[Chuckit]

Originally Posted by gregarios 

Yes, but not ONLY the iPod. (-;

And not ONLY Macintosh desktops, either.

There's a lot of stuff I wanted to see but didn't, but it just ain't right to say that there was nothing impressive or that Apple is out of line talking about its revolutionary new products at MacWorld. I just hope we'll get a special event in the next couple of weeks.

[gooser]

i for one was very pleased. none of the new products (all 3 of them) appeal to me, but i don't need to want anything new. i'm pleased with my old hardware and software.

[drainyoo]

Originally Posted by Gamoe 

Constructive Reply.

Thanks.

[twdawson]

Thats easy for you to say when every product launched is aimed at the us market.

[frankthetank966]

I think they released some awesome products (wireless and iphone) but I would have liked them to release some Leopard news.

p.s. is it over?

[dimmer]

Remember how we laughed at how weak what the Xume could do over WiFi? What can the iPhone do? Sync with a computer? (nope, needs USB cable), share music? nope. A little bit over VoIP (even that basically TBA). And remember how Plays-for-sure didn't with Zume? You also don't get iTunes on your iPhone: back to your computer, upload via USB again. Kinda a snoozer (not totally unexpected: 802.11 still uses far more power than portable devices like).

Still, there's room to improve. That's always been the "Apple Way" -- you get a great new product, then we make it better, then we make it better, then we make it better and so forth. Worked well for the iPod, probably will for the iPhone.

[Chuckit]

Originally Posted by dimmer 

Remember how we laughed at how weak what the Xume could do over WiFi? What can the iPhone do? Sync with a computer? (nope, needs USB cable), share music? nope. A little bit over VoIP (even that basically TBA).

And e-mail. And Web browsing. And Google Maps. And stocks. And weather. And probably some other stuff down the road when Apple decides to let in more programs.

Originally Posted by dimmer 

And remember how Plays-for-sure didn't with Zume? You also don't get iTunes on your iPhone: back to your computer, upload via USB again.

What does that have to do with people's music being unplayable on the Zune?

[ryarber]

Originally Posted by Big Mac 

OS core changes that "none of us understand here"? MacNN's a pretty sophisticated place, and while you may not like such details other people do. Apple essentially left the computers out of the equation, and unfortunately that implies to me that Leopard is not ready for prime time yet.

When I say "here," I mean Macworld. This isn't exactly WWDC.

[xe0]

For those people that missed it. I'll sat it again:

Originally Posted by xe0 

when Apple first released the iPod, people were very confused and gave harsh disapproval of Apple.

Once again some people are displaying the same characteristics of this iPhone focused expo. Im sure in a few years the proliferation of the iPhone will garner a very different retrospective take on this expo.

[itguy05]

Originally Posted by mac128k-1984 

I suppose but my contract is up and I'm month to month. I don't know if I want to wait 6 months plus my wife isn't all that happy with cingular and wants to jump ship to verizon.

Verizon isn't much better. It's really not the network. I know, I've had both and Cingular is better than Verizon.

[- - e r i k - -]

OK, colour me pretty ignorant about US network carriers and their dragonian policies, but isn't Verizon the one who brands their phone not only with their colours and menu options - but also cripples existing phone features that might interfere with their own? Basic features like bluetooth file transfer?

If so, how can anyone prefer such a company. Unless that is of course that the competition has equal measures of fascist business practices.

TWO YEAR lock-in contract? Surely they must be joking

[larrinski]

At least Macs and OSX are modern enough that we don't need an upgrade like Windows customers do. I can wait, though in feels like Santa forgot to come to my house

[fx9xx04]

Yeah, after like an hour of the whole iPhone, I found myself back in reality, asking myself how much this phone is gonna cost, and where the hell are the display and software updates?

[kdaniel]

Safari crashed once while I was trying to read these posts... email has crashed once today.

Steve Jobs thinks it's more of a priority to take the word "computer" out of the title of the company and give us more eye candy than to fix long standing problems that affect the very real usability of their software.

Steve Jobs thinks it's perfectly OK to completely ignore Mac users who have kept Apple COMPUTER afloat through MANY years of crap and give them an over-priced cellphone dependent on a cellular network that has lousy coverage (at least where I live)... plus having to shell our $50-$80/month for a data plan.... never mind those of us who would like the same functionality as a PDA... much less a 'tablet mac'...

