[mattyb]

From The Register.

[smacintush]

God doesn't make people stupid…stupid people made god.

[Dakar the Fourth]

Yeah, I think we can give this a one-way pass to the PL.

Edit: Anyway, he's not to far off from what we already know. The more education you get, the more likely you are to turn from religion. Only follows that people who go through higher education have a higher IQ than the rest of the population (on average).

[osiris]

We need smart people to build a smarter god - perhaps of gold and frankincense.

[Dakar the Fourth]

All I know is he needs to be more user friendly, my good chum.

[smacintush]

Originally Posted by Dakar the Fourth 

All I know is he needs to be more user friendly, my good chum.

Well gee, close your eyes and talk to yourself. How much more user friendly can you get?

[osiris]

Originally Posted by Dakar the Fourth 

All I know is he needs to be more user friendly, my good chum.

Or at least show up with beer, my good man.

[Dakar the Fourth]

Originally Posted by smacintush 

Well gee, close your eyes and talk to yourself. How much more user friendly can you get?

I could start touching myself too...

[osiris]

Originally Posted by Dakar the Fourth 

I could start touching myself too...

He said friendly, not intimate.

[Tiresias]

I read books on atheism, but this study is stupid.

Stupidity is not a cause of religious belief, or visa versa. They are just a positively correlated variables.

[Zeeb]

I'd be interested to read the actual study--this is just an article *about* the study. I do agree with the quote from Dr. Hardman which basically said there is a link between intelligence and the abililty and willingness to question strongly held beliefs--like religion. However, the questioning of those beliefs doesn't automatically result in a non-religious person. This sounds like an academic with a grudge trying to legitimize his own biased beliefs with a study--happens all the time.

[- - e r i k - -]

Not the first study to claim this by far:

Religiosity and intelligence - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[amazing]

Sounds remarkably like an article from one of the rags that are prominently featured next to the cash-register checkout line. The Register loves to publish things like that, but that doesn't mean the so-called "research" has been well-designed or peer-reviewed, etc.

Many controversial beliefs can be held by so-called highly intelligent people.

For example, we who use Macs know that we are a cut above the rest of the world, especially those who use Windows. It goes without saying that anyone with half a brain would choose the platform that has no viruses, no spyware, better designed, better hardware, etc, right?

Trouble is, if you equate Windows with low IQ (and if you're vociferous about it,) you're not going to get many dates.

Next, I propose a "scientific study" that measures how many blondes use Windows vs how many use OS X. Gonna have lots of publicity and fame after this study is published!

[Atomic Rooster]

Originally Posted by Tiresias 

Stupidity is not a cause of religious belief, or visa versa. They are just a positively correlated variables.

Huh, wut?

[osxpro]

This is hilarious - A "psychology researcher" put this out. Anyone with an IQ over 10 knows that "Adademic researchers" are simply people on the academic dole and can't make a living in the real world.
Rule one of research - You have to distinguish the difference in causation and correlation. As one of my more intelligent old professors pointed out. As the temperature goes up from spring to summer, so does the the sale of ice cream AND instances of RAPE. So, ice cream causes rape? Duh - NO!
That's a correlation - not a causation.

[BRussell]

Originally Posted by osxpro 

Anyone with an IQ over 10 knows that "Adademic researchers" are simply people on the academic dole and can't make a living in the real world.

[ironknee]

it's a given. no need to research

[amazing]

this particular priest is amongst the absolute dumbest, but not because of religion. He's dumb simply because he's dumb, no other reason necessary.

Witnesses: Priest often in the nude - The Denver Post

[Shaddim]

Oh brother, more of this clap-trap.

Guess you guys shouldn't vote for Obama, since he's just another stupid Christian. Right?

[Dakar the Fourth]

It's ok, we heard he was pretending.

[ebuddy]

Originally Posted by Dakar the Fourth 

Yeah, I think we can give this a one-way pass to the PL.

Edit: Anyway, he's not to far off from what we already know. The more education you get, the more likely you are to turn from religion. Only follows that people who go through higher education have a higher IQ than the rest of the population (on average).

It might be tempting to relate low IQ with religion, but I think the question is whether or not there's a causal relationship. The college environment is riddled with youth and the inherent anti-establishment mentality within it. Empirically, (assuming science is the interest here) there's certainly more evidence of communal influence than stupidity causing religion or vise versa.

[- - e r i k - -]

Originally Posted by Dakar the Fourth 

It's ok, we heard he was pretending.

'tis true and a sad sad political climate that forces politicians to espouse false spiritual beliefs in a supposedly secular state with clear boundaries between church and state.

[paul w]

Originally Posted by ironknee 

OT, is this another election year political sig trend of yours? I always admired your skills (and yes I admire both sides when clever politically themed sigs are concerned).

[Dakar the Fourth]

Originally Posted by ebuddy 

It might be tempting to relate low IQ with religion, but I think the question is whether or not there's a causal relationship. The college environment is riddled with youth and the inherent anti-establishment mentality within it. Empirically, (assuming science is the interest here) there's certainly more evidence of communal influence than stupidity causing religion or vise versa.

