[Rumor]

I have watched the whole thing yet since I am working. However, so far they have both done a good job.

[subego]

There needs to be an option for "bored now".

[CRASH HARDDRIVE]

Agreed. Put me down for vote #2 for "bored now", or "I couldn't care less who 'won' another talking point snore-fest"

[Big Mac]

McCain, but he's still holding back for some reason.

[macintologist]

McCain called Obama "that one"

[Shaddim]

I still think "Barry" would have been better.

[Krusty]

Originally Posted by CRASH HARDDRIVE 

Agreed. Put me down for vote #2 for "bored now", or "I couldn't care less who 'won' another talking point snore-fest"

Agreed, I think this debate was a "game changer". The game of presenting your platform is now over. It'll be all repetition of talking points + mudslinging from here on out fellas.

Stylistically, I give it close to a draw (I personally like Obama's cooler demeanor but I realize some would rather see the candidates get agitated). As far as content, we now have McCain talking about $300 billion direct to homeowners and mortgage renegotiation. Looks like the McCain camp's research and focus groups have concluded that a lot of American as pissed about a direct-to-banks bailout so now McCain is talking about what is basically a socialist-style, direct government "entitlement" intervention in people's lives. So much for the ownership society. McCain is generally on the defensive now (not as a direct result of this debate). Americans have heard his economic plan and, polls are showing, are basically rejecting it. So, he's having to move over into "liberal" territory now. His running mate has transformed from a boost into basically a non-entity at this point, and he's giving us assurances that he secretly knows answers to big problems but just isn't telegraphing them beforehand. All in all, you can almost palpably feel him falling a little behind in this race.

[Kerrigan]

The weird thing is that, at this point, these debates are designed to persuade fence-sitters in swing states. All of this hooplah is geared towards getting a few finicky people in places like Virginia to come on board. Let's hope they have good judgment, as the fate of the world may depend on them.

[hyteckit]

With all the talk by conservatives about how great McCain is during Townhall style debates for the past few months, you would expect McCain to totally kill Obama in the debate due the Obama's lack of experience. Wow, what a let down McCain.

McCain answer the first 3 questions with the same answers about bailing out homeowners by buying their mortgages and renegotiate the rates. Then the rest of the debate was about how McCain is superman and can fix every issue and tacking every single problem all at the same time in the first 2 years of his presidency.

I know how to find and catch Bin Landen
I can fix the economy
I can fix social security
I can tackle the energy crisis, the economic, and fix the entitlements all at the same time in my first 2 years of office. No need to prioritize.

How? Cause I'm a maverick.


Maverick == superman

Hey McCain. How are you tackling the Afghanistan War and Iraq War, and capturing Bin Laden all at the same time going? What's your secret strategy that no one knows about?

[macintologist]

He still referred to Obama as.. "That One"

VIDEO - http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/1..._n_132802.html

[Shaddim]

What do you think he meant by that?

Personally, I know what he was up to, but I want to see the liberal spin on it.

[hyteckit]

I don't know, let me see.

HUSSEIN
Muslim
Arab
Unpatriotic
Hates America
Terrorist Jab
Palling with terrorist

Now:

That one

Doesn't take a genius to figure out what McCain and his campaign is up to.

[hyteckit]

McCain is belittling Obama and reducing him to just a word "that one".

Not much different from McCain calling Asian people "Gooks".

McCain and his campaign will reduce Obama to just "that one".

You know, "that one" who goes palling with terrorist.

Conservatives are only good with labels.

[Shaddim]

That's what I figured most of you would think.

The reality is, he compared Obama to Bush and Cheney. He was saying that "that one" was just like "the others".

Wake up people. It wasn't a racial slur, no matter how much you yearn for it. McCain may be in ineffectual nincompoop, but he isn't a racist.

There, now stick your own labels up your bum.

[hyteckit]

Right, and Gooks is not a racist term.

Whether it is racist or not, those terms are use to belittle someone.

Might as well just call McCain an old man from now on. Forget about using John McCain's name.

That old man.

[Paco500]

Originally Posted by Shaddim 

That's what I figured most of you would think.

The reality is, he compared Obama to Bush and Cheney. He was saying that "that one" was just like "the others".

Wake up people. It wasn't a racial slur, no matter how much you yearn for it. McCain may be in ineffectual nincompoop, but he isn't a racist.

