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Snow Leopard - A 1000 improvements! (Page 3)
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Simon
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Aug 19, 2009, 01:48 PM
 
Originally Posted by P View Post
I really don't think that this can ever be considered a good change.
That's not up for debate. The standard is a done deal. As long as the standard isn't changed, that's what we should consider the reference.

If Apple had simply done the same thing of writing "MiB" and whatnot, then fine, but now we will have a setup where the computer will use "MB" to mean two different things in different places, depending on context - not to mention that there is this operating system with a 90% market share that uses them differently.
If Apple switches to MB and GB according to the international standard across all their software, we will be OK. At least in Apple world as we will be seeing stuff reported according to the valid standard which incidentally is also what's written on the box of stuff we buy (disks, flash sticks, media players, etc.). Why should Apple care if Windows doesn't want to be compliant with the standard? And why should Apple chose to comply with MS rather than with IEC?

Bottom line, should Apple adhere to the standard or should it violate the standard just to remain compatible to MS?

This way MB remains ambiguous forever
No, actually it doesn't. It's as clear as a MW or kg. MB is the abbreviation for mega which is 10^6 per SI. Hence a MB should have always been 10^6 bytes. Hardware manufacturers have already switched to this notation standard. Apple is following. I see nothing wrong with that. In fact, considering when the standard was ratified, it's surprising it took Apple so long.
( Last edited by Simon; Aug 19, 2009 at 02:02 PM. )
     
Simon
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Aug 19, 2009, 01:54 PM
 
Originally Posted by Chuckit View Post
Well, that's fine, because this is "K" rather than "k".
It is correct that per SI "kilo" is always abbreviated with "k". If you now want to get people to shorten KiB to KB, go ahead and try.

My guess is confusion between your KB (= KiB = 1,024 bytes) and kB (=kilobyte = 10^3 bytes) will be a tough nut to crack.
     
megasad
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Aug 19, 2009, 04:57 PM
 
Dang... I really wish I'd not brought this KiB vs KB thing up, it's completely derailed this thread. Does no-one have any other fun new Snow Leopard things? Could we somehow branch the KB vs KiB discussion into it's own thread?
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CharlesS
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Aug 19, 2009, 06:00 PM
 
I heard that Snow Leopard will ship with a real snow leopard, which will jump out and maul you as soon as you open the box.

Ticking sound coming from a .pkg package? Don't let the .bom go off! Inspect it first with Pacifist. Macworld - five mice!
     
P
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Aug 19, 2009, 06:28 PM
 
Originally Posted by Simon View Post
That's not up for debate. The standard is a done deal. As long as the standard isn't changed, that's what we should consider the reference.
Sure it is. Does the US plan to switch to SI units in general anytime soon? Standards only work if anyone bothers to follow them. Care to look up the percentage of say HTML standards that was never implemented, and eventually withdrawn?

Originally Posted by Simon View Post
If Apple switches to MB and GB according to the international standard across all their software, we will be OK. At least in Apple world as we will be seeing stuff reported according to the valid standard which incidentally is also what's written on the box of stuff we buy (disks, flash sticks, media players, etc.).
No, we won't be OK, because Apple can't control all software that runs on their machines. You will still see KB and MB when they mean the binary versions, and unless I'm mistaken, the RAM capacity is still reported as 2048 MB or whatever.


Originally Posted by Simon View Post
Why should Apple care if Windows doesn't want to be compliant with the standard? And why should Apple chose to comply with MS rather than with IEC?

Bottom line, should Apple adhere to the standard or should it violate the standard just to remain compatible to MS?
It should violate the standard because it's a bad standard. If Windows did switch, that would be a sign that the norm was indeed changing and that they should consider changing because of that, but MS will never change just because Apple does so.

Originally Posted by Simon View Post
Originally Posted by Patrik
This way MB remains ambiguous forever.
No, actually it doesn't. It's as clear as a MW or kg. MB is the abbreviation for mega which is 10^6 per SI. Hence a MB should have always been 10^6 bytes.
Sure it's ambiguous. If you a file size was reported as 12 MB in a document from before 1999, it would with almost 100% certainty be a binary file size. If the document was between 1999 and 2009, it was probably still binary file size, but you can't quite know. After that, it's probably binary unless the writer was a Mac user. How is that not ambiguous? It's troy weights all over again. How hard would it have been to make the designation for decimal megabyte MBy or something?

The irony is that the only way to be perfectly clear is to use the binary prefixes all the time.