And never mind those of us who are more interested in the fact that the ONLY expandable Mac costs $2500... for an overdesigned computer that many of us don't need (but would still like something that is at least somewhat expandable)

Steve Jobs thinks it's ALL about iPods and cellphones...

Some of us are JUST interested in computers and software from APPLE COMPUTER!
NOT more eye candy from Apple "consumer product" INC.

This is the first year I don't even have the interest to download his "keynote" address... He had absolutely nothing to say that interests me.

[vinster]

Originally Posted by macgeek2005 

I want a hard drive based widescreen ipod!! What are they thinking with this "3 in one" thing??? Are they gonna at least leave the regular ipods as they are, so that they have SOME hard drive based players???

That is exactly what I was waiting for. I could care less about an iPhone.

I'm now in the process of getting my 2nd-gen iPod repaired. It and my Nokia 8801 should be good for quite a while.

[siMac]

Originally Posted by Hi I'm Ben 

Apple's New Thing - Mac Forums

Originally Posted by elitemacor

10-23-2001, 01:29 PM
iCan't believe it! It's now at the online Apple Store!

$400 for an Mp3 Player!

I'd call it the Cube 2.0 as it wont sell, and be killed off in a short time...and it's not really functional.

Uuhh Steve, can I have a PDA now?

LOL, brilliant! Would you like some ketchup with those words, sir?

[Madrag]

I'm curious to see if this thing will have the same success as the iPod did...
I wonder if they don't, they'll quietely remove the new area from the apple's site and cary on doing great macs. I hope.

[David Esrati]

Do you think Jobs and company care about you? No 1 slot mac since the LC-
no- it's all about STOCK PRICE_ and as you see- this keynote added billions to their pockets for a product that hasn't shipped- and can't be verified as really working.
Would speed bumps- iLife or iWork 07- or an iSight do that- no-
Even if they had a slick new subcompact notebook it wouldn't change the stock price-
I'm pretty sure Jobs was using a new version of Keynote- the section where all the features flew in like a typewriter while moving looked like a new effect-
They can't do a widescreen ipod until they have the phone selling like hotcakes- all the parts will be stockpiled to make the iPhone until probably past XMas- and just like the intro of the Razr- other phone companies will get the iPhone- just after CIngular gets a bump in customers.
No quad cores yet- but- the moment the stock starts to drop- you will see more announcements-

[ccwillows]

Apple was smart to use Macworld to tout this new phone. It was the kind of product, like the iPod, that the average consumer can relate to. Not everyone is a Macaholic and with the kind of press that Macworld gets, Apple will need that to break into the cell phone market. The fact is that phones are easier to understand than operating systems and applications.

In the process of introducing the iPhone, Apple also introduced the next ipod line, and some of the future of OS X. Also, if the new touch screen works in a phone, why not, eventually, a laptop?

A brand new product will always garner greater press than a revision to an old product. If Apple successfully breaks into the cell phone market, all it means is more money/resources available for the company to continue to develop great computers and software for those of us who love the company for that reason. In other words, what is good for Apple is good for the users/fans.

[NeXTLoop]

And ultimately, new products like this just further expand Apple's overall appeal. People see the iPhone, they're already using the iPod....... next thing they know....... their next computer is a Mac.

It's been beaten to death, but if the Halo Effect exists....... this is only going to make it that much stronger.

Overall..... a good day for Apple!

[f1000]

Apple needed to introduce the iPhone at MacWorld because, as with the iPod, the early adopters will undoubtedly be from among the Mac faithful. True Macheads don't need a MacWorld keynote to be up on the latest Mac-related hardware updates, so Jobs would've squandered his keynote by introducing traditional OS X related products to us.

What Apple needs to do now is continue expanding marketshare. Apple has tried to this in the past, mostly for naught, but the iPod has finally done what both the iMac and OS X couldn't. As Apple gains mindshare, traditional computer and OS X sales will follow. That's something every true Machead can look forward to.

[JKT]

An interesting perspective for all the naysayers here - Apple (probably) did release a new computer into the world on Tuesday, only it is dressed up as a phone and an iPod. The one remaining question is how much access third party developers are going to get to this. My view is that Apple has left the ground open for them - the way that there is a large gap in the lower half of the icon view on the Home page of the phone just cries out for applications to be written that will fill it:



If Apple decides to keep it a closed system, that will be the biggest mistake they will ever make IMO.

