[sixz]

Originally posted by RAILhead:
...You have to try and belittle others while making a vaporous point. You have to be so hateful. Apparently, you think this helps you make your point, or "drive home" your opinion � but you ought to know that all it does is make you look like a child...
Maury

... and vice versa.

[sixz]

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
I rest my case...

where do you rest it - it can't be heavy there's nothing in it ?

[Sherwin]

[mitchell_pgh]

Reagan was the first president that I really followed through his career.

[SimeyTheLimey]

Originally posted by Will McGoonigle:
There was no Cold War. The Soviets fell apart from the inside not the outside.

Of course they did. That was the strategy that defined the cold war and the whole point of US and western foreign policy for 40 years. That's why it was a cold war, not a hot one.

That strategy (called containment) was put in place under Truman following the inspiration of George Kennan. The strategy was to contain and challenge the Soviet Union until it's own internal contradictions and inefficiencies destroyed it internally. You can read the blueprint here. What you seem to think is a critisism is in fact a vindication.

Later presidents lost sight of the point of containment and embraced detente. But Reagan understood the point was destroying Communism, not cooexistence.

[sixz]

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
Reagan was the first president that I really followed through his career.

as I said, a couple of years back I got to hear him chat
about his life and him tell a few stories and it did change
my opinion of him and his legacy. It is truly an end of an era.


He told 'em what was written on the card and they loved him for it.

[zigzag]

Originally posted by itai195:
The italicized made me laugh -- certainly you're not referring to his old catch phrase, 'The Buck Stops Here.' I think a bit of that right now would be refreshing

Well, perhaps I should've said "aspires to" rather than "models himself after" - you know, the whole plain-spoken, never-lose-a-minute's-sleep, buck-stops-here thing. Like I said, it remains to be seen whether he measures up. So far, at least, he doesn't seem to grasp the "buck stops here" idea.

Of course, none of us are old enough to remember Truman in office - we only know his legacy. He almost lost to Dewey. He probably got the same kind of flack while in office that more recent Presidents have, and probably told his share of fibs.

[RAILhead]

Agree?

[mitchell_pgh]

Originally posted by RAILhead:
Agree?

Unfortunately, some people think it's funny to make fun of those who pass away and enjoy derailing threads. He was a well respected president and his battle with Alzheimer's underlined that nobody is immune from this horrible disease. Nancy and he were robbed of the golden years of their lives.

[f1000]

When Garrison Keillor announced Reagan�s death on his �A Prairie Home Companion� yesterday, some jerk whooped and cheered. I�m glad that Keillor ignored the ignoramus, but I wish the show could�ve edited out the sophomoric hooting.

[SimeyTheLimey]

Originally posted by zigzag:
Well, perhaps I should've said "aspires to" rather than "models himself after" - you know, the whole plain-spoken, never-lose-a-minute's-sleep, buck-stops-here thing. Like I said, it remains to be seen whether he measures up. So far, at least, he doesn't seem to grasp the "buck stops here" idea.

Of course, none of us are old enough to remember Truman in office - we only know his legacy. He almost lost to Dewey. He probably got the same kind of flack while in office that more recent Presidents have, and probably told his share of fibs.

That's an interesting parallel. Truman was probably the most unpopular president of the post-war era. Dewey was very bright, and highly respected, but he was cold, haughty, and stiff. That was his public image, and last year I met some people who knew him personally who said that's how he really was. It probably tipped the election back to Truman as the more likable politician.

A parallel with today? Maybe. We'll have to see.

[theolein]

Originally posted by Spheric Harlot:
"Ich hab noch einen Koffer in Berlin" was the title of one of Marlene Dietrich's greatest hits.

The DJ Spheric remix, live with "Cash in my case" Helmut and the Ronnie and Margret crew? Yo.

[zen jihad]

Originally posted by RAILhead:


Agree?

I certainly do, and I started it. I gave up after the first page, when Ad Hominem remarks came into it; and the right-wing Republican online defence league made its presence known.

