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libraryguy · 04:48 AM

I just stopped by the Apple Online store and saw that their ad banner at the top of the store said new lower prices on the 12" and 15" powerbooks. I saved the image to post here. I also noticed that when I clicked the ad...the actual prices hadn't been adjusted but I think they may have just changed them shortly before I got there...it's 3:22am here. Anyway, maybe they're clearing inventory for new models?? Why no discount on the 17"? Who knows?

[EDIT} As of 3:46am the correct (and lower) prices have been post to the Apple Store.

icruise · Jun 2, 2003, 04:59 AM

I guess that's good news all around, but I can't help feeling a little annoyed that the prices came down so quickly after I got mine...

Simon · Jun 2, 2003, 05:20 AM

Oh, yeah!

Just when I decided I'd soon get a 12" PowerBook they come down 200$.

Lucky me!

I expected the 15" to come down in price to clear out inventory for the new 15" Al, but what does the lowered price on the 12" mean?

- new 12" coming too? what will it offer? 1GHz G4? DVI?

- could it mean Apple decided to make all PowerBooks have similar boards (i.e. all have a 1GHz G4 on DDR boards, nVidea GPUs, etc.)?

- the 12" was too expensive for what it offered so they lowered the price? But why, I thought they were selling very well?

- now there will be even less difference between the 12" iBook and 12" PowerBook. How does Apple plan to differentiate the two? They're already rather close now...

Lots of questions...

But for sure good news.

iWrite · Jun 2, 2003, 05:57 AM

This is what I posted yesterday over at the another thread:

Congratulations on your new toy.

I just heard this morning from an attorney from Pillsbury out in San Francisco who also deals with Apple frequently that the reason there's a hold-up on the release of the 15-inch is because Apple is updating the 17-inch to 1.2Ghz.

*Supposedly* the new 15-inch aluminum will debut at 1Ghz and 1.2Ghz respectively, also.

Maybe the 12-inch Powerbook is being discontinued?

Interesting!

Eciton · Jun 2, 2003, 06:08 AM

Well, they haven't made any change in the UK store yet...

Rather odd, actually - I was about to buy a 12" PB yesterday and for some weird intuition held off.

I wouldn't think the 12" is being discontinued - that would be a really idiotic move on Apple's part. Given it came out in January I'd expect a speedbump to be in order soonish, and obviously the Ti needs a price-drop to keep it competitive with the rest of the range before the 15" Al comes out.

Here's hoping the UK prices drop comparably...

Simon · Jun 2, 2003, 06:17 AM

Originally posted by iWrite:
Maybe the 12-inch Powerbook is being discontinued?

Doesn't seem very likely at all.

Look at the last iBook update. It was very clear that the iBook is supposed to stay just an inexpensive entry-level machine.

Discontinuing the 12" would mean Apple doesn't offer a full-featured "sub".

Makes no sense.

I rather think this signals that they are trying to clear 12" inventory out like they're doing with the 15". Sounds like a 12" update.

Would make sense. The 12" lacks quite some "Power" features that are needed to distinguish it from the inexpensive iBook line. 1GHz, L3, DVI, more RAM capacity, etc. come to mind...

Dear Apple, my cash is waiting to be spent.

Here's hoping.

Simon · Jun 2, 2003, 06:21 AM

Originally posted by Eciton:
Well, they haven't made any change in the UK store yet...

I have checked a couple of european stores and none of them have updated prices as far as I can see. Maybe we're just to impatient. Strange...

Ah no, the USD dropped compared to the Euro quite considerably the last few months. Maybe they want to hold off because they are now getting nicer margins.

Rather odd, actually - I was about to buy a 12" PB yesterday and for some weird intuition held off.

Nice intuition there.

I had the cash ready for the 12" PowerBook, but I wanted to wait for the b revision since I though a couple of things should be in there that aren't yet. I hope they get updated soon - I'm really keen on getting one finally.

Given it came out in January I'd expect a speedbump to be in order soonish, and obviously the Ti needs a price-drop to keep it competitive with the rest of the range before the 15" Al comes out.

