[snotnose]

i am watching him on hannity and colmes right now and he is such a waste of life. he can not be asked a question without turning it around completely on whoever asks it. never giving an answer for anything.

i really think they keep asking him to come on just to prove even more to anyone thinkin about voting for him just how worthless he actually is.

just for a second think if we were in the same situation we are now, but with him as our president...

i think he talks as stupid as possible hoping to get assasinated or something so in his mind he will be even remotely close to martin luther kings status.

can you imagine listening to a presidential address with him??? and you guys talk bad about bush!!!

[MindFad]

Yes.


Al Sharpton.

[MPC]

I would vote for Sharpton before Bush. I would vote for John McCain before Sharpton. If McCain would have been a choice last election I would have voted for him. Since he wasn't I went with Nader...

MindFad would get my vote over all of these ass clowns. I would vote for Bush if Snotnose was his oppenent.

[snotnose]

i love you guys so much! i feel the love, i really do, feels great. such warmth in here.

[MPC]

Originally posted by snotnose:
i am watching him on hannity and colmes right now and he is such a waste of life.

OK<<%

Can you feel the love in this room tonight?

[MindFad]

Originally posted by MPC:
OK<<%

Can you feel the love in this room tonight?

I thought I did for a second ... and then I realized I was touching myself.

Vote MindFad. [/quimby]

[snotnose]

Originally posted by MPC:
OK<<%

Can you feel the love in this room tonight?

have another beer

[MPC]

Originally posted by snotnose:
have another beer

Please, don't rush me. I will get around to it.

[spacefreak]

Originally posted by MPC:
I would vote for Sharpton before Bush.

Now we know where you stand in terms of intelligence, logic, and morality - at the low-end of the spectrum.

[Spliffdaddy]

hahaha

true dat

[typoon]

Yes I'm sure some people would vote for him. Me NOT being one of them

[OAW]

Will Sharpton get votes? Undoubtedly.

Does he have a snowball's chance in hell of being elected? Absolutely not.

But of course, that's not the point...

Sharpton knows full well that he won't be elected. That isn't the goal. The goal is to make a big splash in the Democratic primary and establish himself as a NATIONAL powerbroker in the Democratic party. Like it or not, the man has a constituency. His main political powerbase is in NY, but he is high profile and has a national following. This presidential run is designed to expand that political powerbase nationwide. Once that has been established, the Democratic party leaders will have to deal with him and address the concerns of his constituency if they want to receive the votes of its members.

It's as simple as that.

OAW

[Captain Obvious]

Originally posted by OAW:
Will Sharpton get votes? Undoubtedly.

Does he have a snowball's chance in hell of being elected? Absolutely not.

But of course, that's not the point...

Sharpton knows full well that he won't be elected. That isn't the goal. The goal is to make a big splash in the Democratic primary and establish himself as a NATIONAL powerbroker in the Democratic party. Like it or not, the man has a constituency. His main political powerbase is in NY, but he is high profile and has a national following. This presidential run is designed to expand that political powerbase nationwide. Once that has been established, the Democratic party leaders will have to deal with him and address the concerns of his constituency if they want to receive the votes of its members.

It's as simple as that.

OAW

Sorry no. The Dems know he is a liability and will never recognize him as a leader or representative of the party. That's why someone talked Mosley Braun into stepping in. So long as they can put up a viable alternative that is more mainstream the Dems will never allow Sharpton to gain a large powerbase. Jesse and Jesse Jr. are way ahead of him in line anyway.

BTW in the near future his constituency will have no where else to place thier votes but with the Dems.

[CRASH HARDDRIVE]

Come one people, recognize the potential! Sharpton as President would be 3 years of pure slapstick comedy! I'm all for it!

(I say 3 years because I don't think he'd make it the full 4, probably impeachment or scandal-ridden resignation before then.) But in any case, some funny shenanigans before then.

I'll be keeping my fingers crossed!

[chris v]

Political Cartoonists for Sharpton!

Ya know, I really think a major-network Bush-Sharpton debate might be just what this country needs. It'd keep Jay Leno and David Letterman in high cotton for years.

