[Athens]

Words cant explain it, only the video.

Graphic...
Caught on tape: (Warning: Disturbing) Toddler ran over by a couple cars and nobody helps in China - YouTube

CNN story here Outrage in China after toddler run over, ignored - CNN.com

Morality is out the window, how can we ever expect working conditions to improve in a society that devalues life so much.


Disgusting Society

[andi*pandi]

I saw the article but couldn't watch the video.

[imitchellg5]

A few days ago at my school a girl had a seizure while she was walking to class and fell down on the sidewalk. Apparently four or five students just walked past and did nothing. Nobody cares about anything anymore.

[Waragainstsleep]

People suck.

[Athens]

The CNN version cuts out before the kid is run over. The youtube one shows it in all the horror. It is pure horror. I cant describe it really. Except the kid was not hit and bounced off. The kid was run over, a speed bump for the tires not once but twice. Its amazing really is amazing the kid is alive. What i last read anyways. Then in the video the people walking past the kid, its just terrible. Some look down some don't. Ppl sorry monsters ride around the kid ignoring her.

[el chupacabra]

Just how humans are. Remember when that guy was run over on a busy street in NYC and nobody stopped to help while he just lay there..

[mattyb]

Originally Posted by imitchellg5 

Nobody cares about anything anymore.

So true, and I'm at fault myself. What is most important to me is my family (wife, 2 kids), and its made me a really really selfish person. Then when you see someone acting in a selfish way, you tend to do the same thing because somebody else has done it previously, like parking badly jsut to quickly drop the kids off at school or something.

I read somewhere that in China some old woman got injured a few months ago. A passer-by helped her, and ended up being liable for her medical expenses. There was a court case IIRC. Apparently this event has led to a massive decrease in people helping other people.

EDIT : found it, from 2006 : Chinese toddler run over twice after being left on street - Telegraph

Others blamed China’s compensation culture for the apparent show of callousness, recalling a famous 2006 judgment when a Good Samaritan who helped a woman get to hospital was wrongly ordered to pay her compensation.

[Big Mac]

Generally speaking, the Chinese in China don't value the lives of their countrymen too highly, in large part because there are so many Chinese people. My close friend from high school who came from China as a child said that one of the country's famous historical leaders used to remark something like, "Who cares if a million Chinese die in war when millions more are available." That's not a direct quotation but it's close based on what my friend told me. How some portion of that population has been guilty of leaving its infant daughters to die is also very difficult to comprehend, but that's reality.

[RAILhead]

I can only speak for Cambodia -- I don't know if this applies to all Asian countries -- but if you injure someone in a motor vehicle accident, you become responsible for paying their health costs FOR LIFE. So if you get hit in Cambodia, they drive away and hope no one stops them (which no one will), or they'll back up and kill you so you aren't alive to *need* financial assistance.

[Big Mac]

Wowzers.

[lpkmckenna]

As if this kind of thing only happens in China because the Chinese are "a disgusting society." This thread has brought out the worst in people here. Of course, it is a thread started by Athens, so that's to be expected.

Meanwhile, there are videos online of people left to die in hospital waiting rooms in western countries, but I guess that's different somehow.

[Shaddim]

Damn, I can't even walk by a small child lost in a store without trying to help, this shit makes me nauseous.

[lpkmckenna]

Originally Posted by RAILhead 

I can only speak for Cambodia -- I don't know if this applies to all Asian countries -- but if you injure someone in a motor vehicle accident, you become responsible for paying their health costs FOR LIFE. So if you get hit in Cambodia, they drive away and hope no one stops them (which no one will), or they'll back up and kill you so you aren't alive to *need* financial assistance.

This is why accident insurance exists: to keep this from happening.

Being saddled with a lifetime of debt for an error happens here too: a couple of people were sued for millions just for downloading a few songs, and those court cases are still dragging on. Heck, these people couple never pay the lawyer fees, never mind paying the judge's decision.

And I'm pretty sure if you hit someone with your car in Canada or the US, and didn't have insurance, you could expect a lifetime of financial payments after being sued.

To answer your own question, RAILhead, ask yourself: do they have insurance in Japan or South Korea?

[mattyb]

I lived in Egypt as a kid for a bit. When we moved there, my dad was told unofficially that if he had a car accident, make sure that the victim was dead, otherwise the company that he worked for (an oil company) would have to pay out lots of money. This was back in the late 70s.

I also spent some time in quaint North Wales (population density around 100 per square kilometer). Someone that I went to school with was recently killed while cycling along a country lane.

Not just a Chinese issue.

[Athens]

Originally Posted by lpkmckenna 

As if this kind of thing only happens in China because the Chinese are "a disgusting society." This thread has brought out the worst in people here. Of course, it is a thread started by Athens, so that's to be expected.

