[sordid]

I reckon Steve Jobs must have some ego thing going with that fugly NeXT spinning disk icon.. I mean Apple have come so far with the look of aqua to leave behind that fugly looking thing, multi coloured etc.. its so un aquaish! I know its a small thing.. but its the small things that count! ;p

(I guess he also kept the project builder icons etc too.. but least they look nice)

Come on Steve.. NO FUGLY LOOKING SPINNING BEACH BALL ON MAC OSX.. NO FUGLY LOOKING SPINNING BEACH BALL ON MAC OSX!!!

[Millennium]

Um... OK... but what would you replace it with?

[Agent69]

I like it. Now if I could only get the rest of the NeXTStep interface back, I would have a great computer.


Agent69

[Brad Nelson]

I don't mind the color of the wheel, or the reminder that we're really working on a next-generation NeXT workstation, not a Macintosh, but could that spinning cursor of death provide a little more feedback? I mean, I imagine that the intent of the cursor is to let you know that your machine and/or program hasn't died, it's just busy. But often enough the ever-spinning cursor of death is the first feedback you get that your app has indeed died. So now when I see the cursor I think "uh oh." Would it be possible to animate something inside the cursor (like a number counting up from 1) to indicate that you are waiting and are not just dead?

No Brad, the OS can't do that. It's the Job of the app to provide feedback about it's progress. Ether by a spinning whell (OK), chasing arrows (better), or a progress bar (best).
The only thing the OS can know is that an app has stopped responding to it (i. e. doesn't ask for events any more). This can be a) due to lazy programming (no multi-threading) b) the app is really really busy (i. e. the main thread asking for events doesn't get any time any more) or c) well, it's dying (i. e. visits Apple at Infinite Loop


MagiX

[Brad Nelson]

MagiX, thanks for the great explanation. I guess there's a big difference between what should be done and what can be done. Upon first using OS X it was my naive assumption that the Unix underpinnings would be able to do things like pop up the force quit window automatically when the OS detected a misbehaving or dead app. Still, it's lucky that in real life there isn't a spinning beach ball on my forehead when I haven't got a clue. That could be embarrasing.

[RWoelk]

Question: Can one kill it with some key combo if one doesn't wish to wait for it to finish spinning?

[Agent69]

When I get the spinner I can often get it to go away by switching to another open application. If I want to kill the offending application at that point, I switch to the Finder and go from there.


Agent69

[crazyjohnson]

I'm with you Agent. There is a NeXT theme coming soon. . . I actually do like the spinning disc.

Originally posted by Agent69:
I like it. Now if I could only get the rest of the NeXTStep interface back, I would have a great computer.

[bitfly]

Originally posted by sordid:
O FUGLY LOOKING SPINNING BEACH BALL ON MAC OSX.. NO FUGLY LOOKING SPINNING BEACH BALL ON MAC OSX!!!

It is not a Beach Ball, it is a CD. Either way it sucks though.

Originally posted by Agent69:
I like it. Now if I could only get the rest of the NeXTStep interface back, I would have a great computer.

It's ugly, it must die. If I used X more that'd be the first thing I hacked out of it.

In addition to ugliness though, it also doesn't provide enough information. In Windows (ack) you have two busy cursors - the main hourglass which tells you the machine is busy and you need to wait for it and the arrow+hourglass which means that the app you're working with is busy.

Just because something is NeXT doesn't mean it's good. I'd bash on some of the pointless NeXTisms but that'd just send the thread wildly off-topic.

[Angus_D]

It's not a CD, that would be totally pointless to have spinning all over the OS. It's a pinwheel I think, and I've termed the incessant spinning syndrome SPoD - Spinning Pinwheel of Death. OmniWeb has SPoDed me quite a lot recently...

[MikeM32]

whoa here's a thought, maybe just maybe they can speed up OSX enough where we don't see this spinning wheel.

Oops that'd be asking for too much

Personally I don't care if it's the Fetch Dog running in place as long as I'm aware that my computer is "thinking" (so to speak). I mean imagine all the annoyed people trying to open up something because there was nothing letting them know that their comp[uter is busy processing a request?

Mike

[mumble]

Originally posted by bitfly:
It is not a Beach Ball, it is a CD. Either way it sucks though.

Erm, aren't CDs silver?

Originally posted by jethro:
It's ugly, it must die. If I used X more that'd be the first thing I hacked out of it.

Betcha it wouldn't You'd have to find it first.

In addition to ugliness though, it also doesn't provide enough information. In Windows (ack) you have two busy cursors - the main hourglass which tells you the machine is busy and you need to wait for it and the arrow+hourglass which means that the app you're working with is busy.

I've never known OS X to need a cursor to tell you that the machine is busy.

Originally posted by MikeM32:
whoa here's a thought, maybe just maybe they can speed up OSX enough where we don't see this spinning wheel.

