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Don Pickett · Apr 2, 2009, 04:02 PM

Originally Posted by ThinkInsane

It would seem not enough

]Although I didn't love the ending, I'm liking it better than some of the alternatives they were kicking around.

What interview is that from?

ThinkInsane · Apr 2, 2009, 09:02 PM

http://forums.scifi.com/index.php?showtopic=2329378

Third post down

Eug · Apr 5, 2009, 09:21 AM

Originally Posted by selowitch

I really didn't like this notion of scrapping all technology, interbreeding with primitive humans (Eeeew, think I'll pass!! Reminds me unfavorably of one of my exes), and above all separating all the characters who are so closely bonded with each other so they each take off to their own little corner.

It's not logical that splitting up increases their chances for survival. Hasn't anyone heard of "safety in numbers"?

There's nothing in BSG to this point that would lead me to believe that the Colonials would genuinely prefer a pre-technological existence. It's not just a matter of giving up space travel, energy-based weapons, and faster-than-light travel -- it's giving up the means to treat disease, extend life, perhaps use hydroponics for agriculture.

I agree with that completely. This whole premise was a disappointment to me, as were the incessant flashbacks. They did address this concern about people giving up their technology right in the dialogue. They said they were surprised people were so willing to give it up. Cop out dialogue however IMO.

I loved the battle scene though, and the idea that Hera is über-mom.

analogue SPRINKLES · Apr 5, 2009, 02:06 PM

Originally Posted by Eug

I agree with that completely. This whole premise was a disappointment to me, as were the incessant flashbacks. They did address this concern about people giving up their technology right in the dialogue. They said they were surprised people were so willing to give it up. Cop out dialogue however IMO.

Would you rather have them spent 30 minutes watching them discuss ditching the technology and have a vote? Pretend they did, we got much more interesting things to watch it that finale.

Eug · Apr 5, 2009, 02:31 PM

Originally Posted by analogue SPRINKLES

Would you rather have them spent 30 minutes watching them discuss ditching the technology and have a vote? Pretend they did, we got much more interesting things to watch it that finale.

What I'm saying is that it's much harder to believe that 40000 people would all of sudden agree to shift to a hunter-gatherer or agrarian society, esp. when there was no indication before by anyone of a desire to this.

Shaddim · Apr 5, 2009, 03:05 PM

That was my greatest concern too. I can understand wanting to change to a largely agrarian society, but I can't see them abandoning medicine, metallurgy, or basic engineering. I understand that such a choice was necessary for the show to finish according to Moore's wishes, but his failures in logic are too great to ignore.

mrtew · Apr 5, 2009, 04:06 PM

Originally Posted by Shaddim

... I can't see them abandoning metallurgy, or basic engineering.

I thought the first four seasons gave them more than a compelling reason for abandoning metallurgy and basic engineering.

Shaddim · Apr 5, 2009, 06:09 PM

Originally Posted by mrtew

I thought the first four seasons gave them more than a compelling reason for abandoning metallurgy and basic engineering.

Not hardly. If anything, it taught them that going beyond basics could potentially cause problems (Galactica did quite well with simple machines). Adhering to a moderate state would be logical, not the idiocy we're expected to believe.

Sorry, Moore's premise is stupid, he could have done much better.

Edit: and you left out the point I made about medicine.

goMac · Apr 6, 2009, 01:30 AM

I think it's a dumb premise. The colonies developed Cylons without even remembering that they lived with Cylons on Kobol. It seems like to me it doesn't matter how far back you reset the clock, it's going to happen.

OreoCookie · Apr 6, 2009, 05:46 AM

Originally Posted by Eug

What I'm saying is that it's much harder to believe that 40000 people would all of sudden agree to shift to a hunter-gatherer or agrarian society, esp. when there was no indication before by anyone of a desire to this.

Ditto, that is my biggest beef with the ending. Unanimously, they've not just decided to forget about advanced technology, but about building houses, how to read and write, to tell the kids that the earth revolves around the sun, etc.

mrtew · Apr 6, 2009, 06:53 AM

Originally Posted by OreoCookie

Ditto, that is my biggest beef with the ending. Unanimously, they've not just decided to forget about advanced technology, but about building houses, how to read and write, to tell the kids that the earth revolves around the sun, etc.

