[Jean-Loup]

The batery life on the MacBook is stated to be the same as with the PowerBook according to the people I have spoken to at Apple and my university Coop in Montreal. I can see why they aren't bosting about the battery time: ''if it's the same, where's the performance per watt improvement'' could be a question sked all too often. Thing is, people would forget that the screen is brighter, and that there are effectively to processors. This will of course take up more juice than a run of the mill G4...but it also makes for a much MUCH faster machine.

I for one have ordered one of these MacBooks (1.83GHz) for my sound engeneering classes. From what I have been told by Apple, Digidesign is comming out with a universal binary version of PT at the end of march. This is not confirmed on digi's site but it does state that they ar working on one. I'll be calling my studio supplier tomorrow to see if he's heard anything.

As for FW800 it will probably be back in future revs oof the book. It seems that Apple stated to journalists that the reason it wasn't on this one is that it would have needed a redesigned board in order to fir the FW800. Apple said this wasn't in their plan...I'm assuming that it was even less in their time frame...c'mon They got these things out in record speed!!! Would I rather have a rev B or rev C Macbook pro?? Of course!!! Pfffft! But some of us need our computers for work and so we don't have the luxury of waiting another 3, 4, 5, 6 months for the announcement of a new model and perhaps even then we'd have to wait longer to get it in our hands. Of course the next model will be better, and so will the one after that...lol As far as I'm concerned, my MacBook will leave a G4 in it's dust..and that's all that counts for me.

[jamil5454]

Originally Posted by shabbasuraj

I want more ports.

Hopefully the next one will have more.

Probably not.

Want your pacifier? Geez...

Buy a PC notebook. Either elegant and thin, or feature-stuffed and bulky.

You can't have the best of both worlds.

[Nate LFE]

Well the difference between the $1999 vs $2499 MBPs seems to break down, dollar for dollar, like this: (based on Apple's upgrade prices, not on market values)

1GB Memory: $180 (retail $120 minus 512MB DIMM cost)
256MB VRAM: $68 (from iMac upgrade pricing)
100GB HD: $90 ($20 retail difference)
Plugging it all in yields a $162 premium for the 1.83GHz processor, which is 10% faster per core (which would equal 20% theoretical increase, correct?)

Any thoughts? I'm trying to decide which version to buy. The HD and the memory are irrelevant to me, as I can more cheaply upgrade both down the road. Do you think it's worth the premium for the VRAM and CPU upgrades, which obviously can't be done later? Is it worth it to upgrade to the 7200RPM drive?

My predominant usage will be for Photoshop and web design with some FCP work thrown in there as well (obviously after March).

(edit for grammar & clarity)

[Jean-Loup]

Originally Posted by Nate LFE

Well the breakdown for the $1999 vs $2499 MBPs seems to break down, dollar for dollar, like this: (based on Apple's upgrade prices, not on market values)

1GB Memory: $180 (retail $120 minus 512MB DIMM cost)
256MB VRAM: $68 (from iMac upgrade pricing)
100GB HD: $90 ($20 retail difference)
Plugging it all in yields a $162 premium for the 1.83GHz processor, which is 10% faster per core (which would equal 20% theoretical increase, correct?)

Any thoughts? I'm trying to decide which version to buy. The HD and the memory are irrelevant to me, as I can more cheaply upgrade both down the road. Do you think it's worth the premium for the VRAM and CPU upgrades, which obviously can't be done later? Is it worth it to upgrade to the 7200RPM drive?

My predominant usage will be for Photoshop and web design with some FCP work thrown in there as well (obviously after March).

Well, IMO the 1.83 is a better value. Factor in the added features (spec wise) and there really isn't much of a difference in price. I went with the 1.83 standard config.

[mduell]

Originally Posted by CaliforniaMac

The big question about going with GbE though is whether or not the mobo chip that implements it on the MacBookPro can handle Jumbo frames (frames larger than 1500 bytes) so as to be able to be more efficient when transfering multi-GB files. (The old PowerBooks do GbE but are limited to 1500 byte frames, so you won't get close to GbE throughput, but Apple's desktop PowerMacs don't have such an issue.)

The LAN controller supports the reception of long frames, specifically frames longer than 1518 bytes, including the CRC, if software sets the Long Receive OK bit in the Configuration command. (page 110)

Originally Posted by Jean-Loup

The batery life on the MacBook is stated to be the same as with the PowerBook according to the people I have spoken to at Apple and my university Coop in Montreal. I can see why they aren't bosting about the battery time: ''if it's the same, where's the performance per watt improvement''

Four times the performance, same power consumption; that's the performance per watt improvement.

