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mattyb
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Oct 16, 2012, 01:42 PM
 
We'll be getting one at the end of the month. Already seen him and the kids have given him a daft name. He'll be 2 months old when we get him. Craps and pees where he should already apparently. Until he gets bigger, he'll be sleeping in the house and will only go outside when we're present. When big enough I'll put in a cat flap so he can come and go as he pleases.

Question 1) His first few nights in our house, what should we do to ensure a good nights sleep (for him and us)?

Question 2) At what sort of age is big enough to kick him out of the house at night?

Question 3) Why did I let myself get talked into getting a cat?
     
subego
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Oct 16, 2012, 01:54 PM
 
What do you imagine the kitten doing to interfere with your sleep?
     
Waragainstsleep
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Oct 16, 2012, 02:25 PM
 
Cats are ace and mostly take care of themselves. Kittens will tear around like lunatics (more so if you have two or more) then fall asleep immediately when they get tired regardless of where they are and what they are doing. Expect to find him at the top of your curtains and various other places you wouldn't necessarily expect to find him.

You should try and create something warm and cosy that he can basically hide in if he wants to. There is a very good chance he'll pay no attention to it but moving to a new house by yourself is understandably scary for a small cat so don't be surprised if he cowers under a sofa for a day or two until he gets used to you all.

Once the cat flap is installed, he will come and go as he likes and there will be little need to actually boot him out at night. He'll stay out when its warm or interesting and come back in when cold or sleepy.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
mattyb  (op)
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Oct 17, 2012, 03:51 AM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
What do you imagine the kitten doing to interfere with your sleep?
Meowing.

Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep View Post
Cats are ace and mostly take care of themselves. Kittens will tear around like lunatics (more so if you have two or more) then fall asleep immediately when they get tired regardless of where they are and what they are doing. Expect to find him at the top of your curtains and various other places you wouldn't necessarily expect to find him.
You should try and create something warm and cosy that he can basically hide in if he wants to. There is a very good chance he'll pay no attention to it but moving to a new house by yourself is understandably scary for a small cat so don't be surprised if he cowers under a sofa for a day or two until he gets used to you all.
Once the cat flap is installed, he will come and go as he likes and there will be little need to actually boot him out at night. He'll stay out when its warm or interesting and come back in when cold or sleepy.
Cheers. At what age would you recommend that I install the cat flap?
     
The Final Dakar
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Oct 17, 2012, 06:02 AM
 
Given your attitude, I'm not enthusiastic about a cat living with you. Neither are you, given your fixation on making him an outside cat.
     
mattyb  (op)
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Oct 17, 2012, 06:19 AM
 
Online and/or gaming persona <> reality.

My wife had cats when she was younger, the grandparents had a cat until recently, plus the organisation of our life would be more complex with a dog.

I've been told by a few people that cats are better outside at night - unless it freezing cold of course. We have a large garden and we are in a small village, so I don't see the problem. One neighbour said that house-bound cats are a bit quirky.

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Since when did Dakar become an animal lover?

Thats not meant as an insult btw.
     
Phileas
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Oct 17, 2012, 07:49 AM
 
The cat will tell you what it needs. Our cats don't have a catflap - where we live that's too much of an invitation to find a racoon inside your house. They are outside pretty much all the time from April to October and only request to be let inside for food. Fall and spring they sleep inside but spend the day outside and during winter they can be found permanently installed in front of the fire.

As your climate is a lot more moderate than ours, I'd say a catflap is ideal. Make sure he's neutered so he doesn't wander off or gets into fights. I'd let him have the keys when he's about six months old. Also, two cats are better than one.
     
Mrjinglesusa
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Oct 17, 2012, 07:52 AM
 
If you are going to allow him outside at any point do NOT, under any circumstances, have him declawed. He needs to be able to hunt and defend himself - that's what cats do when outside. That, and screw other cats (or be screwed as the case may be).
     