Good point. If they respect the 6 month update cycle we are quite ready for an update.

Yeah.

MusicalTone · Jun 2, 2003, 06:53 AM

Looks like they only dropped the low end 15|" and not the Superdrive. Srange the dint acompany the drop with a new model if they were gonna upgrade.

pic9809 · Jun 2, 2003, 06:54 AM

i'm in the market for a 17" albook, and had previously been holding out until after MWDC in the hopes of price drops and/or speed updates. in light of this price drop, i think it's reasonable to hypothesize that 12" and 15" powerbooks will be updated soom (MWDC?), but what do people think this means for the 17"?

wallinbl · Jun 2, 2003, 07:00 AM

This happens to me every time! I just got my 12" last Tuesday.

BrunoBruin · Jun 2, 2003, 08:39 AM

My campus store had great deals on the 12-inch as early as April, I think. SuperDrive model with 640MB RAM and AppleCare for $1,699, IIRC.

The SuperDrive Ti is now almost the same price I paid for my 667 a year ago. I WANT ONE!!!

mrmister · Jun 2, 2003, 09:24 AM

SD 15" dropped $200 as well.

iWrite · Jun 2, 2003, 09:29 AM

Then get one, Bruno!

They're at a tempting price.

My bet is that it's a sale for about a month.

Apple is gonna announce new Powerbooks.

Now, want to hear something tantalizing?

I heard this morning that the Powerbooks are going to be in the following sizes from now on:

13.3"
15.4"
17.0"

All aluminum.

I heard this from a friend who has been on the money in the past about these things and *may* or *may not* be ~close~ to all things Apple (I cannot say but you get my drift).

Mind you, this is what he's *hearing* in hallowed halls.

Cheers, all --->

tgrundke · Jun 2, 2003, 09:31 AM

I have a feeling that Apple is going to be doing a pretty sweeping change to the entire portable lineup within the next month (WWDC?).

Already there have been comments about the strange location of the 12" PowerBook in terms of pricing in relation to the iBook lineup. And we already know that the 12" PowerBook has been wildly popular on the market. So the question is: What does Apple have up its sleeves?

We can assume that pricing is going to drop. the 17" PowerBook's sales have slowed to a trickle now that the backlog is cleared up (which is also normal for an Apple 'vanity' product). And sales of the 15" have probably slowed significantly, as is the trend with that model. The iBook remains Apple's volume leader, consistently from quarter to quarter.

So, now that it appears that the PowerBook lineup will be updated in the near future, what does this hold out for new pricing? Are we going to see the iBook move lower in price and the PowerBook as well? Are we going to see more overlap, or a much better deliniation between iBook and PowerBook? Or, is Apple moving to eliminate the iBook now that economies of scale are coming to the point where they can sell PowerBooks starting at $999? Lots of speculation in this, 'The Year of the Notebook."

And finally - assuming these new models debut at the WWDC, does this mean that a 970 announcement / new PowerMacs are further off than we all thought?

RealMadrid · Jun 2, 2003, 09:32 AM

Why does it say "Get more for less"?

I understand "less", but "more"?

Have the specs changed or is it just marketing strategy.

On a sidenote, for me this looks like inventory cleaning. New models should be near but still some couple of week away.

Regards

iWrite · Jun 2, 2003, 09:33 AM

Could it POSSIBLY be true?

If so, I will laugh my *SS off at all of the "knowitalls" who said, "NO WAY!"

Simon · Jun 2, 2003, 09:34 AM

Originally posted by iWrite:
13.3"
15.4"
17.0"

All aluminum.

The 15.4 is almost a no-brainer. I don't know about the 13.3" PowerBook though. I mean, it would help distinguish it from the iBook, but what else? At the same resolution it would just be bulkier and at a higher resolution there will be many whining that it shouldn't have a higher res than the 15" or 17".

The only reaon I could think of for the 13.3" is that they can't put enough pro features (hotter CPUs with L3, DVI out, PC card maybe?) into the 12" enclosure.