Originally Posted by Nate LFE

Plugging it all in yields a $162 premium for the 1.83GHz processor, which is 10% faster per core (which would equal 20% theoretical increase, correct?)

No, it's a 10% increase since both have two cores
The wholesale price difference between the 1.66 dual and 1.83 dual is $53

[icruise]

Originally Posted by Nate LFE

Well the difference between the $1999 vs $2499 MBPs seems to break down, dollar for dollar, like this: (based on Apple's upgrade prices, not on market values)

If you configure the low-end model to have the same memory and hard disk as the high-end model, it comes to $2299. So (assuming you're going by Apple's pricing) that means you're getting the faster processor and extra video RAM for $200. That seems reasonable to me.

And when you consider that you can't upgrade video RAM ever, that upgrading the hard disk is fairly difficult (and of course necessitates getting rid of the previous disk), and that having a 512MB chip installed from the beginning will make it necessary to throw out 512MB to get to 2GB of RAM, I think the higher-end model makes more sense.

[uicandrew]

i am getting the higher end model because upgrading the hard drive might void my warranty. (i'm basing this off of the fact that hard drive is not listed as a "do it yourself" upgrade/repair on Apple's support site)

i already know i'm getting applecare since it is a Rev A machine. i don't want to void $250+ worth of warranty because of hard drive.

i would also get the 7200rpm. if you're working with big files, it will make it worth it when copying files from one place to another (ie - from hard drive to flash drive, or from one partition to another). I plan on having 2 partitions eventually. One for Windows, one for Mac OS.

also, in terms of resale value, by the time it is time to sell, 256mb vram is going to be standard and it'll increase the resale value. Also, someone else mentioned that Aero will look better in windows.

at Crucial's website, 1gb costs $130, so i'm sure if you saved $90 for two 512 sticks, that someone on this board would want to buy a cheap upgrade so you can get yours to 1.5gb.

also, applecare will repair/replace parts regardless if you got a 12" $1500 base powerbook or a $5500 17" maxed out with 30" monitor. might as well get the most for your applecare.

[Leia's Left Bun]

If anyone hasn't mentioned it already the reason it is a slower drive is because Apple had to use a slimmer drive to fit the new form factor. The 4x burner is the fastest slim one available.

Doesn't make me feel much better knowing that though but there you have it.

[inkhead]

S-VIDEO is DEAD. PERIOD. S-VIDEO is absolutely stupid to include on a computer. seriously, besides the video cable that COMES WITH THE mac book pro has an adapter.

Stop using S-VIDEO it's so old it's not funny.

Originally Posted by RogerR

One of the rumours floating around in the last few months was that Apple was working on an updated Airport Express that would provide wireless video transfer similar to it's current Airtunes feature. (Again, this was only a rumour I read.)
If this were true, it might explain the lack of an S-Video out port. It could be that the MacBook Pro/ProBook/Mac ProBook/PowerBook Duo has the capability of transmitting video wirelessly, but this ability was not announced because the AirPort Express with Video is not yet ready.
I'm only thinking out loud here.

[uicandrew]

Originally Posted by Leia's Left Bun

If anyone hasn't mentioned it already the reason it is a slower drive is because Apple had to use a slimmer drive to fit the new form factor. The 4x burner is the fastest slim one available.

Doesn't make me feel much better knowing that though but there you have it.

yes, it was mentioned around page 3 or 4. (i'm not trying to be mean about it, i just want to make a point that having one "official" thread about the macbook pro can be cumbersome)

perhaps a FAQ would be more useful.

(at least this "official" thread is started by moderators. I've seen different (non-mods) people make the same "official" thread on the same topic. then people start getting huffy saying stuff like "who are YOU to say that your thread is official?"

my fav was when some guy at ilounge (ipods) tried to get people to list every accessory for the ipod. he would bump his thread trying to get people to do his bidding. (he was not successful at all)
-------
anyways, but the person who first posted the info about the dvd drive asked an apple rep at the mac expo.

as for S-video, it is only as dead as everyone makes it to be. Not everyone has a flat panel tv with DVI or VGA inputs.

besides, look at the floppy drive, now THAT is old, and died only when usb flash drives became really cheap. Think about the "successors' that were supposed to replace it. the 100mb zip disk, the 250 zip disk, the 650mb cd, etc.

