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Cody Dawg · Apr 1, 2006, 11:05 AM

Seriously, which one do you buy?

I have to get one.

I had a Flybook sent to me and it's too small and heavy. (Here is David Pogue's review of the Flybook where he compares it to Apple-inspired design in case you're interested.)

Now I need something else.

What is out there that's great? Thinkpad? What?

vmarks · Apr 1, 2006, 11:17 AM

At 2.5 lbs I don't know that you'll find things bigger in size, yet lighter.

Still, a Thinkpad has always been a quality machine, better than Dell, Acer, or Sony (except in the cases where IBM is simply reselling an Acer as its own.) The T series Thinkpads are solid machines, without being the heavy desktop replacements that the G series is. The R series is entry model, the X series is lighter tablet style.

Of course, if you don't mind a little work in setup, it's entirely technically possible to get a MacBook Pro and run Windows on it, dual-boot.

The Flybook is intriguing- I wasn't aware anyone was still using Transmeta's Crusoe processor. I admit that if it were a Pentium M based machine I would be tempted to run a hacked OSX x86 on it.

boots · Apr 1, 2006, 11:18 AM

I'm a fan of the sony vio. I've never owned one, mind you, but of all my colleagues who use PCs, it's the ones with the vios that seem to have the fewest problems and who have sharp looking notebooks.

thinkpads are pretty solid, but don't have the cool factor that the sony notebooks do.

Cody Dawg · Apr 1, 2006, 11:20 AM

Wow, VMarks!

You really know you're stuff - thank you much!

What I really need is this: Parallel port or LPT1.

I'm working on a project that requires a security dongle/hasp attached to parallel in order to keep the work confidential.

The Flybook doesn't have that.

What does? Anyone? I need a good laptop with LPT1. Does that Thinkpad have one?

Thanks!

vmarks · Apr 1, 2006, 11:28 AM

Oh dear. You're in trouble. I think some models of Thinkpad still have parallel on it, but most laptops are going all USB, no parallel at all.

I have an athlon 1.2ghz HP that is perfect except for a battery that won't hold a charge at all. It has parallel, and I'm not particularly attached to it. PM me if you want to talk about using it/renting it/buying it. As I say, I'm not particularly attached to it.

If it was just for a printer, I would suggest a USB->Parallel cable, but I don't think that would be reliable for a HASP/dongle- too many drivers to expect it to go through.

Cody Dawg · Apr 1, 2006, 11:30 AM

Yes, you're exactly correct. Adapters muddle it up.

I'm wondering if a Thinkpad can be ordered with an LPT1?

What I don't understand is why they didn't go to a USB dongle by now -

vmarks · Apr 1, 2006, 11:31 AM

Well, I looked into it.

The Thinkpad T43 DOES have parallel. The EPP site I PM'd you has it for 1300ish.

Port connectors 2 USB 2.0, AC adapter, Docking/Port Replicator, External Display, External microphone, Headphone / Line out, Infrared, Parallel, RJ-11, RJ-45, S-Video out

Cody Dawg · Apr 1, 2006, 11:31 AM

P.S., VMarks, you are one really class act person. That PM made my day.

If you ever get to Florida you've got a great dinner anywhere you want on me, okay?

Cody Dawg · Apr 1, 2006, 11:53 AM

That T43p Thinkpad is really nice. I like the bigger screen.

Pretty nice!

Noticed that Florida folks can't have an extended warranty though...just as with Apple.

(Though, for Apple products, if you're a business you can for some reason.)

Maflynn · Apr 1, 2006, 11:58 AM

I have a HP laptop from work. Its a tad bigger then my PB but overall it seems nicely built and speedy enough (for a windows machine). Before that I had a Compaq and to be honest that served me for years without any problems.

I've used Dells and I've been pleased with their size, weight and build quality also.

What ever you choose make sure the size and weight is comfortable, then there's the battery life and of course the display resolution. Just because many laptops use 15" displays doesn't mean they use the same resolution. My 40 year old eyes need more help so higher resolution crammed in on a 15" display does me no good

vmarks · Apr 1, 2006, 01:28 PM

Maflynn,

A word on compaq and dell.

Pre-HP buyout, Compaq was horrible. I knew the guys at the service depot because I was there every other week with machines going in as I was coming to pick others up.

Dell Inspiron 5150 and 2200 both have burned me as well- the 5150 power port that rips off the motherboard, the chip on the motherboard whose legs break and so the laptop spontaneously powers off when the case twists mildly on your lap (and it does flex). Dell refused to acknowledge the problem even though there are thousands of 5150 owners with this experience.