Na, I don't think that's a very good step, but I wouldn't say it won't happen.

Simon · Jun 2, 2003, 09:37 AM

Originally posted by iWrite:
If so, I will laugh my *SS off at all of the "knowitalls" who said, "NO WAY!"

The people doubting a 970 release in the 12" PowerBook are by no means knowitalls.

It think reasonable was the word you were looking for.

At least they are not more knowitall than those dreamers who naively assume Apple will introduce the 970 in that market they have the least reason to.

vmarks · Jun 2, 2003, 10:02 AM

Originally posted by iWrite:
Could it POSSIBLY be true?

If so, I will laugh my *SS off at all of the "knowitalls" who said, "NO WAY!"

You know, it's much easier to expect the least and then be pleasantly surprised, as opposed to expecting more, and being disappointed.

Or didn't you learn that lesson with a years' waiting for an LCD iMac?

iWrite · Jun 2, 2003, 10:03 AM

The people doubting a 970 release in the 12" PowerBook are by no means knowitalls.

It think reasonable was the word you were looking for.

At least they are not more knowitall than those dreamers who naively assume Apple will introduce the 970 in that market they have the least reason to.

Okay, let's try it your way:

If so, I will laugh my *SS off at all of the "reasonable" who said, "NO WAY!"

Naw, I think the way I said it was what I meant.

I never said that Apple would put 970 in a Powerbook.

BUT, I never said that Apple would NOT put 970 in a Powerbook.

In fact, I DON'T KNOW.

That is why I find it amusing when people who blatantly PRONOUNCE things...when they themselves don't know.

NYCFarmboy · Jun 2, 2003, 10:10 AM

My speculation:

a 970 12" powerbook coming at the end of this month....and the ibooks go g4.

I doubt they'd increase the size to 13" on the small one...the reason its popular is the size..
the 15" is really too big for use on airplanes...and 17"..well... maybe in first class.

lol

but...I hope they keep it 12" powerbook size. Its a good screen size. If anything wider..but definately NOT taller please!

MusicalTone · Jun 2, 2003, 10:17 AM

I think prior to the price cut most of us didnt think it likely a 970 would be introduced to a PB this soon and that the 15" AlBook was not likely making an appearance any time soon either.

I dont know anyone who put across that opinion as fact or know-it-all.

Since the announcement of price cuts to the 12" and 15" it is farily safe to say that there will be new 12" and 15" models in the next month or so, most likely both in Aluminium enclosures.

But will either sport a new 970 Chip? We will just have to wait and see. Nobody knows. My personal opinion is that it is still unlikely. More like a 1.,25 Ghz G4.

Appleman · Jun 2, 2003, 10:46 AM

I'll just wait and see.
All these speculations make me dizzy, and after a while you start to believe it all.

Like vmarks says, better get surprised than disappointed.

Moreover, the same bull starts again: over here in Europe the prices remain the same.

When they come out with new models, we first have to wait for lots of weeks before thay are available in the USA, and then it takes another some weeks to get them here in Europe.
By that time, new models are being rumoured in the States...

I just wait and see. Just sold my TiBook 500 and wait a little bit what they do with the new 15" or go for the 17".

SOLIDAge · Jun 2, 2003, 11:18 AM

humm
i find it shocking that prices went down so quickly...but i'm not really upset at all that i payed $200 more life goes on, and i'm very happy with my purchase.

iWrite · Jun 2, 2003, 11:20 AM

I think prior to the price cut most of us didnt think it likely a 970 would be introduced to a PB this soon and that the 15" AlBook was not likely making an appearance any time soon either.

I dont know anyone who put across that opinion as fact or know-it-all.

Oh, *they* know who they are.

<smirk>

Besides, I'm not just referring to people; I'm also referring to sites like "MacWhispers" which has made a cottage industry of speculation about the PPC 970.

If the 970 doesn't materialize then MacWhispers, which has in the past ridiculed fellow sites like Think Secret, will have absolutely no credibility left.

