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starman · Jul 16, 2004, 09:50 AM

Eek!

http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/asiapc...pan/index.html

phoenixboy70 · Jul 16, 2004, 09:53 AM

damn' shame too. first i've heard of this.

i hope they have the decency to acquit the guy.

Oisín · Jul 16, 2004, 09:58 AM

He was stopped at Tokyo's Narita International Airport on Tuesday in connection with Japanese immigration officials told CNN.

Err... in connection with what??? Why are they detaining him and preparing to deport him to the US in the first place?

Edit: Oops, misread the article... I thought it said he was unwanted in the US because he attended that game in '92...

Must learn to read better...

voyageur · Jul 16, 2004, 11:26 AM

He's such a sad and mysterious character. So brilliant, yet no social life. You have to wonder what he does all the time by himself. Watch TV? Play chess with the computer? I lived in Pasadena for a couple of years while he was there, and never met anyone who saw him even once.

hyperb0le · Jul 16, 2004, 01:03 PM

He certainly is brilliant, although I guess not brilliant enough to get past Japanese immigration

PacHead · Jul 16, 2004, 01:07 PM

Originally posted by phoenixboy70:
damn' shame too. first i've heard of this.

i hope they have the decency to acquit the guy.

Why ? You like anti-semites or something ?

tavilach · Jul 16, 2004, 01:11 PM

Originally posted by PacHead:
Why ? You like anti-semites or something ?

He's an anti-semite?

Bastard!

I hate anti-semites. Maybe it's because I'm Jewish...but...well...I hate them.

PacHead · Jul 16, 2004, 01:17 PM

Originally posted by tavilach:
He's an anti-semite?

Bastard!

I hate anti-semites. Maybe it's because I'm Jewish...but...well...I hate them.

I didn't know he was, but that's what it says in the article. He may be a brilliant chess player, but he's still a piece of garbage.

He has become known for expressing extremist political viewpoints and anti-Semitic sentiments.

This is from a quick google:

He has been seen in Japan, Hungary and the Philippines. In a Philippine radio interview on Sept. 11, 2001, he applauded the terrorists' attacks and said America should be "wiped out."

He described Jews as "thieving, lying bastards. They made up the Holocaust."
The irony is clear: His mother was Jewish and so was Nemenyi, the man described by some as his father.

Sounds like a nice guy.

Logic · Jul 16, 2004, 01:18 PM

Originally posted by PacHead:
Why ? You like anti-semites or something ?

Should he be arrested for it?

tavilach · Jul 16, 2004, 01:19 PM

Originally posted by Logic:
Should he be arrested for it?

Yes! By all means!

PacHead · Jul 16, 2004, 01:20 PM

Originally posted by Logic:
Should he be arrested for it?

Where did I say he should be arrested for it ? His arrest was for a totally different reason.

I'm all for free speech, even for Nazis and other vile people.

tavilach · Jul 16, 2004, 01:24 PM

Originally posted by PacHead:
Where did I say he should be arrested for it ? His arrest was for a totally different reason.

I'm all for free speech, even for Nazis and other vile people.

Okay, I was joking when I said that he should indeed be arrested. As an incoming Berkeley student, I'm definitely for free speech...

...unless the person is a Nazi. Those bastards killed my grandpa's parents and his seven sisters. If I ever meet a neo-Nazi...and he's using a laptop...I'll definitely sneak over and run ipconfig, and then mark his IP for attack, you know what I'm saying?

Seriously, Nazi's don't count as people. Crazy f*cks...

phoenixboy70 · Jul 16, 2004, 01:31 PM

Originally posted by PacHead:
Why ? You like anti-semites or something ?

no. just chess players.

i don't agree with a lot he says. but the guy's wanted for playin' a f'in chess game. wtf.

maybe they should strip him of his citizenship. but jail? pluheeeez!

PacHead · Jul 16, 2004, 01:32 PM

Originally posted by tavilach:
Okay, I was joking when I said that he should indeed be arrested. As an incoming Berkeley student, I'm definitely for free speech...