I'd say the most universal is just a composite/RCA jack. They are used for dvd players, video game systems, camcorders. It is old, but it is still everywhere. I actually have to use a S-video to composite adapter to get my Shuttle PC to connect to my TV

[uicandrew]

whoa. i just realized something. On apple's homepage, under the macbook picture is a picture of the built-in iSight and a caption that reads "First iSight built into a notebook (and twice the resolution)"

does this mean that the iSight on the Macbook is better than the previous iSights? i don't think they would be comparing the iSight to other notebooks (pc) because there are some with 1.3 megapixels (not 640x480 like the iSight)

do any of you guys see what i'm talking about (no pun intended)

[MORT A POTTY]

I see it, and heard Jobs say something about it during the stevenote wherein he didn't elaborate. Furthermore I cannot find any other mention of it anywhere such as specs.

[icruise]

I just watched the part of the keynote where he introduced the MacBook and he didn't mention anything about the resolution.

Is it double the resolution of the previous iSights? Would a 1.3 megapixel camera be double the resolution of a VGA camera (which is what the previous iSights are)? Maybe that's what it means.

[timmerk]

GOOD NEWS TO ALL: the macbook pro comes with a DVI to S-video adapter, confirmed by an apple rep.

[removed completely irrelevant, off-topic, and forbidden link to referral site. --tooki]

btw, my source is here: http://theory.isthereason.com/?p=650

[icruise]

Interesting. The Apple guy in that video didn't exactly seem to know what he was talking about though.

[timmerk]

True, but he was the one that brought up there was no s-video port and that it came with an adapter, which lead me to think that he was right about at least that.

[timmerk]

Also, I believe it because Apple sells this for the iMac Intel Duo:

http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPL...plm=M9319G%2FA

[threestain]

Originally Posted by Icruise

I just watched the part of the keynote where he introduced the MacBook and he didn't mention anything about the resolution.

Is it double the resolution of the previous iSights? Would a 1.3 megapixel camera be double the resolution of a VGA camera (which is what the previous iSights are)? Maybe that's what it means.

yes it is double the res - 1280x960 = 1.3 megapixels (rounded up of course)

[icruise]

Originally Posted by timmerk

Also, I believe it because Apple sells this for the iMac Intel Duo:

http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPL...plm=M9319G%2FA

I'm not saying that he was wrong, but the existence of that adapter doesn't really prove anything either, since the iMac uses a Mini-DVI interface like the 12" powerbook. The MacBook would require a full-sized DVI-to-S-video adapter.

[schalliol]

Re: The Comment About No eSATA and desire for it:
Just buy a SIIG eSATA II ExpressCard or eSATA II ExpressCard RAID when they release them. EDIT: I'm not sure if this is a /34 card or 54.

Re: S-Video Being Dead:
It totally isn't. Even at home it's nice to have if I want to connect to my AV system, and with Front Row and the remote, a fair number of folks might do it. For projectors, nearly all do VGA or DVI.

[Rumpole]

Being an Apple user for a number of years now, I am of the view that Apple rarely under-delivers. I have watched these pages expand over the past couple of days with increasing incredulity as to the negative comments posted about what the MacBook Pro is lacking, rather than what it actually has. Take the 5th Gen ipod for example, countless negative posts about the lack of the old remote port, only to be followed by the Radio Remote raising the bar. Further back on the board there was a dismissive comment about the nameless source saying that Steve wanted to announce more but couldn't due to chip supply problems. Probably right. Had there been a lineup starting with a consumer MacBook, the MacBook Pro would have fitted into the lineup name-wise. 120Gb drive and a 7200rpm 100Gb drive are BTO options, surely a 17" model is only a few months away, given the vast numbers of 17" units that Apple have sold. When I think about how much people craved a more powerful Powerbook I am amazed at the instant sniping. This is written on a 4 year old 667 TiBook. Still going strong and still meeting my needs. In that time my room-mate has changed his PC laptop twice!

[JKT]

Look, the speed boost is nice, but only because PBs have been in CPU limbo for so damn long. The way I am looking at it is that the speed boost was a given - something that should have been there months to a year ago - not a bonus. It is the other things that would have been the bonus, but they have been stripped out. The effect is the equivalent of being given less for more. Speed boost - wahey, at last! Features - wtf? Where'd they all go? Its a case of two steps forward, one step back. Do you honestly think anyone would be upset if we had been given the last G4's features, but with the Intel CPU?