Simple policy in forums, when you see a topic going off a cliff, don't jump in the same direction.

[Biggysteve]

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
Congratulations, just when you think people can't sink any lower, you post something like this to achieve the "deplorable newby" award.

All the hand wringing and obscene sensitivity the populace expects everyone to show just makes me yearn for more Alzheimer's porridge, mitchell_pgh. This country has an unhealthy fascination with death and all the ridiculous pageantry and exaggerated tribute that comes with death. Reagan dying is not news, and it's not even a surprise. America loves a funeral. In any case, I've never won an award. I'm honored.

[zigzag]

Originally posted by SimeyTheLimey:
That's an interesting parallel. Truman was probably the most unpopular president of the post-war era. Dewey was very bright, and highly respected, but he was cold, haughty, and stiff. That was his public image, and last year I met some people who knew him personally who said that's how he really was. It probably tipped the election back to Truman as the more likable politician.

A parallel with today? Maybe. We'll have to see.

Truman's public image has clearly improved with time, even after the era of WWII revisionism. I'm not old enough to remember him in office, of course, but I do remember when he died and when "Plain Speaking" came out in 1974. As complicated and scandalous as the Presidency has become, people seem to like his decisive, no regrets, straight-talkin' country boy persona, and I think Dubya strives for the same effect (his father tried but nobody bought it). He also seems to emulate Reagan's big-picture-not-details management style. I think these can be virtues - I applaud his willingness to take risks and make a long-term bet on Iraq - but one is still charged with making prudent decisions and executing them well.

And yes, one can certainly see a parallel between Dubya and Gore/Kerry. What I wouldn't give to see a race between Dubya and the learned-yet-charismatic Clinton (meaning Bill, although Hillary might be interesting as well).

[wdlove]

I'm very saddened by the death of Ronald Reagan our 40th president. Truly one of our great presidents. I was proud to serve in the Air Force while he was commander-in chief. May he rest in peace. My prayers goes out to his family and friends. May God say "Welcome home my good and faithful servant."

[mitchell_pgh]

Originally posted by f1000:
When Garrison Keillor announced Reagan�s death on his �A Prairie Home Companion� yesterday, some jerk whooped and cheered. I�m glad that Keillor ignored the ignoramus, but I wish the show could�ve edited out the sophomoric hooting.

It's times like that when I wish they would have had a camera on the guy.

If an american political figure died that I didn't like, I would still feel bad for them. Most politicians here generally do care for the average person, it's just that everyone has better ideas for how to accomplish it.

[wdlove]

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
It's times like that when I wish they would have had a camera on the guy.

If an american political figure died that I didn't like, I would still feel bad for them. Most politicians here generally do care for the average person, it's just that everyone has better ideas for how to accomplish it.

I would pray that was the case, but i fear that for many its not. Ronald Reagan was the real thing, a true servant to his country and God.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by RAILhead:
Heh, here you go again. The thing about you, "sixz," is that you have to be so bitter towards those that think differently than you. For some reason, you have to resort to name-calling and labelling rather than intelligent discussion. You have to try and belittle others while making a vaporous point. You have to be so hateful. Apparently, you think this helps you make your point, or "drive home" your opinion � but you ought to know that all it does is make you look like a child. The bitterness in your comments simply makes it impossible to take you seriously.

"Forgive you," you say? There's nothing to forgive, because your own words make you out to be nothing but an unhappy, angry, and sad, sad, person. I can't take offense at your vitriol, I can only shake my head at your comment's sheer stupidity (using the true meaning of the word). You don't upset me at all � you make me pity and feel sorry for you.

Maury

Esp that last paragraph.

Exactly how I feel as well.

[DanMacMan]

Lets get this man's face on Mt. Rushmore. He only ended the Cold War without having a shot fired.

