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SSharon · Sep 13, 2013, 12:58 PM

I have a 32gb iPhone 4 on ATT and I'm not jumping up and down waiting to upgrade. I'm happy with the screen size, battery life, and general performance of the phone. I'd like siri and panoramic photos, but is that really all I'm getting after waiting for three years? When I went from an original iphone to the 4 it was an enormous leap forward.

Am I the only one that thinks the prices for the cases are beyond absurd? How does Apple think someone will buy multiple cases for a 5C? If they are saving $100 to get the 5C instead of the 5S why would they blow that $100 on 3 cases?

Hawkeye_a · Sep 13, 2013, 01:24 PM

On the flip side to my previous negative-nancy post, I have to say that I found the 3GS, 4 and 4S designs to be unique and tasteful. I guess i'm just thuroughly disappointed with the design direction of iOS devices in the past year or so.

The fit and finish on the iPhone5/S is a level above anything else (like the buttons and chamferd edges), i just don't like the final over-all look of the product.

Spheric Harlot · Sep 13, 2013, 01:29 PM

Originally Posted by SSharon

Am I the only one that thinks the prices for the cases are beyond absurd? How does Apple think someone will buy multiple cases for a 5C? If they are saving $100 to get the 5C instead of the 5S why would they blow that $100 on 3 cases?

iPhone cases are a very popular gift.

Laminar · Sep 13, 2013, 06:54 PM

Originally Posted by SSharon

I have a 32gb iPhone 4 on ATT and I'm not jumping up and down waiting to upgrade. I'm happy with the screen size, battery life, and general performance of the phone. I'd like siri and panoramic photos, but is that really all I'm getting after waiting for three years? When I went from an original iphone to the 4 it was an enormous leap forward.

Don't underestimate the bigger screen, thinner phone, lighter weight, and 4G service. It's a big difference.

Cold Warrior · Sep 13, 2013, 08:43 PM

iPhone 4 to 5: 4G LTE is great. That alone is worth it, on top of everything else laminar said. I'll upgrade from the 5 to the 5s for the camera and video features (burst, intelligent selection, slo mo 720p, dual flash, etc.), plus the fingerprint sensor.

subego · Sep 13, 2013, 08:56 PM

WRT the change between 4 and 5, let me add 802.11n, and the first model which isn't starved for RAM.

Not only is the change from 4 to 5 huge, the 4 is broken.

Spheric Harlot · Sep 14, 2013, 03:16 AM

The 4S has 802.11n, albeit 2.4 GHz only

subego · Sep 14, 2013, 03:33 AM

Hmm... 2.4 is so crowded here I never even realized.

The Final Dakar · Sep 16, 2013, 09:22 AM

Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot

The 4S has 802.11n, albeit 2.4 GHz only

Yeah, its a pain.

SSharon · Sep 16, 2013, 11:37 AM

There's no question that the 5 and 5S are better than the 4 that I have I just don't have the same urgency to upgrade as I did from the original to the 4. I don't think the 4 is broken by any means though. Apps are a bit slow to launch sometimes, but the phone is very usable.

As for wifi, I just ran speedtest and got 20 mbit up/down. I switched to fios last week and those speeds are faster than what I had with optimum (15/5) on my MBP so I don't see 802.11n giving me any real advantage.

subego · Sep 16, 2013, 03:27 PM

Trust me, it's broken.

I've lost count of how many times it wiped out a post because I needed to open another page to check a fact, and when I get back it's out of RAM, needs to rerender the page, and wipes out all my typing. If I need to copy text to the clipboard for safety when I leave a web page, that's broken.

I have a 100/10 connection. 20 is broken to me.

In a similar vein, 3G is broken when you have LTE. Maybe the difference between 20 and 100 isn't a big deal, but the difference of 5-10 up on LTE is very noticeable compared to 1-2 up from 3G.

Also, bigger screen. More room for activities.

SSharon · Sep 16, 2013, 11:33 PM

Originally Posted by subego

I have a 100/10 connection. 20 is broken to me.

I went from 15/5 to 50/25 so I can't complain.

I don't think I'll be able to hang on for another entire year (until the iPhone 6), so I may as well upgrade now and get the most use out of the 5S. My wife has a 4S and seems happy with it.