[uicandrew]

Originally Posted by JKT

Features - wtf? Where'd they all go?

1. Front Row with remote
2. MagSafe connector (think about all the future mishaps that have been avoided!)
3. brighter screen
4. 256 video card
5. iSight (now with TWICE the resolution, or at least the still camera part)
6. thinner

(but i am also aware they took out a lot, i just don't like "blanket" statements where someone only focuses on the facts that support their point of view and ignore the stuff that doesn't fit their viewpoint. it's almost like flame bait to me.)

[chabig]

Originally Posted by JKT

Do you honestly think anyone would be upset if we had been given the last G4's features, but with the Intel CPU?

Yes I do. Some Mac people are just bunch of whiners. They would have said--"it's too expensive", or "it's too heavy/bulky/big", or "I want a built-in iSight like the iMac has", or some such statement.

Chris

[crouchingtiger]

Originally Posted by JKT

Look, the speed boost is nice, but only because PBs have been in CPU limbo for so damn long. The way I am looking at it is that the speed boost was a given - something that should have been there months to a year ago - not a bonus. It is the other things that would have been the bonus, but they have been stripped out. The effect is the equivalent of being given less for more. Speed boost - wahey, at last! Features - wtf? Where'd they all go? Its a case of two steps forward, one step back. Do you honestly think anyone would be upset if we had been given the last G4's features, but with the Intel CPU?

Let's keep everything in perspective here. I think everyone understands exactly the point you're making, but what most people are trying to point out is that "two steps forward and one step back" is still one (HUGE) step forward. Too bad the new MacBook won't work out for you specifically (apparently), but is it so hard to accept that the majority of users don't use FW800, the modem, the S-video, nor dual-layer burning? I certainly do not. Now, would I like to see all those features and do I think some will make it into a new Macbook at some point down the line? Of course, why not? On the other hand, the huge speed increase (both CPU and bus speed), the bright screen, the faster memory, the awesome increase in graphics speed -- those are all things that EVERYONE that uses a laptop would notice.

[ccwillows]

I've been following this thread for a few days, now and others for...years? Yet, I've never posted. This post is about my new expedition into the Macbook. It is intended for anyone who is weighing the current mac choices. Forgive the long post (I'm pretty excited.)

I have been a Mac user since the birth of macs. My main uses have been audio (Logic Pro, currently), internet, word, photos, and some basic movie/dvd production. For the last four years, I have been on a 500mhz TiBook, purchased used on eBay. All of my macs have either been used or refurbished, until now...

Over the last year, I have pondered powermacs, imacs, powerbooks, going back and forth over the pros and cons. As much as I was tempted by the "power" of the powermac, I knew I would need a portable to go along with it, for the sheer coolness of being able to surf around the house, and more importantly, I travel a lot. But, I couldn't justify 2 really expensive computers for my use.

I was leaning to the iMac lately. I enjoy all the consumer level aps...iLife, Frontrow...the hip little remote. But my decision kept reverting back to mobility.

This brought me to the powerbooks, which had not seen a major upgrade for so long that I just wasn't interested...until now, until core duo. But what about the horror of being a first rev. guinea pig?

Well, buying used and refurbished has inherant risks, too, so the risk factor does scare me. Also, my hope is that Apple has so much resting on this new release that they have put it through some rigorous rounds of testing. If this isn't the case, then I suppose I'll fall back on Applecare if necessary.

So, last night, after a year of waiting for the right computer to replace my aging (but faithful) TiBook, after convincing my dad, my wife, and my sister-in-law to switch to mac (and subsequently seeing them with their new shiny imacs, mac minis, and ibooks) I waltzed into the Apple Store Biltmore (where I used to work) and made an online order:

1 MacBook Pro - 1.83GHz Intel Core Duo
1GB 667 DDR2 - 1 SO-DIMM
100GB Serial ATA drive @ 7200 rpm
ATI Mobility Radeon X1600 - 256MB GDDR3
1 AppleCare Protection Plan for MacBook Pro/PowerBook (w/or w/o Display)
1 Apple Cinema HD Display (23" flat panel)
1 Apple Wireless Keyboard M9270LL/A

I threw in the 23" Cinema Display and the bluetooth keyboard to really sweeten up the system because I do miss the desktop experience. When I'm in hardcore audio/movie mode, I can dock in my studio and pretend like I'm using a powermac with extended desktop (maybe figure out a way to hook up the playstation 3 in there somewhere ;-)

Anyhow, I hope this helps some would be intel jumpers. I don't mind not having FW800 or dual layer burners or modems, etc. I don't mind being a guinea pig...in fact, I'm looking forward to it. Are you kidding me...dual core powerbook (oops, MacBook Pro,) front row w/ remote, new iLife, great video card, served on a 23" cinema??? I'll take it.

