Laminar View Post


Oh good, now you're doing it, too.
I've been using the term Amerika for a long time YouTube - Ramstein - Amerika

I usually save it for the worst examples of american idiots, which is why you don't see me saying it often. Crash just happens to be a excellent example of an American Idiot. I believe there is a song out there written for him, oh its called American Idiot.
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Athens
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Jan 27, 2011, 02:16 PM
 
Originally Posted by Doofy View Post
Don't worry Crash - I can wait until you gain enough XP to level up your IQ before continuing this conversation.
This comment brings joy to my day.
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Athens
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Jan 27, 2011, 02:26 PM
 
Originally Posted by CRASH HARDDRIVE View Post

Well, actually some Americans care SO FREAKIN' MUCH about other places, they find it important to NAME THEMSELVES after those other places!
Right, take a World Globe with no labels on it and ask Amerikans where Africa is including the ones with the title of African American. I bet less then half will point to the right land mass.
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sek929
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Jan 27, 2011, 02:29 PM
 
I bet your assumption of American ignorance is completely wrong.

I'm actually starting to side with CRASH here, either **** my country or move on, this obsession is creepy. We are just a country mainly populated by regular people going about their lives, like anywhere else on the globe. Just because we clearly have the best Continent doesn't mean everyone else needs to get their panties in a twist about it.
     
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Jan 27, 2011, 02:32 PM
 
^^^^

You would likely lose that bet. Especially among African-Americans. Now ask them to identify a particular country in Africa and ... well let's just say that the US educational system barely covers geography anymore ... and it shows.

OAW
     
sek929
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Jan 27, 2011, 02:37 PM
 
I love this notion that our country is the only place on earth to find uneducated hicks.
     
Shaddim
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Jan 27, 2011, 03:32 PM
 
Originally Posted by sek929 View Post
I love this notion that our country is the only place on earth to find uneducated hicks.
This is very true, sadly. Do some people-watching in Liverpool and it doesn't take long to figure that out. Just don't do it for long or you'll get mugged.
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Jan 27, 2011, 03:36 PM
 
Originally Posted by sek929 View Post
I love this notion that our country is the only place on earth to find uneducated hicks.
I wouldn't say that. I don't think any one has ever said its the only place on earth to find uneducated hicks. Just the most well known, and most outrageous hicks that makes yours stand out the most. Over all general population ignorance appears to be higher then any other place on earth and I don't just mean ignorance of the rest of the world. Ignorance of your nation appears high too. Its rather sad that the world knows more about whats going on say in Ohio then some one from California. The world has uneducated hicks every where. But the stereo typical trailer trash hick is defiantly uniquely American.
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Athens
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Jan 27, 2011, 03:40 PM
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XxFz4LQUR1w

Its Amazing how many pick Australia to invade ROFL, last minute where they get ask to put the pins.

Oh and I forgot to add, its only fair to say most of these people on these videos are prob cherry picked from a group of people who get some answers right. I don't actually believe every single American is as dumb as the people in these videos. But its still entertaining to see how dumb some people are.
( Last edited by Athens; Jan 27, 2011 at 03:48 PM. )
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Jan 27, 2011, 03:43 PM
 
Stereotypes or impressions that are formed that are inspired by whatever are not always accurate.

People of all kinds have the potential to be ignorant, this is a simple fact of humanity. To make the argument that there exists a special breed of humanity somewhere in the world is problematic.
     
Shaddim
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Jan 27, 2011, 03:54 PM
 
Originally Posted by Athens View Post
I wouldn't say that. I don't think any one has ever said its the only place on earth to find uneducated hicks. Just the most well known, and most outrageous hicks that makes yours stand out the most. Over all general population ignorance appears to be higher then any other place on earth and I don't just mean ignorance of the rest of the world. Ignorance of your nation appears high too. Its rather sad that the world knows more about whats going on say in Ohio then some one from California. The world has uneducated hicks every where. But the stereo typical trailer trash hick is defiantly uniquely American.
You're buying the hype. I've been to most European countries and their "trailer trash" is just as bad, if not worse than the US. This is in terms of quantity and severity. We just get more press coverage for it. Hell, in Birmingham (not the city in Alabama) a guy spit at me and told me to go back to Australia after hearing my accent, which is mostly US-neutral with a slight Southern drawl.
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sek929
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Jan 27, 2011, 04:01 PM
 
You know why everyone knows about our hicks? Because the rest of the world has a raging hard-on for our country and everyone in it.
     
Athens
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Jan 27, 2011, 05:41 PM
 
Originally Posted by sek929 View Post
You know why everyone knows about our hicks? Because the rest of the world has a raging hard-on for our country and everyone in it.
A Famous quote from Pierre Trudeau that fits well with your statement

"Living next to you is in some ways like sleeping with an elephant. No matter how friendly and even-tempered is the beast, if I can call it that, one is affected by every twitch and grunt."

