[clebin]

This is the Big List I have in Notes (not Lotus but the Notepad replacement) which lists various bugs, missing features and nice-to-haves. Any comments please...

General:

DVD Player
Data CD burning
General Speed-up
Improved Quicktime
Appearances, font choices
More 'tints' (eg. Sage, Blueberry, Snow, etc)
HID Manager front-end
Desktop Picture options
Dock Placement, other TinkerTool prefs
File Encryption
Voiceprint Passwords
Windowshade
Lock on sleep/screen saver
Multitasking Applemenu (doesn't freeze with app)
Better Dictionary, app
Standardisation in dialogues, text areas
Switching users like WinXP
Improve look & feel of Applet Launcher, Classic startup
Other Java utilities, Java 1.4, Enterprise Edition
Folder synchronisation/replication
Services in Carbon
Sheets in Carbon
Application launch goes into infinite loop
Force Quit.. on Dock icons
More Dockling features rolled into applications
Tabbed Dock folders
G4 Modem problems
Support for ATI Rage Pro
Split Recent Items in Recent Applications and Recent Folders
Set number of Recent Items in Preferences

Finder:

Icons forgetting their positions
slow window resizing
multithreaded Server Connection
full contextual menus, CMM architecture
labels or equivalent (see Eazel Nautilus)
Spring-loaded Folders
Folder-level Find
Thumbnail view
Auto-slideshow (hooks into screensaver)
Copy & Paste files
Folder icon previews contents
Audio CDs show names (iTunes/CDDB)
Completed AppleScript support
Column view doesn't work with Recent Items
Same Get Info in disks on Desktop and in Computer folder.
Remembers expanded folders in list view when parent is collapsed.

Mail:

Better multithreading/less lock-ups
Stop collecting multiple copies of same message
Expand message rules

This list will never be empty, but I'm looking forward to deleting atleast a few.

Chris

[havannas]

Can take this off of list:

"Force Quit.. on Dock icons"

Try option-clicking.

Clicking =
(click and hold...slight pause) or
(ctrl-click...immediate) or
(right-click...immediate).

PS- This can be invoked after the dock-menu is already up. Option will toggle Quit/Force Quit.

[ 07-08-2001: Message edited by: havannas ]

[Lolo from Paris]

Originally posted by clebin:
<STRONG>
Mail:

Better multithreading/less lock-ups
Stop collecting multiple copies of same message
Expand message rules

</STRONG>

Mail :

-Put the app in the trash

-Ask Micro$oft to make an OS X compatible version of Outlook Express and give it with OS X like it used to be with 0S 9.1

More seriously, I think that the whole Mail.app has to be changed. It's too buggy to be usable. It lacks a lot of features too and it doesn't handle HTML properly, encoding has big problems when sending a message to a PC...

I really don't like it :-(

[moki]

Originally posted by Lolo from Paris:
<STRONG>More seriously, I think that the whole Mail.app has to be changed. It's too buggy to be usable. It lacks a lot of features too and it doesn't handle HTML properly, encoding has big problems when sending a message to a PC...

I really don't like it :-(</STRONG>

I don't understand the animosity re: Mail.app. Personally, I think it's one of the best eMail clients I've used, because it is easy to use and gets out of my way. I've never seen it not handle a HTML email properly or have a problem sending an eMail message to anyone else.

The major issue with Mail.app seems to be with IMAP servers (the IMAP support is spotty at best), but since I use a POP3 server, it doesn't matter to me.

[lookmark]

Originally posted by moki:
[QB]

I don't understand the animosity re: Mail.app. Personally, I think it's one of the best eMail clients I've used, because it is easy to use and gets out of my way. I've never seen it not handle a HTML email properly or have a problem sending an eMail message to anyone else.

Same here. I find Mail very nicely done. Especially for version 1.0.

[Han's Hands on Leia]

Originally posted by lookmark:
<STRONG>

Same here. I find Mail very nicely done. Especially for version 1.0.</STRONG>

Is it really a 1.0 though. How long was mail.app on NeXT? Isn't the OSX version just a port of a late version that ran on NeXT?

[Group51]

Originally posted by lookmark:
<STRONG>

Same here. I find Mail very nicely done. Especially for version 1.0.</STRONG>

1.0? I thought it was a development of NeXT Mail? Anyway, my problem with Mail, which I really want to like, is that, as with the rest of the OS, it is slow, slow to start-up, slow to open mail boxes, slow to index, slow to open (render?) individual mails, slow to delete messages from the server, slow to switch mail boxes, and is slow to switch to when minimized because that mail window insists on appearing even if I have closed it.