[Rumpole]

I agree, the underlying point of my earlier post was that Apple may well have all of the "shortcomings" already addressed in a 17" model, that they wanted to announce, but couldn't due to a limited supply of chips. Some of the posters on this board seem to think that Apple deliberately sets out to upset people. Wider experience shows that to be unfair. After all they want to maximise their revenue, and have consistently produced products that other manufacturers only dream about.

[Nate LFE]

Does the MBP have a dual channel memory controller? Evidently the iMac does, as Apple recommends that memory be installed in pairs on that configuration page, but they make no mention of it on the MacBook configuration page.

Since they apparently have the same 945M chipset, wouldn't it stand to reason that we'll be doubling our memory bandwidth (5.3 -> 10.7GBps) if we install our memory in pairs?

[icruise]

Originally Posted by Rumpole

Take the 5th Gen ipod for example, countless negative posts about the lack of the old remote port, only to be followed by the Radio Remote raising the bar.

I think most people were upset because the lack of a remote control port meant that a lot of accessories are now obsolete, not because they were upset about the loss of the remote per se. But you do have a point -- it originally appeared that we had lost the remote control feature, when in fact Apple must have had the radio remote in mind all along. With the MacBook as well, many people are getting upset about the loss of S-video, a modem, or FW800, but in reality these things are probably going to be available, just in another form. We already know that the modem is available as an external device, which frankly isn't as big a deal as many are making it out to be. I also would be surprised if there won't be a DVI-to-S-video convertor available (or even included). And FW-800 cards will probably be among the first ExpressCard/34 peripherals available. So like the iPod's remote, we are not losing features so much as getting them in a different form. Unfortunately that means paying extra for features that were once included, and for some (those people who used all of these things) it will mean that the PowerBook -- er, MacBook -- is not as convenient as it used to be.

We also don't know what Apple has in mind for other portables. They might be planning to make the 17" version the one with all the bells and whistles. We just don't have enough information right now.

[SEkker]

The new MacBook Pro is a decent machine, and the compromises made (no DL DVD, loss of FW800, etc) were acceptable to me -- and I ordered one.

I believe this is going to be a great machine for my use, and I look forward to getting most of these questions answered from my personal use.

I think the real reason for people whining is the 'Ives' factor -- every new BIG release from Apple has had his stamp all over it. The iMacs (G3, G4, G5 models), the PB17 (and its Al siblings, the PB12 and the slower to market PB15), the iPods. Where is the visible 'wow'? 'It's (only) faster?' Is what I seem to see on these boards.

I, for one, think the decision to be conservative in these transition machines is absolutely the right decision for Apple.

At the same time, I think we CAN expect some fun new machines down the road, when Ives has had his hands untied and after he has had some time to learn all about the new toys Intel is making in ITS house. A MacTablet is something I'd pay a lot for -- IF it was made by Apple and Ives (because that would mean it would work).

[Leia's Left Bun]

I think S-Video is really pathetic also. It belongs in the grave with the Floppy drive.

[MORT A POTTY]

yeah, I personally don't use FW800, modem, or S-video out so I really don't care. and quite frankly I'm glad they took out the modem because it took up extra space and is simply another place to get gunked up. why the hell should Apple support the modem? I don't feel sorry for those of you who only have 56K. You must be masochistic. I also don't mind the loss of a PCMCIA type I and II slot in favor of the much newer ExpressCard 34. much better in terms of future proofing the machine. Kinda like on the Pismo where no serial port is, but two firewire ports are (Pismo also being what I'm typing on) and I can tell you this, I don't care about those of you who wanted it to have a serial port instead of dual firewire, Firewire is still quite useful today whereas I have absolutely no reason, much less desire, to ever use serial ever again. ever.