Waragainstsleep
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Oct 17, 2012, 07:52 AM
 
I've heard of house bound cats but other cats basically come and go as they like. I don't think people have kicked the cat out overnight since the Flintstones. (Maybe when it was set, rather than broadcast).

Assuming you will neuter him, anytime after a few months is ok for the flap I'd say. usually between 3 and 6. Once they have been in a house for a few weeks, they tend to know where to go back to and thats really all they need as a rule. I always used to try to scare the cats from going near the main road near my house but ultimately they just learn not to go that way when you are looking. Clever little buggers.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
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Oct 17, 2012, 08:08 AM
 
To the OP:

Kittens are fairly easy to care for. You can free feed. I'd recommend starting right away on a decent litter box so you don't have problems later - we recently decided to upgrade from standard clumping litter to a fully-automated crystal litter box called the ScoopFree. The upfront investment was kinda high - about $125 on sale - but so far it has been totally worth it.

Get her spayed. That one is a non-negotiable, of course. Do it at around twelve to thirteen weeks for optimal recovery time.

Keep lots of toys around. That being said, cats aren't easily trained the way that dogs are, so watch out for possible threats to the cat's safety or your stuff - one of my cats was absolutely obsessed with chewing on insulated power cords (like computer power cords and surge protector cords) and I ended up having to wrap all of them in cheap foam pipe insulation to prevent possible electric shock and damage to the cords. My other cat loves eating paper, so I keep junk mail around for her and make sure to put the important stuff out of reach.

Also, make sure to keep surfaces clean. Cats are natural climbers and explorers, so make sure that anything the cat can jump onto is free of fragile or otherwise valuable stuff.

If you're not declawing, make sure to get stuff for the cat to scratch on. You will have to frequently and consistently reinforce where the cat can and cannot scratch, or else you will end up with shredded furniture, drapes, and carpet.

As far as going outdoors is concerned, that's completely up to you - cats are at home outdoors and can generally handle their own if they stay around the house. However, if your neighborhood has any known mammal predators - specifically foxes, wolves, coyotes, jackals, raccoons, or feral dogs or cats - you need to be extremely conscious of that and give some thought to whether or not you want to let the cat out unsupervised. Cars are, of course, deadly to cats, so if you live on a busy street and want your cat to live past five months, I'd recommend not letting it out at all.

I'll also say that cats are pretty easy at night - if you try to close the kitten out of your bedroom, it's going to cause more disruptions to your sleep than if you let her in your room.

Originally Posted by Mrjinglesusa View Post

If you are going to allow him outside at any point do NOT, under any circumstances, have him declawed. He needs to be able to hunt and defend himself - that's what cats do when outside. That, and screw other cats (or be screwed as the case may be).
Our family cat when I was growing up was declawed, won many catfights, stayed outside for days and subsisted on rodents, and singlehandedly kept the rabbit/vole/mole population at a minimum at our house. She lived to be 22.

A lot of the hype around declawing is just that - hype. It's a choice (at least in the United States), and vilifying a pet owner for it is unnecessary and overly judgmental.

Just sayin'.
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andi*pandi
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Oct 17, 2012, 08:27 AM
 
Our cats are indoors as we live in a both semi-urban area with traffic, and next to a huge park with coyote sightings. The dog is actually scared to go in the park, she can smell the coyote. There are wild cats roaming around too.

Our cats do not meow at us unless their dish is empty. They are on diets now so we can't free feed as we used to, so in the morning they hover while you get up and going. In a way this has made them more social.

When they were kittens they would get everywhere: on top of bureaus, ceiling beams, behind tvs... watch your valuables. Tin foil can cover things you don't want them on, or a jar of pennies being shaken, or a squirt bottle of water will deter them from the tables/counters.
     
shifuimam
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Oct 17, 2012, 08:29 AM
 
Originally Posted by andi*pandi View Post
Tin foil can cover things you don't want them on, or a jar of pennies being shaken, or a squirt bottle of water will deter them from the tables/counters.
Of course, if your cat is a freak who loves getting wet, spraying does nothing.

