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You are here: MacNN Forums > Hardware - Troubleshooting and Discussion > Mac Notebooks > New MacBooks-Moved from the PowerBook/MacBook Pro forum

New MacBooks-Moved from the PowerBook/MacBook Pro forum
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mkerr64
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May 15, 2007, 09:11 AM
 
the store is down right now however, they have introduced the new MacBook
2.16ghz 200gb HD etc..
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mduell
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May 15, 2007, 09:20 AM
 
Same GMA950 graphics
     
pheonixash
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May 15, 2007, 09:23 AM
 
Minor upgrade, bump in processor speed, 1 GB RAM standard on all models, and increment in hard disk capacity by one up.
     
butterfly0fdoom
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May 15, 2007, 09:24 AM
 
But with the MacBook topping out at 2.16, that means the MPB will have thet 2.2 and the 2.4 when they get the SR update between now and WWDC.
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badnewsblair
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May 15, 2007, 09:27 AM
 
Originally Posted by butterfly0fdoom View Post
But with the MacBook topping out at 2.16, that means the MPB will have thet 2.2 and the 2.4 when they get the SR update between now and WWDC.
IF my friend. IF.
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Dork.
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May 15, 2007, 09:52 AM
 
Originally Posted by mduell View Post
Same GMA950 graphics
I won't be buying one, then....
     
mac128k-1984
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May 15, 2007, 10:09 AM
 
Meh,

I was hoping for something a little more dramatic for the MBP, oh well. My MB will have to suffice for the time being.
Michael
     
rjt1000
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May 15, 2007, 10:19 AM
 
Originally Posted by pheonixash View Post
Minor upgrade, bump in processor speed, 1 GB RAM standard on all models, and increment in hard disk capacity by one up.
OK, I get it: Today was the day for the disappointing updates that Steve would be embarassed to talk about at WWDC
     
Simon
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May 15, 2007, 10:28 AM
 
GMA 950 sucks. Not offering Santa Rosa sucks. Paying even more (it's now $125) just for black sucks. Not offering a $999 MB sucks.

Apple was fairly aggressive when they started the MB line, but now they seem to be falling behind. Obviously Apple sold too many MacBooks lately. Time to head back to that 3% market share.
     
analogika
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May 15, 2007, 11:40 AM
 
They'll continue to sell like hotcakes.
     
Simon
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May 15, 2007, 01:09 PM
 
Until they don't.
     
highstakes
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May 15, 2007, 02:14 PM
 
Wow...200 gig HD
     
analogika
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May 15, 2007, 04:02 PM
 
Originally Posted by Simon View Post
Until they don't.
When is the next big revision of Vista coming out?

I doubt we'll have to be concerned before then.
     
Obi Wan's Ghost
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May 15, 2007, 04:20 PM
 
And all the insider and secrets sites predicted wrongly.
     
Big Mac
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May 15, 2007, 04:28 PM
 
The MB line was lame and will remain so. I don't know why they're so popular.

"The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield and government to gain ground." TJ
     
TailsToo
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May 15, 2007, 07:40 PM
 
Popular because most people don't want to shell out $2 for a laptop anymore.
     
RogueSqdn
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May 15, 2007, 08:00 PM
 
$2K? (I previously had the 1.83GHz CD MB)

I picked up the $2499 MBP at the Apple Store in Charlotte on Saturday... because of a clerk-caused goof on scanning in my credit cards, I had to wait on the phone and in line for more than half an hour with my card company to get it fixed. So we couldn't have to spend the same time calling the second card company, and to compensate me, the manager gave me the $700 I would have spent with the second card as a discount on the MBP.

So, MBP, AppleCare, Incase sleeve, Toast Titanium, and Firewire cable, plus tax, for $2438, less than the retail of the MBP. I was happy. So happy I might have to pick up the new Airport Extreme 802.11n (I have the AEBS 802.11g).
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disposable
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May 15, 2007, 08:09 PM
 
^^ Wow, that's awesome.

I just bought myself a brand new black Macbook with 2gigs of RAM and 200GB hard drive! It should be coming in on Friday.
     
cherry su
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May 15, 2007, 08:57 PM
 
Originally Posted by TailsToo View Post
Popular because most people don't want to shell out $2 for a laptop anymore.
I would!! Actually I would by 10 of 'em. Oh wait...you meant $2K. In that case then I can only afford 1/1000 of a laptop
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QuadG5Man
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May 15, 2007, 09:45 PM
 
The macbook's popular because it performs cpu intensive tasks at speeds roughly equivalent to a Dual G5.