Meanwhile, there are videos online of people left to die in hospital waiting rooms in western countries, but I guess that's different somehow.

I won't deny that mistakes are made every where. But what you see in that video are not mistakes. The first vehicle that hit the girl, that was the mistake. The people that walked around the child most looking at her totally ignored her, 18 people. That is the society the culture there. A person who dies in a waiting room or drowned in a pool is usually from some one making a mistake. What you don't see in most cultures is people blatantly ignoring it when they see it. If some one notices some one in trouble most do something about it. Even if its just a phone call or bringing it to some ones attention. Especially a child. Its easy enough to mistaken a homeless man as being dead in a corner or by a tree. Its another thing to ignore a bleeding out child in the middle of a road squirming around. I asked a few Chinese people actual Chinese people who immigrated from China, couple co-workers and my building manager and from their own mouths this is normal and the way of life in China. So before you spend any time defending it, go talk to some Chinese immigrants and see what they say about it.

[Athens]

Originally Posted by lpkmckenna 

This is why accident insurance exists: to keep this from happening.

Being saddled with a lifetime of debt for an error happens here too: a couple of people were sued for millions just for downloading a few songs, and those court cases are still dragging on. Heck, these people couple never pay the lawyer fees, never mind paying the judge's decision.

And I'm pretty sure if you hit someone with your car in Canada or the US, and didn't have insurance, you could expect a lifetime of financial payments after being sued.

To answer your own question, RAILhead, ask yourself: do they have insurance in Japan or South Korea?

Bankruptcy, ever herd of it? Having a monetary judgement against you doesn't mean much when it comes to trying to collect payment. Lots of ways to avoid actually "paying" anything. How new are you to this country anyways, the more you post the more you sound fresh off the boat.

Originally Posted by mattyb 

I lived in Egypt as a kid for a bit. When we moved there, my dad was told unofficially that if he had a car accident, make sure that the victim was dead, otherwise the company that he worked for (an oil company) would have to pay out lots of money. This was back in the late 70s.

I also spent some time in quaint North Wales (population density around 100 per square kilometer). Someone that I went to school with was recently killed while cycling along a country lane.

Not just a Chinese issue.

That explains the drivers fleeing, and even here people will try to get away with it to avoid being charged or going to Jail. But the disgusting part was not the accident. It was the cold response by those that went out of there way to walk around the victim and ignored the toddler. Thats the disgusting part. You wouldn't even see that in Palestine. India and China are the only 2 places I can think of off hand where you see that kind of response often. Brazil some what to a lessor degree.

How does a society become so numb that people on mass can behave so uncaring.

[lpkmckenna]

Originally Posted by Athens 

Bankruptcy, ever herd of it? Having a monetary judgement against you doesn't mean much when it comes to trying to collect payment. Lots of ways to avoid actually "paying" anything.

You cannot default from many types of court judgements against you. If you injury someone thru criminal negligence, you will never escape that debt. For my example of those file sharers, they will not be able to escape that judgement against them thru bankruptcy.

How new are you to this country anyways, the more you post the more you sound fresh off the boat.

I was fncking born here. Is "immigrant" your go-to insult for everyone who disagrees with you? All most certainly, given your posting history, and we all know how hostile to immigrants you are.

[Athens]

Ha no, you just sound like your fresh off the boat with a lot of the stuff you say. Its easy to mistaken you as some one still adjusting. For example your fantasy about court ordered judgement. bankruptcy will discharge a person liability for court ordered judgement's except for in a few jurisdictions the child support and spouse support payments. And debt owed to government. All other liabilities including judgement's from law suits disappear. The only other exception to that in Canada is the award of damages by a court for intentionally inflicting bodily harm or sexual assault. Accidents and damages awarded from accidents do not count for that. Each province and state has its own rules but for the most part bankruptcy clears debts related to awarded judgement's.

[lpkmckenna]

You're wrong about the two examples here. Those file sharing cases are willful, not accidental. And if someone killed a kid in the way seen in the video, that would be criminal liability. Bankruptcy would not help in either case.

[Waragainstsleep]

Originally Posted by Athens 

India and China are the only 2 places I can think of off hand where you see that kind of response often. Brazil some what to a lessor degree.

How does a society become so numb that people on mass can behave so uncaring.

Going by the places you mention, all of which have high populations, its simply supply and demand. Lots of lives means the value of any one life goes down.

[Athens]

Originally Posted by lpkmckenna 

You're wrong about the two examples here. Those file sharing cases are willful, not accidental. And if someone killed a kid in the way seen in the video, that would be criminal liability. Bankruptcy would not help in either case.

If some one ran over a kid like that here, 1) kid might not actually have died due to prompt medical attention and 2) they would have gone to Jail for a few years. 3) Insurance would cover the medical costs, its debatable a family would go through costs and years of struggle to sue when the chances of collecting are so low. You really have no clue how anything works do you?

