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ordered my new Audi! (Page 2)
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mduell
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Dec 5, 2009, 07:54 PM
 
Originally Posted by downinflames68 View Post
It's not the speed of the shifting that is the problem, it's the amount of control. As a self-proclaimed car enthusiast, I would have thought you'd know this. The problem with ANY automatic is that you are only able to control it through throttle input. With this, the TCU calculates what gear you want, and shifts to or from it.

But it is, and always will be, a lesser driving experience. With a true transmission I can control the throttle, the gear, the RATE/harshness/smoothness a gear change happens, and I can do things while braking you cannot do with an automatic.
S-tronic (as well as SMG, PDK, etc) offer instant manual gear selection override using a lever or paddles, not throttle. They're friction clutched, like your manual, not torque converted slushboxes; don't confuse them with slushboxes that allow the driver to make gear suggestions. They also often offer some sort of index to control the rate/harshness/smoothness of shifts. I've noticed on the track with comparable drivers that my braking distance in an SMG is shorter and more consistent since I'm not screwing around with the clutch pedal.
     
Laminar
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Dec 5, 2009, 09:13 PM
 
Originally Posted by mduell View Post
S-tronic (as well as SMG, PDK, etc) offer instant manual gear selection override using a lever or paddles, not throttle. They're friction clutched, like your manual, not torque converted slushboxes; don't confuse them with slushboxes that allow the driver to make gear suggestions. They also often offer some sort of index to control the rate/harshness/smoothness of shifts. I've noticed on the track with comparable drivers that my braking distance in an SMG is shorter and more consistent since I'm not screwing around with the clutch pedal.
Nonsense. Rob's experience with a 15-year-old car trumps your experience with something relevant.
     
angelmb
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Dec 6, 2009, 04:15 AM
 
Originally Posted by downinflames68 View Post
The result is an engine which is so refined in comparison to older passenger car diesel engines, that there really is no comparison.
Has nothing to do with a modern petrol engine. And… TDI Club?, the brain might be the most wonderful organ in the human body. Now think about who was telling you that.

As for the Turbo lag, what I should have said is the engine is dead below 1800rpm and there is no push whatsoever until the engine revs over 2500rpm, and once you have reached 3700rpm you can say Tschüß! to the engine push, so you have to play with the gearbox a lot, but that is cool enough for the Diesel gang which Oath is 'no smoke no fun', they buy a TDI and think they got a race car, dumb.

Not saying that is Andreas purpose, God forbid!, but I still don't get why he would choose a Diesel over a Petrol when he has to spend no money on gas.
     
angelmb
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Dec 6, 2009, 05:33 AM
 
Originally Posted by Buffy Summers View Post
congrats but my Bimmer 135i is way cooler

Missed that one…

I am not saying that everybody needs such an engine, most will do fine with half of it LOL, but all that power has to seriously kick ass. Is it the coupe?.
     
is not
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Dec 6, 2009, 06:04 AM
 
certainly the 2.0 tfsi would give you more than average diesel speed
     
andreas_g4  (op)
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Dec 6, 2009, 06:28 AM
 
For one or two of you it seems I have to stress that I'm not paying a cent for this car, and that that comes with certain guidelines which I was only too happy to follow:

get a diesel √
stay below 160 g/km CO2 emissions √
get a 4-door variant √

And that's about it. I get a car that looks nice, has almost every extra on the inside you can get in that class, and is fun and safe do drive – for free.

Anything else?
     
andreas_g4  (op)
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Dec 6, 2009, 06:30 AM
 
Originally Posted by angelmb View Post
The middle letter.

Andreas, did the company prevent you from getting a petrol engine car?.
You say it! Otherwise I would have gotten the 2.0 TFSI with 200 HP…
     
OreoCookie
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Dec 6, 2009, 07:28 AM
 
Originally Posted by downinflames68 View Post
All these paddle/tronic/gadgets that are supposed to be better are PURELY, PURELY marketing gimmicks. Yes, in the 1/4 mile, the automatic may be slightly faster. But it is, and always will be, a lesser driving experience. With a true transmission I can control the throttle, the gear, the RATE/harshness/smoothness a gear change happens, and I can do things while braking you cannot do with an automatic.
The new Porsche turbo and Ferrari 458 feature double clutch gearboxes as well. And most race cars have sequential gear boxes that also use pedals to shift gears. While personally, I prefer manual as well, I don't think you can claim that a double clutch gear is the same as an automatic transmission or that the pedals are just gimmicks.
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
     
andreas_g4  (op)
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Dec 6, 2009, 07:35 AM
 
I learn a lot here…

Personally, I don't really care which kind of transmission is faster. I am usually driving several thousand kilometers per month, and being stuck in congestion on the autobahn is no fun, and much less of that with manual transmission.