And there's the 2200 that boots with the BIOS warning that it can't detect the optical drive installed in the modular bay (even though it's not a modular bay, thanks Dell for updating the BIOS) so there's no DVD-RW burning since it can't use the drive. And it too has been in and serviced for this problem more than once.

Stick with IBM or Sony.

Cody Dawg · Apr 1, 2006, 01:46 PM

My husband has the POS Dell Inspiron 5160. It actually caught on fire. They replaced it. That thing is a huge brick - he doesn't even take it anyplace anymore.

I tease him about it and tell him that his Dell notebook "Desktop replacement" means just that: Put four legs under each corner of his Dell notebook and you've got a desk.

Maflynn · Apr 1, 2006, 02:15 PM

Originally Posted by vmarks

Maflynn,

A word on compaq and dell.

Pre-HP buyout, Compaq was horrible. I knew the guys at the service depot because I was there every other week with machines going in as I was coming to pick others up..

My company had pre hp compaqs and they were great. We had tons of problems with the ibm thinkpads, so much they after a few months into the contract they dropped ibm and went back to compaq.

I've had this HP now since december and its seems solid and handles everything I throw at it. I'm happy with it. As for the Dells, I don't have first hand knowledge just from what I read, so I'll defer to those who've actually used thm

Mike

starman · Apr 1, 2006, 02:31 PM

I'm on my second Dell laptop (Inspiron 9100) and it's got more inside it than any machine you can find. Its only problem is the case itself - it feels a bit "plasticy". Not Apple-like at all. However, for the money, I don't think you can cram more features into a laptop.

And no, it's never caught on fire.

wallinbl · Apr 1, 2006, 04:30 PM

I have an HP NX7000 and it's great. I'm not very nice to it and it runs like a champ. My company has a ton of HP laptops and don't have any problems. Buy from the business line of whatever company you choose - they are better. My dad used to have a Thinkpad, and it was full of problems. I've seen Dell go both ways (Inspiron sucks, Latitude is good). I have never known a single good Sony laptop.

My point here is that this is all anecdotal. There are people that have good and bad experiences with all of them. You're going to get a good one or a bad one whoever you buy from. I suppose the difference between brands really only affects the odds of getting a good one.

Y3a · Apr 1, 2006, 04:36 PM

thinkpads are excellent. No way to find out BIOS passwords if you forget them though!!! Boss spent $735 for them to replace boards and such on his! LOL

shrugs* · Apr 1, 2006, 05:23 PM

Thinkpads are the only Winbased laptops I'll ever buy...

Previously had a few Dells (Inspiron 6000, Inspiron 1300, Latitude D800), and a few unmentionables (bargain bin $1000 Compaqs and Toshibas).

Look at any IT or Tech based company and the vast majority use Thinkpads.. proven ruggedness.

I use an X40 at the office and a T42 at home... drop tested on a nearl weekly basis (hah)

macroy · Apr 1, 2006, 05:28 PM

I have a T40 - and there's a parallel port. Not sure about the newer ones... Mine's from work, so I won't get a new one for anothr 6 months (they recycle them every two years).

For home use (if you deduct it as business, I'd go Thinkpad), I got the wife an Inspiron 6000 series. Its not light, but she doesn't go anywhere with it. I like the wide screen, and its cheap ($650 when on sale).. forgot the CPU speed... but it was enough for her. DVD/CDR, widescreen....

Just need to wipe it and load your own stuff as Dell pretty much comes with all kinda of crap.

scaught · Apr 1, 2006, 06:32 PM

ya. i have a work thinkpad R50. sturdy. built in wireless. blabla. not terribly svelte, and it looks like a thinkpad.

the only issues i have with it is the screen res (1024x768). other than that its been solid.

theyre all made by lenovo now, and i dont know if the quality has gone down since that transfer or not.

version · Apr 1, 2006, 06:52 PM

My brother has this DELL thing that looks like a spaceship - green lights on every side, looks crap but is fast.

jasonsRX7 · Apr 1, 2006, 08:56 PM

I've ordered a Thinkpad T60 for myself at work. I've owned several Thinkpad laptops in the past and currently have an Aluminum Powerbook. I like my Powerbook but I may not get another one until they're available with something other than a metal case. This thing is just too fragile and gets too hot.

The T60 I ordered has a 1.8ghz Core Duo, 80gb drive, 512mb ram, Radeon X1300, 14.1" screen at 1400x1050, Bluetooth, 802.11a/b/g, DVDRW and it was around $1880 after tax.