(Not that they did in the first place.)

Anyway, the anticipation of what *may* come is tantalizing, that's for sure.

vmarks · Jun 2, 2003, 12:02 PM

Originally posted by iWrite:
Okay, let's try it your way:

If so, I will laugh my *SS off at all of the "reasonable" who said, "NO WAY!"

Naw, I think the way I said it was what I meant.

I never said that Apple would put 970 in a Powerbook.

BUT, I never said that Apple would NOT put 970 in a Powerbook.

In fact, I DON'T KNOW.

That is why I find it amusing when people who blatantly PRONOUNCE things...when they themselves don't know.

You know, you could stand to be a little less ready to ridicule others, whether they are sites or people here.

It is highly unlikely that Apple would put a 970 processor in Powerbooks at this time. It is much more likely that they would start with PowerMacs and then later revise the PowerBook line.

What would make the unlikely a reality are the following conditions:
1) the IBM is much more affordable.
2) the IBM is small in size and small in power requirements.
3) the IBM is being produced in volume necessary to meet the demand of changing two large product lines, consisting of six total products.
4) the engineering on four of those products has been done to accept an IBM part. (Powermacs share motherboards.)

It is much more reasonable for Apple to first revise the PowerMac motherboard and then later go about the business of upgrading the PowerBooks.

This is why you get "NO WAY" responses.

Alternatively, sites and people get starry-eyed and declare that their wishes are going to come true with the next product release out of unvarnished optimism.

You can't really fault them for that. You can fault them for reporting it as news. It's not, it's op/ed.

Mike Pither · Jun 2, 2003, 12:02 PM

"We can assume that pricing is going to drop. the 17" PowerBook's sales have slowed to a trickle now that the backlog is cleared up."

Where did you get this info tgrundke?

TommyLeeRoth · Jun 2, 2003, 12:07 PM

17" also got a price cut here in Australia.

n_lim · Jun 2, 2003, 12:50 PM

wow..i feel just like I did when I bought a dvd rev. b 667 ti and an external burner and then two months later the combo drive came out at the same price. I was telling myself that no matter what comes out, I would try and be happy with what I have and not to be upgrade crazy. but,,,, a 13.3" widescreen and a 970 would change my mind, and make current 12" pb prices plummet!

iWrite · Jun 2, 2003, 01:06 PM

I was just cruising eBay looking at PB prices there and the 12-inch systems are extremely low-priced.

The 17-inch systems are holding their own.

There is a huge variance in 15-inch prices but the 667s are closing at between $1300 and $1500 -- $1500 if they have a lot going with them.

Considering that the 800Mhz and the 667Mhz ran at about the same speeds, that makes a good condition 667Mhz an awesome deal.

$1300 for a like-new 667Mhz?

Really great price -- if you buy it the right way and don't join the ranks of the "Help!!! I got screwed" thread. (In other words, BE CAREFUL -- no Western Union payments.)

Vicious · Jun 2, 2003, 01:25 PM

The 15" drop was very expected but the issue I believe deserves concentration is the drop in the 12". What could possibly merit a $200 drop, the same drop the 15" experienced yet not the 17". Hmmm. And whats this about a 13.3"? wouldn't that be a massive production mistake to produce one case for 6 months and switch up to an entirely new size... seems erratic.

_Vicious

djjava · Jun 2, 2003, 01:34 PM

Originally posted by Vicious:
The 15" drop was very expected but the issue I believe deserves concentration is the drop in the 12". What could possibly merit a $200 drop, the same drop the 15" experienced yet not the 17". Hmmm. And whats this about a 13.3"? wouldn't that be a massive production mistake to produce one case for 6 months and switch up to an entirely new size... seems erratic.

_Vicious

good point here...

Are they not selling as well as the PB17? Seems like it... or maybe a RevB is sooner than we think. The PB17 seems to be holding its own.

Jacket · Jun 2, 2003, 01:40 PM

Originally posted by djjava:
good point here...

Are they not selling as well as the PB17? Seems like it... or maybe a RevB is sooner than we think. The PB17 seems to be holding its own.