Yeah but it worked! They bought themselves another 150,000 years. If they had held onto anything they probably would have only had 100 at the most.

Wiskedjak · Apr 6, 2009, 08:41 AM

Originally Posted by mrtew

Yeah but it worked! They bought themselves another 150,000 years. If they had held onto anything they probably would have only had 100 at the most.

I think they would have been better off if they made sure to pass on the knowledge they had attained; not just knowledge about technology, but also what they learned about The Cycle. Sure, they bought 150,000 years, but the ending suggested that they were about to begin the cycle anew. Had they passed their knowledge on by using their technology to enshrine it in their culture, they might have ended the cycle forever.

jokell82 · Apr 6, 2009, 09:08 AM

Originally Posted by Wiskedjak

I think they would have been better off if they made sure to pass on the knowledge they had attained; not just knowledge about technology, but also what they learned about The Cycle. Sure, they bought 150,000 years, but the ending suggested that they were about to begin the cycle anew. Had they passed their knowledge on by using their technology to enshrine it in their culture, they might have ended the cycle forever.

But then time passes and you get people like Baltar who think that "fearing" advances in technology is an antiquated principle. And the cycle starts anew anyway.

analogue SPRINKLES · Apr 6, 2009, 11:53 AM

Originally Posted by Eug

What I'm saying is that it's much harder to believe that 40000 people would all of sudden agree to shift to a hunter-gatherer or agrarian society, esp. when there was no indication before by anyone of a desire to this.

Actually they seemed more than willing to do the same on New Caprica. I think they also had slight motovation considering all but 40,000 people were destroyed by technology and they spent the last 4 years of hell in space.

That and it was up to the presidents.

Eug · Apr 6, 2009, 12:12 PM

Originally Posted by analogue SPRINKLES

Actually they seemed more than willing to do the same on New Caprica. I think they also had slight motovation considering all but 40,000 people were destroyed by technology and they spent the last 4 years of hell in space.

That and it was up to the presidents.

? Dunno which BSG you watched, but...

On New Caprica they had a town. That's what the prez wanted to do on New Earth too, but it was Lee Adama (who wasn't president at the time) who suggested nixing the city idea.

lexapro · Apr 6, 2009, 02:59 PM

So humanity divided into several pockets around the globe. And they expect us to believe each one didn't die out and they succeeded in repopulating the human species?

Wiskedjak · Apr 6, 2009, 09:50 PM

Originally Posted by lexapro

So humanity divided into several pockets around the globe. And they expect us to believe each one didn't die out and they succeeded in repopulating the human species?

Well, they *did* have help from the indigenous population, which probably surpassed 40,000 by about 100x.

Chuckit · Apr 6, 2009, 10:09 PM

Originally Posted by Wiskedjak

Well, they *did* have help from the indigenous population, which probably surpassed 40,000 by about 100x.

Four million Homo sapiens in 150,000 BC? Isn't that a little high? According to the US Census Bureau, there might not even have been that many in 10,000 BC.

Wiskedjak · Apr 6, 2009, 11:14 PM

Originally Posted by Chuckit

Four million Homo sapiens in 150,000 BC? Isn't that a little high? According to the US Census Bureau, there might not even have been that many in 10,000 BC.

Sorry, I meant to say 10x.

analogue SPRINKLES · Apr 7, 2009, 01:20 AM

Originally Posted by Eug

? Dunno which BSG you watched, but...

On New Caprica they had a town. That's what the prez wanted to do on New Earth too, but it was Lee Adama (who wasn't president at the time) who suggested nixing the city idea.

Well that was partly because only a small part of the planet was habitable so they HAD to have a city. Not to mention that was a looong time ago. Another 2 years in space is another story.

mrtew · Apr 7, 2009, 06:51 PM

Originally Posted by analogue SPRINKLES

Well that was partly because only a small part of the planet was habitable so they HAD to have a city. Not to mention that was a looong time ago. Another 2 years in space is another story.

And also it was uninhabited so spreading out would mean suicide. On New Earth the plan was to spread out and mix in with the genetically identical aboriginals that God had placed there for the humans and cylons that escaped His original 5 muddled plans to mate with. Maybe only Hera was genetically identical enough to successfully breed with though leading me to think that the primitives they found were somehow created by cylons or humans in some previous 'happened before' instance and God's plan was simply to reuinite them.