Oops that'd be asking for too much

Crap, the spinning-beach-ball-of-death appears when an application has not responded to events for two seconds. Please explain which part of the OS is slowing down your applications by two seconds?

[MikeM32]

Two seconds?!? LOL What are you running a 5 Ghz G 12?!?

Mike

------------------

[gorgonzola]

CD's aren't silver at Apple.

It's really not Aqua-esque at all. If you're going NeXT, okay, but at least be consistent...

------------------
the oddball newsletter
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it's only after you lose everything that you're free to do anything

[MacmanX]

I agree with those who think the "Spinning whatever of death" is rotten. I am a generally patient person; however, something about that rainbow swirl sends my body into twitches of agony. If Apple is taking suggestions, I vote for the old watch with spinning hands. Now there was a busy signal I could really dig. In fact, that is one of my earliest Mac memories, and over the years, that little watch has come to embody everything Mac to me. So I say, "Bring ticky back!" Cheers,
MacmanX
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10:00 conoc� a Apple. 10:30 trabaj� con Apple. Apple Computer�

[This message has been edited by MacmanX (edited 04-21-2001).]

[osiris]

I wish it at least looked like a real beach ball - or maybe a washing machine with a clown stuck inside, helplessly spinning with a frown.

[gorgonzola]

I don't know ... I think a spinning blue whirlpool would be kind of nice if it was done right ... fits into the Aqua theme.

------------------
the oddball newsletter
------------------
it's only after you lose everything that you're free to do anything

[matvon]

NeXT workstations had magneto-optical drives. The media in these drives, if memory serves me correctly, sort of looked looked like a CD but had a rainbow shimmer to it. I think the "beachball" is actually a MO disk spinning round and round.

[Angus_D]

I'm just wondering where on earth the actual image is... I'm guessing the kernel because it appears for the first time just after it's loaded, and it's also in Darwin.... Perhaps it's in the windowserver too somewhere?

[Boondoggle]

I think the perfect busy cursor would be a dripping faucet. Complete with an annoying soundtrack.

OSX: Featuring Sherlock 2 and Chinese water torture!!!

[rhino_g3]

It's not a CD, that would be totally pointless to have spinning all over the OS. It's a pinwheel I think, and I've termed the incessant spinning syndrome SPoD - Spinning Pinwheel of Death. OmniWeb has SPoDed me quite a lot recently...

Angus_D, I have noticed the same thing when using OmniWeb.

That spinning thing also annoys the hell out of me.

rhino_g3

Originally posted by Boondoggle:
I think the perfect busy cursor would be a dripping faucet. Complete with an annoying soundtrack.

OSX: Featuring Sherlock 2 and Chinese water torture!!!

hahahahhahahahahahah

You just made me pee my pants.

Thanks a lot!

I loved that little watch! BRING BACK THE LITTLE ANALOG WONDER WATCH! Just colorize it and bring it into the new centry by making the hour hand move too!

[Brad Nelson]

<<I don't know ... I think a spinning blue whirlpool would be kind of nice if it was done right ... fits into the Aqua theme.>>

Gorgonzola, that's actually not a bad idea. To take the idea further (too far?), the "just busy" whirlpool could be like a blue-spinning-thingy spiral galaxy. For the "app is dead" whirlpool you'd have the watery spiral of a toilet flush swirl inside a white porcelain border.

[nealconner]

Could someone post a screenshot of it so that I know what you all are talking about.

------------------
We've secretly replaced the Pacific Ocean with Folgers crystals...

the spinning-curser is at system/library/frameworks/appkit.framework/versions/c/resources/

in the file

NSSharedFullColorAlpha.tiff

also check out

NSSharedMacColorAlpha.tiff
and
NSSharedGray.tiff

[Spirit_VW]

One thing:

A) It is a spinning CD (yeah, in NeXT, maybe one of those drives, but in OS X it represents a CD). It is not a beach ball, or anything else people have been calling it other than a CD. It's a spinning CD. Turn a CD over with light shining on it...it gets all rainbow-y. In the years and years people have been using CDs, am I the first to notice this? Think: if it was a beach ball, the colors would be moving. On the actual icon, the colors stay in the same spot and the object turns, like a CD.

As for its ugliness, I really don't think it's ugly. I don't understand why some of you hate the way it looks so much - it's a heckuva lot nice looking than the old black and white spinning icon.

------------------
Kevin Buchanan
The Spirit of Volkswagen
The Retro New Beetle Headquarters
Webmaster, Fort Worth VolksFolks Club

Originally posted by aholckp:
the spinning-curser is at system/library/frameworks/appkit.framework/versions/c/resources/

in the file

NSSharedFullColorAlpha.tiff

Nice work .

I suppose they just cycle the colors to get the "spinning" effect, which makes it impossible to do something with real animation unlike if they'd used a traditional Mac cursor.