Because the PB17 is the same laptop that God uses...

iWrite · Jun 2, 2003, 01:53 PM

I might buy a 13.3-inch Powerbook but I wouldn't buy a 12-inch Powerbook. It's just TOO small -- and no DVI? That makes it a glorified iBook.

At the Apple Store here where I live the 12-inch Powerbook sales have tanked. Zilcho. They're not selling the Titaniums either, for that matter, that often.

The only Powerbook really selling is the 17-inch system and those are far and few between because, let's face it, in this day and age of $1000 PC notebooks running at 2.4Ghz, a $3200 notebook running 1Ghz doesn't look very tantalizing -- even if people ignore "megahertz myth."

Quanta makes Apple's Powerbooks and Quanta has their own team to develop notebook designs -- and those notebook designs are sold to vendors/manufacturers, such as Dell. Yes, Quanta works WITH manufacturers to design custom notebooks, but a lot of the designs are already architected.

Quanta

Since the 13.3-inch form factor is already standard on the PC side of things, it might make sense that Apple simply adopts the 13.3-inch size.

Just food for thought.

cpac · Jun 2, 2003, 02:04 PM

if y'all haven't noticed, Apple Canada dropped prices on *all* the PBs, including th 17".

BrunoBruin · Jun 2, 2003, 02:14 PM

Originally posted by tgrundke:
And we already know that the 12" PowerBook has been wildly popular on the market. ...The iBook remains Apple's volume leader, consistently from quarter to quarter.

In the last quarter PowerBooks outsold iBooks, 166,000 to 133,000. Apple sold more Power Macs than iBooks last quarter and far more iMacs/eMacs.

I don't know that the 12-inch PowerBook is such a runaway success. As I mentioned above, my campus store had good discounts on them almost immediately. And despite what people think of 15-inch sales tanking, Apple sold only 10,000 fewer 15s than 12s last quarter, and Apple themselves said that some 12-inch PowerBook sales were coming at the expense of iBook sales.

ae86_16v · Jun 2, 2003, 02:22 PM

Originally posted by Vicious:
The 15" drop was very expected but the issue I believe deserves concentration is the drop in the 12". What could possibly merit a $200 drop, the same drop the 15" experienced yet not the 17". Hmmm. And whats this about a 13.3"? wouldn't that be a massive production mistake to produce one case for 6 months and switch up to an entirely new size... seems erratic.

_Vicious

I don't think it is that hard to switch the screen size as far as manufacturing stand point. Isn't the 12" screen the same as the iBook's? If so, then it is just the matter to changing the enclosure. It is not like they had to design a new 12" screen for the Powerbook.

Another thing, I thought Steve Jobs said there would be no new hardware at WWDC? (I forgot where I did read that from.)

Dubloseven · Jun 2, 2003, 02:24 PM

Originally posted by BrunoBruin:
Apple themselves said that some 12-inch PowerBook sales were coming at the expense of iBook sales.

wouldnt that be a good thing? the powerbooks cost more than the ibooks! why would apple be disapointed that they were selling a higher priced computer?

Mastrap · Jun 2, 2003, 02:37 PM

I bought my 12" $600 under list as a return from Apple. If they're bumping the specs that 12" will be on ebay sooner than you can say something that doesn't take very long to say.

The Placid Casual · Jun 2, 2003, 02:38 PM

Anyione thought that the price cut could mean there is nothing new on the horizon in terms of the Powerbook?

They could be putting in a premptive strike to make them seem more attractive than the upcoming kick-ass Powermacs?

I know this es against previous form, but to me it is if not a likely scenario, it is at least possible.

I'm just getting the earplugs ready for the whinging threads, if no Quad 970 15" Powerbooks with infinate batteries are released soon...

Peace,

Marc

Mastrap · Jun 2, 2003, 02:39 PM

Originally posted by iWrite:

At the Apple Store here where I live the 12-inch Powerbook sales have tanked. Zilcho. They're not selling the Titaniums either, for that matter, that often.