Chuckit · Apr 7, 2009, 07:23 PM

Originally Posted by mrtew

And also it was uninhabited so spreading out would mean suicide. On New Earth the plan was to spread out and mix in with the genetically identical aboriginals that God had placed there for the humans and cylons that escaped His original 5 muddled plans to mate with. Maybe only Hera was genetically identical enough to successfully breed with though leading me to think that the primitives they found were somehow created by cylons or humans in some previous 'happened before' instance and God's plan was simply to reuinite them.

What reason would there be to think only Hera was compatible?

ThinkInsane · Apr 7, 2009, 08:43 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hwQscp0FAUw

No rickroll, I promise. Just a Robot Chicken clip that explains the BSG creative process.

ghporter · Apr 7, 2009, 08:48 PM

Thanks Think. From "Robot Chicken on Ron Moore" I got to "Robot Chicken on BSG and Star Trek." I'm sore from laughing.

mrtew · Apr 8, 2009, 07:15 AM

Originally Posted by Chuckit

What reason would there be to think only Hera was compatible?

Because all modern humans are from her bloodline. That whole 'Eve' thing.

andi*pandi · Apr 8, 2009, 10:19 AM

I just spent an hour on youtube. hee.

SpaceMonkey · Apr 8, 2009, 11:19 AM

Originally Posted by mrtew

Because all modern humans are from her bloodline. That whole 'Eve' thing.

Right, but that doesn't mean that the other survivors are not also common ancestors of modern humans. Please read the discussion earlier in the thread. "Mitochondrial Eve" means something very specific: Hera would be the most recent common ancestor with an unbroken matrilineal line of descent to all living humans. Some of her contemporaries would also be our common ancestors.

mrtew · Apr 8, 2009, 07:31 PM

Originally Posted by SpaceMonkey

Right, but that doesn't mean that the other survivors are not also common ancestors of modern humans. Please read the discussion earlier in the thread. "Mitochondrial Eve" means something very specific: Hera would be the most recent common ancestor with an unbroken matrilineal line of descent to all living humans. Some of her contemporaries would also be our common ancestors.

That's why I said 'maybe' but it's too big of coincidence that she just 'happened to be' or was 'destined to be' the Mitochondrial Eve. It had to be because she was half cylon/human that either made her the only one from the colonies that had heirs to survive, or gave descendents and advantage over all the others.

dzp111 · Apr 8, 2009, 10:40 PM

Yep. It's a simple genetic thing. We can only go so far (in history).

mrtew · Apr 19, 2009, 08:21 AM

Battlestar Galactica: The Complete Series [Blu-ray]
Pre-Order Price Guarantee! Order now and if the Amazon.com price decreases between your order time and release date, you'll receive the lowest price. Availability: This title has not yet been released. You may pre-order it now and we will deliver it to you when it arrives. Ships from and sold by Amazon.com. Price: $244.99

Idiots! I was dying to buy this while the series was still going. So they release it after it's all over and nobody cares. Sales will suck of course and they'll blame internet downloading or something. Geez.

Eug · Apr 19, 2009, 08:30 AM

I'd pay $99.99 for that. $244.99? No thanks.

Visnaut · Apr 19, 2009, 10:35 AM

They're just culling as much profit as they can from hard-core fans.

I'll wait until this comes down in price by at least another benjamin, which means I'll likely be purchasing this around the same time they sell $99 Blu-ray players...

goMac · Apr 19, 2009, 03:55 PM

Well that's an insane price...

starman · Apr 19, 2009, 05:17 PM

How is that an "insane" price?

$245 for 4 seasons. $60ish/season. That's LESS than others on BR.

Firefly is $70.

Do the math.

goMac · Apr 19, 2009, 06:11 PM

Originally Posted by starman

How is that an "insane" price?

$245 for 4 seasons. $60ish/season. That's LESS than others on BR.

Firefly is $70.

Do the math.

Because the old seasons aren't worth $60 a season...

http://www.amazon.com/Battlestar-Gal...0179077&sr=8-3

Plus buying them all together should be CHEAPER, not more expensive.

starman · Apr 19, 2009, 10:01 PM

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

Remember when X-Files was $125 A SEASON?

mrtew · Apr 19, 2009, 10:31 PM

Originally Posted by starman

How is that an "insane" price?
$245 for 4 seasons. $60ish/season. That's LESS than others on BR.
Firefly is $70. Do the math.