Also, I rented several cars before making my decision, and found the Audi automatic transmission worked more than fine for me.

Manual is more fun, automatic is more comfortable.
     
Phileas
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Dec 6, 2009, 09:34 AM
 
Originally Posted by andreas_g4 View Post
get a diesel √
stay below 160 g/km CO2 emissions √
get a 4-door variant √

Anything else?
Dude, you need to have a word with whoever it is makes these guidelines for you. They've forgotten to make sure to add the most important point:

Approved by Rob, the leading automotive authority - in the world √

Having said that, if you're driving that much I would seriously rethink the sports suspension. Your back will thank you.
     
moep
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Dec 6, 2009, 10:01 AM
 
Originally Posted by Phileas View Post
Having said that, if you're driving that much I would seriously rethink the sports suspension. Your back will thank you.
I think the suspension is fine as long as he isn’t planning on driving with ****** run-flat tires.
A hard suspension and the reinforced sidewalls of run-flats are a recipe for disaster for the back in my experience, not to mention the difference in handling going into the twisties.
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is not
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Dec 6, 2009, 01:23 PM
 
"Approved by Rob, the leading automotive authority - in the world √ "
Who is Rob?
     
mduell
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Dec 6, 2009, 02:08 PM
 
Originally Posted by OreoCookie View Post
The new Porsche turbo and Ferrari 458 feature double clutch gearboxes as well. And most race cars have sequential gear boxes that also use pedals to shift gears. While personally, I prefer manual as well, I don't think you can claim that a double clutch gear is the same as an automatic transmission or that the pedals are just gimmicks.
ITYM paddles not pedals.
     
imitchellg5
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Dec 6, 2009, 02:13 PM
 
Originally Posted by is not View Post
Who is Rob?
Really?
     
Goldfinger
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Dec 6, 2009, 02:25 PM
 
Originally Posted by Phileas View Post
Dude, you need to have a word with whoever it is makes these guidelines for you. They've forgotten to make sure to add the most important point:

Approved by Rob, the leading automotive authority - in the world √

Having said that, if you're driving that much I would seriously rethink the sports suspension. Your back will thank you.
I agree, adding a sports suspension on top of Audi's known-to-be rock hard base suspension is a bad idea.

As for all the people bashing diesels: you really have no clue about modern diesels. As a car enthousiast it pains me to say that a diesel is the only sensible choice for daily driving in Europe these days. Petrol engines cost you your first born in taxes and fuel (especially where I live, now wonder 80% of the population drives a diesel).

I'm not an Audi-fan* but it'll probably be a good car. Enjoy it, Andreas!

*And even less so after the introduction of the new A8 this week. My god, it's a LWB A4. They have NO imagination in Ingolstadt.

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imitchellg5
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Dec 6, 2009, 02:30 PM
 
Originally Posted by Goldfinger View Post
*And even less so after the introduction of the new A8 this week. My god, it's a LWB A4. They have NO imagination in Ingolstadt.
I would like to expand on this and add that they have no humor. I work at Audi, and even the sexiest or fastest car that I drive fails to put a smile on my face. Except the A3, but that's because it's a GTI, and VW know how to smile occasionally.
     
is not
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Dec 6, 2009, 02:30 PM
 
Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot View Post
What's wrong with a 170hp TDi?
That competition has moved up, this :


and the BMW 123d, both on 204hp, 2.1 and 2.0l diesel engines
     
Doofy
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Dec 6, 2009, 02:34 PM
 
Originally Posted by is not View Post
Where's the other half of the engine?
Been inclined to wander... off the beaten track.
That's where there's thunder... and the wind shouts back.
     
is not
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Dec 6, 2009, 02:41 PM
 
[QUOTE=Goldfinger;3912936]
As for all the people bashing diesels: you really have no clue about modern diesels. /QUOTE]

We Europeans know about diesels
     
is not
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Dec 6, 2009, 02:41 PM
 
Lol doofy
     
downinflames68
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Dec 6, 2009, 02:45 PM
 
Originally Posted by OreoCookie View Post
The new Porsche turbo and Ferrari 458 feature double clutch gearboxes as well.
I believe the word you were looking for was dual clutch. Double clutch= driving a vehicle, usually a big truck, without synchros in the transmission.