CV

[OAW]

Originally posted by Captain Obvious:
Sorry no. The Dems know he is a liability and will never recognize him as a leader or representative of the party. That's why someone talked Mosley Braun into stepping in. So long as they can put up a viable alternative that is more mainstream the Dems will never allow Sharpton to gain a large powerbase. Jesse and Jesse Jr. are way ahead of him in line anyway.

The Dems realize he is a liability in the general election. However, Sharpton is running in the primary. Primary elections are about appealing to the base of a party. General elections are about mass appeal. This is why Dems tend to campaign to the left in the primary and move back towards the center in the general election. And vice versa for Repubs. If Sharpton can capture 70+ percent of the African-American vote in the primary, then the Dem leadership will have no choice but to deal with him. Why? Because the Dems simply cannot win in the general election unless they capture 90+ percent of the African-American vote. But more importantly, there has to be a strong turnout because 90% of 1 million votes is one thing ... but 90% of 10 million votes is another thing altogether! If Sharpton plays his cards right, he can position himself so that he has a lot of influence over whether there is a strong or weak African-American turnout.

As for Jesse Jackson, while his still has a lot of clout, the bottom line is that he is not running in the election. Jackson had his shot in 1988 (?) after his incredible campaign and his riveting speech at the Democratic National Convention. He wasn't going to win the nomination ... everybody knew that. However, he did have a boatload of delegates and a much larger constituency and power base than Sharpton. He had the Dems by the balls, but he was refused to squeeze! Consequently, not a single plank that he advocated was adopted in the Democratic Party Platform that election. Just goes to show you what being a "good Democrat" will get you ... especially if you are African-American.

As for Mosely-Braun, that is an interesting twist. There's never been two high profile African-Americans running before. It could be that she was encouraged to run in order to "neutralize" Sharpton. It will be interesting to see what happens.

Originally posted by Captain Obvious:

BTW in the near future his constituency will have no where else to place thier votes but with the Dems.

Quite frankly, the overwhelming majority only place their votes with the Dems now. This is understandable, given the relative hostility that conservatives have historically had towards civil rights, affirmative action, etc. Consequently, the Republican Party doesn't get many of these votes since that seems to be the place that most of the conservatives hang out. The ironic part is that a significant portion of the Repub agenda (e.g. lower taxes, strong defense, etc.) actually appeals to a large portion of this constituency. Unfortunately, the Repub Party learned decades ago that they could sew up the conservative white male vote by harping on civil rights, affirmative action, and other "racially charged" issues that quite frankly, have neglible impact on the daily life of the typical white male. Even Armstrong Williams, a noted African-American conservative, has said that if the Repub party wasn't so antagonistic to affirmative action, etc. that it would make massive inroads into the African-American electorate. Having said that, I certainly don't expect to see that happening anytime soon.

In the meantime, the consituency that Sharpton appeals to only has the Dems. And the only leverage it has is to show up at the polls in droves or not. This is a significant amount of power because the African-American vote can make or break the Dems in a general election. All that is needed is leadership that isn't afraid to flex. Jackson blinked in 1988. We'll see how Sharpton does.

OAW

[Kitschy]

Lotsa people will vote for him.

http://www.newsmax.com/showinsidecov...003/3/4/131252

Sharpton Tops NY Prez Poll

Firebrand Rev. Al Sharpton is favored over all other 2004 presidential hopefuls among New York City Democrats, according to the latest Zogby International survey.

"In New York City, Sharpton was the strongest [Democrat] with 13 percent of the vote, followed closely by [Sen. Joseph] Lieberman (12 percent) and [Rep. Richard] Gephardt (11 percent)," Zogby reported on his Web site last week, in news that was mysteriously ignored by the mainstream press.

In New York State overall, Sharpton trails only two other Democrats - again, Lieberman (14 percent) and Gephardt (13 percent).

But with 9 percent support statewide, Sharpton's third place finish puts him ahead of white media darlings Sen. John Kerry (7 percent) and Sen. John Edwards (4 percent).

He also beat alleged presidential rising star, Vermont Gov. Howard Dean, as well as former Sen. Carol Moseley-Braun and former Sen. Gary Hart, all of whom attracted a meager 3 percent support in the statewide survey.