At least that's why it's popular to me
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xsphat
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May 15, 2007, 09:48 PM
 
mduell has it right, I am not a fan of the GMA950 BS either. I tam thinking about trading my MacBook in for the next MBP release. Apple better not drop the ball on the Santa Rosa thing either or I'm gonna be pissed.
     
pyrite
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May 15, 2007, 09:54 PM
 
i'm not surprised by this update, im not quite sure what you guys are talking about... they'll probably roll santa rosa out into the MBP soon, which will push their sales and increase the performance gap between MB and MBP, highlighting the pro line to professional users. People will continue to buy macbooks, because they still rock, and 99.9% of people interested in them wouldn't have a clue what santa rosa even means, and couldn't care.

GMA950 makes NO difference to a home/entertainment/office user, it will ONLY affect the 3D graphics professional or gamer. The C2D chips are still lightning fast, and in Australia there's even been a welcome price drop to $1599AUS for the new base model MB. i'll probably pick one up soon.
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Simon
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May 16, 2007, 01:08 AM
 
Originally Posted by analogika View Post
When is the next big revision of Vista coming out?
I doubt we'll have to be concerned before then.
I don't believe this has anything to do with Vista at all. The reason Apple won market share with the previous MBs is because they offered very competitive hardware bundled with a superior OS. But PC history tells us most people will sacrifice the superior OS if it becomes tied to outdated and/or overpriced hardware.

The new MBs are more expensive then most entry-level PC notebooks. Offering a GMA 950 on a $1499 notebook is plain ridiculous. Of course fan boys will tell you that users won't notice since they supposedly don't play games or run stuff like Aperture. But that's completely irrelevant when you consider competition offers less expensive notebooks that come with dedicated GPUs, superior chipsets, and/or faster CPUs.
     
Pierre B.
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May 16, 2007, 04:50 AM
 
Originally Posted by Obi Wan's Ghost View Post
And all the insider and secrets sites predicted wrongly.
How about this? And this?
     
analogika
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May 16, 2007, 05:22 AM
 
Originally Posted by Big Mac View Post
The MB line was lame and will remain so. I don't know why they're so popular.
Because they're spectacular value for anyone who doesn't game or render 3D stuff all day or do professional video editing or CAD under Windows.

I.e. 90% of the non-professional market, and almost the entire audio production industry.

In addition, they're small.

Everybody I know who has one is absolutely in love with it.
     
analogika
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May 16, 2007, 05:26 AM
 
Originally Posted by Simon View Post
I don't believe this has anything to do with Vista at all.
This update, no. Sales of MacBooks in general, yes.

"Until they don't" was just stupid, though, because a) of course Apple is going to keep updating these machines, and b) the competition has nothing substantial to offer consumers (note: consumers), at least until Vista becomes a viable option - in the next MAJOR revision a few years down the line, IF Microsoft manages to overcome the most fundamental ****-ups.
     
Obi Wan's Ghost
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May 16, 2007, 06:18 AM
 
Originally Posted by Pierre B. View Post
How about this? And this?
Secrets and insiders my butt

Think Secret - Laptop updates slated to arrive sooner than expected
Details of the MacBook update are less known, although there is a strong possibility that the laptop will also take advantage of Santa Rosa, which can be configured with Core 2 Duo processors at speeds of 1.8GHz, 2.0GHz, 2.2GHz, and 2.4GHz. The faster speeds will almost certainly be reserved for the MacBook Pro. More significant for MacBook owners is the faster Intel GMA 3000 graphics processor that Apple will be able to use, delivering improved graphics performance.
No Santa Rosa, no GMA 3000.
     
Simon
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May 16, 2007, 06:22 AM
 
Originally Posted by analogika View Post
"Until they don't" was just stupid, though, because a) of course Apple is going to keep updating these machines, and b) the competition has nothing substantial to offer consumers (note: consumers), at least until Vista becomes a viable option - in the next MAJOR revision a few years down the line, IF Microsoft manages to overcome the most fundamental ****-ups.
Of course Apple will keep updating these machines. But the updates should meet the level of Apple's competitors. Staying one step behind doesn't mix well with charging well over $1k for an entry-level notebook. Yes, OS X is far better than XP, but the MB is also a whole lot more expensive than other entry-level notebooks.