And most race cars have sequential gear boxes that also use pedals to shift gears.
Never seen a pedal operated transmission. Pix?

While personally, I prefer manual as well, I don't think you can claim that a double clutch gear is the same as an automatic transmission or that the pedals are just gimmicks.
Again, dual clutch. The reason I will claim it is a gimmick is that it STILL does not offer the control of a regular manual transmission. Yes, you can shift the gears yourself in a DCT, but it does not offer the rate at which things change. It is not as engaging of an experience. Is it better than a regular automatic? Sure, probably, but I don't really care.
     
downinflames68
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Dec 6, 2009, 02:47 PM
 
Originally Posted by Goldfinger View Post
As for all the people bashing diesels: you really have no clue about modern diesels. As a car enthousiast it pains me to say that a diesel is the only sensible choice for daily driving in Europe these days. Petrol engines cost you your first born in taxes and fuel (especially where I live, now wonder 80% of the population drives a diesel).
I'm not bashing diesels, I'm bashing a wimpy little 170hp engine in a car with an automatic transmission, sport suspension purely because it "looks cooler", and an appearance package to make it look aggressive and fast. With a WORSE power to weight ratio than a base model plymouth neon.
     
imitchellg5
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Dec 6, 2009, 02:53 PM
 
170hp isn't wimpy, especially in Europe.
     
downinflames68
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Dec 6, 2009, 02:58 PM
 
Originally Posted by Laminar View Post
Yeah, the stuff that made in the mid-90s was pure garbage.
Originally Posted by Laminar View Post
Nonsense. Rob's experience with a 15-year-old car trumps your experience with something relevant.
Dude. Stop. I know you are trying really hard to be a troll, but ... here's the thing. I don't care. Your trolling is so obvious it doesn't even piss me off, plus you generally don't know what you are talking about when it comes to anything automotive.
     
Goldfinger
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Dec 6, 2009, 03:00 PM
 
Originally Posted by downinflames68 View Post
I'm not bashing diesels, I'm bashing a wimpy little 170hp engine in a car with an automatic transmission, sport suspension purely because it "looks cooler", and an appearance package to make it look aggressive and fast. With a WORSE power to weight ratio than a base model plymouth neon.
I wouldn't call 170hp* wimpy... especially combined with all the torque you get in a turbo diesel but hey (350nm at 1750rpm in that particular engine). And sure a manual offers more control but the DSG box really IS great. You can't compare it to a normal automatic.

As for the S-line, M-packages etc. I partly agree but it's just boils down to personal taste and preference. Les goûts et les couleurs ne se discutent pas.

*realise that having lots of HP is VERY expensive in Europe. You guys are lucky, your cars are incredibly cheap, you get reaallly cheap gas and low taxes.

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downinflames68
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Dec 6, 2009, 03:02 PM
 
Originally Posted by imitchellg5 View Post
170hp isn't wimpy, especially in Europe.
Seems pretty wimpy when the curb weight is 3300+lbs.
     
downinflames68
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Dec 6, 2009, 03:03 PM
 
Originally Posted by Goldfinger View Post
I wouldn't call 170hp* wimpy... especially combined with all the torque you get in a turbo diesel but hey (350nm at 1750rpm in that particular engine). And sure a manual offers more control but the DSG box really IS great. You can't compare it to a normal automatic.

As for the S-line, M-packages etc. I partly agree but it's just boils down to personal taste and preference. Les goûts et les couleurs ne se discutent pas.

*realise that having lots of HP is VERY expensive in Europe. You guys are lucky, your cars are incredibly cheap, you get reaallly cheap gas and low taxes.
In a light car, I would agree, 170hp is not wimpy. But when the car weighs as much as a WRX, that kind of blows.
     
sek929
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Dec 6, 2009, 03:06 PM
 
He's commuting to work, not racing the Indy-500 for f**ks sake.

It's a nice car, andreas_g4, don't let our resident know-it-all get to you.
     
is not
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Dec 6, 2009, 03:09 PM
 
Originally Posted by Goldfinger View Post
*And even less so after the introduction of the new A8 this week. My god, it's a LWB A4. They have NO imagination in Ingolstadt.
So right!