[mdc]

There is a lot that Apple could've done to open up the iPod for everyone, but they never did and it still has done very well.

Honestly, I do not see Apple opening the iPhone. I see them bringing out software updates for it which will give new applications.

Widgets on the other hand. Since the iPhone does run Safari, and all widgets are are simple (and some not so simple) webpages, I could see Apple letting people install Widgets onto the iPhone.
Hopefully this is true since, in my opinion, widgets are a very good way to get quick access to specific information. Weather, Stocks, etc.

[Seattle]

Since iLife 07 and iWork 07 were not released when would be the next most likely time that they would be?

[mdc]

For some reason I have this feeling that 10.5 is going to do a lot with Core Animation, and I also think that iLife and iWork 07 are going to use Core Animation for a lot of their new features.

I think Apple did the right thing by focusing this MacWorld on the iPhone and leaving 10.5 for it's own 'media event'.
I have no reason to believe they won't meet their Spring '07 shipping date, and I think iLife and iWork are going to be shipping alongside 10.5.

Did anyone notice the new effects in Keynote?

[ginoledesma]

Several people at the expo as well were "disappointed" in the sense that there wasn't anything they could carry home with them. At the very least, if iLife '07 were announced and made available, that would be something. You can tell this also from the SF Apple Store -- where I guess they were expecting more foot traffic due to the keynote. But without a product that can be solved, they didn't have as much traffic.

Which leads me to think that iLife '07 et al will be very heavily integrated with Leopard (though that's a given already).

[Seattle]

Originally Posted by mdc 

For some reason I have this feeling that 10.5 is going to do a lot with Core Animation, and I also think that iLife and iWork 07 are going to use Core Animation for a lot of their new features.

I think Apple did the right thing by focusing this MacWorld on the iPhone and leaving 10.5 for it's own 'media event'.
I have no reason to believe they won't meet their Spring '07 shipping date, and I think iLife and iWork are going to be shipping alongside 10.5.

Did anyone notice the new effects in Keynote?

Do you think that iLife 07 and iWork 07 will require OSX 10.5?

[gregarios]

Originally Posted by Chuckit 

And not ONLY Macintosh desktops, either.

There's a lot of stuff I wanted to see but didn't, but it just ain't right to say that there was nothing impressive or that Apple is out of line talking about its revolutionary new products at MacWorld. I just hope we'll get a special event in the next couple of weeks.

Yeah, yeah... whatever... All I'm saying is when I go to Kentucky Fried Chicken I expect there to be at least ONE thing on the menu containing CHICKEN.

[Chuckit]

Originally Posted by Seattle 

Do you think that iLife 07 and iWork 07 will require OSX 10.5?

If mdc is right (and I'd say there's a good chance he is), then they would pretty much have to require it.

[G0Ducks]

I have read almost all of the previous posts now, and I think I have a new view of what's going on now at apple and what might be going on in the future.

Firstly, let me say that my frustrations with the keynote were misdirected. I am not frustrated that I would have to fork out $500 - $600 for a great three in one device, it is that I will have to pay $60 - $80 (or more depending on how much I download, email, Text, use the internet features of the phone) per month to keep the phone functioning as advertised.

Secondly, regarding the "no Leopard" issue. There have been some fairly inteligant posts regarding this issue, and I have to say that I agree with some of them.
1. If Leopard were to be briefed now, people would destroy it under whatever unfinished state it is on.
2. WE as openly-admitted fan-boys (I am... Admittedly) would also start to haggle it because it is incomplete and without a directional context (I mean to say that we couldn't see the entire scope of things... after all, none of us are prophets/clairvoyant).
3. Come on... Beyond the miniscule scrap of info we have, this bit of stress is actually kind of fun! I mean, I love to speculate about what it is or isn't going to be like. Being in the dark, seeing a glimpse of light, allowing our hopes to illuminate the possibilities... that drives me crazy in a good way (I just know there is an ad campaign in there for Illuminous .)

Anyway. I hope that Apple Inc. is working their asses off on this, making the OS at least as cool as their great new phone/ipod/internet communicator.