The other problem is that it appears not to be able to multi-task. I have to wait and wait for it to read the list of message or do it index before it displays the message - can't it do this in the background? The speed reminds me of GroupWise at work where all Mail is stored on the server. Slooow.

I have 256MB RAM, PowerBook G3, 333.

[NeilCharter]

Who cares where it came from. I would use it even if it had come out of Bill Gate's arse (providing someone had cleaned it properly first, of course!).

I've had little problems with it for POP and it does everything I want and i don't have to jerk around with Eudora's advertisement crap. And even though my work now has a license for Eudora 5 and I could download the carbon version I haven't even bothered.

As for the original question - I don't really know and I don't think anyone else who can say does either. CD data burning and speed are my 2 main issues. That and carbon versions of apps I need.

Only a week til NY - we'll all soon find out.

Neil

[BTP]

I didn't have any problems with Mail.app, but one of the few things that keep Classic around for me is that I need Entourage. Mail.app just doesn't have the functionality I need.

[Ron Goodman]

I've been very happy with the OS X Eudora, although Mail.app never caused a problem and in fact, handles multiple accounts nicely. The only thing I really want is to be able to burn data CDs and support for my UMAX scanner. Sooner or later we'll need fax software too, I guess. I'd like to see an OS X update for my Adobe Events, but my GIMP CD should be here in a day or so.

[ 07-08-2001: Message edited by: Ron Goodman ]

[BuonRotto]

just rying to knock a few out:

Lock on sleep/screen saver

Isn't this already in 10.0?

Force Quit.. on Dock icons

Same, use the option key, or is it option-command? One of those.

Split Recent Items in Recent Applications and Recent Folders

Doesn't it already do this, or do you mean split it into apps, folders and files?

Thumbnail view

Not sure what you mean: icons? the preview pane of column view? The Show Info dialog has a preview panel. FYI, A common behavior of NeXTstep users was to have the File Browser (Finder) and Inspector (Show Info) open at all times. Just want to clear it up, thanks.

Good list though.

[clebin]

Certain bugs in Mail.app are beginning to quite annoy me, but overall I like the program. The big problem is locking up, but Omniweb is a good example of how this can be eradicated. If I saw a similar change in Mail.app, I'd be very happy with it. Personally, I liked Outlook Express 4.5 but can't abide 5.0. I'll add email attachment encoding errors to my list.

I just plain forgot about Force Quit on the Dock. Thanks! In doing this just now I found another feature I didn't know about - Command-Clicking a Dock item does a Show Original. Nice!

Edit: OK - I just saw the screen-saver activation preference! Another mistake. Strange it isn't available for Sleep, though.

By thumbnail view, I mean exactly what Windows Explorer has (see other thread) although I'd just like something to ensure that all my images had a preview icon. The preview pane is all very well, but you have to click through every image to find the one you want.

By splitting Recent Items, I mean having Recent Applications and Recent Folders as seperate sub-menus on the Applemenu and the ability to set the number of items in the General control panel. It takes too long to appear right now, and I always know whether I'm looking for a file or an app before I get there.

A few down...more than a few to go!

Chris

[ 07-08-2001: Message edited by: clebin ]

Originally posted by clebin:
<STRONG>This is the Big List I have in Notes (not Lotus but the Notepad replacement) which lists various bugs, missing features and nice-to-haves. Any comments please...

General:

Data CD burning
</STRONG>

Toast X can't get here soon enough. Unfortunately they're waiting on Apple to finalize the underlying framework for SCSI and friends.

<STRONG>
Appearances, font choices

</STRONG>

Especially for Finder filename text and desktop items. The desktop / dock text (large white text with drop shadow) is especially awful. I expect some people like it though so I'll settle for a choice to switch to something like OS 9. I don't want to have to hold down the option key to see what the file is actually called all the time.

<STRONG>
More 'tints' (eg. Sage, Blueberry, Snow, etc)

</STRONG>

Because of the way they do this I wouldn't expect lots of tints. It'd be nice to see every application not have to carry it's own copy of Extras.rsrc around though, that would make it easier to do this without requiring everyone to have 256MB of RAM.