Enjoy the car Andreas, is a good car for your commute
     
downinflames68
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Dec 6, 2009, 03:16 PM
 
Originally Posted by sek929 View Post
He's commuting to work, not racing the Indy-500 for f**ks sake.

It's a nice car, andreas_g4, don't let our resident know-it-all get to you.
EXACTLY. EXACTLY sek, which is why this S-Line appearance package and sport suspension is annoying. It's tarting up a slow commuter car as fast performance version. Lame. Imagine if someone started putting XRP Lithium Ion on all the batteries at your job sites, even though they were crappy old 18v's. My problem isn't that the car is slow, it's that the owner is trying to make it look fast and aggressive, when it ISN'T. That is exactly the same as a honda owner putting on a spoiler and a body kit.
     
moep
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Dec 6, 2009, 03:49 PM
 
Originally Posted by downinflames68 View Post
My problem isn't that the car is slow, it's that the owner is trying to make it look fast and aggressive, when it ISN'T.
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andreas_g4  (op)
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Dec 6, 2009, 04:40 PM
 
Originally Posted by sek929 View Post
It's a nice car, andreas_g4, don't let our resident know-it-all get to you.
Thanks, but I actually just enjoy the show. I know that it is a wonderful car!
     
downinflames68
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Dec 6, 2009, 04:56 PM
 
Originally Posted by andreas_g4 View Post
Thanks, but I actually just enjoy the show. I know that it is a wonderful LOOKING car!
Fixed.
     
Spheric Harlot
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Dec 6, 2009, 05:00 PM
 
Originally Posted by downinflames68 View Post
Fixed.
Down in flames, indeed.
     
angelmb
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Dec 6, 2009, 05:31 PM
 
Originally Posted by Goldfinger View Post
As for all the people bashing diesels: you really have no clue about modern diesels.
I would really appreciate if you could point out which part of the text I wrote about VAG's best selling TDI engine is wrong.
     
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Dec 6, 2009, 05:46 PM
 
Originally Posted by angelmb View Post
VAG
Why do I never, ever think about cars and always think about something else when someone says that?
Been inclined to wander... off the beaten track.
That's where there's thunder... and the wind shouts back.
     
Laminar
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Dec 6, 2009, 05:51 PM
 
Originally Posted by downinflames68 View Post
Dude. Stop. I know you are trying really hard to be a troll, but ... here's the thing. I don't care. Your trolling is so obvious it doesn't even piss me off,
Hence, the joke.

plus you generally don't know what you are talking about when it comes to anything automotive.
You have a good point. Like the time you were talking about how the SVT Contour has 220 horsepower stock, and I said that it had 200 horsepower stock. You were totally right and I looked like a total idiot. Seriously...show me the last time I posted something automotive-related that lends credence to the idea that I don't know what I'm talking about. I'd love to see what you can come up with.
     
imitchellg5
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Dec 6, 2009, 05:57 PM
 
Originally Posted by downinflames68 View Post
Dude. Stop. I know you are trying really hard to be a troll, but ... here's the thing. I don't care. Your trolling is so obvious it doesn't even piss me off, plus you generally don't know what you are talking about when it comes to anything automotive.
What has it been with you lately and saying that nobody besides yourself knows anything about cars? Get off of your throne, please. If people enjoy something, it's not in your place to ruin it for them. Why don't you go find some elitist Audi owner's forum to go bitch on?
     
angelmb
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Dec 6, 2009, 05:58 PM
 
Haughty eyes. Meh.
     
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Dec 6, 2009, 06:53 PM
 
Originally Posted by downinflames68 View Post
I believe the word you were looking for was dual clutch. Double clutch= driving a vehicle, usually a big truck, without synchros in the transmission.
Well, I was thinking of the German word, Doppelkupplungsgetriebe. If that's called dual clutch in English, this is what I mean.
Originally Posted by downinflames68 View Post
Never seen a pedal operated transmission. Pix?
Oh, it's a typo: I don't mean pedal as in foot pedal, but flappy paddle gearbox.
A video can be found here for Formula 1 cars. Or here if you are interested in rally cars.
Originally Posted by downinflames68 View Post
Again, dual clutch. The reason I will claim it is a gimmick is that it STILL does not offer the control of a regular manual transmission. Yes, you can shift the gears yourself in a DCT, but it does not offer the rate at which things change. It is not as engaging of an experience. Is it better than a regular automatic? Sure, probably, but I don't really care.
Yes, perhaps for an aficionado, it doesn't offer the same experience as a manual gearbox. (Again, I prefer manual gearboxes.) But you cannot claim it's a gimmick, it's standard on basically all race cars these days (whether it's dual clutch, sequential or whatever doesn't really matter at this point). A gimmick is something that doesn't really have an effect. However, on my current ride, I like my 24-speed flappy paddle gearbox.
( Last edited by OreoCookie; Dec 6, 2009 at 07:04 PM. )
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Laminar
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Dec 6, 2009, 07:06 PM
 