R

[JKT]

Originally Posted by mdc 

There is a lot that Apple could've done to open up the iPod for everyone, but they never did and it still has done very well.

However, the iPod is "just" a digital music player, the iPhone has the potential to be a UMPC that happens to also be an iPod and a phone. This puts it in a different category entirely - the iPod only had to be good at one thing - playing music. By marketing the iPhone as a smartphone, it needs to be good at several things, as well as being good as a phone.

FWIW, I didn't necessarily mean that Apple should open it to all and sundry - given that the iPhone's embedded OS is going to have limited functionality compared to the desktop version, it would be necessary for Apple to exert control over who could and could not develop for the phone - but it would be foolish for them to exclude third parties, just because.

E.g. people on the OmniGroup forums are already hoping for the prospect of having a version of OmniOutliner and/or OmniFocus on the phone; people are definitely going to want to have some form of text and spreadsheet viewing application for looking at and editing their Pages/Calc/Word/Excel files; a Keynote and Powerpoint viewer would also be great (thinking about that - the video playback feature of the phone would work here as the next version of Keynote could offer an iPhone export option); an image editing application and an illustration application (draw with your finger) would make perfect sense; etc. Will Apple be able to deliver all this themselves? Perhaps, but it would be far better for the end user if they had a choice of apps from multiple developers to pick from.

iPhone specific widgets would be the logical first step.

In any case, we are beginning to see this with the iPod already - Apple isn't developing the games for the iPods.

On a different tack, the one killer "application" for me would be the ability to choose to have the data on the phone encrypted and have it password protected whenever it goes to sleep. I dread the moment I misplace or have my current phone stolen given how easy it would be for someone to learn an awful lot of information about me and my friends/family/colleagues. As far as I know, there aren't any phones out there that currently do a good job of protecting your information on them.

[rlorenc]

The killer app--or feature--for me would be if that Home button were really an iSight so that the iPhone could have mobile video chats.

I suppose that that would need a faster network, i.e. 3G, eh?

(In fact, I thought that the Home button was, indeed, an iSight originally.)

[Javizun]

What a dissapoinment overall.

tO ALL OF us who actually put smartphones to use and neeed them beyond multi-media
apple could have dont something so much greater then this .

[Carmissimo]

Originally Posted by Horsepoo!!! 

iPhone is definitely cool...but for everyone but Cingular users (US-only), it's a huge let down until, at the earliest, Q4.

But because most people won't be able to use the iPhone, the only other decent product announcement was Apple TV.

I can't believe Leopard wasn't shown either. This leads me to believe that Leopard is *far* from being finished.

Jobs prizes himself to show new features...and none were shown. There's definitely something wrong here.

I don't even think we should expect Leopard until June or July. Same for iWork and iLife.

All the rumor sites overhyped this ****in' thing. They're probably all wondering what the **** happened. John Siracussa and Gruber were both soooo wrong it's not even funny.

All the asses at Ars are probably staring at their blank bingo cards right now (ok...not blank but close.)

I think you've got it all wrong. The iPhone is such a spectacular product that Jobs decided – correctly I think – that there is no point in having talked about all the other stuff going on at Apple on account of nobody would be paying any attention to it anyway.

In other words, he did it that way so that all the other stuff would not get lost amidst the iPhone buzz.

I expect an Apple media event, likely by early February though possibly closer to the end of February or early March, during which all the stuff we'd usually see at an event like MWSF will be presented. First though, the shockwaves from the remarkable iPhone will need to have subsided. Think if it as getting free publicity now and more still later.

[CheesePuff]

Originally Posted by Javizun 

What a dissapoinment overall.

tO ALL OF us who actually put smartphones to use and neeed them beyond multi-media
apple could have dont something so much greater then this .

Has FULL Mail, Address Book, iCal, noties, iTunes and web browsing (not WAP) but does not do what smart phones do?

[sessamoid]

Since Leopard is not ready for release yet, talking about it at MWSF doesn't accomplish anything except maybe keep a few people from bitching about his keynote not talking about the OS. The iPhone announcement is so big that anything he revealed about Leopard would have been ignored and minimized, which is not how Jobs wants the OS treated by the media. The iPhone was announced 6 months before release because the FCC filing would have revealed all the details about the phone shortly anyway, so he had to make the announcement now.