And the good news for Sharpton doesn't end with the Zogby poll. A Time/CNN survey conducted Feb. 19-20 shows that the New York minister is the presidential front-runner among black Democrats nationwide.

Citing Time/CNN's latest numbers, Sharpton's office said in a press release Monday:

"Presidential candidate Al Sharpton has twice as much support among African-Americans as his closest Democratic rival, ties North Carolina Sen. John Edwards for fourth-place among all registered Democratic voters, and is ahead of former Illinois Sen. Carol Moseley-Braun, Vermont Gov. Howard Dean, Florida Sen. Bob Graham and Ohio Rep. Dennis Kucinich. ..."

Sen. Joseph Lieberman leads the pack with 16 percent in the nationwide Time/CNN poll, followed by former House Minority Leader Dick Gephardt (13 percent) and Sen. John Kerry (8 percent). Then come Sharpton and Edwards, each tied at 7 percent.

Among blacks, however, Sharpton led the field with 20 percent - leading Gephardt and Lieberman, who were tied with 9 percent. Moseley-Braun received support from just 6 percent of African-Americans, followed by Edwards with 5 percent, Kerry at 4 percent, Graham with 4 percent, Dean at 3 percent and Kucinich in last place with 1 percent.

Though aspects of the Time/CNN poll were covered in a handful of media reports, none mentioned Sharpton's front-runner status among African-Americans.

[OAW]

Originally posted by Kitschy:
Lotsa people will vote for him.

http://www.newsmax.com/showinsidecov...003/3/4/131252

Just as I said. Bill O'Reilly, Rush Limbaugh, and Sean Hannitty notwithstanding ... Sharpton is a force to be reckoned with. It'll be interesting to see how this all plays out.

OAW

[MacGorilla]

You're kidding me, right?

[OAW]

Originally posted by MacGorilla:
You're kidding me, right?

Typical "dismissive" response of someone incapable of addressing an issue on a "point vs. counterpoint" basis. Oh well ....

OAW

[finboy]

I'll vote for him, especially in a primary.

That reminds me, I might have to switch from "independent" to "Democrat" for the next election, just in case. That way, someone might even figure out a way I could vote a couple of times. Of course, I might then have trouble reading the ballot, and I'd need a pollworker to help.

In a general election, I'd be glad to help split the Democrat vote.

Al Sharpton is to Democrats what Perot was to Republicans in '92. I don't think, though, that Sharpton will help unify the party post-Sharpton, because I don't think the Democrats can be anything but a collection of special interests.

But yeah, I'd vote for him. Especially over Al Gore!

[finboy]

Originally posted by OAW:
Typical "dismissive" response of someone incapable of addressing an issue on a "point vs. counterpoint" basis. Oh well ....

OAW

I hope you aren't serious. There really isn't any rational discussion of Sharpton's candidacy -- he's a buffoon. He is being extremely irresponsible running for president.

[OAW]

Originally posted by finboy:
I hope you aren't serious. There really isn't any rational discussion of Sharpton's candidacy -- he's a buffoon. He is being extremely irresponsible running for president.

I laid out very rational reasons for why Sharpton is running and how he is looking to establish himself as a national powerbroker in the Democratic Party. Someone else listed an article that cited a poll that shows he is currently leading in NY City and has a very respectable showing in NY State and the nation ... even better than some of the media favorites. You have the opportunity to respond to the points raised. Unfortunately, you have chosen to simply adopt a dismissive attitude rather than address the issues. Of course, that's your prerogative. I'm just calling it what it is.

IMO, the question raised by the title of the thread isn't whether or not one supports Sharpton. The question is whether or not a significant number of people are going to vote for him. I contend that there are significant numbers of people that will. Apparently, there is polling data that supports this view. I fully expected that those who disagree would address the issues and present their case to the contrary.

The way I see it, this thread was either intended to be a serious discussion ... or it was simply designed to be a venue for people to express their personal disdain for Sharpton. Perhaps I was in error when I assumed it was the former.

OAW

[Captain Obvious]

Originally posted by OAW:


The way I see it, this thread was either intended to be a serious discussion ... or it was simply designed to be a venue for people to express their personal disdain for Sharpton. Perhaps I was in error when I assumed it was the former.