Compressed air also works really well.
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Mrjinglesusa
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Oct 17, 2012, 09:27 AM
 
Originally Posted by shifuimam View Post
Our family cat when I was growing up was declawed, won many catfights, stayed outside for days and subsisted on rodents, and singlehandedly kept the rabbit/vole/mole population at a minimum at our house. She lived to be 22.

A lot of the hype around declawing is just that - hype. It's a choice (at least in the United States), and vilifying a pet owner for it is unnecessary and overly judgmental.

Just sayin'.

First off, nowhere did I vilify anyone. Secondly, you seem a little guilty that your family had your cat declawed. Otherwise, why do you feel the need to defend and justify declawing cats? Thirdly, exactly what about declawing is "hype"? That is it is painful? It is. That it is a mutilation? It is. That it doesn't serve any purpose other than keeping a cat from scratching up furniture? It doesn't. That it is outlawed in many countries and in many cities in the U.S.? It is. Where's this "hype" you speak of?

Our family cat when I was growing up was declawed as well. And he stayed indoors. I had no say in the matter. I have done my research and come to the conclusion that declawing a cat is selfish and unnecessary, not to mention mutilating. Declawing a cat is like cutting off human fingers at the knuckle.

Declawing a cat serves only one purpose: to make it so a cat doesn't scratch it's precious owner's furniture. Worried about your furniture getting scratched? Don't get a cat.

Cats are born with claws - there is no legitimate reason to remove them.

All of the defense of declawing comes from people who have declawed their cats and feel the need to defend their choice in doing so, and mutilating a cat so your furniture doesn't get scratched is unnecessary, selfish, and cruel.

Just sayin'.


To the OP, it's your choice (it doesn't appear to be outlawed in France as it is in Germany, Austria, Switzerland, Norway, Sweden, Netherlands, Denmark, Finland, Brazil, Australia and Poland), but please do your own research before making the decision.


http://pets.webmd.com/cats/guide/declawing-cats-positives-negatives-alternatives

http://www.pawproject.org/

http://www.humanesociety.org/animals/cats/tips/declawing.html
     
BadKosh
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Oct 17, 2012, 09:45 AM
 
Originally Posted by mattyb View Post
Question 1) His first few nights in our house, what should we do to ensure a good nights sleep (for him and us)?
Question 2) At what sort of age is big enough to kick him out of the house at night?
Question 3) Why did I let myself get talked into getting a cat?
#1 - catnip, lots of playing and some food. Cats will usually sleep until they are hungry again.

#2 - I wouldn't as they kill little animals, get into fights(vet costs) and might be eaten by larger animals like racoons, foxes, etc.

#3 - after it sits in your lap and purrs you'll be hooked.

Declawing is wrong and cruel. Lets cut those last digits of your fingers off to prove the point.

All those arguments saying de-clawing is somehow OK are BS.
If you don't like the claws DON'T GET A CAT.
Its as stupid as moving next to an airport and whining about the noise.
     
subego
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Oct 17, 2012, 10:17 AM
 
Originally Posted by BadKosh View Post
#1 - catnip, lots of playing and some food. Cats will usually sleep until they are hungry again.
FWIW, kittens don't usually take to catnip. About 20% of cats never do, even as adults, so don't be frustrated if that only gets an uninterested sniff.
     
mattyb  (op)
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Oct 17, 2012, 10:37 AM
 
He'll get the snip, dunno when. There's a over population of cats where we live, loads of wild ones in the countryside (which we aren't far from).

Doubt he'll get his claws clipped. I understand that a simple post with a string and a ball is quite effective

Free feeding - you mean putting a bowl down with food in it? We've got one of those things that lets food out little by little. We were told not to feed them the 'paté' sort of catfood, too rich. And apparently milk not from mother cat gives them the runs.