The only Powerbook really selling is the 17-inch system and those are far and few between

I'd like to see you back these statements up with facts. because they go against all the numbers that Apple is publishing.

The Placid Casual · Jun 2, 2003, 02:42 PM

Originally posted by Mastrap:
I bought my 12" $600 under list as a return from Apple. If they're bumping the specs that 12" will be on ebay sooner than you can say something that doesn't take very long to say.

I got mine last month as a replacement machine for a faulty MDD Powermac I bought in August last year... I love UK consumer legislation! Didn't have to pay anymore, just a straight swap.

If a decent 15" comes out, the 12" may be Ebayed here too

Although, for once, I am totally happy with the 12". Regardless of the lack of DVI out, it is a really, really sweet machine for my needs... I am truly smitten so far!

djjava · Jun 2, 2003, 02:45 PM

Originally posted by Mastrap:
I'd like to see you back these statements up with facts. because they go against all the numbers that Apple is publishing.

whenever i am in the apple store near me, which is a lot, there is always someone looking to buy the PB17.

iWrite · Jun 2, 2003, 02:55 PM

I'd like to see you back these statements up with facts. because they go against all the numbers that Apple is publishing.

If the numbers are so *great* as you're alluding to, then why is Apple having a sale?

djjava · Jun 2, 2003, 02:59 PM

Originally posted by iWrite:
If the numbers are so *great* as you're alluding to, then why is Apple having a sale?

\

I'd say the PB17s are flying off the shelves, so to speak, and the 12's are as hot items.. but no hard #s to back my statement up with, that is just my inclination,and explanation for the 12s going down, and the 17s staying. I don't need to explain the 15s and that price drop.

The Placid Casual · 06:52 PM

Originally posted by iWrite:
If the numbers are so *great* as you're alluding to, then why is Apple having a sale?

There could be an infinite number of reasons why Apple is having sale.

Some more probable than others, but as we know nothing for definite all avenues are open.

If you are going to throw around 'facts and figures', back them up, or you risk looking very foolish should they not be correct.

Incidentally, while we're talking figures, I'm sure 87.7%* of Apple machines sold are eMacs and iMac sales are tanking.

Peace,

Marc

*79.3% of statistics are made up on the spot.

Mastrap · Jun 2, 2003, 03:21 PM

Originally posted by The Placid Casual:

Although, for once, I am totally happy with the 12". Regardless of the lack of DVI out, it is a really, really sweet machine for my needs... I am truly smitten so far! [/B]

Totally agree. I love mine too.

But if it should get bumped to Gigabook specs, maybe with DVI out, I'll swap it that very day. There's an Apple 17" flatscreen with my name on it somewhere

DekuDekuplex · Jun 2, 2003, 03:24 PM

Apple Japan has also dropped prices on its PowerBooks, also apparently across the board.

DekuDekuplex

Originally posted by cpac:
if y'all haven't noticed, Apple Canada dropped prices on *all* the PBs, including th 17".

The Placid Casual · 03:36 PM

Originally posted by Mastrap:
Totally agree. I love mine too.

But if it should get bumped to Gigabook specs, maybe with DVI out, I'll swap it that very day. There's an Apple 17" flatscreen with my name on it somewhere

I know what you mean... DVI is my only gripe. Although i knew about it before I chose the 12" so I can't complain.

The problem I have, is that I have my 17" Apple display sitting here on my desk next to the Powerbook, doing nothing...

More than annoying...

BrunoBruin · Jun 2, 2003, 04:12 PM

Originally posted by Dubloseven:
why would apple be disapointed that they were selling a higher priced computer?

Because the point is to sell MORE computers, not just different ones to the same number of people. Ideally you'd keep iBook sales strong and sell more PowerBooks as well. Also, we don't know the profit margins on the higher-end iBooks vs. the 12-inch PowerBook.

It will be interesting to see the breakdown of PowerBook sales in the current quarter, since all three models will have been shipping. In April all they really had were the initial shipments of the 17, about 14,000.