I expect another media event in a month or so to talk about Leopard, iWork, and iLife updates, closer to when they are ready for release.

[scotth_uk]

Originally Posted by TheoCryst 

Now would be a fairly poor time to throw Leopard info out

Couldn't agree more. Why unveil your latest and greatest OS when Vista is clearly the subject of much attention at present. I also think that any amazing OSX stuff unveiled now will give MS more time to develop something similar.

[lookmark]

"See you soon."

[Macpilot]

Apple can release stuff when it is ready. I could not care less if they announce it at Macworld or anywhere else.

So what if they announced nothing about Leopard or any new Macs?

Who says Steve won't have a "media event" anytime soon?

To say that Apple won't be getting your money based on a keynote is quite silly.

As if Apple has not been working to bring new products besides the iPhone and Apple TV along.

Lighten up people, move along.

[Dark Goob]

Get a life. 10.4 is such a great OS, I'm not in a hurry to upgrade to 10.5. I'd rather that Apple take its time, space out its stock-price-raising announcements if it feels like it. Sure it would be great to hear more about what the features of 10.5 are, like the rumored resolution-independent UI. But that would be a huge leap forward and I'm sure is going to take a lot of programming changes across the board to work flawlessly and fast.

I had the same thought, that it would be good for Apple to give something about 10.5 in order to combat Microsoft's Vista launch. However I think Apple realizes that the average consumer is not going to be able to understand the things about 10.5 that really make it better. As you can see, Apple is focusing on emotional, not technical, type advertising when it comes to Mac vs. PC. I think they want to let Vista start generating its own bad press (much like the PS3 is now doing) before they then introduce something else.

Also I think Apple wanted to isolate the iPhone, which is an incredible device, and which deserved the type of solo introduction that it got.

If you should be upset about anything at all, you should be upset about Apple's adoption of TPM, as well as everyone else's adoption of it in the industry. The TPM (trusted computing) chip is a fricking nightmare they are about to rape us with and will make DRM look like software piracy.

-=DG=-

[NeilCharter]

Here's my 2 cents:

1. Apple needed to launch a phone solution because that is the way technology will be going. The iPhone is a superb piece of engineering but it is a long term venture much like the iPod was. I believe that the iPod was originally priced at $499 and only available in the US for a while. I remember they sold 150K units in the first quarter or so. It took me 2 years with the launch of the 3G iPod to come on board. I really wanted one earlier but wasn't prepared to pay the price for the earlier capacities. So I really think in 2 years time the iPhone will be available for the majority of networks and I'll probably get one then. It will be as successful as the iPhone.

2. 10.5 deserves a lot more attention that Jobs could have given in the keynote with iTV and iPhone being announced. Hopefully they are still on track for an April release and if so there will be a big special event about a month or two weeks before where Jobs will go over the new OS and announce the release date. Also they may have wanted to wait until after Vista is released to the unsuspecting public to let all that die down so that the impact of 10.5 is heightened.

3. Likewise any other software announcements will wait till Leopard 's release simply because they will be complimentary to the new OS.

4. iPod development will be interesting. My only disappointment is that the widescreen iPod didn't happen. I've got money set aside for that but with the iPhone I doubt that they will release a WS iPod anytime soon. That's a shame cos in the short term they could make a lot of dough out of that until the iPhone get traction.

5. I for one am happy that Apple have more than one successful product line. Computers will still be important because they will be central to the digital hub approach for quite a while, until chips and the networks become fast enough to do everything online.

6. Trusted computing? Well FWIW there's a lot more of that going on in the Windows world and I'm sure sooner or later we'll all have to pay for everything we use.

[Brass]

Here's an idea as to why Leopard could not be ready for MW...

Apple is very secretive about new products, such as the iPhone. I bet that many of the Mac OS X developers did not even know about the iPhone. Therefore all the integration required to be build into Leopard to work with the iPhone, could not be done before the iPhone was announced. Ie now.

So maybe now the OS X developers have been given an urgent assignment: ie, make it work with iPhone!

maybe... maybe not.

[romeosc]

Originally Posted by f1000 

I, for one, am a very happy camper. I wish I could buy one of the iPhones before they receive FCC approval just to fiddle around with the UI. If there's any downside to the iPhone, it's that its not 3G but 2.5G (no UMTS/HSDPA). I hate the thought of having to regress back to EDGE.