...unless the person is a Nazi. Those bastards killed my grandpa's parents and his seven sisters. If I ever meet a neo-Nazi...and he's using a laptop...I'll definitely sneak over and run ipconfig, and then mark his IP for attack, you know what I'm saying?

Seriously, Nazi's don't count as people. Crazy f*cks...

I agree with you that Nazis are subhumans, but just look at Europe where they have many censorship laws against Nazis. In the US we don't have any of those laws, and I've seen many more Nazis and skinheads in Europe than I've ever seen it in the US. In France, one cannot even sell German WW2 memorabilia on the net. I saw more skinheads in Sweden in one week, than I saw in my entire life in the USA.

tavilach · Jul 16, 2004, 01:34 PM

Originally posted by PacHead:
I agree with you that Nazis are subhumans, but just look at Europe where they have many censorship laws against Nazis. In the US we don't have any of those laws, and I've seen many more Nazis and skinheads in Europe than I've ever seen it in the US. In France, one cannot even sell German WW2 memorabilia on the net. I saw more skinheads in Sweden in one week, than I saw in my entire life in the USA.

Perhaps you have a point. Still, this may not be a cause-effect scenario...

phoenixboy70 · Jul 16, 2004, 01:41 PM

Originally posted by PacHead:
I saw more skinheads in Sweden in one week, than I saw in my entire life in the USA...

that's because it's one of the main "outlets" for identification of the european right (youths). i have met quite a few american "rednecks", thugs and right wingers in the us that were further RIGHT than most german skinheads i had the displeasure of dealing with.

anyway, nazis are whack. i agree. not that neocons are a lot better though...

/sorry for the derail. i'll stop here.

phoenixboy70 · Jul 16, 2004, 01:44 PM

Originally posted by tavilach:
As an incoming Berkeley student...

if you mention this one more time, i'm going to have to fly over there and steal your dreidl.

Logic · Jul 16, 2004, 02:27 PM

Originally posted by PacHead:
Where did I say he should be arrested for it ? His arrest was for a totally different reason.

I'm all for free speech, even for Nazis and other vile people.

Fair enough.

OH-N'omac · Jul 16, 2004, 02:40 PM

...will be interesting to see what the US does with him once he's back in custody. Brilliant player, too bad the rest of his head seems wrapped around nonsense.

wataru · Jul 16, 2004, 03:18 PM

Originally posted by PacHead:
I agree with you that Nazis are subhumans

That's what they thought about Jews, gays, blacks... the list goes on. Sounds like you're trying to have two wrongs make a right.

Randman · Jul 16, 2004, 03:24 PM

Never to defend the Nazi and the atrocities committed in that party's name, but I would like to point out that saying people hate them and they're

and they're not human, is basically doing exactly what the Nazis are doing to others.

Kinda hard to call them stupid when someone engages (mr incoming Berkeley

) in the same kind of response, hating someone because they're not like you and have differing opinions/values.

Back to the thread, didn't Fischer have some young chippie, a Czech girl, as a girlfriend around the time he played that controversial match in Yugoslavia?

PacHead · Jul 16, 2004, 03:25 PM

Originally posted by wataru:
That's what they thought about Jews, gays, blacks... the list goes on. Sounds like you're trying to have two wrongs make a right.

Yes, I see your point, however one difference is that I don't believe that Nazis should be rounded up and gassed. Just ridiculed and occasionally beaten up.

KrazyEvilGoat · Jul 16, 2004, 03:41 PM

Originally posted by PacHead:
Yes, I see your point, however one difference is that I don't believe that Nazis should be rounded up and gassed. Just ridiculed and occasionally beaten up.

It all starts that way.

wataru · Jul 16, 2004, 03:47 PM

Originally posted by PacHead:
Yes, I see your point, however one difference is that I don't believe that Nazis should be rounded up and gassed. Just ridiculed and occasionally beaten up.