There are other cats in the neighbourhood, haven't heard about wild animals eating them. Sometimes the neighbours' cat catches rabbits though.

No way is the cat coming in our bedroom for the night. End of story.

Think we'll clear the bookshelves of ornaments for the first few weeks.

Cheers for the advice people.
     
The Final Dakar
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Oct 17, 2012, 10:49 AM
 
Can the cat sleep with the kids?
     
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Oct 17, 2012, 10:53 AM
 
Cats only wake you up if they get wet and decide to climb in bed with you. Otherwise its much more likely you'll just wake up in the morning with something warm and furry beside or on you.

I would never declaw a cat. They need their claws, its cruel.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
andi*pandi
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Oct 17, 2012, 11:23 AM
 
Note that trimming is different than declawing, which is surgical and permanent. I have to trim our cats claws once in a while with clippers. Course, if they were outdoor cats they might get worn down more and not need it. They do have scratchy posts and such that they use.

I would never declaw a cat. The dog has destroyed more things in these few months with chewing than the cats ever did with claws--not going to remove her teeth.

(Seriously dog, you chewed the doorknob?)

As to where the cat sleeps, the cat will find a person it prefers. If you do not want it sleeping with you, have someone else feed it. But if you lock it out of where it wants to be, it may annoy you more with yowling, scratching at the door, etc, than it would if you just let it in.

Also, our cats know how to open shut doors.
     
subego
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Oct 17, 2012, 11:25 AM
 
Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep View Post
Cats only wake you up if they get wet and decide to climb in bed with you. Otherwise its much more likely you'll just wake up in the morning with something warm and furry beside or on you.
I would never declaw a cat. They need their claws, its cruel.
I'd say it's roughly analogous to removing a human's thumbs.
     
mattyb  (op)
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Oct 17, 2012, 01:47 PM
 
Originally Posted by The Final Dakar View Post
Can the cat sleep with the kids?
You! Out of this thread.

Originally Posted by andi*pandi View Post
As to where the cat sleeps, the cat will find a person it prefers. If you do not want it sleeping with you, have someone else feed it. But if you lock it out of where it wants to be, it may annoy you more with yowling, scratching at the door, etc, than it would if you just let it in.
Also, our cats know how to open shut doors.
She who must be obeyed decided where the cat will sleep. I just don't want to be woken at stupid o'clock.
     
Waragainstsleep
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Oct 17, 2012, 02:00 PM
 
Most cats will get used to what time breakfast is and won't pester you unless you take the p**s. My cat gets fed ~8:30am in the week. If I lie in on the weekend, I can expect to get visited repeatedly after about 11am or so. She's pretty good really.

When I was a kid, all cats were constantly hungry all the time and would instantly and completely eat what they were given whenever they were given it and then ask for more just in case they got it. Nowadays cats seem much more likely to leave food in the hope it will be there later (Even when I had four, three of them did this and the other was only allowed special food so would always go for anything different otherwise she'd have been the same I suspect). I think they are evolving to become even more pampered and relaxed.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
Shaddim
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Oct 17, 2012, 03:19 PM
 
I know one thing, mine won't eat that super-duper food from the vet. They like Friskies canned and regular Cat Chow. Ramses gets some raw (or slightly cooked) beef and/or lamb, instead of the wet food, but that's the only variation for all of them.
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subego
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Oct 17, 2012, 03:31 PM
 
Mine's are same way. Fancy Feast or lots of complaining.

They like the Fromm's dry though.
     
Waragainstsleep
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Oct 17, 2012, 04:10 PM
 
Do you find that they like it when you change food brand now and then? Mine likes some longer than others, but always seems to get bored a given brand periodically and loves it when I get a new one, even if its cheap and nasty.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
Shaddim
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Oct 17, 2012, 05:03 PM
 
No, pretty much always Friskies, but we do get them lots of different flavors.