P · Sep 18, 2013, 10:19 AM

Early reviews are up - Anandtech's is worth a read as usual. The A7 mostly holds what Apple promises, and yes, they did it without clocking it higher or going quadcore. Extremely impressive. He doesn't have any inside intel this time, however, but basically Apple seems to have done it by improving memory accesses again. L2 cache latency is down, main memory latency is down (although no exact numbers), the improvements in Arm64 mean a couple of big improvements in certain specific cases, and that almost comes to a 100% improvement. I have to wonder if they didn't go wider, though - another integer unit, perhaps, or another decoder.

Hmm... I wonder if they have decoders that convert Arm32 to Arm64 and then use the Arm64 as Intel's uops? It would make sense, because you can disable the converter-decoder when running 64-bit code and save some energy.

ShortcutToMoncton · Sep 18, 2013, 10:48 AM

Welp, no significant change in battery life from the 5.

Spheric Harlot · Sep 18, 2013, 10:57 AM

Slightly better.

And the increase in power at no expense to battery life is pretty remarkable.

Spheric Harlot · Sep 18, 2013, 11:00 AM

Originally Posted by P

I wonder if they have decoders that convert Arm32 to Arm64 and then use the Arm64 as Intel's uops? It would make sense, because you can disable the converter-decoder when running 64-bit code and save some energy.

From how I understand Anand, the new die includes both Arm32 and ARM64 units?

P · Sep 18, 2013, 01:20 PM

I'm certain they didn't replicate the entire core, that would be wasteful (and there isn't space in the die to do so anyway). Either they made the decoders work for both A32 and A64 code, they duplicated the decoders (but kept the fetch, write back and execution units), or they have decoders of one type converting to the other type. I'm thinking they did the last one so they can save some energy when running A64 code, and because it has the potential for being faster for A32 code as well.

Shaddim · Sep 18, 2013, 05:30 PM

Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot

Slightly better.

And the increase in power at no expense to battery life is pretty remarkable.

There is an impact to battery, but only ~11%. You can see it more in his wi-fi tests.

Spheric Harlot · Sep 18, 2013, 05:35 PM

Originally Posted by Shaddim

There is an impact to battery, but only ~11%. You can see it more in his wi-fi tests.

LTE is much improved, though.

And, at least according to Apple's tech specs, standby time and 3G talk time have improved, as well.

Hawkeye_a · Sep 22, 2013, 02:29 PM

Hypothetical question:
If the 5C was available alongside the iPhone5(black & white), for the exact same price. which one would you be inclined to buy?

Personally, I would go for the iPhone5. It's thinner, lighter and better looking.

If Apple were to have kept the 5 i their lineup without introducing the 5C, what do you think the price would have been? (ie whats the point of the 5C?)

Spheric Harlot · Sep 22, 2013, 02:51 PM

The point of the 5c is that the phone needed a redesign anyway to accommodate the new, much more comprehensive LTE coverage, so Apple used the opportunity to create a new line that is clearly differentiated from the high-end model, and also has the appeal of colors (which, I predict, will make it the #1 selling phone this Christmas season, by far).

I suspect that the plastic case is somewhat cheaper to manufacture, which means that Apple can redesign the 5 into the 5c, drop the price, and still have a better margin than they did on the 5.

Sales are high enough now to warrant this redesign.

ort888 · Sep 22, 2013, 04:26 PM

I spent a while playing around with my dad's 5S and am really impressed by the fingerprint scanner.

It really works flawlessly.

Here's what I want. I want it to be tied to every password I have, on my phone and computer.

Whenever I have to put a in password on my mac, let me use a thumbprint on my phone and have it beam over.

Spheric Harlot · Sep 22, 2013, 05:28 PM

I'm sure something like that is in the works. Nothing to be rushed, though. The potential for abuse is enormous.

subego · Sep 22, 2013, 05:51 PM

Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot

The point of the 5c is that the phone needed a redesign anyway to accommodate the new, much more comprehensive LTE coverage, so Apple used the opportunity to create a new line that is clearly differentiated from the high-end model, and also has the appeal of colors (which, I predict, will make it the #1 selling phone this Christmas season, by far).

I suspect that the plastic case is somewhat cheaper to manufacture, which means that Apple can redesign the 5 into the 5c, drop the price, and still have a better margin than they did on the 5.

Sales are high enough now to warrant this redesign.

It's not just cheaper, it self-identifies as "teh new".

The 5 (without s) is last year's sloppy seconds.