As to why we think it's ugly or sucks or whatever - just look at it compared to the rest of the operating system. For something that shows up as much as it does you'd think they would have given more effort to have something that looked like it belonged.

Maybe it's just a case where they wanted to make the remaining 13 NeXT users feel more at home after they finally switched over to Macs.

Originally posted by jethro:
Nice work .

Dang, forgot I'm not registered here.

Unfortunately this didn't work for me, and here I spent all that time Aquafying it and everything. Thanks for the effort though.

[moggy]

I think that spinning color wheel was the first thing I was disappointed with in X. And that disappointment started with the installer. Luckily the OS is supa nice, despite the sluggishness.

Isn't Job's an in-the closet homosexual? I think that spinning color wheel is just his little way of spreading some looove.

Maybe I'm wrong.

I thought the spinngin CD cursor was supposed to replace the black and white circular busy cursor with :

[dogzilla]

Originally posted by Spirit_VW:
A) It is a spinning CD (yeah, in NeXT, maybe one of those drives, but in OS X it represents a CD). It is not a beach ball, or anything else people have been calling it other than a CD. It's a spinning CD. Turn a CD over with light shining on it...it gets all rainbow-y. In the years and years people have been using CDs, am I the first to notice this? Think: if it was a beach ball, the colors would be moving. On the actual icon, the colors stay in the same spot and the object turns, like a CD.

Wait - didn't we all have this conversation a few months ago. I think someone said ti was a spinning registration mark of some kind. Sorta like a 4-color reg mark...but different.

[davesimondotcom]

Originally posted by Angus_D:
I'm just wondering where on earth the actual image is... I'm guessing the kernel because it appears for the first time just after it's loaded, and it's also in Darwin.... Perhaps it's in the windowserver too somewhere?

Perhaps the Apple guys can't even find it and that's why it's still there. Avie and Steve are keeping it's location a secret.



------------------
Dave Simon
----------
Windows are easily broken.

[foobars]

Originally posted by davesimondotcom:
Perhaps the Apple guys can't even find it and that's why it's still there. Avie and Steve are keeping it's location a secret.

Well if it's in Darwin then the Apple guys clearly know where it is. Perhaps it's in the windowserer, or maybe it's even lower. Either way it was used on purpose.

Personally I don't see what the big deal is, it looks fine to me.

-------------

[theoden]

I'd like to see a mini-fied version of the water drop animation.
You know, in the setup assistant when it's configuring and connecting you to the internet, the water drop jumping back in forth.

Oh, yeah, it probally wouldn't be as sweet at 16 x 16 pixels, but it's still neat

[Smircle]

Originally posted by moggy:
Isn't Job's an in-the closet homosexual? [..]

Maybe I'm wrong.

Maybe you are just an intolerant asshole.

[booboo]

Originally posted by Smircle:
Maybe you are just an intolerant asshole.

Was the irony intentional?

[SnowmanX]

Wow. This is without doubt a "The glass is half full" thread. The spinning CD (what else can it be?) cursor is just that -- a curse, a curse of at least two possible causes: overtaxed CPU and/or f*cked up/erratic threading in the respective application(s).

Oh, well, at least the window manager will now (unlike in public beta) still allow for moving of windows around while the spinning CD cursor mocks us.

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You can ask me anything. Just don't question me.

[Boondoggle]

Hey Booboo,

"quote:


Originally posted by Smircle:
Maybe you are just an intolerant asshole.




Was the irony intentional?"


Now THAT is goddam funny....

[sordid]

I dont know about most of you ... but I had a look at the processes that are going on when I have The Gimp 1.2.1 running and itunes and internet explorer in the background.. now have a look at those interesting figures on how many resources programs like the gimp use verses an aqua program... im getting the impression that the more ram the better? 128 meg just isnt sufficient.. this is probably why i see that damned fugly disk or whatever it is so much.



my 2 cents

[michaelb]

Sordid:

John Siracusa over on Ars Technica gives a pretty good rundown on RAM usage in Mac OS X.

http://www.arstechnica.com/reviews/0...macos-x-4.html


And, yes, 128 MB is plainly inadequate for anything of substance under Mac OS X. The good news is that RAM is cheap as chips these days. You could do worse than visit these guys to beef up your Mac:
http://eshop.macsales.com/Catalog_Di...mory&Template=

[sordid]

Michael: you know what i'd find interesting is a review of the same system with different amounts of ram running osx and the time that it takes to load and switch between apps?

[Cipher13]

Yeah, OSX is utterly useless crap with 128 megs on ANY computer.
It sits there thrashing and spinning the damn rainbow disc.

Unfortunately, RAM is very damn expensive over here, so thats not much of an option


------------------

[geekstud]

Originally posted by jethro:
Nice work .

Maybe it's just a case where they wanted to make the remaining 13 NeXT users feel more at home after they finally switched over to Macs.

You're all NeXT users now ;-)