Tomchu · Apr 1, 2006, 09:40 PM

I just recently bought an Averatec 3700 series notebook for my girlfriend. It's solid, smaller and lighter than my 12" iBook G4, has a great screen (looks almost twice as bright as my iBook), and has great specs to boot (60 GB drive, WiFi, 1.8 GHz Sempron, 512 MB DDR, CD-RW/DVD-ROM, 3 USB 2.0, Firewire, etc.). Oh, and it only costs $850 CAD.

I was/am pretty pleased with it.

vmarks · Apr 1, 2006, 09:48 PM

But does it have parallel?

alligator · Apr 1, 2006, 10:20 PM

Wow, I was really drooling when you got the flybook. That's exactly what I'm looking for, but I can't afford the price. So I'm stuck using a Dell Latitude 410 from work (which is nice enough, but not small enough for my home needs). This one may have the parallel port you're looking for.

ghporter · Apr 2, 2006, 12:51 AM

I haul my Dell Inspiron 8200 to school every day of the week; it's a bit heavy, but it is solid and reliable. That's because it's supposed to be a desktop replacement, and the extra mass actually makes it more rugged. ALL small/thin laptops suffer from a lack of sturdiness, some more than others. It's hard to beat an iBook for solidness (and the right amount of flex), but iBooks certainly don't have parallel ports.

The Inspiron 5XXX laptops were uniformly flimsy. All of 'em. They are not a reflection of ALL Dell laptops.

On the other hand, their Latitude product lines have always been very solid and reliable-they're the corporate line so they have to be able to handle the kind of abuse travelers give them. The Latitude X1 fits everything you're asking for except for having a parallel port... Have you considered using a USB-Parallel converter for whatever laptop you choose?

Paco500 · Apr 2, 2006, 01:30 AM

This doesn't really answer your question (the parallel port part) but I'm inclined to like ThinkPads and Toshibas for PC laptops, although there are some HPs I've seen recently that I like quite a bit. I'm actually a bit surprised no one has mentioned Toshibas yet. Although they have lost some of their shine in the last few years, they used to go neck in neck with IBM as the benchmark of laptops. In the US, that's all they sell and they do a pretty good business.

But if I had to use a Windows laptop (which in reality I do at work, a Dell Latitude D600, which is a poorly made, flimsy, heavy, steaming pile of poo- I really don't care for Dell stuff outside of their server lines, but I didn't get to choose it, so whatever) I would pick a TabletPC, probably the Toshiba M400, small, relatively light, and I could draw on the screen, which is cool. The older version, the M200 I think, had a better video card and resolution, but this looks pretty groovy.

CharlesS · Apr 2, 2006, 01:35 AM

The thing I wonder is, are the ThinkPads nowadays the same quality that they used to be, now that they're made by Lenovo instead of IBM?

mindwaves · Apr 2, 2006, 01:46 AM

Originally Posted by CharlesS

The thing I wonder is, are the ThinkPads nowadays the same quality that they used to be, now that they're made by Lenovo instead of IBM?

Arstechnica says yes

fibroptikl · Apr 2, 2006, 04:25 AM

IBM ThinkPad T60

Cody Dawg · Apr 2, 2006, 11:22 AM

Are there any retail stores that sell Thinkpad?

I ran into some Googled comments about how people bought them and they took forever to arrive - after ordering them.

???

I really want a Thinkpad, but I'm learning towards a Sony Vaio notebook.

The reason is that Sony corporate is located in Fort Myers Florida and whenever I have any problem with my Sony product I don't call the 800-number that goes to India, I call Fort Myers directly and they always take care of us. That's a huge positive.

So, it boils down to the Thinkpad versus the Sony. Now I need to find one with a parallel port...which is doubtful.

shrugs* · Apr 2, 2006, 11:57 AM

My older t42 has a parrallel ports

Would a usb>parrallel port adapter be a viable solution?

Cody Dawg · Apr 2, 2006, 12:06 PM

No. Won't work. Thanks tho.

vmarks · Apr 2, 2006, 05:02 PM

The Thinkpad takes forever if it doesn't say availability one week, and if you custom it up when you're ordering. order just as is and it should be more prompt.

Best Buy and compusa both sell Vaio.

ghporter · Apr 2, 2006, 05:53 PM

Vaios are expensive for what you get. Unless you need really top end everything, a Vaio is too pricey. Thinkpad is a better choice for ruggedness too (and better than HP, for that as well). If it HAS to be an actual parallel printer port, you're probably going to have to get a larger and heavier laptop than you'd like; the printer port is physically large, and adds weight, so the small/light laptop makers tend to dump it first, or at least right after a modular optical drive bay.

The Godfather · Apr 2, 2006, 07:12 PM

Cody,

Is your company trying to sell the Flybook for a good price markdown?

