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sanity assassin · Mar 22, 2004, 05:13 AM

Typical Israel, another example of state terrorism by them. Now, I wonder who the spiritual leaders of Israeli settlers are? I wonder how Israel would feel about those Israeli leaders who tell the illegal setlers to go around killing Palestininans for trying to get the settlers out of the land they are illegally on?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/mid...st/3556099.stm

Captain Obvious · 06:09 AM

about goddamn time

coolmacdude · Mar 22, 2004, 06:01 AM

Originally posted by Captain Obvious:
about goddamn time

Nicko · Mar 22, 2004, 06:03 AM

They just turned a martyr into a saint.

How exactly does this improve things?

lil'babykitten · Mar 22, 2004, 07:06 AM

Expect more murder and bloodshed in the usual cycle of violence that will undoubtedly follow.

Spheric Harlot · Mar 22, 2004, 07:17 AM

Originally posted by Captain Obvious:
about goddamn time

One of the opposition leaders has already gone on record wondering how many Israelis this foolhardy murder will cost their lives.

Powerbook · Mar 22, 2004, 07:24 AM

W00000t! Peace and stability will come now! Just like in Iraq!
What a great deed.

PB.

Troll · Mar 22, 2004, 08:27 AM

It takes a big, brave man to murder a quadriplegic by firing a missile from a helicopter into his wheelchair while he's being pushed home from morning prayers. It takes an even bigger man to murder the quadriplegic without worrying who else he murders in the process.

Palestine has lots of big men too.

eklipse · Mar 22, 2004, 08:41 AM

There is a name for all those who would attack civilian facilities and/or order the assassinations of partially blind, wheel-chair-bound, quadriplegics.

Cowards.

stupendousman · Mar 22, 2004, 08:47 AM

Originally posted by eklipse:
There is a name for all those who would attack civilian facilities and/or order the assassinations of partially blind, wheel-chair-bound, quadriplegics.

Cowards.

It's always the CONTEXT that is missing from these crazy posts...

You forgot to complete your sentence. It should have read, "partially blind, wheel-chair-bound, guadriplegic mass murdering terrorist". It's always the stuff people forget to add that usually better explains the circumstances. I suppose if Jeffrey Dahmer was ill, but still been murdering people and eluding the authorities, that he too would be mourned if he was removed from the planet violently. I'd expect it from someone like his mother, but not from rational people.

Nicko · Mar 22, 2004, 08:54 AM

Originally posted by stupendousman:
It's always the CONTEXT that is missing from these crazy posts...

You forgot to complete your sentence. It should have read, "partially blind, wheel-chair-bound, guadriplegic mass murdering terrorist". It's always the stuff people forget to add that usually better explains the circumstances. I suppose if Jeffrey Dahmer was ill, but still been murdering people and eluding the authorities, that he too would be mourned if he was removed from the planet violently. I'd expect it from someone like his mother, but not from rational people.

So why didn't they take him into custody and formally charge him? He couldn't have been that hard to catch after all.

Troll · Mar 22, 2004, 08:59 AM

Originally posted by stupendousman:
It's always the CONTEXT that is missing from these crazy posts...

You forgot to complete your sentence. It should have read, "partially blind, wheel-chair-bound, guadriplegic mass murdering terrorist". It's always the stuff people forget to add that usually better explains the circumstances. I suppose if Jeffrey Dahmer was ill, but still been murdering people and eluding the authorities, that he too would be mourned if he was removed from the planet violently. I'd expect it from someone like his mother, but not from rational people.

Nicko made the point obvious for you.

The other point that you obviously missed is what about the innocent people who just happened to be going about their business, before they lost their lives? Were they mass murderers too? Can we see charge sheets for each one of them as well?

Logic · Mar 22, 2004, 09:00 AM

This will probably cost about 20-50 innocent Israelis their lives in the next week or so.........