[sixz]

It's a good thing you superstitious fascists don't have any power.
If you did you might be scary, luckily - you only frighten
yourselves. You hide behind patriotism like you can gleam
some respectability from it - you are sadly mistaken.

Everybody knew he was a dumbass. Ronald Reagan was famous for not understanding how government works and not particularly caring about it. His job was to read speeches off the Teleprompter, shake hands with foreign dignitaries, pose for pictures, and maybe go out and visit a flag factory or a steel mill every once in a while. Otherwise he was busy sleeping in, eating jellybeans, and watching television...

[wolfen]

Originally posted by DanMacMan:
He only ended the Cold War without having a shot fired.

You are misinformed.

[:dragonflypro:]

Originally posted by wolfen:
You are misinformed.

Perhaps.

But no more or less than sixz.

[nredman]

Originally posted by RAILhead:


Agree?

i agree, send it to the politcal forums, where everyone can have fun and bitch at each other

[RAILhead]

Originally posted by sixz:
It's a good thing you superstitious fascists don't have any power.
If you did you might be scary, luckily - you only frighten
yourselves. You hide behind patriotism like you can gleam
some respectability from it - you are sadly mistaken.

[quandarry]

ronald reagan dead?

wheh...for a m

inute i th


ought
you sa
id

ronald macd



onald.


booosh!

[typoon]

Originally posted by quandarry:

he was a shitty president...

What do you base this on?

[RAILhead]

[quandarry]

heheh...

darn those fascist republicans and their thread derailment agenda.

[Adam Betts]

RAILhead,

'Ignore' isn't in your vocabulary list?

[ghost_flash]

Originally posted by quandarry:
heheh... (Look at me I am an attention whore)

*gosh* darn us communist liberal democrats and our thread derailment agenda.

Fixenated.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Adam Betts:
RAILhead,

'Ignore' isn't in your vocabulary list?

ignore list is for the weak.

[Adam Betts]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
ignore list is for the weak.

I didn't talk about putting anyone on ignore list. Just a plain, old-fashion 'ignore' should do.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Adam Betts:
I didn't talk about putting anyone on ignore list. Just a plain, old-fashion 'ignore' should do.

Ah, sorry.

[RAILhead]

Originally posted by Adam Betts:
RAILhead,

'Ignore' isn't in your vocabulary list?

Yeah, it is, but I'm bored so I started making a bunch of stupid forum images � and since this thread was one of the worst rabbit-chasing derailments in recent days, I thought I'd utilize them here. I have a lot more, too, but now I'm bored and lazy, so I doubt I'll post any more of them here, but you never know. OK, I guess I'll post one more � the most recent one I've finished:



Oh, and you could always ignore, too, if it's in *your* vocabulary.

Maury

[sixz]

Originally posted by RAILhead:
Yeah, it is, but I'm bored so I started making a bunch of stupid forum images � and since this thread was one of the worst rabbit-chasing derailments in recent days, I thought I'd utilize them here. I have a lot more, too, but now I'm bored and lazy, so I doubt I'll post any more of them here, but you never know. OK, I guess I'll post one more � the most recent one I've finished:

[img]snip[/img]

Oh, and you could always ignore, too, if it's in *your* vocabulary.

Maury

...bored means boring - Heres one I made earlier.

[mitchell_pgh]

I find is so sad that people can't put aside their difference long enough to post (or refrain from posting) in a page regarding the passing of a past president.

[ghost_flash]

I tried to refrain....

[Gankdawg]

RIP.

[andi*pandi]

we can mourn the man, and feel for his family, without viewing his presidency thru rose-colored glasses.

g_f, I hope that (far in the future) when Clinton passes, you will be able to say something constructive about him to honor his memory, as you seem to think we should do for Reagan. Each president did something good in office. Each president set a stage.

Reagan got in office because Carter's team messed up the Iran hostage situation. I was too young at the time to understand this, or notice why he got reelected so handily... but I do remember Ollie North and the Savings and Loan scandals. If he was unaware of these dealings, surely he failed the country in this aspect. Now if I could only remember who was the guy in the S&L crisis... darn my foggy memory.