The reason MB sales took off was that Apple originally spec'ed out a very impressive portable Mac at a comparably low price. With this update neither the components nor the prices have changed considerably. In the meantime however, competition has lowered prices and increased the specs. How is that supposed to increase the number of switchers?
     
Pierre B.
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May 16, 2007, 06:28 AM
 
Originally Posted by Obi Wan's Ghost View Post
I don't understand this logic. TS made a wrong prediction and one day before the update it rectified. And it got it right. It is obvious that their sources want to cover themselves, so they waited until the last moment to provide more accurate info.

AI said right away that the Macbook update will not bring SR.
     
Obi Wan's Ghost
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May 16, 2007, 07:56 AM
 
Originally Posted by Pierre B. View Post
I don't understand this logic. TS made a wrong prediction and one day before the update it rectified. And it got it right.
Right my butt. They didn't get the specs right and it isn't the first time. It's the thousandth time. In early March both Think Secret and Apple Insider said Leopard was on track for a March/April release. AI said "insiders" told them the first MacBook would have an ATI graphics card and there would be a Red (the charity) version too. They're full of it. And illegally obtaining Leopard betas to post screenshots of doesn't make them insiders either.
     
mac128k-1984
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May 16, 2007, 08:14 AM
 
Originally Posted by Big Mac View Post
The MB line was lame and will remain so. I don't know why they're so popular.
why do you say they're lame?

The sell for a number of reasons, here's but a few.
First is the size and durability. Students can throw them in a backpack and not worry about the metal being deformed like the MBPs.
The price is another reason, its a heck of cheaper then a MBP.
Usage - for a lot of tasks its a great laptop, such as office apps, internet and anything that is processor intensive.

For me I bought the MB for all of those reasons, small size, portability, durability and at the time I didn't need to worry too much about using applications that were more demanding or could have used a larger screen.

I purchased a MB when they first came out and I've been pretty happy with mine, but because I'm getting more into photoshop and DW, I want a laptop that has a larger screen and a little more horsepower.
Michael
     
Pierre B.
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May 16, 2007, 09:07 AM
 
Originally Posted by Obi Wan's Ghost View Post
In early March both Think Secret and Apple Insider said Leopard was on track for a March/April release.
Yet, AI reports on the Leopard state of development made clear long ago that it is nearly impossible for Apple to meet the self-imposed deadline. It has been discussed many times over at AI. Apparently the sources want to cover again, but the Leopard seeds spoke for themselves.

Originally Posted by Obi Wan's Ghost View Post
AI said "insiders" told them the first MacBook would have an ATI graphics card and there would be a Red (the charity) version too.
A memory refreshing link would not hurt here.

Telling me that you generally hate rumor sites is something that I can understand and accept. But in the Macbook case (and many others) both nailed it.
     
Obi Wan's Ghost
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May 16, 2007, 09:25 AM
 
Originally Posted by Pierre B. View Post
Telling me that you generally hate rumor sites is something that I can understand and accept. But in the Macbook case (and many others) both nailed it.
Why did you snip out the part where I quoted their "inside" knowledge that the MacBook would have Santa Rosa and Intel X3000 graphics? MacNN members aren't so stupid that they can't scroll up
     
ghporter
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May 16, 2007, 09:28 AM
 
Why is this thread in the PowerBook/MacBook Pro forum? You will notice that the iMac forum is between the PowerBook and iBook forums so people can see the difference... And there's a thread in the iBook/MacBook forum about this already too.

Moving.

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
Pierre B.
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May 16, 2007, 09:41 AM
 
Originally Posted by Obi Wan's Ghost View Post
Why did you snip out the part where I quoted their "inside" knowledge that the MacBook would have Santa Rosa and Intel X3000 graphics? MacNN members aren't so stupid that they can't scroll up
I already gave you an answer on that.
     
Terrin
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May 16, 2007, 01:13 PM
 
I am not a fan of the integrated graphic chip either, but for most people this chip will more then fullfill their needs. I spent time playing with my girlfriend's mom's MacBook over the weekend, and the computer is no slouch.

The only real place the GMA950 takes a hit is with high end 3D games. For other games, and applications, like Photoshop and Final Cut Pro, the Mac Book works more then fine.

