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SMacSteve · Jul 17, 2006, 01:14 AM

I have a question. I'd like to hear from as many of the viewers as possible to what their thoughts are about Apple's Cinema Displays.

I own a 23" Cinema Display connected to a Quad G5 and I love it. About the only thing that could be better is a 30" Cinema Display. I'm thinking about buying one, but I'm waiting until the price drops again. I would have thought Apple would have done this by now, but maybe they're waiting until they unveil the new Intel Mac Pro's.

What I was wondering is what others would want. Would you pay the higher price for a Apple Display? And if so why? If not why?

I personally feel that Apple's Displays are among the best if not "the" best. I work at a Apple Comp USA and whenever we've done a side-by-side comparison the Apple has always looked best. It may not always be a night and day difference and sometimes only slight. Of course this is related mostly to the quality of the displays that we pit it up against. I have to believe that Apple's hand picking the "cream of the crop" from it's LCD vendors would have a little to do with this as well as lower frequency of bad pixels.

What would you buy in any given size catagory? The Apple Cinema Display or a Samsung, Dell, Viewsonic, NEC, etc...

TFunkadelic · Jul 17, 2006, 01:46 AM

I mulled over this for awhile when I was getting my 20" dell display. It was half as expensive as the same size apple, and in my eyes looked just as good. It might not have the sleek aluminum case, but it looks fine to me, and I actually like the way it looks. I love my powerbook and feel it was worth every penny, but there's no chance in hell I'm going to shell out $800 for an apple display when I could get two of the same size that are practically as good from dell..

mduell · Jul 17, 2006, 07:46 AM

I'd buy the 30" Dell next time it's on sale.

jasonsRX7 · Jul 17, 2006, 10:00 AM

Had the Dell 30" been available at the time, I wouldn't have bought my Apple 30"

mikochu · Jul 17, 2006, 10:10 AM

I'm waiting for BenQ to release their 24" and 30"...

wowway1 · Jul 17, 2006, 11:06 AM

I can't figure out Apple's strategy for keeping their display prices so high, especially now that very good alternatives are available. I went to purchase a 20" widescreen for my MBP this weekend. Let's see - 20" ACD - $699 w/student discount. Viewsonice VA2012wb 20" widescreen, same specs, dual input, built in speakers - $299 after rebate. Guess which one I chose?

brassplayersrock² · Jul 17, 2006, 11:50 AM

there are cinema refurb. displays on the apple site for cheaper prices

mikochu · Jul 17, 2006, 12:55 PM

The refurbed Cinema displays are the same price as the Education-discounted ones...

brassplayersrock² · Jul 17, 2006, 02:11 PM

Originally Posted by mikochu

The refurbed Cinema displays are the same price as the Education-discounted ones...

not everyone can get the educational discount, so yes, they are cheaper for the non student based apple buyers

SMacSteve · Jul 17, 2006, 10:59 PM

I'm not hearing any real reasons other than price. Is there anyone who feels that Apples Displays are "better" than the competition? I for one do think that they are, but I just am trying to gain an idea of if Apple reduced the prices by say 20% would that be enough? I'm thinking it would for me, but what about you guys?

mikochu · 12:13 AM

I was researching the Dell 20/24" and the Apple 23" last week. The Dells new FPW2x07 Dells have color banding problems which they haven't seemed to fixed. The ACD 23" has dead pixels and pink/purple hue issues , as well as poorly lit screens. I don't mind paying a premium for the aluminum casing, but the LCD is said to be subpar. The Apple support forum is riddled with complaints. Website reviews point out the issues, too.

I read on digg.com about the rumored ACD update when the new desktops come out. We'll see what happens.

wowway1 · Jul 18, 2006, 08:36 AM

Originally Posted by SMacSteve

I'm not hearing any real reasons other than price. Is there anyone who feels that Apples Displays are "better" than the competition? I for one do think that they are, but I just am trying to gain an idea of if Apple reduced the prices by say 20% would that be enough? I'm thinking it would for me, but what about you guys?

Looking at the Viewsonice I bought, I can't imagine it being $400 worse than the 20" ACD. In fact, I could have bought 2 of these and had $100 left over. I owned a 20" alu ACD a couple of years back, from what I can remember it wasn't anything fancy compared to my Viewsonic.