[zigzag]

Originally posted by andi*pandi:
we can mourn the man, and feel for his family, without viewing his presidency thru rose-colored glasses.

g_f, I hope that (far in the future) when Clinton passes, you will be able to say something constructive about him to honor his memory, as you seem to think we should do for Reagan. Each president did something good in office. Each president set a stage.

Reagan got in office because Carter's team messed up the Iran hostage situation. I was too young at the time to understand this, or notice why he got reelected so handily... but I do remember Ollie North and the Savings and Loan scandals. If he was unaware of these dealings, surely he failed the country in this aspect. Now if I could only remember who was the guy in the S&L crisis... darn my foggy memory.

You might be thinking of Charles Keating, a lifelong Republican groupie (the Democrats have theirs as well). If you want to know how politics really works, follow Keating's story. He started out making anti-porn propaganda, then served on Nixon's porn commission (which decided there wasn't really a problem, so Nixon and Keating actually filed suit to quash the very report that Nixon had commissioned . . . ), then moved on to the savings and loan business after Reagan deregulated it. In order to avoid a clamp down on his various swindles, he bought off a few Senators, including John McCain and John Glenn, but everything collapsed anyway and tens of thousands of people lost everything. Nice work if you can get it.

He was also active in the Catholic Church and gave a lot of money to Mother Theresa, who, when he was being prosecuted for swindling tens of thousands of people, wrote an infamous letter to the court about what a fine person he was, overlooking the fact that the money she (or, I should say, the Church) received had been swindled from the aforementioned people.

I've always suspected that McCain's zeal for campaign finance reform grew out of a desire to overcome the embarrassment of the Keating scandal. I think he's sincere but it's always hard to tell with politicians.

[Zimphire]

I specifically grew up in a town where the nuclear air raid sirens blared twice a day. There was a tower with a siren a mile from my house. I grew up scouting the caves on our property figuring out where we might be able to go quickly in the event of an attack. There are hundreds of homes in Oak Ridge with bomb shelters.

I grew up in that. And Reagan, the man people claimed was going to get us into WWIII fully recognized the weakness of the Soviet system and brought that fear of nuclear annihilation to a halt. It was odd not hearing the sirens twice daily anymore, but it was a palpable result of his policy. A strong leader projects a strong America. A strong America provides hope for people all over the world.

He provided it for me. And he provided it for others elsewhere. You should have listened to the Eastern Europeans living in America that called in last night on C-SPAN. They were in tears sobbing at the loss of a man who had them standing and cheering at his "evil empire" speech. Our "enemies" were cheering an American President because he gave them hope that atheir dreams of freedom and democracy could come true. That projection of a strong America can't be counted in dollar signs, or buildings, or roads, or schools. You can't quantify what his ability to rally the human spirit gave America and the world. Was he a God? Was he infallible? Was every move a stroke of genius? No. But he wasn't scared to make a mistake. You and others might call it "headstrong" and "fast and loose" but at that time, in the world and in America, it provided all of us hope for a better future.

Do you know how deeply a man has to touch the people when he wins a partisan Presidential election by a 20 point margin? Gaps like that aren't created by laws or policy, but by emotion. He made Americans feel good about themselves. That is why he was an unrivaled leader of the modern era.

And I thank him from the bottom of my heart. Godspeed Ronnie.

[ghost_flash]

Originally posted by andi*pandi:
we can mourn the man, and feel for his family, without viewing his presidency thru rose-colored glasses.

g_f, I hope that (far in the future) when Clinton passes, you will be able to say something constructive about him to honor his memory, as you seem to think we should do for Reagan. Each president did something good in office. Each president set a stage.