Im not touching the file sharing cases because I just don't know enough about US bankruptcy laws to touch on it. But I have a feeling your wrong about those too when it comes to being discharged after bankruptcy.

[Athens]

Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep 

Going by the places you mention, all of which have high populations, its simply supply and demand. Lots of lives means the value of any one life goes down.

I don't know if its that easy. I think part of it might be the rapid growth and rapid change China has had over the last 25 years. I think as a society they are still adjusting.

There are some basic human instincts though attributed with children that makes it hard to understand though. We are hard wired or at least I thought we where to nurture and support children even those that are not ours. I have a hard time accepting that a population can evolve a culture that does not care.

[k2director]

The brain-dead Mao and his obscene "cultural revolution" are responsible for the lack of morality in modern China.

A core feature of the cultural revolution was "reporting" on any suspicious activities of your neighbors or your family...ie, putting loyalty to a huge monolithic state enterprise above all other relationships, making connections between people secondary.

Well, here's the result of that, China. Enjoy stepping over the broken bodies of toddlers in the streets while you celebrate that little monster/monkey's birthday and his stupid little sayings...

[FireWire]

Sick! I heard the story but I had yet to see the video.. WTF!!

Reminds me of this video : CAUGHT ON TAPE: Manslaughter in Hartford Connecticut Hit-and-run - YouTube

Even dogs could teach us about how being human! Dog Risks Life To Save another Dog! - YouTube

[olePigeon]

This unfortunately happens everywhere. There're also a series of videos of social experiments where some actors portrayed abusive or offensive scenes in public places to see if anyone would bother to intervene. The answer was almost never.

The actors did stuff like beating up a pregnant woman in a busy parking lot, or blatant racism in an upscale shopping center. People would rather keep to themselves than actually do anything about it. It's pretty sad. They caught up with people who witnessed the events and asked them why they didn't help, and the most common answer was, "It wasn't my problem."

Speaking of pets, a few years ago there was a rather big story on our local news of a cat that did something similar to that dog listed above. It ran back into a burning house 4 times to get her kittens. Poor kitty got burned all to hell and one of the kittens wasn't breathing, but firemen actually managed to give the kitten CPR and save its life. The cat went blind in one eye, but otherwise they all survived.

[Athens]

The best social experiment I have ever seen is this one related to pain buttons. There is a row of buttons each one representing a higher scale of pain. The last 3 are labeled dangerous avoid using and the last one is labeled possibly fatal do not use. The person in the other room which you can't see that is supposed to be hooked up to the machine gives feed back with each push. The lower settings just a ouch, the higher ones he screams, the ones labeled dangerous he screams as if he was going to die.

The experiment is take subjects from regular walks of life to assist in a social experiment of right and wrong answers. The subject operates the machine for the scientist. The study is on how far will a person go knowing they are inflicting harm on another at the direction of a authoritive figure. The scientist would be that figure. So the tests are done and most people would take direction and push the button all the way up tot he fatal one. Very few people would question what they are doing or refuse to push the last few buttons.

I can't remember the name of the experiment but it explains very well why solders under orders can commit horrible crimes, while otherwise being normal good people. I dont think this social experiment applies to this case but was interesting to shed light on some of our behaviors.

@olepideon

I don't know if that study with the actors would apply in this case either. Its one thing to get involved in a active situation between adults. But its a totally different thing to totally ignore a hurt bleeding person on the road. Though I imagine there is a study out there that has the answer to that since there seems to be a study on almost everything these days.

I personal wont get involved in a fight or offensive person one on one. I'll just call the cops.

[lpkmckenna]

Originally Posted by Athens 

Insurance would cover the medical costs, its debatable a family would go through costs and years of struggle to sue when the chances of collecting are so low. You really have no clue how anything works do you?

You love to tell me I don't know what I'm talking about; the irony is killing me. But do you really, really think that in Canada, a driver who hit a kid (once by accident, second by criminal negligence) and then fled the scene wouldn't be sued for a huge amount of money? Are your parents that stupid not to do so? Would you be that stupid as a parent?

[Athens]

Of course I would sue, but its the insurance company not the individual who would end up paying..... And it would be the lawyer taking most of the winnings. Average judgement's in this country are $100,000

[Hawkeye_a]

It was all over the online news here, so I couldn't avoid seeing that. I thought the news sites would have censored it, but they hadn't.

It actually made me nauseous and cry a bit. I am still shaken from having watched it. I seriously suggest no one watch that video.

What worries me is, this time it was caught on tape, what about the other times? Is this what people become when they think no one is watching?

Very disturbing.

[Athens]

Reminds me of this commercial about if some one is watching everything changes

Amnesty International - If someone's watching the violence stops - YouTube