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Cadaver · Dec 7, 2004, 12:04 AM

Listed here...
I wonder how it'll perform. Could be very interesting.

Looks like its a PPC 7447 (512K on-chip L2 cache, no L3 cache support) like the current PowerBooks use, vs. the 7455, which supports an L3 cache but only has 256K worth of L2 cache.

$499 at OWC.

Can't wait to see benchmarks between the current 1.4 - 1.5 GHz PPC 7455-based upgrades (which typically have 2MB of L3 cache but only 256K of on-chip cache) and this new 1.7 GHz 7447 (512K on-chip cache).

Wonder if this also points to a PowerBook speed bump, since this is the same chip model that the PowerBooks (and current G4 iBooks) use. A 1.7 GHz PowerBook would be killer.

Eug Wanker · Dec 7, 2004, 12:41 AM

Looks sweet, but I'd prefer a fanless 1.5 GHz 7447A for my Cube. Will Gigadesigns do it? BTW, the most recent previous ones (at least from some companies) are based off the 7457.

I don't expect to see 1.7 GHz from a 7447A in a PowerBook, but who knows...

Lateralus · Dec 7, 2004, 12:42 AM

I'll be buying one almost certainly. I am just not sure for which machine: My Digital Audio or my Cube.

A 1.7GHz Cube would be quite lust worthy...

Weezer · Dec 7, 2004, 12:42 AM

dahh I was all set to get a dual 1.2 upgrade from giga over the single 1.46, now with the single 1.7 I dont know what to do

Eug Wanker · Dec 7, 2004, 12:43 AM

I'll be buying one almost certainly. I am just not sure for which machine: My Digital Audio or my Cube.

A 1.7GHz Cube would be quite lust worthy...

How loud are those fans? That 1.3 GHz fanless 7457 for the Cube still seems quite sexay.

Lateralus · Dec 7, 2004, 12:47 AM

I don't care about the fan noise. I have had a Cube before and know first hand that trying to keep it fanless with upgrades is not worth the risk. I'd have no problem with a large fan if it will keep my components cool.

Weezer · Dec 7, 2004, 12:47 AM

so if I could get them both for $500, which would you go for, the dual 1.2 or the single 1.7? I had decided on the dual 1.2 over the single 1.46, but now I dont know. the boost in gaming that I would get with the single would be pretty big.

Lateralus · Dec 7, 2004, 12:49 AM

I suspest Giga wont be far behind Sonnet on this. Keep an eye on the field.

Given that the Sonnet upgrades aren't shipping yet, it probably wouldn't hurt to wait it out, read the reviews from people who have gotten the 1.7 Sonnets, and hopefully by then Giga will have dropped a competitor.

Eug Wanker · Dec 7, 2004, 12:57 AM

Originally posted by Lateralus:
I don't care about the fan noise. I have had a Cube before and know first hand that trying to keep it fanless with upgrades is not worth the risk. I'd have no problem with a large fan if it will keep my components cool.

I care somewhat bout the fan noise. Low flow fans are fine, but I have no idea how quiet or loud the fans are for the CPU upgrades.

BTW, does Sonnet still require removal of the heatsink? IIRC, the Gigadesigns modules include the heatsink.

I wasn't plannng to upgrade until 2005, and the 2 week wait for the Sonnet pretty much seals that anyway.

jrramsey · Dec 7, 2004, 01:04 AM

I wonder if PowerLogix has something up their sleeve...they've been promising for months with no delivery. Maybe dual?

Weezer · Dec 7, 2004, 03:35 AM

any word on what the native chip speed is? Is this a 1.42 overclocked to 1.7?

Lateralus · Dec 7, 2004, 03:40 AM

Probably 1.5s OC'd to 1.7 with a voltage boost I'd imagine.

LeeG · Dec 7, 2004, 10:19 AM

I had just about settled into buying th OWC 1.4 @ $389 - now for $110 more, I can get a 1.7? Hmmm. Sounds like a good deal, considering I am upgrading from a 500Mhz, the 300Mhz boost is like adding my existing machine to the 1.4 card - quite a boost.