I'm also happy with the new Apple TV unit. I'm looking for a way to streamline the UI to our plasma HDTV, and this is just the ticket. I may wait for others to catch the bugs before jumping on this one, though.

The iPod created a fantastic new market for Apple and I hope the iPhone does the same.

Apple came out with AppleTV too little too late(http://www.slingcommunity.com/articl...nd-More-to-TVs) Sling beat them to punch with a much better product!

Allows sending and saving to a hard drive EVEN protected programing.

I love my 2 Slingbox AVs I have connected to 2 DirecTV Tivos. One in Living room and 1 in Master Bedroom.

I can watch, pause, fast forward and record from hotel room while I am out of town on business. I can actually watch both at same time in dual windows to watch 2 ballgames at same time that might even be "blacked out" in the city I'm visiting!

I am waiting for the new SlingCatcher announced at CES!

[f1000]

I've been intrigued by the SlingCatcher, but didn't really know much about it. Thanks for the info, romeosc!

[hldan]

Originally Posted by twdawson 

Thats easy for you to say when every product launched is aimed at the us market.

No offense to you personally but I for one am really getting tired of the people that live outside the U.S. complaining about certain Apple products not be distributed worldwide. There are so many things in the world of electronics that practically live in Japan, China and Europe and never make it to the U.S. and we aren't whining about it. Not everything made in the U.S. has to be shared abroad.

[twdawson]

Why not when British mac fans are happy enough to spend money on the best computers around, should we not be allowed to buy the other stuff as well.
What we Brits are sick of is no movies or tv shows on the itunes music store. How long have they been available in the US, quite a while now, but apple is expecting us to buy music and be happy, so i have stopped buying off the store until movies and tv shows are available.

[hldan]

Originally Posted by twdawson 

Why not when British mac fans are happy enough to spend money on the best computers around, should we not be allowed to buy the other stuff as well.
What we Brits are sick of is no movies or tv shows on the itunes music store. How long have they been available in the US, quite a while now, but apple is expecting us to buy music and be happy, so i have stopped buying off the store until movies and tv shows are available.

So let me understand this better, you decided to deprive yourself of the pleasure of buying music (in other words boycott iTunes) just because there are no movie downloads available for the UK? Apple is a money making company just like Microsoft so most likely they are not holding back from offering movies to your country, it may be digital rights that prevent them.

And it goes both ways buddy, there's some great stuff sold only in Europe that's not available for us in the U.S to spend our money towards. It just happens like that. Sony is famous for releasing "Japan Only" electronics that I would just love to spend my money on but they won't offer it here.

[twdawson]

I dont deprive myself of anything, if i want music i can just, and do, go out and buy a cd, its just as easy and at the end of the day its my choice.

All the tv shows that are advertised on itunes have been on the tv here for quite some time i.e 24, which i went and bought the dvds to rip them myself, so i cant see the digital rights applying to them. As for movies we get them a couple of months later on dvd than the US, so surely they can offer some of them. Apple needs to get this sorted because in my opinion they are losing a fair amount of money by not offering these for sale.

And by the way my name is not buddy its Thomas.

[larrinski]

Originally Posted by twdawson 

Why not when British mac fans are happy enough to spend money on the best computers around, should we not be allowed to buy the other stuff as well.
What we Brits are sick of is no movies or tv shows on the itunes music store. How long have they been available in the US, quite a while now, but apple is expecting us to buy music and be happy, so i have stopped buying off the store until movies and tv shows are available.

I totally agree with you. Apple has no problem advertising their wares on the apple Canada site, including the new AppleTV, but we can't get the content...

[chris v]

Originally Posted by David Esrati 

Do you think Jobs and company care about you? No 1 slot mac since the LC-
no- it's all about STOCK PRICE.

Good grief. Let's see... how does Apple drive its stock price? By selling things, that people want, at a profit. Any bump in price due to speculation is just that, on the part of the speculators. You make it sound like they're in the business of announcing vaporware solely for the reason of driving short-term gains. If they hadn't announced it in advance, you'd probably be whining about their secrecy and paranoia.

That said, I would have liked to see some updated displays, at least. The prices on their 2-year-old kit are really getting dumb.