There, now stick your own labels up your bum.

What the hell are you talking about? Who called the comment racist? It was compared to his use of a racist term, but that was part of an assertion that he was just trying to belittle him. I think you are the only one who saw racism here.

Am I wrong? Do any liberals here think he was being racist?

[hyteckit]

You know who keeps calling Asian people "Gooks"?

That old man.

[Paco500]

BTW, I don't think it was a concious effort on McCain's part to belittle Obama, I think McCain's temper got away from him and he wasn't thinking clearly. I've only seen clips and not the whole debate, but it looked to me to have been said in anger rather than as calculated slur of any kind.

[Big Mac]

Are you completely out of ideas, hyteckit? Yes, he called his captors gooks. The ones who tortured them. He was very specific on that point. Not all Vietnamese or all Asians like you imply. Do I think it was politically smart for him to say? No. But look at the context. I'm sure you'd come with some choice slurs for your captors if you were subjected to torture like McCain was. McCain was also the leading force in the Senate behind normalizing American relations with Vietnam.

You know, you're the type of person who writes in the media that Sarah Palin's comments are "tinged with racism" simply because she says Obama has palled around with domestic terrorists. Despite the fact that Bill Ayers is white. The left likes to find racism in everything. If you criticize Obama over anything there's a chance you'll be called a racist for it, simply because you're criticizing a black person. If you criticize Freddie and Fannie Barney Frank calls you a racist. It doesn't serve your cause; I'd say it annoys those not on the left and takes power away from all allegations of racism.

[hyteckit]

Originally Posted by Big Mac 

Are you completely out of ideas hyteckit? Yes, he called his captors gooks. The ones who tortured them. Not all Vietnamese or all Asians like you imply. He was also the leading force in the Senate behind normalizing American relations with Vietnam.

Yeah, and I'm Asian. Those white folks who call me a gook must think I'm one of those captors who torture POW during Vietnam War before I was born.

Gooks is a derogatory term for Asians, so why don't you STFU.

[hyteckit]

McCain use the term "Gooks" to belittle his captors.

Not much different from McCain using "that one" to belittle Obama.

[Paco500]

Originally Posted by hyteckit 

Gooks is a derogatory term for Asians, so why don't you STFU.

Give it a rest, McCain was a POW and a hero, it's ok for him to be racist. I'm surprised you didn't know that.
I hope it's understood that the sarcasm tag is implied

[hyteckit]

Originally Posted by Paco500 

Give it a rest, McCain was a POW and a hero, it's ok for him to be racist. I'm surprised you didn't know that.

I'm not saying McCain is racist. Just saying he is using a derogatory term to belittle someone or some group of people. And no, it's not okay to use a derogatory term for Asians, just because he was a POW of the Vietnamese.

I don't care if he was beaten up and torture by a group of black people. Doesn't mean it's okay for him to use the 'N' word to refer to those who torture him.

[Big Mac]

Originally Posted by hyteckit 

Gooks is a derogatory term for Asians, so why don't you STFU.

You're treating me like I used the term. Many of my best friends growing up were Chinese, so why don't you STFU? Besides, you're not the only member of a minority group to have to deal with bigotry.

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by Kerrigan 

The weird thing is that, at this point, these debates are designed to persuade fence-sitters in swing states. All of this hooplah is geared towards getting a few finicky people in places like Virginia to come on board. Let's hope they have good judgment, as the fate of the world may depend on them.

Makes you feel good, don't it? The fate of the entire western world resting in the hands of a bunch of folks who can't make their minds up and will vote based on how good the candidates' hair looked at the last debate before the election.

[Paco500]

Originally Posted by hyteckit 

I'm not saying McCain is racist. Just saying he is using a derogatory term to belittle someone or some group of people. And no, it's not okay to use a derogatory term for Asians, just because he was a POW of the Vietnamese.

I don't care if he was beaten up and torture by a group of black people. Doesn't mean it's okay for him to use the 'N' word to refer to those who torture him.

Originally Posted by Paco500

Give it a rest, McCain was a POW and a hero, it's ok for him to be racist. I'm surprised you didn't know that.
I hope it's understood that the sarcasm tag is implied

Note the white text.
I guess I should have made the sarcasm tag more obvious.