Originally Posted by Simon View Post
Hardware manufacturers have already switched to this notation standard. Apple is following. I see nothing wrong with that. In fact, considering when the standard was ratified, it's surprising it took Apple so long.
Absolutely noone has switched. The only people who use MB to mean 1 million bytes are the ones who did so long before 1999, namely storage manufacturers. RAM is still reported as MB or GB, meaning binary numbers, and the JEDEC standards make it very clear that they should be reported that way - no GiB there. Have you ever noted that computer ads use both notations in different places (decimal for storage and binary for RAM), with a disclaimer on the decimal one? Doesn't that say something about people's expectations when they see the term MB?
The new Mac Pro has up to 30 MB of cache inside the processor itself. That's more than the HD in my first Mac. Somehow I'm still running out of space.
     
- - e r i k - -  (op)
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Aug 19, 2009, 09:19 PM
 
Originally Posted by P View Post
I wasn't aware. It's an absolutely terrible recommendation, and I wasn't aware that IEC had signed off on it. Even if you don't want to switch to using bits for storage, a reasonable suggestion would have included a new name for both units (ie, a different name for the unit than than "byte", or making the unit "By" or something) to make it clear which system was used. This way MB remains ambiguous forever.
If you weren't aware it is because you didn't read the thread.

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- - e r i k - -  (op)
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Aug 19, 2009, 09:30 PM
 
God, this is a derail isn't it?

Continuing on…
34. Apple continues to cripple Flash

35. Dock context menus are now a very slick translucent black with white type

36. QuickTime in Safari has a new player-bar that looks more flash-like instead of the standard QT control, inexplicably still no full screen button, yet there's a new "skip back 30s button" WTF?

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64stang06
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Aug 20, 2009, 01:18 AM
 
37. Launching a 32-bit system preference pane causes System Preferences to reopen in 32-bit mode.
38. The Get Info window no longer allows you to add/remove languages.
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Simon
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Aug 20, 2009, 02:48 AM
 
Originally Posted by - - e r i k - - View Post
If you weren't aware it is because you didn't read the thread.
Especially since the section on the standard was quoted twice in this thread already.

God, this is a derail isn't it?
You're absolutely right. P, let's just agree to disagree and get back to SL's improvements, shall we?
     
Spheric Harlot
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Aug 20, 2009, 03:25 AM
 
Originally Posted by Simon View Post
You're absolutely right. P, let's just agree to disagree and get back to SL's improvements, shall we?
"Improvements"?

That's the can of worms that *started* this whole derail!

Way to go, Simon!


(I submit "SL's changes" as alternative subject description.)
     
Simon
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Aug 20, 2009, 04:17 AM
 
Hehe. Fair enough.
     
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Aug 20, 2009, 05:29 AM
 
Originally Posted by Simon View Post
You're absolutely right. P, let's just agree to disagree and get back to SL's improvements, shall we?
Sure. We can pick it up when we're on page 8 or something - derails are expected at that point.

With every OS version, there's some change that bugs the hell out of me - it was the Finder view setting change in Leopard. After a while, I find a way to work around it and I forgive them...until the next big release. I'm sure there's a defaults hack to restore the old behavior or something like that.
The new Mac Pro has up to 30 MB of cache inside the processor itself. That's more than the HD in my first Mac. Somehow I'm still running out of space.
     
webraider
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Aug 20, 2009, 03:07 PM
 
Originally Posted by Jasoco View Post
First thing I noticed in the WWDC build. Very cool.


No it doesn't. The Dock and menubar are still visible. In fact, this is to allow the Dock to be clickable to switch to App Exposé mode. (Also known as Dock Exposé)

It bugs me though that windows are scalled inproportionately. Tall windows that are narrow make wide windows that are shorter vertically harder to read. At least they all have labels now.

Oh.. My... God... I forgot about seeing this at WWDC!
Edit: And once you press Space, you can use the arrows or move the mouse to resize all the others one at a time. Holy crap!!!

I'd use this if it gave visual notification that there were windows belonging to an application. Like Windows has.

Sometimes it delays too long. And I hate hate hate sidebar mode expecially since it keeps defaulting to it when I don't want it to and resizes my specifically arranged windows. Boooo!! DOWN WITH SIDEBAR SINGLE WINDOW MODE IN THE FINDER! Or at least stop defaulting to it! The ONLY time I want the sidebar to appear is when I press Command+N to create a fresh window. NEVER EVER ANY OTHER TIME.

So useful The greying out notifies you that the disc is being processed so you don't think nothing is happening or remove it too soon.


I'll add one or more.