Originally Posted by OreoCookie View Post
However, on my current ride, I like my 24-speed flappy paddle gearbox.
I only have ten.
     
Laminar
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Dec 6, 2009, 07:07 PM
 
Originally Posted by imitchellg5 View Post
What has it been with you lately and saying that nobody besides yourself knows anything about cars? Get off of your throne, please. If people enjoy something, it's not in your place to ruin it for them. Why don't you go find some elitist Audi owner's forum to go bitch on?
It's really fun watching his coping methods progress.
     
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Dec 6, 2009, 07:36 PM
 
Originally Posted by Laminar View Post
I only have ten.
On the other hand, I only have two wheels
I really wish I could afford Andreas' car … 
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mduell
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Dec 6, 2009, 07:59 PM
 
Originally Posted by downinflames68 View Post
Again, dual clutch. The reason I will claim it is a gimmick is that it STILL does not offer the control of a regular manual transmission. Yes, you can shift the gears yourself in a DCT, but it does not offer the rate at which things change. It is not as engaging of an experience.
Why is shift time terribly relevant for commuting?
     
imitchellg5
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Dec 6, 2009, 08:58 PM
 
Originally Posted by Laminar View Post
It's really fun watching his coping methods progress.
There is SO much that I wanted to add, but I resisted. Somehow.
     
nonhuman
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Dec 6, 2009, 09:23 PM
 
Originally Posted by mduell View Post
Why is shift time terribly relevant for commuting?
The more time one spends driving, the more important it is that their car be enjoyable to drive.
     
downinflames68
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Dec 6, 2009, 11:45 PM
 
Originally Posted by Laminar View Post
Hence, the joke.
It's hilarious. I'll report you from now on, when you do it. I don't know what I did to piss you off, but you've made it abundantly clear that you're hell bent on f*cking with me. Keep it up.

You have a good point. Like the time you were talking about how the SVT Contour has 220 horsepower stock, and I said that it had 200 horsepower stock. You were totally right and I looked like a total idiot. Seriously...show me the last time I posted something automotive-related that lends credence to the idea that I don't know what I'm talking about. I'd love to see what you can come up with.
Oh gee I was wrong about your precious SVT, once. I think you'll find I posted about that car on these forums many many times before you even owned one, kiddo.
     
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Dec 6, 2009, 11:47 PM
 
Originally Posted by imitchellg5 View Post
What has it been with you lately and saying that nobody besides yourself knows anything about cars? Get off of your throne, please. If people enjoy something, it's not in your place to ruin it for them. Why don't you go find some elitist Audi owner's forum to go bitch on?
Oh some people do around here, just not him. Certainly not anybody who defends tarting a car up to look fast, but then shoving the weakest engine and automatic transmission into it. You seemed like you know a bit, but then again, you drive an accord, so it's not like you really need to understand anything about vehicles. But hey you have a stig sticker, so props on that.

As for the audi forums... yeah, I would, but all of them would agree with me. I'm trying to educate the masses here.
( Last edited by downinflames68; Dec 6, 2009 at 11:54 PM. )
     
downinflames68
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Dec 6, 2009, 11:50 PM
 
Originally Posted by mduell View Post
Why is shift time terribly relevant for commuting?
It isn't. Which is what I am talking about. These fancy new automatic gearboxes might have the edge in shift times, but that is IT. They do not have the control of a normal, manual gearbox. The rate at which the gears change, or how hard you snap inbetween them, or softly change in them, can only be matched by a manual and someone who knows how to actually drive.
     
imitchellg5
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Washington + Colorado
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Dec 7, 2009, 01:03 AM
 
Originally Posted by downinflames68 View Post
You seemed like you know a bit, but then again, you drive an accord, so it's not like you really need to understand anything about vehicles.
What do you mean? I LIKE knowing how things work, but I don't know things with terribly technical detail... I know how things work, but not really why things work.
     
 
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