And I who thought that Palestinian lives were cheaper than Israeli lives. Ah well.........

stupendousman · Mar 22, 2004, 09:11 AM

Originally posted by Logic:
This will probably cost about 20-50 innocent Israelis their lives in the next week or so.........

And I who thought that Palestinian lives were cheaper than Israeli lives. Ah well.........

Wow...a mass murdering madman is put to death, and his followers may decide to murder more innocent people, and it's the fault of those who rid the planet of the terrorist. That's some strong logic going on there!

As far as "innocent" people killed...I thought it was just the mass murdering terrorist and some of his accomplices who helped him allude authorities?

eklipse · Mar 22, 2004, 09:23 AM

Originally posted by stupendousman:
It's always the CONTEXT that is missing from these crazy posts...

You forgot to complete your sentence. It should have read, "partially blind, wheel-chair-bound, guadriplegic mass murdering terrorist". It's always the stuff people forget to add that usually better explains the circumstances. I suppose if Jeffrey Dahmer was ill, but still been murdering people and eluding the authorities, that he too would be mourned if he was removed from the planet violently. I'd expect it from someone like his mother, but not from rational people.

I've heard reports saying that Yassin was actually quite moderate in his views and did not favor attacks on civilians.

Israel may have just taken out a balancing force inside Hamas - which could be bad.

sanity assassin · Mar 22, 2004, 09:39 AM

Here's the Uk's response so far.

'
UK Foreign Secretary Jack Straw said the killing of an elderly man in a wheelchair was "unjustified" and "very unlikely to achieve its objective".

Spheric Harlot · Mar 22, 2004, 09:42 AM

Originally posted by stupendousman:
Wow...a mass murdering madman is put to death, and his followers may decide to murder more innocent people, and it's the fault of those who rid the planet of the terrorist. That's some strong logic going on there!

The deaths of innocents are the sole fault of ALL who would continue the cycle of violence.

Israel's cabinet decided upon this murder in retaliation for the Ashdod attacks, knowing FULL WELL that it would achieve NOTHING except provoke further attacks upon innocent Israelis.

They are as guilty as the one they have murdered - and that's not even taking into account the violation of human rights they have perpetrated by murdering a man without due process.

Violence begets violence and nothing else.

This isn't rocket science, stupendousman.

-s*

sanity assassin · Mar 22, 2004, 09:42 AM

Originally posted by stupendousman:
Wow...a mass murdering madman is put to death, and his followers may decide to murder more innocent people, and it's the fault of those who rid the planet of the terrorist. That's some strong logic going on there!

As far as "innocent" people killed...I thought it was just the mass murdering terrorist and some of his accomplices who helped him allude authorities?

I'm not sure he murdered anyone. He did give moral support to those who fought against Irael, bombers, or not. Does one showing moral support for people in Palestine deserve this? I sure don't think so.

At the very least, if Israel suspects him of having carried out any terorist acts, then arrest him; if not, and he only voiced support for bombers, then this murder is quite an outrage.

slow moe · Mar 22, 2004, 09:52 AM

Originally posted by eklipse:
I've heard reports saying that Yassin was actually quite moderate in his views and did not favor attacks on civilians.

Israel may have just taken out a balancing force inside Hamas - which could be bad.

Terrorists are not ambassadors of peace dressed in wolf costumes, they're terrorists.

Spheric Harlot · Mar 22, 2004, 10:03 AM

Originally posted by slow moe:
Terrorists are not ambassadors of peace dressed in wolf costumes, they're terrorists.

True.

And murderers are murderers, regardless.

macvillage.net · Mar 22, 2004, 10:09 AM

XXX

Spliffdaddy · Mar 22, 2004, 10:24 AM

Originally posted by stupendousman:
Wow...a mass murdering madman is put to death, and his followers may decide to murder more innocent people, and it's the fault of those who rid the planet of the terrorist. That's some strong logic going on there!

