[macmend]

like you are 2/3/4 computers in a a small office Home Office environment, cable modem or adsl, ever get hacked, invaded, bombed, whatever, like do we really need this personal firewall stuff.

See the reason I ask this an the other virus question, is are we being encourgaed to live in fear of each other? And so payout for PFs.

macmend

[passmaster16]

I've never personally been hacked although my friends tell me that their logs are always filled with attempts to hack their systems. My friend down the street had some issues as he didn't have any type of firewall on his little network. He is on a cable connection as well as me. He noticed strange things happening to his machines. Once he installed personal firewall software, he noticed the amount of attempts being made. I rely soley on my router which some may say is foolish. My feeling is most of these people are mainly wannabe hackers that use port scanners to cause trouble. If a real hacker wants in your machine, chances are, he/she will find a way. Also, I do think Windows machines are more susceptible to break ins. So I would say to you that you should use some sort of firewall if you are on a broadband connection. Some get even more complex and use both hardware and software. The threat does exist though and it probably should be acknowledged.

[Mactoid]

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think it's foolish at all to rely on your router.

The router acts as a hardware firewall. If you don't explicitly tell the router to send a particular port to your computer than the packet will get dropped.

Of course, this doesn't really protect you from trojans (programs on your computer unknowingly communication with the outside world), but trojans are little more than a theoretical problem currently under the Mac OS.

[NeXTLoop]

I run two Macs off of a Cable modem. Although I've never been hacked till now, like others, my log files are always filled with attempts.

[iRei]

Originally posted by Mactoid:
Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think it's foolish at all to rely on your router.

The router acts as a hardware firewall. If you don't explicitly tell the router to send a particular port to your computer than the packet will get dropped.

Of course, this doesn't really protect you from trojans (programs on your computer unknowingly communication with the outside world), but trojans are little more than a theoretical problem currently under the Mac OS.

Depends on the route. If its a plain, unconfigured router it offers no protection. Most "cable modem routers" do have NAT and a firewall and will offer decent protection right out of the box.

[iRei]

Originally posted by macmend:
like you are 2/3/4 computers in a a small office Home Office environment, cable modem or adsl, ever get hacked, invaded, bombed, whatever, like do we really need this personal firewall stuff.

I probably would have agreed with you that the threat was low in OS 9. Unfortunately OS X brings all the security concerns and hole from the free software it is built from. Yes, Apple has been good about fixing these problems, but we still belong to that big world of UNIX and its becoming a larger taget for hacker every day. (Yes most of this additional risk can be avoided by not enabling services you don't need).

See the reason I ask this an the other virus question, is are we being encourgaed to live in fear of each other? And so payout for PFs.

I did tech support in collage dorms for two years. I fixed enough computers that were hacked into (not including email virus type stuff). In my experience, if you have broadband accessyou are extremely likely to be scanned and possibly attacked.

I would rather not have my computer seen period. But you can probably get away with a properly configured sw firewall just fine. And best of all, Apple included a software fireall in OS X. The only extra cost is the time to configure it.

[passmaster16]

Originally posted by iRei:


Depends on the route. If its a plain, unconfigured router it offers no protection. Most "cable modem routers" do have NAT and a firewall and will offer decent protection right out of the box.

Right, this is why I said some may think it would be a liability just using a cable modem router. Since, in exact terms, a cable modem router isn't a *real* firewall per se. Obviously the NAT is fairly effective which is why I don't mind just using it. Because as I said before, if a true hacker wants in my machine, I'm sure it wouldn't be difficult to eventually gain access. For 99% of us, the NAT found in a cable modem router should do just fine. The only time you have to be careful is as the other poster said, trojans sending packets out allowing access to certain ports.

[Gee4orce]

Hackers run automated tools to scan ranges of IP addresses (run from other machines they've hacked). If you are connected to the internet, you will be scanned sooner or later. Obviously, if like me you connect via a modem then a hacker isn't going to have much spare bandwidth and might loose patience, plus you're more likely to drop the connection at any time.

For an example of how soon 'sooner' means - I heard of someone connecting a honeypot system (ie. a machine left as a desirable target for hackers, and monitored) to the internet which was root kitted with 15 minutes.

I don't want to scare anybody, but if you've got broadband you need some kind of firewall.

[ratlater]

Originally posted by Gee4orce:
For an example of how soon 'sooner' means - I heard of someone connecting a honeypot system (ie. a machine left as a desirable target for hackers, and monitored) to the internet which was root kitted with 15 minutes.

I don't want to scare anybody, but if you've got broadband you need some kind of firewall.

This should be amended slightly. If you run Windows then you NEED a firewall. If you run a vanilla install of most linux distros you really should use one. If you run a vanilla install of OS X then you are fine.

You'll need a firewall in X if you start turning on services, but a default install of OS X is very secure because all the fun networking stuff is turned off. I work at my school's NOC and talking with the security staff about Windows machines is scary. I wouldn't feel secure unless the network cable was cut in half, and even then I'd be nervous. There is some scary stuff out there. Fortunately most hackers don't worry about Macs...at least yet.

-matt

[SMacTech]

Originally posted by NeXTLoop:
I run two Macs off of a Cable modem. Although I've never been hacked till now, like others, my log files are always filled with attempts.

What logs are you referring too? Are these OSX logs or your software firewall logs?