Finder windows now resize with the green button correctly instead of leaving too much space or resizing one or two pixels too little causing wrapping. About time! Only took 9 years to get back to OS 9!
Quick question. Has the main hard disk (aka.. Macintosh HD) icon been disabled by default to appear on the desktop? At one point it was but it looks like it's been turned back on in later builds.
     
DCJ001
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Aug 20, 2009, 03:29 PM
 
Originally Posted by 64stang06 View Post
37. Launching a 32-bit system preference pane causes System Preferences to reopen in 32-bit mode.
38. The Get Info window no longer allows you to add/remove languages.
Great. Only 962 more improvements for you to list before Mac OS X 10.6 is released for sale.

Hurry about and list them so that I may make an informed decision.
     
besson3c
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Aug 20, 2009, 04:44 PM
 
Original poster: just so you know "1000" reads as "one thousand" not simply "thousand". Therefore the title reads "a one thousand improvements".
     
besson3c
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Aug 20, 2009, 04:50 PM
 
Originally Posted by DCJ001 View Post
Great. Only 962 more improvements for you to list before Mac OS X 10.6 is released for sale.

Hurry about and list them so that I may make an informed decision.
At least that informed decision for you amounts to $30 and some of your time. For some of us it amounts to buying a new computer... I'm weary about getting a new computer because some people in a forum say that it is snappy, because that is what everybody seems to say after every new OS release (including point releases), and then of course memory leaks and things are found over time that make the OS feel much slower than it did after a fresh install.

Is there anyway you guys can be more specific than just "overall it's very snappy?" Would having specific questions/tests help? Here is a very simple question (not terribly scientific, but easy to assess): do your fans kick on less frequently?
     
zerostar
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Aug 20, 2009, 05:41 PM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
Is there anyway you guys can be more specific than just "overall it's very snappy?" Would having specific questions/tests help? Here is a very simple question (not terribly scientific, but easy to assess): do your fans kick on less frequently?
NO update has been this "snappy" for me. Everything is instant and I am just on a 2.8GHz iMac... my HD2600 isn't even OpenCL supported either AFAIK.

The finder is instant, even cover flow is instant, seems like they pre-load everything and its just smooth... maybe that is why spotlight seemed to take FOREVER to update this time... But it's done and no slowness anymore... I open system prefs. boom. click a pane open. boom. close it. boom. its just instant on most things, leopard was fast, this just feels refined, and like built from the ground up if you know what I mean.

It's kinds disappointing I can't run it on my Powerbook because now Leopard (10.5.8) feels VERY sluggish on there... but I know the Intel is the reason its fast :-)

Also, I did update the HD to a Western Digital Black 1TB, Leopard loved that update but Snow Leopard seems to love it more.... listings in the finder are instant, searches spin and done... also I added 4GB ram...

What comp. are you running now? Chances are any PPC update to Intel will be FAST Snow Leopard or OG Leopard.
     
besson3c
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Aug 20, 2009, 06:24 PM
 
zerostar: Powerbook G4. I used a Macbook Pro running Leopard at my old job and I wasn't really all that impressed with the performance on that machine. Sure most things were faster, but it really seemed like the chainsaw approach. Really weird and bizarre things would still spinning beach ball or stutter for inexplicable reasons, applications would leak and bog down occasionally, etc. I really felt at the time that OS X had some fundamental performance bottlenecks, and the announcement of Snow Leopard and its intended goals gave me even more reason to think that.

Guys, don't bother going over the usual sorts of performance tips of adding more RAM, running so called maintenance utilities and repairing the permissions a thousand times, I'm already privy to all of those sorts of tricks and this has never been a deal breaker, I'm not interested in trying to coax out a little more performance because it isn't all that necessary. I've just not been terribly excited about throwing more hardware at the problem given its cause up until now. To me this would sort of be like trading in a car that gets 20 mpg for one that gets 25 mpg.

I've been hoping that SL will be a more fundamental optimization overhaul, and so far I'm hearing positive reports, but it just sounds a little too good to be true
     
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Aug 20, 2009, 07:49 PM
 
If you want an informed opinion on whether to go for it at launch, I'd actually wait until 10.6.1 at least. There are definitely rough edges. Yesterday I had my first kernel panic in years! At work I am constantly losing my WiFi connection (a problem I have never had). Just now it reset my Spotlight index for seemingly no reason. My home iMac is actually beach balling more than ever. Whereas 10.5 had no problem with a large HOSTS file for adblocking, on 10.6 it would slow my internet connection to a crawl and cause lots of timeouts.