[ebuddy]

I voted "neither".

This was supposed to be McCain's style of debate and while he did a better job of addressing those in the hall more intimately, he didn't serve himself very well at all to the public at large IMO.

- Obama challenged McCain by connecting him to deregulation. McCain let that one stick to him like stink on sh!t. Hardly touched it. In fact, there were a litany of accusations against McCain that he hardly touched. It was as if McCain (or an advisor) advised McCain to lay off.

- McCain challenged Obama's notion of "the government is always the answer" which worked great until introducing (completely unannounced) the "government solution" of a massive nationalization of bad paper all across Main St. while most are still reeling from assuming the bad paper of Wall St. WTF?!?

While McCain managed to not remind people of his age, this one was a draw with advantage Obama. My prediction is that this will not have moved voters in either direction. If there is movement at all in the coming days, it will be due in part to ratcheting up some 527s against Obama.

[ebuddy]

I might be interested in one of those colorful Ron Paul bumper stickers. Anyone know where I can get one?

[Wiskedjak]

Originally Posted by macintologist 

He still referred to Obama as.. "That One"

VIDEO - http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/1..._n_132802.html

Personally, that doesn't matter much to me, except in the context of all the fuss over Obama calling McCain "John".

[Wiskedjak]

Originally Posted by Paco500 

What the hell are you talking about? Who called the comment racist? It was compared to his use of a racist term, but that was part of an assertion that he was just trying to belittle him. I think you are the only one who saw racism here.

Am I wrong? Do any liberals here think he was being racist?

Paco, that was just Shaddim's prepared response. Probably all he saw was the 'gook' statement and jerked his knee from there.

[zerostar]

Originally Posted by ebuddy 

I might be interested in one of those colorful Ron Paul bumper stickers. Anyone know where I can get one?

which one? the red ones?

[TheMosco]

I think McCain actually did decent on the Economy, but I think Obama won on foreign policy.

Overall, again I think Obama came off as more presidential. He was calm and cool. McCain seemed to be getting kind of cranky. So much so that apparently he didn't even shake his hand at the end?

[SpaceMonkey]

Originally Posted by TheMosco 

Overall, again I think Obama came off as more presidential. He was calm and cool. McCain seemed to be getting kind of cranky. So much so that apparently he didn't even shake his hand at the end?

That was just smart politics. McCain knows that if he shakes Obama's hand, then it becomes a "working relationship," and how's he going to explain that to the base?

[tie]

Originally Posted by ebuddy 

- McCain challenged Obama's notion of "the government is always the answer" which worked great until introducing (completely unannounced) the "government solution" of a massive nationalization of bad paper all across Main St. while most are still reeling from assuming the bad paper of Wall St. WTF?!?

He said that he wanted the government to guarantee that home prices wouldn't fall any more. I think it is brilliant. Next the government should just guarantee our salaries, and I think we'll all be set.

[ShortcutToMoncton]

Originally Posted by SpaceMonkey 

That was just smart politics. McCain knows that if he shakes Obama's hand, then it becomes a "working relationship," and how's he going to explain that to the base?

Haha, but I thought he "reached across the aisle?"

greg

[SpaceMonkey]

There should really be a poll option for Tom Brokaw. I think he was the only clear winner here.

[stupendousman]

Originally Posted by SpaceMonkey 

That was just smart politics. McCain knows that if he shakes Obama's hand, then it becomes a "working relationship," and how's he going to explain that to the base?

Good call. I wouldn't shake the hand of a guy who is a terrorist sympathizer either. With the race tightening back down to a statistical tie in several major polls again, McCain doesn't need a backlash from the "anti-terrorist", "anti-throwing your friends under the bus and lying about it when it's politically necessary" crowd. It might send Obama over the 6-8 points up he needs to beat the "Bradley Effect" and the democrat over-representation weighting in the polls.

Smart move.

[paul w]

I really don't care about the That one remark, the constant drone of "my friends" or whatever. McCain had a couple good moments and his ending, while blissfully vague, was far better and more eloquent than Obama's.

But overall Obama communicated better, with more ease and fluidity. The messages by both haven't changed either so I don't see how that helps McCain unless people start furiously poring over his record.

But I don't see how people can watch the debate on anything other than PBS - I flipped around and the on screen graphics are insanely intrusive. Ugh...