Velocity211 · Apr 2, 2006, 08:19 PM

HP DV5000, IBM Thinkpad Z60t, Alienware Aurora

turtle777 · Apr 3, 2006, 12:08 AM

Originally Posted by Cody Dawg

Seriously, which one do you buy?

Seriously, is it that time of the week again ?
Or did I miss the other thread asking about PC vs. Apple notebooks...

-t

jasonsRX7 · Apr 3, 2006, 12:32 AM

Originally Posted by what_the_heck

Seriously, is it that time of the week again ?
Or did I miss the other thread asking about PC vs. Apple notebooks...

-t

This thread is about picking a PC laptop, not about PC vs. Apple notebooks. Maybe that's what you missed.

turtle777 · Apr 3, 2006, 12:36 AM

Originally Posted by jasonsRX7

This thread is about picking a PC laptop, not about PC vs. Apple notebooks. Maybe that's what you missed.

No, I didn't miss it. I'm just surprised to have the same discussion AGAIN. And again. And again, again. There were dozens of this kind of thread.

-t

jasonsRX7 · Apr 3, 2006, 12:45 AM

Originally Posted by what_the_heck

No, I didn't miss it. I'm just surprised to have the same discussion AGAIN. And again. And again, again. There were dozens of this kind of thread.

-t

Oh well, I guess since new products are released on such a frequent basis, it justifies asking again from time to time.

turtle777 · Apr 3, 2006, 12:46 AM

Originally Posted by jasonsRX7

Oh well, I guess since new products are released on such a frequent basis, it justifies asking again from time to time.

Fair enough. But in the Lounge ?

-t

boots · Apr 3, 2006, 07:17 AM

Originally Posted by what_the_heck

No, I didn't miss it. I'm just surprised to have the same discussion AGAIN. And again. And again, again. There were dozens of this kind of thread.

-t

She needed something specific. That makes it a little different. I certainly wouldn't dig through all the other crap to get a specific answer about a particular interface I need.

goMac · Apr 3, 2006, 12:21 PM

A Macbook Pro.

Duh.

Love Calm Quiet · Apr 19, 2006, 12:34 PM

Yes, goMac, the answer to "If You HAVE to Use a PC Notebook..." ...

is... "You Don't !"

Unfortunately a MacBook Pro is beyond this year's budget.

Anyone want to warn me of the disasters awaiting me since I got a $500 Dell clearance on:

Inspiron 1300, Intel Celeron M370 (1.50GHz/1MB Cache/400MHz FSB) XP-Home

I don't actually expect to "laptop" it to anywhere... just to check my web pages on Exploder... and start learning how to advise my web clients on how to recover from viruses.

I already know from elsewhere that with 2.3 minutes of hooking it up on my AirPort/DSL network it will begin collecting viruses, etc...

Any other warnings? condolences?

SpaceMonkey · Apr 19, 2006, 01:29 PM

Originally Posted by Love Calm Quiet

I already know from elsewhere that with 2.3 minutes of hooking it up on my AirPort/DSL network it will begin collecting viruses, etc...

Any other warnings? condolences?

You shouldn't have to worry about viruses if you take some reasonable precautions when you initially set up the machine. There was recently a thread about "securing" Windows that had some good tips in it--a search should turn it up quickly. The only tip that I remember offhand was to download the Windows Firefox installer on your Mac first, burn it to disc, and then install it on the Windows machine before you connect to the internet, so you'll never have to touch Internet Explorer at all.

Love Calm Quiet · Apr 19, 2006, 01:36 PM

I'm with it, SpaceMonkey.

Not using IE, however, will make it harder to test how web pages display in IE

(unfortunately, I need to see how they download from the WEB... where the most recent db info inserted by users resides.)

olePigeon · Apr 19, 2006, 02:01 PM

I would recommend a ThinkPad, but Lenovo doesn't offer education discounts to students in grade school.

turtle777 · Apr 19, 2006, 02:02 PM

Originally Posted by olePigeon

but Lenovo doesn't offer education discounts to students in grade school.

Those greedy bastards. Apple would NEVAR do that

-t

olePigeon · Apr 19, 2006, 02:05 PM

I would recommend an OQO, but OQO doesn't offer education discounts to students in grade school.

SpaceMonkey · Apr 19, 2006, 02:09 PM

Originally Posted by olePigeon

I would recommend a ThinkPad, but Lenovo doesn't offer education discounts to students in grade school.

And when I sent them a friendly-worded (handwritten!) letter offering them a suggestion for such discounts, I got a letter back from their legal department telling me that I now owe THEM money, and that I was on "the list" until I paid up. It was written in blood.