As far as "innocent" people killed...I thought it was just the mass murdering terrorist and some of his accomplices who helped him allude authorities?

good point.

swrate · Mar 22, 2004, 10:27 AM

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Powder keg magazine, its a tragedy, and a huge mistake. Terrorism will now become worse,there is one reason more to retaliate�. How do the people from Israel reflect on that move? Sacrificed for the elections, isn�t it going too far? Are you behind your PM on this? What do you imagine will happen next? I am so sorry, I have no words. Psychologically the worst thing to do, imo. Setting fire to the oil and chemicals, I am very upset, I fear degradation. As if Hamas would cease now. I thought Sharon was smarter, not good for the election As if Jews/Palestinians hadn�t suffered enough, stupid decisions are often paid by deaths of civilians.... another slash ....

sanity assassin · Mar 22, 2004, 10:53 AM

Here's more reactions from around the world. Europe is particularly angry about this, with the EU statnig this is breaking international law. Nothing new there for Israel. And some people wonder why Muslims use terrorism, to me it's just using the same tactics as the opposition.

"The killing of Sheikh Yassin has drawn widespread condemnation in the Arab world and Europe, while the US State Department has appealed for calm.

Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak described it as cowardly and King Abdullah of Jordan called it a crime.

Iranian officials said the killing would trigger an even bigger struggle against Israel and the US.

European Union foreign ministers condemned what they called Israel's "extra-judicial killing".

"Not only are extra-judicial killings contrary to international law, they undermine the concept of the rule of law, which is a key element in the fight against terrorism," they said at their regular monthly meeting in Brussels.

British Foreign Secretary Jack Straw described the assassination as "unacceptable" and "unjustified".

Mr Straw said he did not think Israel would benefit from an attack on an old man in a wheelchair.

French Foreign Minister Dominique de Villepin said such acts could only "feed the spiral of violence".

The European Union's foreign policy chief, Javier Solana, said the killing was "very, very bad news" for the Middle East peace process.

In Moscow, the Russian foreign ministry said it was "deeply concerned" at the assassination, which it feared would cause "a new wave of violence".

Restraint urged

The US was among the first countries to issue an official reaction in the wake of the killing of Sheikh Yassin by Israeli forces.

State Department spokesman Lou Fintor said: "The United States urges all sides to remain calm and exercise restraint."

An Australian foreign ministry spokesman also urged efforts to "try and prevent any further decline into violence".

Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak said he had cancelled a visit by Egyptian members of parliament to Jerusalem in protest at the assassination.

The delegation was to have taken part in celebrations to mark the 25th anniversary of the Camp David peace treaty between Egypt and Israel.

Mr Mubarak described the killing as "regrettable and cowardly".

When asked about its possible impact on the Middle East peace process, he said: "What peace process?"

Iran's ex-President Akbar Hashemi Rafsanjani warned that Sheikh Yassin's "martyrdom" would trigger an "even more serious struggle by the oppressed Palestinians against the Israeli terrorist occupiers and their US supporter".

Roadmap fears

Other leading figures in the Arab world have also criticised the killing of Sheikh Yassin.

Arab League Secretary General Amr Moussa said it was "state terrorism in its most hideous form", while Iraq's US-appointed Governing Council said it could escalate danger in Iraq.

One member of the Council, Muwaffaq al-Rubaiye, told the AFP news agency: "We condemn the killing, which will only serve to strengthen the justifications for terrorist acts in the world and does not serve peace."

Kuwaiti Prime Minister Sheikh Sabah al-Ahmad al-Sabah said: "Violence will increase now because violence always breeds violence."

Lebanese President Emile Lahoud said Israel was "mistaken" if it thought that by killing resistance fighters, it could kill the Palestinian cause.

The spiritual leader of Egypt's outlawed Muslim Brotherhood, Mohammed Mehdi Akef, said Sheikh Yassin had fallen as a "martyr" in a "cowardly operation".

BBC diplomatic correspondent Barnaby Mason says the world's big powers are likely to be dismayed that Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon has chosen to escalate Israeli military action against Hamas.