But it's a slippery slope. Thinking of people as "less than human" is the classic mindset used to justify much worse treatment than ridicule and beatings. It's important to recognize the Nazis' humanity. Yes, they did bad things, but they were (are?) still humans with the same inalienable rights as the rest of us. You don't have the right to take their punishment into your own hands; that's the judicial system's job.

PacHead · Jul 16, 2004, 03:50 PM

Originally posted by wataru:
But it's a slippery slope. Thinking of people as "less than human" is the classic mindset used to justify much worse treatment than ridicule and beatings. It's important to recognize the Nazis' humanity. Yes, they did bad things, but they were (are?) still humans with the same inalienable rights as the rest of us.

Ok, fine, I'll retract my "subhuman" comments. I still think that they are scum however, and they deserve to be ridiculed and beaten up.

tavilach · Jul 16, 2004, 04:01 PM

Originally posted by phoenixboy70:
if you mention this one more time, i'm going to have to fly over there and steal your dreidl.

The Free Speech Movement

When something relates, I mention it...

Originally posted by wataru:
That's what they thought about Jews, gays, blacks... the list goes on. Sounds like you're trying to have two wrongs make a right.

Ah, but you see, their views were groundless, and they murdered 11,000,000 innocent people. That is a big difference. The Nazis are not innocent. It's wrong to say that Nazis are subhumans, but I say it anyway. Still, there are different levels of "wrong." The Nazis viewing 11,000,000 people as subhuman, and then murdering them, raping them, burning them, etc. is a bit more wrong than viewing the murderers of 11,000,000 innocent people as subhuman, and of course, not harming them. I think that they should all rot in hell, but I'm not going to kill them, and I would not want some sort of vengeful Nazi genocide. After all, as much as I say that they're subhuman, I do understand that they are indeed people, but were/are manipulated by insane leaders.

Originally posted by Randman:
Never to defend the Nazi and the atrocities committed in that party's name, but I would like to point out that saying people hate them and they're and they're not human, is basically doing exactly what the Nazis are doing to others.

Kinda hard to call them stupid when someone engages (mr incoming Berkeley ) in the same kind of response, hating someone because they're not like you and have differing opinions/values.

Back to the thread, didn't Fischer have some young chippie, a Czech girl, as a girlfriend around the time he played that controversial match in Yugoslavia?

How on earth can you compare the two? It's not the same thing...not nearly the same thing. Please see what I said above.

Hating people because they "have differing opinions/values" is very different from hating people because they murdered 11,000,000 innocent people, with no regrets.

As for your Berkeley comment...you're not too bright. I mentioned Berkeley when asking about colleges, I mentioned Berkeley when asking about bringing a PowerBook to college, and I am mentioning Berkeley when we are talking about free speech...

"The Free Speech Movement (FSM) Digital Archives document the role of Mario Savio and other participants in the Free Speech Movement (University of California, Berkeley, September-December 1964), as well as its origins in political protest and civil rights movements and its legacy of political activism and educational reform that can be traced throughout the country and the world down to the present."

...condescending prick.

Hmm, the stick is hard to resist...

Edit:

Originally posted by wataru:
But it's a slippery slope. Thinking of people as "less than human" is the classic mindset used to justify much worse treatment than ridicule and beatings. It's important to recognize the Nazis' humanity. Yes, they did bad things, but they were (are?) still humans with the same inalienable rights as the rest of us. You don't have the right to take their punishment into your own hands; that's the judicial system's job.

When you're right, you're right. They are humans...many of them were simply brainwashed as children. Still, nothing justifies their actions, and I hope to G-d that they rot in hell for all eternity (whether or not I actually believe in hell...well, that's another story).

CharlesS · Jul 16, 2004, 05:10 PM

Originally posted by tavilach:
...unless the person is a Nazi. Those bastards killed my grandpa's parents and his seven sisters. If I ever meet a neo-Nazi...and he's using a laptop...I'll definitely sneak over and run ipconfig, and then mark his IP for attack, you know what I'm saying?

Not evil enough. Grab his e-mail address, then set up a Hotmail account and wait until you get a lot of spam on it. Then, send e-mail to the "remove" addresses of all the spam messages with his e-mail address in the "From" field. Mwa ha ha ha ha...