How about sonnet compatibility comapared to OWC? I am a bit nervous about the "required" 9.2 based firmware upgrade for the 1.7 - will this be tiger compatible? Maybe I'll wait it out til January and see what people's reports are-

Lee

Eug Wanker · Dec 7, 2004, 10:56 AM

Originally posted by Lateralus:
Probably 1.5s OC'd to 1.7 with a voltage boost I'd imagine.

If that's true, it's another reason I'd prefer a 7447A 1.5.

Luca Rescigno · Dec 7, 2004, 11:02 AM

Originally posted by LeeG:
I had just about settled into buying th OWC 1.4 @ $389 - now for $110 more, I can get a 1.7? Hmmm. Sounds like a good deal, considering I am upgrading from a 500Mhz, the 300Mhz boost is like adding my existing machine to the 1.4 card - quite a boost.

How about sonnet compatibility comapared to OWC? I am a bit nervous about the "required" 9.2 based firmware upgrade for the 1.7 - will this be tiger compatible? Maybe I'll wait it out til January and see what people's reports are-

Lee

Actually, going from the 1.4 to the 1.7 will probably not make much of a difference. That's like taking your own machine from 500 MHz to 605 MHz. Same proportion.

It's cool that there's a 1.7 G4 coming up, but it seems that for over $100 more than a 1.4, it really won't provide much benefit. Still cool though.

As far as the firmware upgrade... I don't see why it wouldn't be Tiger compatible.

Eug Wanker · Dec 7, 2004, 11:14 AM

Hmmm... The Gigadesigns 7457 1.3 fanless for the Cube comes with 2 MB L3 (on top of the 512 KB L2). I'm guessing that's roughly equivalent to a 1.4-1.5 GHz 7447A, and it doesn't require an additional firmware upgrade either. It's looking more and more like I'm getting the 1.3 GHz fanless for the Cube.

Weezer · Dec 7, 2004, 11:16 AM

which chip is faster at the same clock speed, the 7455 or the 7447? Does the 256 extra L2 cache make up for the lack of L3 cache?

Lateralus · Dec 7, 2004, 11:50 AM

Originally posted by Weezer:
which chip is faster at the same clock speed, the 7455 or the 7447? Does the 256 extra L2 cache make up for the lack of L3 cache?

Upon further thought, I am not sure which I am going to get anymore. The 1.5GHz 2MB/256k Giga or the 1.7GHz 512k Sonnet.

L3 seems to provide a 15-20% performance boost, and no, the additional 256k of L2 does not make up for it's loss.

So on paper, a 1.5GHz 7455/7457 should perform as well or better than a 1.7GHz 7447.

Lateralus · Dec 7, 2004, 11:56 AM

Originally posted by Luca Rescigno:
Actually, going from the 1.4 to the 1.7 will probably not make much of a difference. That's like taking your own machine from 500 MHz to 605 MHz. Same proportion.

It's a more than 20% increase in clock speed. Depending on what you use your machine for, the increase could be very noticeable.

Luca Rescigno · Dec 7, 2004, 12:11 PM

BTW, you haven't been on AIM much. I guess your (second) Cube is the Mac Of The Week this week.

Lateralus · Dec 7, 2004, 12:31 PM

Yeah, I seem to lose interest in machines as soon as I have FrankenMac'd them.

Eug Wanker · Dec 7, 2004, 12:44 PM

Originally posted by Eug Wanker:
Hmmm... The Gigadesigns 7457 1.3 fanless for the Cube comes with 2 MB L3 (on top of the 512 KB L2). I'm guessing that's roughly equivalent to a 1.4-1.5 GHz 7447A, and it doesn't require an additional firmware upgrade either. It's looking more and more like I'm getting the 1.3 GHz fanless for the Cube.

Or maybe not.

There are rumours a dual 1.2-1.4 7457 (4 MB L3) coming, but more importantly for me, a lower priced single 1.4 7457 (2 MB L3).

Lateralus · Dec 7, 2004, 12:51 PM

Yeah, if the rumors of upgrades that actually exercise the 745x's 4MB L3 ability are true, I will continue to wait.

Letting future plans 'leak' the same day that Sonnet's new 1.7s were announced was a strategic move on PowerLogix's part I think. A good one, too.