Apfhex · Jul 18, 2006, 03:35 PM

Originally Posted by mikochu

The Dells new FPW2x07 Dells have color banding problems which they haven't seemed to fixed. ... I read on digg.com about the rumored ACD update when the new desktops come out. We'll see what happens.

They fixed the banding issues with a firmware update.

I haven't heard a single rumor regarding new ACD's but I'm also anxiously awaiting news of an update with the MacPro's.

U n i o n 0015 · Jul 18, 2006, 04:49 PM

Eh, I go back and forth about the Apple Cinema Displays and the Dell displays as well. The Apple displays enclosures look hands-down better, but the new Dell displays have a nice, retangular black enclosure that is classy and sublime. It's better than the old 240x series.

It's hard for me, especially since I like how the CD would match my PowerBook, but at the same time it is DOUBLE the cost for no performance difference. All you're paying for is the Apple brand and design. I think my next display is going to be the Dell 24" because I can get the thing for the same price as the Apple 20"!

And it's an outright shame that the 23" CD has had so many issues. That is pathetic for a monitor that costs over $1200.

mikochu · Jul 18, 2006, 05:00 PM

Originally Posted by Apfhex

They fixed the banding issues with a firmware update.

I haven't heard a single rumor regarding new ACD's but I'm also anxiously awaiting news of an update with the MacPro's.

If you read on the Dell support forum, they didn't fix it. They disabled the "Desktop" display mode in the firmware which was notorious for the banding. People on the forum said the color banding is still noticeable in other modes.

Apfhex · Jul 18, 2006, 08:09 PM

Originally Posted by mikochu

If you read on the Dell support forum, they didn't fix it. They disabled the "Desktop" display mode in the firmware which was notorious for the banding. People on the forum said the color banding is still noticeable in other modes.

I see... I had read somewhere else that they disabled a setting within the "Desktop" mode, rather than the mode itself, that fixed the banding issues for that mode.

Even if the 2407 is (now) $400 cheaper than an edu priced 23" ACD, I'm not convinced that I'd be able to get a satisfactory picture from it—at least I've read user reviews saying the 2405/2407 require strong calibration to look good, and that they're overly bright no matter what. Alas, I haven't been able to see them in person, which is what I really need to do.

SMacSteve · Jul 19, 2006, 01:11 AM

Originally Posted by U n i o n 0015

Eh, I go back and forth about the Apple Cinema Displays and the Dell displays as well. The Apple displays enclosures look hands-down better, but the new Dell displays have a nice, retangular black enclosure that is classy and sublime. It's better than the old 240x series.

It's hard for me, especially since I like how the CD would match my PowerBook, but at the same time it is DOUBLE the cost for no performance difference. All you're paying for is the Apple brand and design. I think my next display is going to be the Dell 24" because I can get the thing for the same price as the Apple 20"!

And it's an outright shame that the 23" CD has had so many issues. That is pathetic for a monitor that costs over $1200.

Yea, but they have that 4 letter word on the bottom of them that is just not going anywhere near my house! I'm a big fan of the Aluminum Display enclosure so I'm going to go with it when the new displays come out or the prices come down.

quangdiggity · 01:43 AM

I had a similar dilemma two weeks ago. I wanted to buy a second display for my iMac core duo and ended up deciding between the Dell 2007WFP and the 20" ACD. They both use the same lcd panels, but the electronics driving it is different between the two. Ultimately it came down to two factors:

1) The dell has banding issues, which may be fixed. I didn't want to have to toss a coin and repeatedly send back a defective monitor.
2) Aesthetics. Harmony and peace of mind is worth $300.

#2 was probably the most important.

After buying the ACD, I noticed that there were a one more little detail that made it a better choice than the Dell, and it definitely feels like a little detail that apple engineering would pay attention to.

The monitor integrates very well with OS X. The ACD has a USB hub and when you plug the USB connector into your mac, the buttons on the side of the display interact with the mac. The display brightness bezel pops up when you push the brightness buttons on the side of the monitor. You can also control brightness from the display preferences panel and optionally disable the brightness controls on the display. The power button on the side of the display is equally flexible. It can be made to power the display, sleep the mac, or do nothing.

As far as a 30" ACD goes, I think I would prefer having two 23" side-by-side or three 20" rather than a single 30". I've got a 23" ACD at the office, and I never use the upper and lower 2" of the screen. The way I work, I prefer having windows side-by-side, and can't really stand windows that are too long. But then, most of my work involves text.