Our correspondent says there will also be concern, especially in the British government, that the killing might further hinder the progress of the international roadmap peace plan for the Middle East."

James Christ · Mar 22, 2004, 11:03 AM

Originally posted by sanity assassin:
Here's the Uk's response so far.

'
UK Foreign Secretary Jack Straw said the killing of an elderly man in a wheelchair was "unjustified" and "very unlikely to achieve its objective".

Bin Ladin is an old man with a walking stick. Whats the difference? One just happens to 'sheikh' a bit more.

lil'babykitten · Mar 22, 2004, 11:21 AM

I think it just serves to confirm the objectives of the Israeli government. Sharon does not want peace as he continually demonstrates. All his actions serve to instigate more violence. This cowardly act was planned by Sharon personally, it has been reported.

If Israel, the holder of significant military capability - including nuclear weapons, felt threatened by an old, paralyzed man in a wheelchair, then it only serves to show that it is governed by a gang of cowardly thugs who do not have even an ounce of intelligence. Their methods are sick - they fired a missile directly at the man in his wheelchair, cutting him to pieces? Who in the living fvck do they think they are? They mean to suggest that they could not bring this man in to custody? What a joke.

Hamas has said, today Israel 'opened the gates of hell'. Consider how many Palestinians are now willing to die in Yasin's name. Consider who the victims are going to be and then question the usefulness of such a disgusting act by Israel, a state-sponsor of terrorism itself.

"The United States urges all sides to remain calm and exercise restraint." What a piss poor response. This is what the worlds 'super-power' has to say? remain calm?! lol! This just goes to show that America is absolutely Israel's bitch.

Every action has a reaction. We'll see this in effect in the coming weeks, months and years, no doubt.

ghost_flash · Mar 22, 2004, 11:22 AM

I didn't notice if anyone has posted that they have stated the missle came from an American Ship off-shore.

You know what I say?

NICE SHOT!

Spheric Harlot · Mar 22, 2004, 11:24 AM

Originally posted by ghost_flash:
I didn't notice if anyone has posted that they have stated the missle came from an American Ship off-shore.

You know what I say?

NICE SHOT!

Welcome to WWIII.

You can pick up your soul when you leave.

SimeyTheLimey · Mar 22, 2004, 11:25 AM

Originally posted by lil'babykitten:
I think it just serves to confirm the objectives of the Israeli government. Sharon does not want peace as he continually demonstrates. All his actions serve to instigate more violence. This cowardly act was planned by Sharon personally, it has been reported.

If Israel, the holder of significant military capability - including nuclear weapons, felt threatened by an old, paralyzed man in a wheelchair, then it only serves to show that it is governed by a gang of cowardly thugs who do not have even an ounce of intelligence. Their methods are sick - they fired a missile directly at the man in his wheelchair, cutting him to pieces? Who in the living fvck do they think they are? They mean to suggest that they could not bring this man in to custody? What a joke.

Hamas has said, today Israel 'opened the gates of hell'. Consider how many Palestinians are now willing to die in Yasin's name. Consider who the victims are going to be and then question the usefulness of such a disgusting act by Israel, a state-sponsor of terrorism itself.

"The United States urges all sides to remain calm and exercise restraint." What a piss poor response. This is what the worlds 'super-power' has to say? remain calm?! lol! This just goes to show that America is absolutely Israel's bitch.

Every action has a reaction. We'll see this in effect in the coming weeks, months and years, no doubt.

I'd be interested in seeing the posts in which you write so passionately when Hamas blows innocent men, women, and children to bits.

Lerkfish · Mar 22, 2004, 11:26 AM

Originally posted by James Christ:
Bin Ladin is an old man with a walking stick. Whats the difference? One just happens to 'sheikh' a bit more.

Actions have consequences. Things do not occur in a vacuum. Read the post above yours for some indications of that.

Lerkfish · Mar 22, 2004, 11:27 AM

Originally posted by Spheric Harlot:
Welcome to WWIII.

You can pick up your soul when you leave.