He's right though. While Sharpton is making a ding now but by the time we reach the primary he has no chance. He is the only candidate thus far to be actively working on the primary campaign so of course he has a lot of press. Quoting a poll done in NY is worthless. Braun could do the same in Illinois and you'd see just as skewed results. The truth is he's lost 3 local elections in New York already. He has enough of a controversial history that as soon as a national audience is reminded of it that he will lose further support. In terms of a nation wide view of him the Joint Center for Political and Economic Studies found in a 2000 poll that 23% of the mainstream population didn't even know Sharpton, while 32% of Blacks had an unfavorable view of him. That means he's working to dig himself out of a hole even before the primary.

He is good at drawing attention to himself and is boisterous but only when he makes a spectacle. So yes he will be heard. Unfortunately most people won't pay attention. This run takes money and Braun is far better at courting funds from people eager to donate to an African American candidate. She has legislative experience, is far more eloquent, and has excellent academic credentials. She will be able to garnish votes outside the AA community which will be key. She does need more name recognition but at least no one hates her the way they do Sharpton.
Once the other Dems start gearing up they will drown him out and the press will focus on them. Talking about him now like he is going to be important is kind of silly. He's not so much a buffoon as he is a hustler, He'll never be taken seriously by enough people. Ultimately he is his own worst enemy.

[Mark Tungston]

ahahahaha]\\


when i eat my own ass hair

[finboy]

Jebus Christ, lecture me on "personal disdain." When things are serious enough to merit discussion, we'll discuss them.

Al Sharpton, other than being a pungie stake in the side of the Democrats, isn't worth two lines of text. I have no "personal disdain" for the guy, he just doesn't merit discussion. I admire his drive and ability to sway a crowd, much in the same way that I admire the skill and abilities of the late Josef Goebbels. My opinion notwithstanding, the guy is an ignorant thug. He could be white, black, purple or teal, and he'd still be a thug -- it isn't a racial thing (with me).

Again, though, I admire the drive and determination that a hairdresser has to have to get that far in life.

And again, I'd gladly vote for the guy if he managed to get on the ticket. I'd like to see him take office, too -- at least we wouldn't have to worry about having any more Democrat presidents for a few generations.

[MacGorilla]

Originally posted by OAW:
Typical "dismissive" response of someone incapable of addressing an issue on a "point vs. counterpoint" basis. Oh well ....

OAW

Ouch!

[OAW]

Originally posted by Captain Obvious:
He's right though. While Sharpton is making a ding now but by the time we reach the primary he has no chance. He is the only candidate thus far to be actively working on the primary campaign so of course he has a lot of press. Quoting a poll done in NY is worthless. Braun could do the same in Illinois and you'd see just as skewed results. The truth is he's lost 3 local elections in New York already. He has enough of a controversial history that as soon as a national audience is reminded of it that he will lose further support. In terms of a nation wide view of him the Joint Center for Political and Economic Studies found in a 2000 poll that 23% of the mainstream population didn't even know Sharpton, while 32% of Blacks had an unfavorable view of him. That means he's working to dig himself out of a hole even before the primary.

He is good at drawing attention to himself and is boisterous but only when he makes a spectacle. So yes he will be heard. Unfortunately most people won't pay attention. This run takes money and Braun is far better at courting funds from people eager to donate to an African American candidate. She has legislative experience, is far more eloquent, and has excellent academic credentials. She will be able to garnish votes outside the AA community which will be key. She does need more name recognition but at least no one hates her the way they do Sharpton.
Once the other Dems start gearing up they will drown him out and the press will focus on them. Talking about him now like he is going to be important is kind of silly. He's not so much a buffoon as he is a hustler, He'll never be taken seriously by enough people. Ultimately he is his own worst enemy.