SMacSteve · Jul 19, 2006, 01:42 AM

Bingo! I agree!

TFunkadelic · Jul 19, 2006, 04:27 AM

Banding issues have been solved according to most...I know mine doesn't suffer from it. Aluminum and a name isn't worth it to me when I could have twice the screen area at the same price.

iRussel · Jul 19, 2006, 08:11 AM

Personally I'm going to get the Dell 2405FPW for two reasons. It's a lot cheaper than an ACD and it has a bunch of ports: USB / DVI-D / S-Video / Composite / Component Connectors.

nerd · Jul 21, 2006, 12:32 AM

Also note that the Apple 23" displays are suffering from 'persistence' meaning if you leave up a window for a couple minutes and drag it away you'll see a ghost of the window. I had just bought one 2 weeks ago and returned it because of this. I have the HP L2335 and it doesn't have this ghosting problem. Just an FYI, I probably had the one in 1000 bad ones but....

robby818 · Jul 22, 2006, 11:03 PM

I have a Dell 2407. rev. A02 "fixed" the banding issue. BUT there is still some vertical banding. It's a minor annoyance for me, so I am keeping the monitor. You can order one through Costco's website, return it at any Costco location for a full refund (including shipping). I've owned a lot of Dell monitors including the 2005, 2405, and 3007. Compared to the 2405, the 2407 has much better contrast and is also brighter.

The 3007 is a good monitor but there is a bit of unevenness in the brightness levels on the left and right side of the screens.

Captain Curt · Jul 23, 2006, 02:04 AM

For nongamers, I've got to say that I think the 30" ACD is the best. I bought a 30" ACD refurb two months ago and am happy with the purchase. The resolution and brightness of this monitor are just simply great. I anticipate a ten year usefull life for the monitor vs three to five years for a cpu making the higher cost a little easier to justify. (I know ten years is a loooong time in tech but notice I did say "usefull" life.) The 30" ACDs will always hold a better resale value than the others and I think that Apple has better quality control in components and manufacturing.

I think that one 30" inch screen is better that two 23" screeens simply because long windows are usefull sometimes. You can scan ebay lists faster, read long articles and more often keep the entire article on the screen. And my personal favorite, you can add bookmarks until the cows come home and still see them all on the screen.

Gamers may not be happy with the 14 ms screen response time. I'm OK with the Radeon 9600 PC/MAC video card. I'm having restart problems (thermal and shut down script I imagine). People with PCI Macs may want to wait.

Last and least, I think this display will last for a long time, the 30" ACD will be alot nicer to look at.

angelmb · Jul 23, 2006, 02:06 AM

It would help if you look for more expensive displays than Apple's one, like the Philips 230W5BS/00 -slightly more expensive- and the Eizo ColorEdge24W, way more expensive.

This way, the Apple 23" doesn't look that bad, huh?

mikochu · Jul 25, 2006, 01:14 PM

How I have my room setup, I was looking at buying a 24" ACD. After going to the Apple store to check it out, I realized it was too small for me to watch it from my bed, especially for the price. The same went for the 30". Two 20" ACDs was just too expensive. I ended up buying two Sceptre 20" widescreen LCDs for @ $580 at Costco. I'm real happy with them. Combined, they have a higher width resolution than a 30". And if I get tired of them, I can always return it since Costco has a lifetime return policy.

skucera · Jul 25, 2006, 11:39 PM

I thought I read on Engadget or something that Dell and Apple use the same screen in their 30" displays, and so it all comes down to the other hardware in the monitor, as well as the firmware.

mduell · Jul 26, 2006, 08:46 PM

Originally Posted by skucera

I thought I read on Engadget or something that Dell and Apple use the same screen in their 30" displays, and so it all comes down to the other hardware in the monitor, as well as the firmware.

They use the same panel for their 20" products (at the time Anandtech tore them apart, Dell was actually using a higher-numbered revision), so I wouldn't be surprised if they did the same with the 30" panels.

starman · Aug 23, 2006, 11:22 AM

Is anyone forgetting that Dell puts in slots for multiple types of memory cards? I absolutely LOVE that feature on my 2405. I've been debating on getting a 2407 if I get a Mac Pro and the slots alone are enough to sway me to get a Dell monitor.