[Mrjinglesusa]

Originally Posted by stupendousman 

Good call. I wouldn't shake the hand of a guy who is a terrorist sympathizer either.

Oh, so now Obama is a "terrorist sympathizer"?

I hereby take back the apology I made in the other thread. You ARE a right-wing wacko.

[TheMosco]

Originally Posted by paul w 

I really don't care about the That one remark, the constant drone of "my friends" or whatever. McCain had a couple good moments and his ending, while blissfully vague, was far better and more eloquent than Obama's.

Yeah, I don't think that one was racist or anything like some people make it out to be. I think it did seem like McCain was flustered, but there def wasn't any racism behind it.

And in regard to PBS... I watched some of the aftershow from FOX news. It was pretty crazy. First of all, they had something like 90 percent of their text vote saying that McCain won. They also had people like people like fred thompson and carl rove for commentary. Would have liked to see a little more fair and balanced views on the fair and balanced new channel.

[ort888]

I think he had a "zinger" planned out where he would say... "and guess which Senator voted for BLANK... {PAUSE} ...that one!"

It seems to me that he just screwed up on the delivery. While it came out sounding pretty horrible, there really is nothing to see here folks.

[RAILhead]

Originally Posted by hyteckit 

McCain use the term "Gooks" to belittle his captors.

Not much different from McCain using "that one" to belittle Obama.

So if someone kidnaps my family and I call him a jackass, you'd object? I "bewiddled" the poor guy that captured and tortured my family by calling him a jackass.

You need to check your crop, man, because whatever you're smoking has more octane than you can handle...

[RAILhead]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

Makes you feel good, don't it? The fate of the entire western world resting in the hands of a bunch of folks who can't make their minds up and will vote based on how good the candidates' hair looked at the last debate before the election.

Not just her hair -- she has GREAT legs, too, man!

oh wait...

[stupendousman]

Originally Posted by Mrjinglesusa 

Oh, so now Obama is a "terrorist sympathizer"?

What do you call a guy who has no problem attending parties hosted by a terrorist? I didn't though call him a "terror" sympathizer. I don't think Obama himself wants to bomb things. He just doesn't have a big problem if those who surround him do.

I hereby take back the apology I made in the other thread. You ARE a right-wing wacko.

When you can't defend, attack. Noted.

[TheMosco]

Originally Posted by stupendousman 

When you can't defend, attack. Noted.

That's what McCain has been forced too do....

[TheWOAT]

Well, my father still uses the term "Gooks" from time to time, and since I wasnt the one being shot at for 4+ years in a foreign land, who am I to judge.

Where do you order those Ron Paul bumper stickers?

[goMac]

McCain came off as an angry old man. He likes to talk about his ability to work across the aisle, but the only person I saw being polite to the other side of the aisle was Obama.

[Mrjinglesusa]

Originally Posted by stupendousman 

What do you call a guy who has no problem attending parties hosted by a terrorist? I didn't though call him a "terror" sympathizer. I don't think Obama himself wants to bomb things. He just doesn't have a big problem if those who surround him do.



When you can't defend, attack. Noted.

Defend WHAT exactly? The right-wing wacko mantras that Obama "pals around with terrorists" and is a "terrorist sympathizer"?? Give me a break. Those lies are so far fetched and ridiculous they don't deserve consideration.

It's been repeated over and over and over again - Obama has PUBLICLY stated that he doesn't condone or support what Ayers did 40 YEARS AGO, when Obama was only 8 years old.

[TheMosco]

Originally Posted by goMac 

McCain came off as an angry old man. He likes to talk about his ability to work across the aisle, but the only person I saw being polite to the other side of the aisle was Obama.

Yeah, he def came off as a dick. The tone in which he said that one. And just so people don't think I am trying to make that one into a big deal. He could have used Senator Obama there and the tone wouldn't have changed. Throughout the debate, his tone was just angry.

[Shaddim]

Originally Posted by Wiskedjak 

Paco, that was just Shaddim's prepared response. Probably all he saw was the 'gook' statement and jerked his knee from there.

His comment was DIRECTLY compared to racial slurs, that's hardly a knee jerk. I explained where McCain was coming from with the statement, and it makes perfect sense.

Seriously, wtf is wrong with "you people"?