The US is the Elephant of the world. Your impossible to ignore. Has nothing to do with having a hard-on for the US.
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Jan 27, 2011, 06:11 PM
 
I don't have a link, since I'm listening on the radio, but it appears the Illinois Supreme Court has unanimously overturned the appellate court decision.

The attorney who brought the case is on right now. He says he won't appeal.


Edit: an interesting aside. The court put it on the Internet before they announced it to the press at the court building. The reporter they have on the ground there is asking the host for information, not vice-versa.
( Last edited by subego; Jan 27, 2011 at 06:19 PM. )
     
OAW
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Jan 27, 2011, 07:27 PM
 
This is true. The ruling was 7-0 and entirely appropriate. I don't know what those 2 judges on the appellate court were thinking.

Unless something really strange happens Mr. Emanuel is a shoo-in for the mayor's office. He's currently polling at 44%. His closet competitor is former Sen. Carol Mosley-Braun at 21%. A gentleman name Gerry Chico (?) I believe is polling around 11% IIRC. It's pretty much a wrap.

OAW
     
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Jan 27, 2011, 08:36 PM
 
Again, though, it's worth pointing out that the distinction in the case hinged on whether Emanuel had "abandoned" his Chicago residence, and not the exemption clause. I would not have been surprised if this case had gone either way.

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Jan 27, 2011, 09:11 PM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
This is very true, sadly. Do some people-watching in Liverpool and it doesn't take long to figure that out.
Yep. Everywhere has its hicks. But for some reason, the US is very defensive about theirs (as in this thread).

Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
Just don't do it for long or you'll get mugged.
Unless you're from Stoke. The scousers know when they're bested.

Originally Posted by Shaddim
Hell, in Birmingham (not the city in Alabama) a guy spit at me and told me to go back to Australia after hearing my accent, which is mostly US-neutral with a slight Southern drawl.
Hell, a bloke in Birmingham would tell me to go back to Australia after hearing my accent, and I'm from 30 miles north of it.
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Doofy
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Jan 27, 2011, 09:13 PM
 
Originally Posted by sek929 View Post
You know why everyone knows about our hicks?
Probably because you elect them to front-dead-centre every decade or so.
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vmarks
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Jan 28, 2011, 03:15 AM
 
Originally Posted by OAW View Post
^^^^

You would likely lose that bet. Especially among African-Americans. Now ask them to identify a particular country in Africa and ... well let's just say that the US educational system barely covers geography anymore ... and it shows.

OAW
May I just say, the changes taking place around the world don't always make it easy to keep up. When I learned African geography, Zaire was Zaire. Then, years after I had learnt it, it changed to the Congo. Oh well. Interesting thing about Zaire, they had an authenticity policy that required citizens to change their names to authentic sounding names. Joseph Desiré changed his name to Mobutu. huh. (Mobutu was the ruler for life, until his overthrow in '97.)
If this post is in the Lounge forum, it is likely to be my own opinion, and not representative of the position of MacNN.com.

     
Captain Obvious  (op)
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Jan 28, 2011, 03:25 AM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
I don't have a link, since I'm listening on the radio, but it appears the Illinois Supreme Court has unanimously overturned the appellate court decision.
Of course it was. There's no way the ruling was going to sit. Rahm wasn't going to be bamboozled by an appellate court.

As for the rest of this thread, I don't know why you guys got so uppity.

Barack Obama: Four more years of the Carter Presidency
     
ebuddy
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Jan 28, 2011, 07:29 AM
 
Originally Posted by sek929 View Post
You know why everyone knows about our hicks? Because the rest of the world has a raging hard-on for our country and everyone in it.
meh. It's a heavy crown.

Suffice it to say, none of these insults are aimed at actually making the US a better country and IMO the merit of their message should be measured in this light. It is commonplace for xenophobia to manifest itself in the characterization of an entire collective of people by its lowest common denominator; in much the same way our hicks would decry "them towelheads". There are hicks of all sorts making their presence known here and the awkward alliances in this thread have been fun to watch.

On topic: It is right IMO that Rahm would be allowed candidacy and I'm glad sanity prevailed here.
ebuddy
     
OAW
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Jan 28, 2011, 06:34 PM
 
Originally Posted by vmarks View Post
May I just say, the changes taking place around the world don't always make it easy to keep up. When I learned African geography, Zaire was Zaire. Then, years after I had learnt it, it changed to the Congo. Oh well. Interesting thing about Zaire, they had an authenticity policy that required citizens to change their names to authentic sounding names. Joseph Desiré changed his name to Mobutu. huh. (Mobutu was the ruler for life, until his overthrow in '97.)
Indeed. The thing is ... the country has always been called Congo. It was Mobutu (who was definitely backed by the US government and reputedly a CIA agent during his reign of terror) who changed the name to Zaire about 11 years into his rule. And Zaire, interestingly enough, was a Portuguese language word that was based upon the Kongo language word nzere which means "the river that swallows all rivers" ... itself a reference to the great Congo River. Go figure. In any event, after Mobutu was finally overthrown the name of the country was changed back to Congo.

OAW
     
 
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