If I came off as supporting the original hypothesis, it was not my intention. My point was his claim seemed like an off-shoot of what I believe is much more likely – higher education leads to athiesm/agnosticsm. I think the correlation there has more to do with post-secondary education leading one down new paths (to ask questions never thought of, explore beliefs previously held as fact, etc.) than one having a higher IQ. It's just more likely that someone who has a higher IQ has gone the post-secondary and beyond route than the stupid, to put it bluntly.

That said, I haven't met any agnostics or atheists without a college or even highschool diploma yet.

[Andy8]

Originally Posted by Dakar the Fourth 

That said, I haven't met any agnostics or atheists without a college or even highschool diploma yet.

Yes you have - me

[(s)macintosh]

Religion is a huge leap of faith; Here's this book, the man in it has amazing powers. Read it, learn it, live it and obey and your soul will be forever saved from damnation.

The thinking man should question every topic the book touches upon, unless we don't want to evolve as a human race. Blind zealotry seems to be the Bible's main theme... Do exactly what I tell you to do otherwise bad things will happen to you and your loved ones.

I saved this quote from somewhere and it seems relevant:

"I think the point is that God is actually evil, while Satan just encourages us to do whatever we want. What other reason is there for killing homosexuals and the like ? The whole book seems geared towards training people to tolerate injustice from those in power. That no doubt accounts for its popularity with leaders."

[Dakar the Fourth]

Originally Posted by Andy8 

Yes you have - me

You have a British accent, though. By default your IQ is 20 points higher than your American equivalent.

[- - e r i k - -]

It's not a huge leap of faith for most. You put your trust in your parents from birth. If they tell you a certain story is truth, that will be the core of your beliefs growing up. Not everyone gets to the stage where they can critically examine these indoctrinated "truths". Education helps, experience even moreso.

[lpkmckenna]

I doubt there is a relation between smarts and religion. An awful lot of smart people were religious: Newton, MLK, Locke, etc.

Besides, plainly ridiculous beliefs are adopted by the gullible, not the stupid.

[Captain Obvious]

As a person advances their education there is a shift of one's preoccupation and priorities to more immediate and tangible things in their lives. For a large part of the population I wouldn't necessarily say they abandon religion as much as they no longer focus on it. As they gain more intellect something else moves to the front of their minds but religion is still back there somewhere. Religion is inescapable and a necessary part of society and for most individuals. It has allowed humanity to cope with thing in life that feel greater than themselves.

It explains those TIME magazine polls years ago saying that upwards of 80% of the country believe in a deity of some kind. To say that religion is for the stupid is an oversimplification. Most of you are stupid but religion exists to bind society and many people's psychological well-being together.

Just look at the huge influx of people who flocked to church in the hours and days following September 11th. Any large catastrophe or personal crisis will drive a large portion of learned people to god for comfort and to find meaning.

I am sure few of you would draw any solace from or turn to statistics and physics principles if your whole family went down in a freak plane crash.

[design219]

Originally Posted by Captain Obvious 

Most of you are stupid

[(s)macintosh]

Originally Posted by - - e r i k - - 

You put your trust in your parents from birth. If they tell you a certain story is truth, that will be the core of your beliefs growing up. Not everyone gets to the stage where they can critically examine these indoctrinated "truths".

It happens with the Easter Bunny & Santa Clause, so it makes me wonder why people put so much faith in God, when it's basically storytelling tradition passed down from generation to generation.

[BRussell]

Originally Posted by lpkmckenna 

I doubt there is a relation between smarts and religion. An awful lot of smart people were religious: Newton, MLK, Locke, etc.

Besides, plainly ridiculous beliefs are adopted by the gullible, not the stupid.

You may doubt it, but the data pretty clearly shows that there is. Why there is, and what it means, is very much in doubt, but that there is doesn't seem to be much in doubt.

[Shaddim]

Originally Posted by Dakar the Fourth 

It's ok, we heard he was pretending.

Horsesh*t.

[King Bob On The Cob]

Originally Posted by BRussell 

You may doubt it, but the data pretty clearly shows that there is. Why there is, and what it means, is very much in doubt, but that there is doesn't seem to be much in doubt.

What it means is I'm an outlier according to this study!

Whoo hoo! I'm special!

[Lava Lamp Freak]

I've read on theology, faith, etc, and do not have the evidence that I personally require to believe in God. Everyone is different in what they are capable of believing. I do believe that it is my own education that led me to a point in my life where I questioned my childhood beliefs and was no longer able to continue believing them. I don't claim to know there isn't a god or higher power, I think that is unknowable, but Christianity, and all other god believing, control-by-fear religions, are rubbish.

[Lava Lamp Freak]

Originally Posted by Shaddim 

Oh brother, more of this clap-trap.

Guess you guys shouldn't vote for Obama, since he's just another stupid Christian. Right?

Originally Posted by Dakar the Fourth 

It's ok, we heard he was pretending.

Originally Posted by Shaddim 

Horsesh*t.

According to polls, Obama is the choice of the majority of atheists voting. He falls more into the universalism way of thinking as far as his religion goes. He has my vote.

[stupendousman]

This study proves one thing.

There's apparently no shortage of stupid, biased researchers with too much time on their hands.