Weezer · Dec 7, 2004, 01:22 PM

Originally posted by Lateralus:

Letting future plans 'leak' the same day that Sonnet's new 1.7s were announced was a strategic move on PowerLogix's part I think. A good one, too.

link?

bimmerphile · Dec 7, 2004, 01:30 PM

Originally posted by Lateralus:
A 1.7GHz Cube would be quite lust worthy...

Weezer · Dec 7, 2004, 01:56 PM

the more I think about this the less excited I am. Why couldn't they use the 7457

The lack of L3 cache is a big disappointment

Lateralus · Dec 7, 2004, 02:00 PM

L3 doesn't like high clock speeds. It's the first thing to go when overclocking.

Eug Wanker · Dec 7, 2004, 03:30 PM

Giga Designs has now announced a 1.73 GHz MPC7447A upgrade. For the Cube, it runs fanless in at 1.6 GHz.

The G-celerator AGP 7A series includes dual processor upgrades for the "Gigabit Ethernet" thru "Quicksilver 2002" & dual processor compatible "AGP Graphics (Sawtooth)" models, and single processor upgrades for these models as well as the Power Mac® "Cube". The dual processor and Cube upgrades feature Giga Designs unique multi-voltage power sharing architecture. This feature allocates the system's power to allow for the addition of high performance graphics and storage solutions. The Cube upgrade supports fan less operation at 1.6GHz, and 1.7GHz+ operation with the addition of a low speed fan.

1.42 GHz @ 1.7 GHz = $449
1.6 GHz @ 1.7 GHz = $499

Dual 1.7 also available, but not for the Cube.

Cadaver · Dec 7, 2004, 03:52 PM

Originally posted by Eug Wanker:
(snip) Dual 1.7 also available, but not for the Cube.

Now that would be nice. Sure, it'll probably cost nearly as much as a new G5, but still...

Eug Wanker · Dec 7, 2004, 03:59 PM

Originally posted by Cadaver:
Now that would be nice. Sure, it'll probably cost nearly as much as a new G5, but still...

Dual 1.42 GHz @ 1.7 GHz = $699
Dual 1.6 GHz @ 1.7 GHz = $799

Weezer · 05:44 PM

Originally posted by Eug Wanker:
Dual 1.42 GHz @ 1.7 GHz = $699
Dual 1.6 GHz @ 1.7 GHz = $799

I dont understand that, why pay $100 more?

I guess less overclocked is better, but still. They havnt revamped their existing product pricing yet, it will be interesting to see what the single 1.467 and the dual 1.33 7455 go for. who wins in a fight, dual 1.33 (7455) or dual 1.7 (7447)?

Eug Wanker · Dec 7, 2004, 06:09 PM

Originally posted by Weezer:
I dont understand that, why pay $100 more?

I guess less overclocked is better, but still. They havnt revamped their existing product pricing yet, it will be interesting to see what the single 1.467 and the dual 1.33 7455 go for. who wins in a fight, dual 1.33 (7455) or dual 1.7 (7447)?

For a 1.6 certified to be able to be overclocked to 1.7, I won't run at 1.7. In fact, for a Cube, I'd even consider underclocking it. 1.6 would be the max for me.

chris v · Dec 7, 2004, 07:14 PM

Ooh, I want one of those dualies for my QS dual 1 gig. $699.00 isn't too bad for a 70% processor speed boost. I'm very tempted.

Link · Dec 7, 2004, 07:26 PM

I knew it'd happen! Now to get that $800...

2x speed increase

I wonder how fast this will be in comparison to a dual 1.8 g5...

Lateralus · Dec 7, 2004, 11:56 PM

Well, I think my plans to soup up the Cube just went down the drain. I don't think I can resist Dual 1.73GHz for my Digital Audio.

Weezer · Dec 8, 2004, 12:42 AM

Originally posted by Lateralus:
Well, I think my plans to soup up the Cube just went down the drain. I don't think I can resist Dual 1.73GHz for my Digital Audio.

which are you planning on getting, the $700 or the $800?

Lateralus · Dec 8, 2004, 02:03 AM

Unsure. If I find any evidence that the 1.6GHz/$799 model has higher OC potential than the 1.42GHz/$699 model, I may splurge and drop the extra hundred.