(disclaimer: this is in jest, I do not recommend actually doing this

)

mydog8mymac · Jul 16, 2004, 06:50 PM

It's hard to believe that anybody is surprised that this the way Fischer turned out. After the morally corrupt and lavish lifestyles that professional chess players live, can he really be blamed for thinking he's above the law? It's clear the vast number of chess fans that support the free agency and TV contracts are at fault.

voyageur · Jul 16, 2004, 07:27 PM

It's more than a lavish lifestyle issue. Fischer has always been on the fringe. He spent years in some kind of cult (which I believe took all his money, necessitating his reentry into the championship ring in Yugoslavia).

Invictus · Jul 16, 2004, 08:04 PM

Originally posted by PacHead:
Ok, fine, I'll retract my "subhuman" comments. I still think that they are scum however, and they deserve to be ridiculed and beaten up.

PACHEAD stay in the miserable war lounge where your crap belongs and leave us alone.

You hate too much. Please, PLEASE stay away from here with your HATE.

sideus · Jul 16, 2004, 08:06 PM

Originally posted by Invictus:
PACHEAD stay in the miserable war lounge where your crap belongs and leave us alone.

You hate too much. Please, PLEASE stay away from here with your HATE.

Why? I hate Nazis too.

OH-N'omac · 09:54 PM

Originally posted by sideus:
Why? I hate Nazis too.

You live in a culture where it's acceptable to hate nazis.

The nazis lived in one where it was acceptable to hate jews.

You would not have posted "Why? I hate jews too", but hating jews and hating nazis are, in essence, the same thing. Edit: I'm just trying to say that it's bad to hate groups of people for any reason

Gene Jockey · Jul 16, 2004, 09:37 PM

Originally posted by OH-N'omac:
You live in a culture where it's acceptable to hate nazis.

The nazis lived in one where it was acceptable to hate jews.

You would not have posted "Why? I hate jews too", but hating jews and hating nazis are, in essence, the same thing. <snip>

Wow, GG moral equivalence. People who discuss opinions as if they exist in a total vacuum, and don't understand the difference between belonging to a political party and belonging to an ethnic minority, truly rule.

It's called context. Look into it.

scottiB · Jul 16, 2004, 09:46 PM

[indiana jones]

Nazis. I hate these guys.

[/indiana jones]

PacHead · Jul 16, 2004, 10:03 PM

Originally posted by Invictus:
PACHEAD stay in the miserable war lounge where your crap belongs and leave us alone.

You hate too much. Please, PLEASE stay away from here with your HATE.

Yeah, I am a bad and terrible human being for hating Nazis, well excuse me. Meanwhile you would prefer that I don't post here.

You have a right to your opinion, and I certainly have a right to mine. I'm getting tired of people trying to censor others.

And no, I won't stay away from here. I'll post wherever I please, unless some mod wants to ban me for discrimination against Nazis, then I'll gladly leave.

Otherwise, stop trying to be a fascist and dictate who people can dislike or not.

This has to be a joke, I'm getting flamed for hating Nazis, LOL.

Am I in the twilight zone or something ?

PacHead · Jul 16, 2004, 10:07 PM

Originally posted by OH-N'omac:
You live in a culture where it's acceptable to hate nazis.

Of course it's acceptable to hate nazis. Where do you live ? 1942 Berlin ?

CharlesS · Jul 16, 2004, 10:16 PM

Hmm, does this fall under Godwin's law?

BasketofPuppies · Jul 16, 2004, 10:24 PM

Originally posted by PacHead:
Yeah, I am a bad and terrible human being for hating Nazis, well excuse me. Meanwhile you would prefer that I don't post here.

You have a right to your opinion, and I certainly have a right to mine. I'm getting tired of people trying to censor others.

Hey, I already posted a thread mocking so-called open minded people who attack others who have differing opinions.