Your mileage will vary of course, but if this is the GM build I'd wait for things to stabilise.

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ginoledesma
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Aug 22, 2009, 03:41 AM
 
39. The airport menubar icon is animated when it's scanning for a wireless network — instead of the gray color when not connected to a network, each individual "bar" turns black, from the bottom to the top, and then the top to the bottom.

I think that's cool. Can't wait to get my hands on SL!
     
rytc
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Aug 22, 2009, 06:08 AM
 
40. Time Machine now states "Calculating changes 1% (up to 100%)" rather than preparing for backup.
41. Deleting a diskimage which is mounted now gives you the option of ejecting the disk image during the trash emptying process.
42. Mounting a diskimage now doesn't require you to wait while it scans the checksum (or whatever took so long) i.e. really snappy!
43. Built-in Cisco VPN a la iPhone OS.
44. Items in the trash now can be 'put back' to their original locations.
45. Selecting text in Preview is fantastic now that it is intelligent in what text goes together
46. Preview allows you to fold a group of pdfs into a single bundle or see all pages with a single click on the first page - hard to explain.
     
rytc
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Aug 22, 2009, 06:12 AM
 
47. FInder windows in icon view now allow you to change the icon size within the finder window using a slider.
     
rytc
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Aug 22, 2009, 08:27 AM
 
48. Copying files to a Windows server works even when the file names contains characters not supported by Windows. These files show up on the server with the same file name too.
     
rytc
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Aug 22, 2009, 08:30 AM
 
49. Logouts that timeout due to stuck applications now give you the option to force quit them and continue with the log out (or shutdow/restart etc)
50. Quicktime X - editing now has a timeline much like iMovie, movies play in borderless windows, screen activity can be recorded as a movie using Quicktime X, movies can be sent to iTunes, Mobileme,Youtube with one click inside Quicktime.
51. Folders inside folders in the dock can now be 'burrowed' into without opening the finder.
52. Right clicking on the finder icon in the dock now allows you to connect to servers, search amongst other things.
53. New and improved desktop pictures of Snow Leopards.
54. It's now possible to play a video using Quicktime X in fullscreen on a second display and it will remain full screen even when using other applications in the primary display. Quicktime 7 used to always exit fullscreen as soon as you changed apps.
( Last edited by rytc; Aug 25, 2009 at 11:03 AM. )
     
- - e r i k - -  (op)
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Aug 22, 2009, 09:42 AM
 
Originally Posted by rytc View Post
42. Mounting a diskimage now doesn't require you to wait while it scans the checksum (or whatever took so long) i.e. really snappy!
This can of course be turned off in any version of OS X in Disk Utility prefs

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64stang06
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Aug 22, 2009, 09:43 AM
 
Originally Posted by DCJ001 View Post
Great. Only 962 more improvements for you to list before Mac OS X 10.6 is released for sale.

Hurry about and list them so that I may make an informed decision.
And if you read the thread, I didn't start the list. I merely contributed to it. Buy it, don't buy it, you won't break my heart.
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rytc
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Aug 22, 2009, 10:10 AM
 
Originally Posted by - - e r i k - - View Post
This can of course be turned off in any version of OS X in Disk Utility prefs
That's true but it's actually a lot quicker than was previously the case i.e. they've done more than turn this off by default.
     
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Aug 24, 2009, 08:47 AM
 
Can you CUT and paste files in finder in Snow Leopard. That is one function I miss from my Linux box. I am forced to use a file cutter application (which is actually cool).
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rytc
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Aug 24, 2009, 08:50 AM
 
Originally Posted by HyperX View Post
Can you CUT and paste files in finder in Snow Leopard. That is one function I miss from my Linux box. I am forced to use a file cutter application (which is actually cool).
No only copy and paste as previously.
     
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Aug 24, 2009, 09:03 AM
 
Originally Posted by rytc View Post
43. Built-in Cisco VPN a la iPhone OS.
No more shutting off Back to my Mac before using Cisco VPN?

44. Items in the trash now can be 'put back' to their original locations.
About freakin' time!!!
     
rytc
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Aug 24, 2009, 09:05 AM
 
Originally Posted by Atheist View Post
No more shutting off Back to my Mac before using Cisco VPN?
Not sure about that as I don't use Back to my mac....
     
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Aug 24, 2009, 10:08 AM
 
Originally Posted by Atheist View Post
No more shutting off Back to my Mac before using Cisco VPN?
My guess would be that this hasn't changed. I imagine it's the fact that you're connecting to a VPN, not the specific client you use, that makes BTTM not work. But I haven't tried it yet.