Dual 1.73 is fantastic, but I am a glutton and am already thinking of which way to best acheive Dual 1.8/1.86.

Eug Wanker · Dec 8, 2004, 02:08 AM

Originally posted by Lateralus:
Unsure. If I find any evidence that the 1.6GHz/$799 model has higher OC potential than the 1.42GHz/$699 model, I may splurge and drop the extra hundred.

Dual 1.73 is fantastic, but I am a glutton and am already thinking of which way to best acheive Dual 1.8/1.86.

The perceivable difference between 1.73 and 1.86 would be essentially nil, for the vast majority of applications.

Lateralus · Dec 8, 2004, 02:18 AM

Yeah, but I'm a MHz whore.

Weezer · Dec 8, 2004, 03:26 AM

so I was looking around for info about the lack of L3 cache, and it seems that it does not really affect it much, atleast based on these scores:

http://barefeats.com/al15.html

Is that a fair extrapolation?

macaddict0001 · Dec 8, 2004, 04:39 AM

Would it be in some way possible to take the 1.4 g4 from your digital audio and put it in your cube?

Lateralus · Dec 8, 2004, 11:05 AM

Originally posted by macaddict0001:
Would it be in some way possible to take the 1.4 g4 from your digital audio and put it in your cube?

Nope.

Taipan · Dec 8, 2004, 11:07 AM

Hi!

I'd like to see those for the MDD series...

CincyGamer · Dec 8, 2004, 11:17 AM

That would be a bad move to Apple to upgrade the PB to 1.7 GHZ. Everyone would rather have the G5 PB even if it is 1.6 GHZ. It can do alot more simutanously and the higher system buses which cripple the current G4.

Lateralus · Dec 8, 2004, 11:41 AM

Originally posted by CincyGamer:
Everyone would rather have the G5 PB even if it is 1.6 GHZ.

Everyone, meaning you?

If you look around the forum, I doubt you'll find many people who would be happy with a 1.6GHz G5 PowerBook. It wouldn't be any faster than the 1.5GHz G4.

I'd take a 1.7GHz G4 over a 1.6GHz G5.

And no, it wouldn't be able to do a lot more simultaneously.

Cadaver · Dec 8, 2004, 11:43 AM

Originally posted by CincyGamer:
That would be a bad move to Apple to upgrade the PB to 1.7 GHZ. Everyone would rather have the G5 PB even if it is 1.6 GHZ. It can do alot more simutanously and the higher system buses which cripple the current G4.

That is of course only IF they can actually get a current-production G5 in to a PowerBook without it melting down. Otherwise, there's not much choice, is there?

Weezer · Dec 8, 2004, 01:59 PM

how much of a bottleneck is a 133 bus going to be on a dual 1.7?

Eug Wanker · Dec 8, 2004, 02:02 PM

Originally posted by Weezer:
how much of a bottleneck is a 133 bus going to be on a dual 1.7?

Pretty bad. However, fortunately, it's not a big deal for most every day apps. The dual 1.7 will be a nice boost for a lot of people.

I'm strongly considering the single 1.7 from Sonnet by the way. I'll still be on the 100 MHz bus, but the 278% boost in clockspeed ought to be noticeable.

iREZ · Dec 8, 2004, 02:19 PM

I have no clue on how to install one of these in a cube, but I know of one laying around that I could get a good deal on, would something like this be easy for the everyday joe to install or should I just stick to my plan of getting a G5 iMac later down the road?

Eug Wanker · Dec 8, 2004, 03:54 PM

Originally posted by iREZ:
I have no clue on how to install one of these in a cube, but I know of one laying around that I could get a good deal on, would something like this be easy for the everyday joe to install or should I just stick to my plan of getting a G5 iMac later down the road?

From the looks of it I think I could do it myself. ie. It's much harder than working on a tower, but much easier than a laptop. Still, I'm thinking I may get the store to do it, esp. since work is paying for part of it.

Now I have a question... Should I get a base fan put in at the same time, or is the 1.7 GHz Sonnet fan going to be enough? The Cube fan installation kit is $29 from Sonnet.