If you are a serious gamer, you have to pay the big bucks and get a more serious machine.

Originally Posted by xsphat View Post
mduell has it right, I am not a fan of the GMA950 BS either. I tam thinking about trading my MacBook in for the next MBP release. Apple better not drop the ball on the Santa Rosa thing either or I'm gonna be pissed.
     
Terrin
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May 16, 2007, 01:24 PM
 
I am not a fan of rumors, but Thinks Secret does a fair job. Moreover, rumors are just that rumors. Somebody may hear something that Apple is doing, but Apple may later change its plans, or the plans might not bear fruit until years later.

I once had a friend who did an internship for Apple (but no longer works there), and he told me about the iPod dock, the Mac Mini, and some other updates before they happened ( I never revealed this information). It took about two years after he told me about these things for them to be released, and some of the things were not released in the lab form.

The point is a reliable source may tell somebody something Apple is considering, but then Apple changes its mind.

TS also did not say that the Macbooks would have SR, merely that it was a possiblity.

Originally Posted by Pierre B. View Post
I don't understand this logic. TS made a wrong prediction and one day before the update it rectified. And it got it right. It is obvious that their sources want to cover themselves, so they waited until the last moment to provide more accurate info.

AI said right away that the Macbook update will not bring SR.
     
Pierre B.
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May 16, 2007, 02:00 PM
 
Originally Posted by Terrin View Post
I am not a fan of rumors, but Thinks Secret does a fair job. Moreover, rumors are just that rumors. Somebody may hear something that Apple is doing, but Apple may later change its plans, or the plans might not bear fruit until years later.
Exactly. The two or three main rumor sites we have today get many things wrong because of that. Moreover, there are the consequences of the recent Apple lawsuit against said sites. TS credibility took a deep plunge after the lawsuit because apparently its sources either have been identified and got fired or from fear of that shut their mouth.
     
ph0ust
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May 16, 2007, 02:43 PM
 
Originally Posted by Simon View Post
Of course Apple will keep updating these machines. But the updates should meet the level of Apple's competitors. Staying one step behind doesn't mix well with charging well over $1k for an entry-level notebook. Yes, OS X is far better than XP, but the MB is also a whole lot more expensive than other entry-level notebooks.

The reason MB sales took off was that Apple originally spec'ed out a very impressive portable Mac at a comparably low price. With this update neither the components nor the prices have changed considerably. In the meantime however, competition has lowered prices and increased the specs. How is that supposed to increase the number of switchers?
so true! i think you are right. i imagine hearing this in an apple store...

consumer: hi, i have a windows pc and am thinking of buying a mac. can you show me one?

salesperson: sure, do you want a pro machine or a regular use type of laptop?

consumer: oh, just regular use type stuff-- email, internet, photo editing, videos, music, office type stuff, etc.

salesperson: well here is our macbook line of computers. they run os x which is much better than windows and look great.

consumer: i don't know much about os x, is it easy to use?

salesperson: oh yes, very easy. and everything is built for the mac as well since apple makes all these applications.

consumer: doesn't microsoft make applications?

salesperson: yes, but we include more for free.

consumer: i see. is it as fast as a new windows computer?

salesperson: actually, no. it uses older hardware. if you want current hardware, you should buy the pro line of laptops.

consumer: but i don't want to pay for all the other extra stuff i don't need. why would i buy this instead of a similar priced windows machine that has CURRENT hardware?

salesperson: (using jedi mind trick) you want to buy this computer anyway.

consumer: uh, right. thanks anyway.
     
pyrite
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May 16, 2007, 08:44 PM
 
Originally Posted by analogika View Post
Because they're spectacular value for anyone who doesn't game or render 3D stuff all day or do professional video editing or CAD under Windows.

I.e. 90% of the non-professional market, and almost the entire audio production industry.

In addition, they're small.