so yeah, you may scoff at the eliminating of older ports (PCMCIA, S-Video, modem) in favor of newer ports only (expresscard, DVI) but you know what? It's all about future proofing the machine and getting read of obsolete technologies. Sure it sucks to lose FW800, but quite frankly it was poorly adopted in the first place so I knew better than to jump on it. from the very beginning Apple announced it and then didn't even make anything that used it, ever, it seemed to me they didn't care about it. then they never put it on the consumer Macs (iBooks, iMacs, etc.) so really, what was the point? for pros? fine, pros won't be buying the Intel PowerBooks yet anyway because guess what, their software wont run natively on it till march at least, and by that time, who knows what Apple will have out.

and DL was left out because they used a thinner optical drive in which no DL drive is available.

[mduell]

Originally Posted by Rumpole

Further back on the board there was a dismissive comment about the nameless source saying that Steve wanted to announce more but couldn't due to chip supply problems. Probably right.
<snip>
surely a 17" model is only a few months away, given the vast numbers of 17" units that Apple have sold.

With so many other OEMs offering Core Duo (and at higher clock rates), I doubt chip supply is holding back any Apple products.

How many 17" PowerBooks has Apple sold? With the average Apple laptop price at just $1300, I don't think the 17" (or PowerBooks in general) is selling that well. Apple stopped reporting the iBook/PowerBook breakdown a few quarters ago, but at the time the iBooks were outselling the PowerBooks by about 2:1.

Originally Posted by Nate LFE

Does the MBP have a dual channel memory controller? Evidently the iMac does, as Apple recommends that memory be installed in pairs on that configuration page, but they make no mention of it on the MacBook configuration page.

Since they apparently have the same 945M chipset, wouldn't it stand to reason that we'll be doubling our memory bandwidth (5.3 -> 10.7GBps) if we install our memory in pairs?

I can't confirm that MacBook Pro does support dual channel, but the chipset supports dual channel, the older Centrino platform supports dual channel, and I can't see a reason for Apple to go out of their way to lower performance.

[Simon]

So if it indeed uses dual channel memory, performance-wise it would be better to have 2x512MB instead of a single gig stick in the Mac Book Pro.

[schalliol]

Maybe, but then you can't expand. The solution for many would be to 2GB, as over the life it of the unit, it makes sense.

[icruise]

Originally Posted by mduell

How many 17" PowerBooks has Apple sold? With the average Apple laptop price at just $1300, I don't think the 17" (or PowerBooks in general) is selling that well. Apple stopped reporting the iBook/PowerBook breakdown a few quarters ago, but at the time the iBooks were outselling the PowerBooks by about 2:1.

If Apple sells twice as many iBooks as PowerBooks, they're still making more money overall on the PowerBooks, since they are a lot higher margin machines than iBooks with their razor-slim margins. (Plus, I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of the iBook purchases were to education, so they would be even lower margin, and always the bottom-of-the-line model as well). Make no mistake about it. PowerBooks are where the money is at for Apple. As for how the 17" model does in comparison to the other PowerBooks, I have no way of knowing, but I never got the impression that it was selling particularly poorly.

Of course, it is true that PowerBook sales haven't been as good as they once were, since there have only been minor increases in speed in the last couple of years, and after the Intel announcement a lot of people were waiting until the new machines were released to buy.

[Peabo]

I made this animated gif to show how the form factor has been altered. As you can see, the trackpad is bigger, there are now 2 latches and the footprint is larger due to the 15.4" screen vs the old 15.2"

[analogika]

Originally Posted by Rumpole

Some of the posters on this board seem to think that Apple deliberately sets out to upset people.

Some of the posters on this board just have Core Envy.

[yticolev]

Here's an issue no one has raised. I was at MacWorld yesterday and played with a couple Macbooks. Man, are they hot. Sizzling on the bottom. Sure they are "prototypes" and sure they were running a lot of CPU intensive stuff. My rev A 15" 1.25 has never come close to being that hot. So there is a good reason they did not name it "MacLapTop". I don't think anyone could tolerate it on their lap.

Besides the ergonomics of it (maybe some never use their laps), heat equals power. Battery size is about the same, heat produced is much higher, I have to believe that battery life will be lower. And think about it, even at lower power per cycle, this book has twice the effective CPU cycles as the G4 books.

And for what it is worth, I've had my current laptop for a bit over two years now and have never used the modem. Of course, I always bail out by tethering my cell phone. Faster than dialup anyway.