I remember when Jimmy "The Greek" made similar styled observations years ago and got fired for repeating them on air. Of course, his observations where likely fueled by bigotry and where a great example of not being able to distinguish the difference between causation and correlation as well. On TV that gets you fired. In academia, that apparently gets you tenure.

[ebuddy]

Originally Posted by BRussell 

You may doubt it, but the data pretty clearly shows that there is. Why there is, and what it means, is very much in doubt, but that there is doesn't seem to be much in doubt.

Upon looking at more information on the study, it seems they're citing studies including a 1990s survey that found that only 7% of members of the American National Academy of Sciences believed in God. It seems they're dredging up old data to reiterate an opinion.

What it shows me is what we've already known through centuries of overwhelming evidence; people are impressionable. The college campus is riddled with youth, the age group of those statistically more apt to question authority, dogma, and the "establishment". There's an infectious degree of energy among folks that are ideologically wide-open. They often quietly come back around at the birth of their first child.

IMO, we have much more evidence to suggest communal influence is more integral to shaping one's ideology over mere intellect. There's also considerable debate whether or not IQ is an adequate gauge of intelligence; enter EQ and AQ. lpk mentions this probably better than I, but there are simply too many examples to the contrary to maintain the notion that religion and IQ have a causal relationship.

[Dakar the Fourth]

Originally Posted by Shaddim 

Horsesh*t.

I was being sarcastic. I realize there are a lot of crazies here in the PL, but I'm offended you haven't realized I'm not one of them after all these years.

*cue dramatic sobbing*

[red rocket]

I was thinking the other day about how religion was invented by a bunch of psychotherapist magicians to pacify and control stupid people. Clearly, they realised that there would probably always be stupid people around, and that these people would need something like religion to keep them from killing themselves and endangering the commonweal.

Probably seemed like a good idea at the time.

[OldManMac]

I think the use of the word "stupid" is a little harsh, and shows a basic lack of security from its users (and I'm guilty of that at times as well), as if we need to totally denigrate anyone who doesn't believe the same way as we do, by attempting to make ourselves feel vastly superior. What I do believe, however, is that people are impressionable and gullible, especially when events occur that they can't conceive an explanation for. They then invent explanations, which are then used to control others. This doesn't apply just to religions, although; seeing as how most people subscribe to some religious faith or another, it's one of the dominant influences in our lives. There have been many beliefs that have later been shown to be ridiculous, which some people cling to until their last breath, but are nonetheless discredited later. Unfortunately, the belief in some magical god, because it's ingrained in most from a very early age, seems to be a tough one to shake.

[stupendousman]

...and I think that this thread proves one thing as well:

There's no shortage on bigotry by some people who participate in these forums. Yes, even religious bigotry counts for those keeping score. "Science" does not protect you from being a bigot.

[lpkmckenna]

Thinking religion is stupid isn't bigotry. "Turn or burn," that's bigotry.

Some atheists are more diplomatic towards religion, while some are less diplomatic. Non-diplomatic != bigotry. Get a clue, stup.

[BRussell]

It's also a well-known finding that religious people are happier than non-religious people. I wonder if that's bigotry and claptrap too. :shrugs:

[OreoCookie]

Originally Posted by OldManMac 

I think the use of the word "stupid" is a little harsh, and shows a basic lack of security from its users (and I'm guilty of that at times as well) …

Are you familiar with The Register?
It's a British information technology `gossip' site (one of the best on the net, actually) with a very peculiar style: they lace all of their articles with a boot load of sarcasm. And the title was just a typical example.

Among the headlines of the site today were gems like `Yahoo! Messenger! Trojan! false alarm!' and `BBC deploys the Tw*t-O-Tron -- Unholy turdspurt feedback loop.' (And yes, I'm sure that they have the best computer industry/IT news )

[stupendousman]

Originally Posted by lpkmckenna 

Thinking religion is stupid isn't bigotry. "Turn or burn," that's bigotry.

This thread shows a disdain (by some) for PEOPLE who have religious beliefs. THEY are being called stupid due to their faith. It's not really much different than if someone stated that they thought black people were stupid. You can try and defend that sort of bigotry with data as well. There's a difference between not agreeing with someone's beliefs and disrespecting them because you disagree or don't understand them.

That's bigotry. Sorry.

[BRussell]

Originally Posted by stupendousman 

It's not really much different than if someone stated that they thought black people were stupid.

Is being black a belief system?

[Lava Lamp Freak]

I first saw the article on the Telegraph.

Intelligent people 'less likely to believe in God' - Telegraph

I don't like saying that someone is stupid if they believe in religion, but you have to admit, if someone believes in a talking snake, there is something very different going on inside their brain.

[lpkmckenna]

Originally Posted by stupendousman 

This thread shows a disdain (by some) for PEOPLE who have religious beliefs.

Disdain != Bigotry. I have disdain for patently irrational beliefs and their advocates, but not all believers. I was just reading Gary Will's book "What Paul Meant" yesterday, and I think he's just swell. For the most part, it's only "turn or burn" preachers who receive disdain from me, along with a few NREs like Scientology or neoPaganism.