Seriously, while I do try to respect the opinions of others, I draw the line at extremists. There's a reason why the German government and military had to be completely rebuilt after World War II, and it wasn't just because they lost. (If that were the case, there wouldn't be members of Saddam Hussein's Iraqi military in the current Iraqi military.)

sideus · Jul 16, 2004, 10:47 PM

OMG! I'm being attacked for hating a group of people that destoryed another group of people and that it is wrong to hate so called people that killed other people OMGWTFBBQ!

sideus · Jul 16, 2004, 10:49 PM

Someone photoshop an Apple logo and Think Different on here.

PacHead · Jul 16, 2004, 10:51 PM

Originally posted by sideus:
OMG! I'm being attacked for hating a group of people that destoryed another group of people and that it is wrong to hate so called people that killed other people OMGWTFBBQ!

I'll be sure to be careful the next time I ever decide to type any negative words about the KKK or Al-Qaeda terrorists or Jeffrey Dahmers of the world. You never know which Mac users are going to jump to their defense.

sideus · Jul 16, 2004, 11:23 PM

TOKYO, Japan (CNN) -- Former world chess champion Bobby Fischer has been detained by immigration authorities in Japan.

Checkmate.

spacefreak · Jul 16, 2004, 11:45 PM

Was Laurence Fishburn traveling with him at the time? Did he get arrested as well?

I know FIshburn was a major influence on Fischer's early chess playing.

yukon · Jul 16, 2004, 11:46 PM

CNN news used the word "checkmate" every 10 seconds when mentioning the story, it was horrible.

Anyway, the guy grew up having to play against the Russians, the entire country looked up to him for beating them. He was to defend his title against the world, especially Eastern Europe. Then, the UN says he can't defend what he spent his life on, the US being very involved in that it seems. He defends, and wins (ISTR), and suddenly he's a wanted man. I'm not sure if that's how it all went, but it seems plausable to me....Israel is a close ally of the US, not quite carte blanche, but It seems something close to that at times....both (as rumsfield put it) "we're also making life difficult around the world in a number of other countries" (http://www.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0112/05/lkl.00.html), he's quite the international citizen it seems...so I can sorta see a possible train of thought.

Not saying it's great, just trying to see where he's coming from. And absolutly, strip his citizenship, he seems to want that anyway. Don't like what he does, don't let him represent you.

Invictus · Jul 16, 2004, 11:52 PM

Originally posted by PacHead:
Yeah, I am a bad and terrible human being for hating Nazis, well excuse me. Meanwhile you would prefer that I don't post here.

You have a right to your opinion, and I certainly have a right to mine. I'm getting tired of people trying to censor others.

And no, I won't stay away from here. I'll post wherever I please, unless some mod wants to ban me for discrimination against Nazis, then I'll gladly leave.

Otherwise, stop trying to be a fascist and dictate who people can dislike or not.

This has to be a joke, I'm getting flamed for hating Nazis, LOL.

Am I in the twilight zone or something ?

You hate everyone and everything. One only has to read your previous posts in other threads.

I should have made myself clear. I have to remember that some people have a problem with the language.

sideus · Jul 16, 2004, 11:54 PM

Originally posted by yukon:
The French CBC, driving antenna users mad since 1937.

Sorry for being OT, but I'm curious what that is about?

Invictus · Jul 17, 2004, 12:00 AM

Originally posted by sideus:
OMG! I'm being attacked for hating a group of people that destoryed another group of people and that it is wrong to hate so called people that killed other people OMGWTFBBQ!

Get a grip sonny. There is no culture on this planet that is innocent when it come to genocide, including Americans. So as the bible says, 'Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.'

sideus · Jul 17, 2004, 12:03 AM

Originally posted by Invictus:
Get a grip sonny. There is no culture on this planet that is innocent when it come to genocide, including Americans. So as the bible says, 'Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.'

Listen here BOY, I still hate them.

Invictus · Jul 17, 2004, 12:05 AM

Originally posted by sideus:
Listen here BOY, I still hate them.

Why do you hate Americans?

sideus · Jul 17, 2004, 12:09 AM

Originally posted by Invictus:
Why do you hate Americans?

Nice.