<STRONG>
Desktop Picture options

</STRONG>

They're supposed to be adding ways for 3rd party apps to change the desktop picture, so even if Apple doesn't for some odd reason you'll probably be able to get another program to do it.

<STRONG>
Sheets in Carbon

</STRONG>

The next major revision is supposed to have translucent sheets in Carbon apps.

<STRONG>
More Dockling features rolled into applications

</STRONG>

I'd rather see a way for programs to add items to their pop-up menu than waste space with a dockling. But then I refuse to put anything that sounds so twee on my computer .

<STRONG>
Support for ATI Rage Pro

</STRONG>

Apparently Apple decided to handle support for these video chipsets, that means the preferred method of support is to make you buy a new system.

<STRONG>
Finder:

slow window resizing

</STRONG>

Do you mean the slower-than-others window resizing like the list view, or just the general slowness of resizing any large window in X? You can see an example of the latter by dragging a selection rectangle on the desktop, it's fairly fast when small but once it reaches a certain size it bogs down horribly. This is independent of any content since it happens even when there isn't any.

<STRONG>
full contextual menus, CMM architecture
Spring-loaded Folders

</STRONG>

The next major revision should (finally) have contextual menu support. I think that spring-loaded folders are a victim of NIAN syndrome (not-invented-at-NeXT).

<STRONG>
Audio CDs show names (iTunes/CDDB)

</STRONG>

This is planned, though I hope it's something you can turn off.

<STRONG>
Mail:

</STRONG>

Bring on Entourage X. It's a shame that Outlook Express for the Mac is unlikely to ever be a native application.

Sorry if the formatting on this is screwed up, buggy native X software .

Sheets in Carbon

If by sheets, you mean the windows that pop out from the title bar (like the Save dialog in Mail.app); that ability is already in Carbon. I just added sheets to the Carbonized version of the app the company I work at develops.

[Lolo from Paris]

Originally posted by moki:
<STRONG>

I don't understand the animosity re: Mail.app. Personally, I think it's one of the best eMail clients I've used, because it is easy to use and gets out of my way. I've never seen it not handle a HTML email properly or have a problem sending an eMail message to anyone else.
</STRONG>

I loved Claris Emailer and I think it was one of the best email client ever created. But IMO Mail.app is not a good Apple software, it is certainly the worst one.

I have about 5 crashs a day, problem with keychain (Mail.app asks me to type my keychain password everytime...), HTML doesn't render properly means some images are not displayed as they should, especially .gif and most of the time I have encoding/decoding problems with PC people or Mac people using Outlook (they received strange characters instead of my documents)...


Plus, I just don't like the interface, especially the drawer which should be more customisable or it should be like Outlook Express. I think it's not easy to create subfolders etc. Icons shouldn't be the same for deleted messages and sent messages etc. Search is not as good as Outlook Express. There is no way to put a message in color or with a flag. There is not export too...

For me, Mail.app is too basic and lacks a lot of features and it just doesn't look like a finished app. I hard to say that about an apple software but it's the first time I really don't like an apple app (well, maybe sherlock was first)

Maybe it's just that mail.app is damn slow ??? ;-)

About OS X, I just want DVD/CDRW functions, all the OS 9.1 features (function keys F1,F2...custom apple menu, better contextual menus etc), some apps and all my USB devices drivers (especially scanner, wacom & webcam) and I'll be happy


[ 07-09-2001: Message edited by: Lolo from Paris ]

[ 07-09-2001: Message edited by: Lolo from Paris ]

[SirCastor]

Originally posted by Lolo from Paris:
<STRONG>

I loved Claris Emailer and I think it was one of the best email client ever created.
</STRONG>

Although a bit unrelated. I strongly suggest that anyone who misses Claris Emailer check out
Powermail
It's a really wonderful email client.. and as near as I can tell, matches Emailer Feature for Feature (even acts the same a lot). It's not identical, but It's pretty close.

No, I don't work for CTM-Dev. But I really do like their product.
-Aaron

[Millennium]

I like PowerMail myself. It's still missing two mig Emailer features, namely redirecting a message to a group as part of a filter (I loved that one; I could run whole mailing lists using nothing but Emailer), and support for AOL mail (yeah, yeah, I know I'm dreaming on that one).

I'd also like to see IMAP support, though I understand that's scheduled for 3.1 anyway.