Everybody I know who has one is absolutely in love with it.

bingo. my C2D macbook is mostly for Pro Tools use, and I couldn't be happier.
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pyrite
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May 16, 2007, 09:19 PM
 
Originally Posted by ph0ust View Post
so true! i think you are right. i imagine hearing this in an apple store...

consumer: hi, i have a windows pc and am thinking of buying a mac. can you show me one?

salesperson: sure, do you want a pro machine or a regular use type of laptop?

consumer: oh, just regular use type stuff-- email, internet, photo editing, videos, music, office type stuff, etc.

salesperson: well here is our macbook line of computers. they run os x which is much better than windows and look great.

consumer: i don't know much about os x, is it easy to use?

salesperson: oh yes, very easy. and everything is built for the mac as well since apple makes all these applications.

consumer: doesn't microsoft make applications?

salesperson: yes, but we include more for free.

consumer: i see. is it as fast as a new windows computer?

salesperson: actually, no. it uses older hardware. if you want current hardware, you should buy the pro line of laptops.

consumer: but i don't want to pay for all the other extra stuff i don't need. why would i buy this instead of a similar priced windows machine that has CURRENT hardware?

salesperson: (using jedi mind trick) you want to buy this computer anyway.

consumer: uh, right. thanks anyway.
C2D is not 'old hardware' just yet. you forget that we're basically all power users on this forum, and we know when a new chipset comes out the very day that it happens. average users don't and won't feel left behind until they see that, for example, every other machine on the market near MB's price range has an 800mhz FSB and a macbook doesn't (and even that's only for users who know what a frontside bus is...), or MB's chip is considerably slower in clock speed.

in Australia, a dell Inspiron 6400 currently sells for $100 more than a macbook, and has a 533MHz FSB and a 1.73GHz C2D chip. it may have 120GB and 2GB Ram, but given the shortfall of the chipset compared to the new entry-level macbook, I wouldn't go near the dell. It's bigger, heavier, nowhere near as sleek, and is slower than the macbook. i would have liked SR in the new macbook as much as the next guy, but the last thing they are is obsolete.
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pyrite
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May 16, 2007, 10:18 PM
 
^ actually, that price was for the model with a 256MB GeForce 7300LE, so not such a fair comparison.. the model without this has 1GB ram and is cheaper than MB, but also has the slower processor and bus speed. the point remains, MB is not an outdated machine in its price range.
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mduell
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May 17, 2007, 12:00 AM
 
Originally Posted by pyrite View Post
in Australia, a dell Inspiron 6400 currently sells for $100 more than a macbook, and has a 533MHz FSB and a 1.73GHz C2D chip. it may have 120GB and 2GB Ram, but given the shortfall of the chipset compared to the new entry-level macbook, I wouldn't go near the dell. It's bigger, heavier, nowhere near as sleek, and is slower than the macbook. i would have liked SR in the new macbook as much as the next guy, but the last thing they are is obsolete.
In the US, the Dell Latitude D630 (14" widescreen/2Ghz/1GB/GMAX3100/120GB/wifi/bt/combo/3 yr warranty) is $1100. Note that's with SR, and still hundreds cheaper than the MB with AppleCare. Size and weight are about the same despite the bigger screen.
     
analogika
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May 17, 2007, 11:03 AM
 
Actually, I just configured the D630 on the Dell USA website to

2GHz/1280x800 screen/1GB/GMAX3100/120GB/wifi/BT/Combo

and it came out to $1,594 excluding tax and shipping.

That's quite a bit more than the MacBook INCLUDING AppleCare.

And I could swear it looks quite a bit thicker than the MacBook.
     
mduell
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May 17, 2007, 11:27 AM
 
Looks like it's up about $100 from whatever promo I saw yesterday, but still $200 cheaper than MB+AC.



As far as size and weight goes, the D630 is 13.3" x 9.37" x 1.27" and 5.1 lbs with 6-cell battery and CD-ROM drive and MacBook is 12.8" x 8.92" x 1.08" and 5.1 lbs. A whopping fifth of an inch extra.
     
analogika
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May 17, 2007, 05:26 PM
 
Plus a half-inch in width and a half-inch in depth.

What is it with all these Dell promos? What happened to just buying computer without having to scour an entire site and half the web for a ****ing coupon?
     
mduell
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May 17, 2007, 06:05 PM
 
Originally Posted by analogika View Post
Plus a half-inch in width and a half-inch in depth.

What is it with all these Dell promos? What happened to just buying computer without having to scour an entire site and half the web for a ****ing coupon?
Due to the 1" increase in the screen size; it actually has a thinner bezel (you'd expect a three quarter inch gain in both depth and width).

Even without coupons their pricing is insanely random. Which way did you enter the site? Which configuration did you start at? What day of the week is it? All of those seem to change the price, which can cause real headaches when filling out purchase orders.
     
   
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