I think we tried the Fromm dry but they didn't care for it as much. Cats are funny.
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Oct 17, 2012, 05:22 PM
 
The only time my cats complain about food, is when I give them diet food. They hate that crap. I even mix it in with the good stuff they will pick out the good stuff and leave the diet bits behind. They rarely get wet food.
     
Shaddim
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Oct 17, 2012, 05:59 PM
 
Oh, just wondering, does anyone else have a high "community cat" population? Around here we have these strays, probably 12 or more, who everyone in the neighborhood kinda looks after? Every morning my wife puts out a pan of dry for them and they converge in the yard, then they wander from house to house throughout the day. Some you can pet, others you can't. We've all worked on wrangling them up and then the vet comes out and checks them and gives them their shots, worming, takes them to get fixed, etc. but the population gradually keeps growing. It's not annoying, but I imagine at some point we're going to reach some type of feline critical mass.
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Oct 18, 2012, 12:51 AM
 
There is an enormous fat white cat that lives a couple of doors down from me in a house full of young children and dogs so its no surprise that he sneaks into my house and sleeps in my spare room, even in winter when my house is freezing. I wouldn't mind that but he eats everything left in sight and if nothing is in sight will pull my kitchen bin over or tear through garbage bags to get and anything, even as little as an empty pouch of wet food. Its kind of annoying.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
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Oct 18, 2012, 04:50 AM
 
We have feral cats in the neighborhood, mostly black cats. Our cats were adopted from when one of the feral mothers was captured by a rescue society. However, we don't feed the wild ones, they seem to do well on chipmunks and squirrels. I've tried to call them, feed them, but they are very people wary. Some of the younger ones disappear (coyote) but the big black tom still wanders through our yard like he owns it.
     
The Final Dakar
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Oct 18, 2012, 05:11 AM
 
Originally Posted by mattyb View Post
You! Out of this thread.
What the hell did I do wrong now?
     
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Oct 18, 2012, 05:36 AM
 
Originally Posted by Mrjinglesusa View Post
Declawing a cat is like cutting off human fingers at the knuckle.
This. End of story.

Our cats have always been recues/strays who decided to move in. They seem to know when a space becomes available. Our newest cat appeared as a six week old stray kitten in our backyard a month after our last cat died. I put up posters for a week, then he was allowed to stay.
     
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Oct 18, 2012, 09:11 AM
 
@mrjingle

Sorry I basically repeated what you said verbatim. I missed your post.
     
subego
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Oct 18, 2012, 10:54 AM
 
Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep View Post
Do you find that they like it when you change food brand now and then? Mine likes some longer than others, but always seems to get bored a given brand periodically and loves it when I get a new one, even if its cheap and nasty.
My dumb cat doesn't care. My smart cat likes to fool you into thinking they'll eat something else, and as soon as you buy a case of it it's back to pining for the Fancy Feast.
     
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Oct 18, 2012, 11:24 AM
 
Our cats eat what we give them. We recently switched from vet provided food - $50 a huge bag - to CostCo's brand at a third of the price. No complaints so far.
     
Waragainstsleep
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Oct 18, 2012, 11:54 AM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
My dumb cat doesn't care. My smart cat likes to fool you into thinking they'll eat something else, and as soon as you buy a case of it it's back to pining for the Fancy Feast.
Yeah, that sounds about right.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
moonmonkey
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Oct 18, 2012, 07:37 PM
 
Its important to de-claw, and de-tail and de-eye.

This will keep them under control.
     
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Oct 18, 2012, 07:57 PM
 
Originally Posted by moonmonkey View Post
Its important to de-claw, and de-tail and de-eye.
This will keep them under control.
I hope you're joking. You are, aren't you?

Oh, good. *whew*
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design219
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Oct 19, 2012, 09:55 AM
 
My kitty just turned 20. Pretty old for a cat. She has always lived in door and eaten only relatively good (Iams) kitty food.