Will the last person to leave the planet please remember to turn out the lights?

Spheric Harlot · Mar 22, 2004, 11:28 AM

Originally posted by SimeyTheLimey:
I'd be interested in seeing the posts in which you write so passionately when Hamas blows innocent men, women, and children to bits.

And that justifies this action how?

Does your comment somehow make Israel's assassination accord with international human rights?

Does it somehow address the FACT that possibly *hundreds* of Israelis will DIE as a direct result of this "retaliation"?

Does it in any way make Sharon's motivations any less evil? Because peace is most obviously NOT his motivation.

Well?

-s*

Spheric Harlot · Mar 22, 2004, 11:29 AM

Originally posted by Lerkfish:
Will the last person to leave the planet please remember to turn out the lights?

Don't worry, the friendly glow will subside on its own after a couple thousand years.

-s*

Logic · Mar 22, 2004, 11:30 AM

Originally posted by SimeyTheLimey:
I'd be interested in seeing the posts in which you write so passionately when Hamas blows innocent men, women, and children to bits.

I'd be interested in seeing the posts in which you write so passionately when Israel blows innocent men, women, and children to bits.

ghost_flash · Mar 22, 2004, 11:30 AM

Originally posted by Lerkfish:
Will the last person to leave the planet please remember to turn out the lights?

I'll get it.

SimeyTheLimey · Mar 22, 2004, 11:31 AM

Originally posted by Logic:
I'd be interested in seeing the posts in which you write so passionately when Israel blows innocent men, women, and children to bits.

This guy wasn't innocent. Not by a long shot.

Of course, I should qualify my post above to point out that Hamas deliberately blows up innocent men, women, and children. I'd like to see the emotional condemnations of that. All I have seen is "yes this is bad, BUT -- followed by a ritual passage where Israel is blamed for bringing attacks on itself.

However, there is a cycle of violence here. It begins with groups like Hamas.

Logic · Mar 22, 2004, 11:33 AM

Originally posted by SimeyTheLimey:
This guy wasn't innocent. Not by a long shot.

What about the other killed in the attack?

And of all the other that have been killed in this endless conflict? Are Israelis worth more than Palestinians in your opinion?

ghost_flash · Mar 22, 2004, 11:34 AM

Originally posted by SimeyTheLimey:
This guy wasn't innocent. Not by a long shot.

And believe-you-me, that was one hell of a looooong shot!

SimeyTheLimey · Mar 22, 2004, 11:35 AM

Originally posted by Logic:
What about the other killed in the attack?

And of all the other that have been killed in this endless conflict? Are Israelis worth more than Palestinians in your opinion?

Israeili civilians are worth more than Hamas terrorists, yes.

Logic · Mar 22, 2004, 11:36 AM

Oh, and one other question.

Has the US ever asked for calm after a terrorist attack?

Logic · Mar 22, 2004, 11:36 AM

Originally posted by SimeyTheLimey:
Israeili civilians are worth more than Hamas terrorists, yes.

Nice duck!

I asked about innocent civilians. Not terrorists.

SimeyTheLimey · Mar 22, 2004, 11:37 AM

Originally posted by Logic:
Oh, and one other question.

Has the US ever asked for calm after a terrorist attack?

Yes. But it would require considerable research to find it.

BTW, what is your fixation about the US? You turn every thread into an attack on the US. Stop it!

ghost_flash · Mar 22, 2004, 11:37 AM

Originally posted by Logic:
Oh, and one other question.

Has the US ever asked for calm after a terrorist attack?

Has Iceland? Oh wait, Iceland has never had a terrorist attack.
STFU, you don't count.

dcolton · Mar 22, 2004, 11:38 AM

"It is the natural right of the Jewish people, like that of all nations in the world that love life, to hunt down those who rise to destroy it."
-Ariel Sharon

Ahmed Yassin was no saint. He was an evil man who leads and encourages murderers...nothing more, nothing less. Just because he was in pathetic physical condition, his influence over hate filled murderers was still prominent. He deserves to be buried in the filth we call the other white meat - Pork.

itai195 · Mar 22, 2004, 11:41 AM

Originally posted by lil'babykitten:
I think it just serves to confirm the objectives of the Israeli government. Sharon does not want peace as he continually demonstrates. All his actions serve to instigate more violence. This cowardly act was planned by Sharon personally, it has been reported.