What I'd really like is the option for BTTM to automatically turn back on when you disconnect from a VPN.
     
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Aug 24, 2009, 10:43 AM
 
Originally Posted by slugslugslug View Post
My guess would be that this hasn't changed. I imagine it's the fact that you're connecting to a VPN, not the specific client you use, that makes BTTM not work. But I haven't tried it yet.

What I'd really like is the option for BTTM to automatically turn back on when you disconnect from a VPN.
It's my experience that it's only the Cisco VPN client that interferes with BTMM. The built-in OS X VPN client never required that I shut off BTMM.

Edit: It's been a while since I used the built-in VPN so I could very well be mistaken.
     
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Aug 24, 2009, 12:49 PM
 
Can't wait to buy my copy on Friday.
     
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Aug 25, 2009, 01:23 PM
 
Originally Posted by rytc View Post
47. FInder windows in icon view now allow you to change the icon size within the finder window using a slider.
Can you change the icon size with "the pinch"?? That would rock.
     
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Aug 25, 2009, 01:25 PM
 
I would hope so. Why should they remove that functioanality in 10.6?
     
rytc
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Aug 25, 2009, 01:48 PM
 
You still can :-)
     
slugslugslug
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Aug 25, 2009, 03:40 PM
 
Originally Posted by rytc View Post
47. FInder windows in icon view now allow you to change the icon size within the finder window using a slider.
Man, I used to love that on the Silicon Graphics workstation I got to play with way back in the day! Glad it's alive and well again in the aughts.
     
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Aug 25, 2009, 04:47 PM
 
Originally Posted by CharlesS View Post
I heard that Snow Leopard will ship with a real snow leopard, which will jump out and maul you as soon as you open the box.
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tkmd
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Aug 25, 2009, 06:23 PM
 
Does anyone know if you have Pages autocorrect and auto capitilization feature embedded in Mail or Safari?

I hope that it's not limited to text edit.
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Thinine
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Aug 25, 2009, 06:27 PM
 
No, I believe it's any application that uses the Cocoa text view. So most of them.
     
tkmd
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Aug 25, 2009, 06:32 PM
 
Originally Posted by Thinine View Post
No, I believe it's any application that uses the Cocoa text view. So most of them.
If this is indeed true- I would have been glad to pay even $60 for the DVD.

Fingers crossed
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- - e r i k - -  (op)
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Aug 25, 2009, 11:46 PM
 
Seriously, the best new feature is saved searches in the open dialogs. I use this multiple times daily now.

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voodoo
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Aug 26, 2009, 12:37 AM
 
Default gamma changed from 1.8 to 2.2 (the Windows default).

I never liked the windows gamma setting.

OK fanboiz: explain how this is an improvement (the blurb on the Apple page about it helping digital photographers makes no sense)
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Aug 26, 2009, 01:57 AM
 
Originally Posted by voodoo View Post
(the blurb on the Apple page about it helping digital photographers makes no sense)
Why? The first thing pro photographers do is switch it to 2.2 when calibrating their monitors.
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Aug 26, 2009, 03:17 AM
 
Originally Posted by tkmd View Post
Does anyone know if you have Pages autocorrect and auto capitilization feature embedded in Mail or Safari?

I hope that it's not limited to text edit.
Pretty much everything in TextEdit is bog standard Cocoa features.
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voodoo
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Aug 26, 2009, 07:51 AM
 
Originally Posted by Art Vandelay View Post
Why? The first thing pro photographers do is switch it to 2.2 when calibrating their monitors.
What pro photographer doesn't calibrate his monitor anyway?
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OreoCookie
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Aug 26, 2009, 07:57 AM
 
Originally Posted by Art Vandelay View Post
Why? The first thing pro photographers do is switch it to 2.2 when calibrating their monitors.
Even if you don't, if you use Photoshop, it will compensate for that so that you always with with a gamma of 2.2.
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TheoCryst
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Aug 27, 2009, 11:38 AM
 
55. Individual multitouch gestures can be enabled/disabled in System Preferences (still no customized actions, though).
56. Fancy new algorithm ("Lanczos interpolation") used by Preview for zooming images past 100%

Any ramblings are entirely my own, and do not represent those of my employers, coworkers, friends, or species
     
mdc
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Aug 27, 2009, 03:16 PM
 
Does QuickTime X have a pro option or has Apple removed that and brought all the settings to one version?

If there isn't a Pro version could someone check if QuickTime Player has the File > Open Image Sequence... option?
I use that all the time for time-lapse movies.
     
 
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