I've never had a problem sleeping with a cat in the house. You do need to be careful not to let them train you to get up and feed them early in the morning... I've heard some cats are good at doing that and starting earlier and earlier.
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Oct 19, 2012, 10:21 AM
 
A cat thread with no pictures?

     
subego
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Oct 19, 2012, 10:58 AM
 
Originally Posted by design219 View Post
My kitty just turned 20. Pretty old for a cat. She has always lived in door and eaten only relatively good (Iams) kitty food.
I've never had a problem sleeping with a cat in the house. You do need to be careful not to let them train you to get up and feed them early in the morning... I've heard some cats are good at doing that and starting earlier and earlier.
I've found flinging a pillow at them usually curbs that behavior.
     
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Oct 19, 2012, 02:35 PM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
I've found flinging a pillow at them usually curbs that behavior.
Yeah but then you can't get comfy so you don't get back to sleep because you have no pillow. Then you get up so you might as well feed them while you're up. Its all part of their plan.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
mattyb  (op)
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Oct 19, 2012, 02:46 PM
 
Not being able to get within 5m of the master bedroom is MY plan.
     
BLAZE_MkIV
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Oct 19, 2012, 02:54 PM
 
Originally Posted by mattyb View Post
Not being able to get within 5m of the master bedroom is MY plan.
Seriously I think its a little early to be exiling yourself to the couch.
     
Shaddim
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Oct 19, 2012, 02:59 PM
 
We live fairly close to the Smoky Mtns nat'l park, and my wife says she saw a pair of red wolves when she was driving out this morning. That could be bad for our cat population.

They are pretty, but not sure if I want them in my backyard.

Example:
( Last edited by reader50; Jun 7, 2013 at 04:29 AM. Reason: fixed image import)
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
- Thomas Paine
     
design219
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Oct 19, 2012, 03:01 PM
 
Originally Posted by BLAZE_MkIV View Post
Seriously I think its a little early to be exiling yourself to the couch.



So, does Mrs. mattyb have any say in this arrangement? (with the cat, that is)
__________________________________________________

My stupid iPhone game: Nesen Probe, it's rather old, annoying and pointless, but it's free.
Was free. Now it's gone. Never to be seen again.
Off to join its brother and sister apps that could not
keep up with the ever updating iOS. RIP Nesen Probe.
     
design219
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Oct 19, 2012, 03:07 PM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
We live fairly close to the Smoky Mtns nat'l park, and my wife says she saw a pair of red wolves when she was driving out this morning. That could be bad for our cat population.
They are pretty, but not sure if I want them in my backyard.
Example:
Is she sure it was a wolf? I ask because supposedly there are no wolves left in the Smokey Mountains anymore. There was a re-introduction effort in the 90s, but it ended in failure and the remainders were all accounted for and removed.
( Last edited by reader50; Jun 7, 2013 at 04:30 AM. Reason: fixed image import)
__________________________________________________

My stupid iPhone game: Nesen Probe, it's rather old, annoying and pointless, but it's free.
Was free. Now it's gone. Never to be seen again.
Off to join its brother and sister apps that could not
keep up with the ever updating iOS. RIP Nesen Probe.
     
Shaddim
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Oct 19, 2012, 03:12 PM
 
I asked if they could have been coyotes but she says they weren't.
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
- Thomas Paine
     
Shaddim
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Oct 19, 2012, 03:18 PM
 
From the wiki article:

The current status of the “non-essential/ experimental” population in North Carolina is “endangered” and the population numbers around 100 wild animals.
That's just over a couple mountains.
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
- Thomas Paine
     
subego
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Oct 19, 2012, 06:03 PM
 
Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep View Post
Yeah but then you can't get comfy so you don't get back to sleep because you have no pillow. Then you get up so you might as well feed them while you're up. Its all part of their plan.
I've got three shots in the magazine and one in the pipe.
     
 
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