If Israel, the holder of significant military capability - including nuclear weapons, felt threatened by an old, paralyzed man in a wheelchair, then it only serves to show that it is governed by a gang of cowardly thugs who do not have even an ounce of intelligence. Their methods are sick - they fired a missile directly at the man in his wheelchair, cutting him to pieces? Who in the living fvck do they think they are? They mean to suggest that they could not bring this man in to custody? What a joke.

Hamas has said, today Israel 'opened the gates of hell'. Consider how many Palestinians are now willing to die in Yasin's name. Consider who the victims are going to be and then question the usefulness of such a disgusting act by Israel, a state-sponsor of terrorism itself.

"The United States urges all sides to remain calm and exercise restraint." What a piss poor response. This is what the worlds 'super-power' has to say? remain calm?! lol! This just goes to show that America is absolutely Israel's bitch.

Every action has a reaction. We'll see this in effect in the coming weeks, months and years, no doubt.

Actually they probably could not bring him into custody, at least not without significant casualties on both sides. Hamas supporters make trouble even for the PA security forces.

SimeyTheLimey · Mar 22, 2004, 11:41 AM

Originally posted by Logic:
Nice duck!

I asked about innocent civilians. Not terrorists.

Innocent civilians are worth the same regardless of nationality -- which is a lesson that I wish Hamas would learn. They target civilians as civilians, not incidentally as civilians caught in the crossfire. There is a massive moral difference.

Where is your emotional condemnation of Hamas and its murderous campaign? You know, the one that doesn't try to blame Israel or the US.

Logic · Mar 22, 2004, 11:41 AM

Originally posted by SimeyTheLimey:
This guy wasn't innocent. Not by a long shot.

Of course, I should qualify my post above to point out that Hamas deliberately blows up innocent men, women, and children. I'd like to see the emotional condemnations of that. All I have seen is "yes this is bad, BUT -- followed by a ritual passage where Israel is blamed for bringing attacks on itself.

However, there is a cycle of violence here. It begins with groups like Hamas.

And Israelis deliberately attack "terrorists" when they are close to innocent people.

All of us "terrorist sympathizers" have condemned terrorist attacks on several occasions. Not once have I seen the "tough on terrorist Bushies" condemn attacks on "terrorists" that deliberately caused civilian deaths. Not once.

Oh, and one more question. Does anyone have any proof that this man had committed any terrorist attacks?

Logic · Mar 22, 2004, 11:42 AM

Originally posted by SimeyTheLimey:
Yes. But it would require considerable research to find it.

BTW, what is your fixation about the US? You turn every thread into an attack on the US. Stop it!

Sorry, but you will not tell me what I'll post.

If you are so sure they have done that, perhaps you could find something to prove it.

itai195 · Mar 22, 2004, 11:43 AM

Originally posted by Logic:
And Israelis deliberately attack "terrorists" when they are close to innocent people.

All of us "terrorist sympathizers" have condemned terrorist attacks on several occasions. Not once have I seen the "tough on terrorist Bushies" condemn attacks on "terrorists" that deliberately caused civilian deaths. Not once.

Err, do you have any proof of that?

Wiskedjak · Mar 22, 2004, 11:43 AM

Originally posted by Troll:
... what about the innocent people who just happened to be going about their business, before they lost their lives? Were they mass murderers too? Can we see charge sheets for each one of them as well?

Acceptable losses when hunting partially blind, wheel-chair-bound, guadriplegic "terrorists"/"freedom fighters" (depending upon perspective). Especially when those innocent people are Palestinian and not Israeli.