Here's the math...

The value of the show was the suspense of the storyline. Now that it's over none of the old seasons have any value. So it's priced $245 too high. It might be worth $79 - $99 just to have around for sentimental reasons even though who's going to sit through all that again? I'm more likely to delete all the ones I downloaded than I am to pay money for them at this point. They should have released them as promptly as the DVDs except more so.

analogue SPRINKLES · Apr 20, 2009, 01:43 AM

I don't think $244 is much. I can't wait to get it.

mrtew · Apr 20, 2009, 07:23 AM

You're going to watch that crap again even after knowing the lame ending?

At least that's a good sign that the economy is picking up if they think they can charge hundreds of dollars for some old thing that was free when it was fresh and new and interesting. (as long as you don't count the thousands of dollars the cable cost :-)

jokell82 · Apr 20, 2009, 08:21 AM

Originally Posted by mrtew

You're going to watch that crap again even after knowing the lame ending?

At least that's a good sign that the economy is picking up if they think they can charge hundreds of dollars for some old thing that was free when it was fresh and new and interesting. (as long as you don't count the thousands of dollars the cable cost :-)

Even if you didn't like the finale it doesn't detract from the amazing first couple of seasons.

I won't be buying the BD set at that price, but maybe when it drops to $100-$150 on sale.

goMac · Apr 20, 2009, 04:14 PM

Originally Posted by mrtew

The value of the show was the suspense of the storyline. Now that it's over none of the old seasons have any value. So it's priced $245 too high. It might be worth $79 - $99 just to have around for sentimental reasons even though who's going to sit through all that again? I'm more likely to delete all the ones I downloaded than I am to pay money for them at this point. They should have released them as promptly as the DVDs except more so.

I should start selling used cars to these people...

goMac · Apr 20, 2009, 04:16 PM

Originally Posted by jokell82

Even if you didn't like the finale it doesn't detract from the amazing first couple of seasons.

I won't be buying the BD set at that price, but maybe when it drops to $100-$150 on sale.

Yeah, but you've already seen those seasons. You may still enjoy them, but it certainly lowers your enjoyment.

I've already bought them on DVD. I already have most of them through iTunes, and if I wanted to pick and choose, I could continue downloading through iTunes. And they want me to pay full price again?

And we know it doesn't cost them $250 to produce the stupid thing.

jokell82 · Apr 20, 2009, 08:25 PM

Originally Posted by goMac

Yeah, but you've already seen those seasons. You may still enjoy them, but it certainly lowers your enjoyment.

I've already bought them on DVD. I already have most of them through iTunes, and if I wanted to pick and choose, I could continue downloading through iTunes. And they want me to pay full price again?

And we know it doesn't cost them $250 to produce the stupid thing.

Well that depends on just how many people buy it...

analogue SPRINKLES · Apr 20, 2009, 09:06 PM

Originally Posted by mrtew

You're going to watch that crap again even after knowing the lame ending?)

Yep, gonna watch it from beginning to end. Loved every bit of it other than a couple episodes.

Sourbook · Apr 20, 2009, 09:20 PM

^ Same here.

Oh, and i still think Baltar is a Cylon.

mrtew · Apr 20, 2009, 10:59 PM

Originally Posted by goMac

I should start selling used cars to these people...

Actually used cars are a great value.

goMac · Apr 21, 2009, 06:55 PM

Originally Posted by mrtew

Actually used cars are a great value.

Not when they're being sold for the same price as new cars.

analogue SPRINKLES · Apr 21, 2009, 10:11 PM

Caprica was pretty wicked. Better than I thought it was going to be.

besson3c · Apr 21, 2009, 11:49 PM

I wonder if the Caprica thread will get to 100 pages

I loved the Caprica Pilot, and can't wait to start watching this series!

ThinkInsane · Oct 22, 2009, 12:15 PM

I picked up The Plan last night at the record store. Just finished watching it. I won't give anything away until more people have a chance to see it. I will say it plugged some plot holes and answered some questions, so that a bonus. Plus there's boobies (and some dude's junk if that's more your thing)!