You may be right. You are definitely right about Mosely-Braun being a more likely recipient of political donations. She certainly has more appeal outside of the African-American community. You are definitely correct about him never winning a political race he's entered. But as I said, the goal isn't to win. The goal is to garner enough support that he has to be "consulted" on matters important to his constituency. Despite the fact that he lost the mayor's race in NYC and the senate race in NY state, top Democrats still regularly consult with the man. Even Hillary Clinton actively sought his support in her campaign for the Senate, because the bottom line is that if he didn't support her, she wouldn't have won. I recently heard Sharpton say on Fox News Channel that even Colin Powell returns his calls. As for whether his campaign will falter by the time we get closer to the primary ... only time will tell. All I can say is that is that "mainstream" America often underestimates the influence of African-American leadership it disagrees with. For instance, the mainstream press didn't think that Min. Louis Farrakhan would pull the crowd he did to the Million Man March in 1995. But the Capitol Mall was packed shoulder to shoulder from the Capitol steps back to the Lincoln Memorial. And we're talking about a man who is much more controversial than Sharpton!

So it will be interesting to see if Sharpton's campaign can sustain its momentum or if it falters. Of course, this will ultimately be decided by the level of his support within the African-American community. After all, that's his primary constituency. His support among white Americans is negligible at best and non-existent at worse. So the fact that those white Americans who actually know anything about the man have a relatively negative opinion of him is, quite frankly, irrelevant. Whether he succeeds in becoming a national powerbroker in the Democratic party will utimately be decided by African-Americans. You mentioned a 2000 poll that said that 32% of African-Americans had an unfavorable view of him. Well that means that 68% did not have an unfavorable view. Prior to your post I had said that if Sharpton could capture 70+ percent off the African-American vote in the Democratic primary, the Democratic party leadership would have no choice but to deal with him. It seems to me that you have cited a source that only bolsters my point. Of course, it remains to be seen whether or not his support within the African-American community grows or shrinks as time goes on. Having said that, one must admit that Sharpton has "toned down" his rhetoric and his image in recent years in order to have wider appeal ... which is why he is now considered to be the main "rival" of Jesse Jackson for the unofficial "pre-eminient African-American leader" position. Back in his more "radical" days Sharpton wasn't even mentioned in the same breath as Jackson.

Basically what I'm saying is that Sharpton's "mainstream appeal" (which quite frankly is just a euphemism for his appeal among whites) is not the issue. His base is with African-Americans. African-Americans are a core voting bloc of the Democratic party. The Democrats simply can't win national elections without a strong turnout of African-Americans. If Sharpton can put himself into a position to influence whether or not there is a strong turnout, then like it or not, the Dems will have no choice but to deal with him.

OAW

[OAW]

Originally posted by finboy:
Jebus Christ, lecture me on "personal disdain." When things are serious enough to merit discussion, we'll discuss them.

Al Sharpton, other than being a pungie stake in the side of the Democrats, isn't worth two lines of text. I have no "personal disdain" for the guy, he just doesn't merit discussion. I admire his drive and ability to sway a crowd, much in the same way that I admire the skill and abilities of the late Josef Goebbels. My opinion notwithstanding, the guy is an ignorant thug. He could be white, black, purple or teal, and he'd still be a thug -- it isn't a racial thing (with me).

Again, though, I admire the drive and determination that a hairdresser has to have to get that far in life.

And again, I'd gladly vote for the guy if he managed to get on the ticket. I'd like to see him take office, too -- at least we wouldn't have to worry about having any more Democrat presidents for a few generations.

If the man isn't "worth two lines of text", why did you devote over ten to him?

OAW

[Captain Obvious]

Daley consults plenty of people just for the media brownie points but he sure as hell doesn't need to. Its a matter of kissing up to demographics. And again all of his support is in his home area which he has never been able to have a successful win in.

But let's say 1/3 of African Americans don't like the guy so clearly they won't vote for him. The remaining 66% are not all going to vote for him. Plenty of people in that community will still support Liberian because they did in the last election. Another fraction of the block will vote for Braun, particularly the more affluent and middle-class African Americans. Then small blocks will support other candidates because of regional ties or because they like what they say. At best Sharpton might get 10-20% and I highly doubt it once people start to air his dirty laundry.

Then let's also remember this is a primary. Barely 50% of the eligible voters in the country vote for presidential races. For primaries its a pretty sad turnout and among the AA voting block the turnout is even worse. The "get out the vote" efforts are all coordinated by the national party and they sure as hell won't drop money for primaries much less for areas where a candidate they don't like has the potential for strong support. No matter how much spin he tries to put on his new persona he quite simply has bad image for the party and black community. Don King has far more presidential potential than Sharpton.