Reagan got in office because Carter's team messed up the Iran hostage situation. I was too young at the time to understand this, or notice why he got reelected so handily... but I do remember Ollie North and the Savings and Loan scandals. If he was unaware of these dealings, surely he failed the country in this aspect. Now if I could only remember who was the guy in the S&L crisis... darn my foggy memory.

As I stated earlier. I would not dance on the grave of anyone, like some have in here with Ronald Reagan. Even Clinton had some good times. Didn't he aprove the WWII memorial in DC?

Rose-Colored Glasses? I lived through the Reagan and Carter Years, and my memory is quite good.

Carter had 18 percent interest rates and 3 points to get a mortgage!
The misery index was incredible!
Reagan won, and then he was shot! Did the "actor" fold? No, he did his job even while recouperating.

Reagan was the best President this country has known in 30 years.
He alone won the Cold War, and has made millions of lives better because of his being ALIVE. Can't say that about Clinton or Carter.

[phoenixboy70]

*california �ber alles*

[sixz]

Originally posted by ghost_flash:

...Reagan was the best President this country has known in 30 years.
He alone won the Cold War, and has made millions of lives better because of his being ALIVE. Can't say that about Clinton or Carter.

You are misinformed.

...American people immediately rallied around their wounded leader. Reagan's popularity ratings suddenly went through the roof, inflated by public sympathy. The nation's news editors and publishers chose to play along, rather than risk appearing cold and heartless. This deference persisted throughout his Presidency. So when Reagan would say something phenomenally stupid during a press conference, most news outlets just let it go. Even when he was obviously lying his ass off, he never really got called on it. Reagan received the nickname "The Teflon President" thanks to this phenomenon, the name being that of a nonstick coating applied to cookware.

After the shooting, First Lady Nancy heard from her part-time astrologer, Joan Quigley, that they could have and would have predicted that March 30 was destined to be a bad day for her husband... if only Quigley had been on the payroll. Rather than risk a similar incident happening, Nancy decided that it would be prudent to keep the astrologer in the loop. She ordered dedicated phone lines be installed at the White House and Camp David, just so she would never be without the wisdom of the Zodiac.

For the next eight years, Quigley determined the most opportune timing for all of the President's crucial activities. The First Lady would furnish Ronnie's tentative itinerary, which the astrologer would optimize and return. Then the White House staff would make the necessary adjustments. This tinkering affected the scheduling of press conferences, Air Force One departures, even the timing of international summits.

[zen jihad]

I had more dislike, than like for Reagan during his Presidency. Off the top of my head I could list many charges I would lay at his, and his cronies feet.

Here's something I stumbled across while looking through the news of his death.
http://www.americanpolitics.com/20020319Hersh.html

[ghost_flash]

Originally posted by zen jihad:
I had more dislike, than like for Reagan during his Presidency. Off the top of my head I could list many charges I would lay at his, and his cronies feet.

Here's something I stumbled across while looking through the news of his death.
http://www.americanpolitics.com/20020319Hersh.html

Talk about cr@p.

Well then, I guess since he won more popular votes than ANY President in history, that makes your crud worthless. Try as you may to sully the memory of a Great President, you will always fall short. Please do, list off the top of your head the "many" charges you would lay at his coffin.

[zen jihad]

Originally posted by ghost_flash:
Talk about cr@p.

Well then, I guess since he won more popular votes than ANY President in history, that makes your crud worthless. Try as you may to sully the memory of a Great President, you will always fall short. Please do, list off the top of your head the "many" charges you would lay at his coffin.

Now who has the blinkers on.

[MindFad]

Did you guys hear? Ronald Reagan died. I wasn't sure if anyone knew. I heard about it on TV.

[zen jihad]

From the immortal wisdom of Slashdot:

"I just heard some sad news on talk radio - Horror/Sci Fi actor Ronald Reagan was found dead in his Bel Air home this morning. There weren't any more details. I'm sure everyone in the Slashdot community will miss him - even if you didn't enjoy his bombs, there's no denying his contributions to popular poverty. Truly an American icon"