[JKT]

I hadn't noticed this earlier, but is there less third party software bundled on these MacBooks?

Have the OmniGraffle and GraphicConverter deals ended? Art Director's Toolkit is missing as well... that adds up to a $140 loss in software licences if they really aren't bundled anymore.

http://www.apple.com/macbookpro/whatsinside.html

[schalliol]

I sure hope my 1.83 isn't so hot! I'm glad I at least picked the 120GB 5400 since I thought bigger would be more important than faster when we're talking this sizing.

[uicandrew]

here's a link to a 15minute video of the macbook in action. in the last 2 or 3 minutes, the person feels the bottom of the notebook and remarks that it is as hot as the 12" powerbook. The apple rep started getting defensive about the temperature, citing that it had been running for 3 days, and that it was a preproduction model.

maybe the heat issue is why steve jobs didn't show it onstage himself. maybe he couldn't take the heat (pun INTENDED) hahahaha. but seriously, if he left it running the entire time during the keynote in a hidden area, maybe it would've gotten to hot to hold. I mean, the mac mini was hidden behind everything else in a previous keynote, and i think the imac came up thru a trap door in the stage.

can someone post a link to a thread about the heat issue of the powerbook? i searched for "hot powerbook" and nothing turned up.

http://tuaw.com/2006/01/13/video-of-...pro-in-action/

[mduell]

The temperature of the case is one of the downsides of using a metal case. With the lower head conductivity of a plastic case more of the heat can go out the fans/vents in the back, instead of being radiated by the case.

[fisherKing]

hmmm...as long as it doesn't get HOTTER than my 12" powerbook...
(which makes me wonder...how hot would a 12" version of the macbook pro get??)

when i' working on a lot (audio, rewired, etc) i can fry an egg on my alubook (altho i choose not to).

[MORT A POTTY]

Originally Posted by mduell

The temperature of the case is one of the downsides of using a metal case. With the lower head conductivity of a plastic case more of the heat can go out the fans/vents in the back, instead of being radiated by the case.

actually a metal case would keep the innards cooler better than a plastic case for precisely the reason people hate it. because in adition to the exhaust system and all the internal cooling that would be there in either "case" (har har) but w/ metal you get the added "benefit" of the case being a big-ol-heatsink as well.

[uicandrew]

hmmm, so that's why cooling pads for laptops are made.....

[analogika]

Originally Posted by fisherKing

hmmm...as long as it doesn't get HOTTER than my 12" powerbook...
(which makes me wonder...how hot would a 12" version of the macbook pro get??)

when i' working on a lot (audio, rewired, etc) i can fry an egg on my alubook (altho i choose not to).

same here.

[fisherKing]

i've been following this thread, reading others.
visiting the apple site and drooling over specs and features.

all i know is, by summer, there will (hopefully) be a 12" (or equivalent) version.
that's what i'll wait for.

will watch this forum, mid-late february, when we start to get real-world reports.

but, really, a 12" that got hotter than my alubook would be unusable (or the world's most expensive hotplate).

[analogika]

iWant 13.3" with ProBook 15"'s features and the 1280 resolution of the older 15" Powerbooks.

Will buy the second they're announced, provided Logic and MIO drivers are native.

[inkhead]

[FONT="Arial Black"]Why do you and everyone else INSIST ON SPREADING LIES? INTEL MOTHERBOARDS HAVE HAD FIREWIRE ON THEIR MOTHERBOARDS FOR YEARS. Not only that Intel makes their very own firewire chipset that is Damn Good, IF NOT A BETTER VERSION than the one Apple includes (yes it's true)[/FONT]

I swear i want to scream, everybody here is so stupid. "Does it boot firewire??>?~?!~" "Target Disk mode?!!"


YES IT'S A MAC DAMNIT. IT DOES.

Originally Posted by mduell

I'm surprised to see a single FW400 port instead of a single FW800 port. The Intel chipsets don't support any FW port, so they have to include another chip anyway.

I'm disappointed not to see e.SATA or 4 USB ports.

I'm happy about the graphics card, but it's too bad they're still using the same low res screens (give me HD, everyone else has it!).

Integrated iSight is going to hurt business sales.

Why on earth is the Apple Remote IR? It shoudl be BT so it doesn't rely on LoS.

ExpressCard is going to be painful for some people, but ultimately the way to go. The choice of /34 instead of /54 on a larger laptop is lame.