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f1000 · Feb 14, 2007, 01:26 PM

Originally Posted by ::maroma::

Why argue about who's smarter for waiting, or whether or not everyone else is wasting their money on something that isn't for you. Some people need a new phone, and will get it when its released. Others don't need a new phone so they won't get it. That's it. The end. .

Except that in this case failure of the iPhone could spell fiscal disaster for Apple, which in turn could mean bad things for the development of Macs and OS X. That's why we're armchair quarterbacking as to whether or not Apple has made a smart decision by taking a decided step backwards in using EDGE. Don't kid yourself that 3G+ isn't a must-have technology: DSL died on the vine because it couldn't be rolled out as quickly as cable modem.

Besides, I don't think anyone's arguing anymore that one shouldn't wait for the phone that one wants. Some of us happen to find the current iteration of the iPhone sufficient and will get it; however, you did ask what we'd be missing without HSDPA, and I'm saying, "a lot."

::maroma:: · Feb 14, 2007, 02:43 PM

Originally Posted by f1000

Except that in this case failure of the iPhone could spell fiscal disaster for Apple, which in turn could mean bad things for the development of Macs and OS X. That's why we're armchair quarterbacking as to whether or not Apple has made a smart decision by taking a decided step backwards in using EDGE. Don't kid yourself that 3G+ isn't a must-have technology: DSL died on the vine because it couldn't be rolled out as quickly as cable modem.

Besides, I don't think anyone's arguing anymore that one shouldn't wait for the phone that one wants. Some of us happen to find the current iteration of the iPhone sufficient and will get it; however, you did ask what we'd be missing without HSDPA, and I'm saying, "a lot."

Well first, I don't agree that the lack of 3G in the first round of the iPhone will at all spell disaster for Apple. Also, even if the iPhone fails, Apple will be fine. They've had plenty of things fail over the years, and they're stronger than ever.

Its fun to play armchair quarterback and all, but at some point it just goes in circles and people start arguing minutia that means nothing in the big scheme of things. Apple has decided on the technologies that will be in the first round of the iPhone. Like it or hate it, its done. There is no doubt in anyone's mind that future versions of the iPhone will have more advanced technologies in it, that's just plain common knowledge. So I'm just not seeing the point in getting into huge arguments over whether or not what Apple has decided on doing with the initial iPhone is right or wrong. Apple spent untold amounts of money researching and deciding on what to use in the iPhone. And I have enough confidence in Apple to make the decisions that are right for Apple, not what is right for every single person out there. If Apple set out to make every single person happy, they'd never make a dime and would never be able to develop the wonderful products they do. No matter what Apple does with the iPhone, there will be detractors and people saying they made a giant mistake and it will spell disaster for the company.

I've been around long enough to see this happen countless times with Apple products. I saw it with the Newton (a failure, but Apple is still here), I saw it with the Pippin (a failure, but Apple is still here), the Cube, the iPod, etc etc. And every time there were droves of people who argued over the every little thing, but in the end its Apple who makes the decisions. We have to live with them. And no one's forcing anyone to buy Apple products. If you don't want or need or agree with an Apple product, then you don't buy it and hope that others agree with you which will therefore force Apple to upgrade/improve it in the future.

And if the fear is that a complete failure of the iPhone will kill Apple (and I don't know if anyone feels that or not), thats just plain silly. Apple would never wage their entire company on one single product, especially something as risky as the iPhone. So I'm just saying relax, enjoy all these companies who are frantically trying to copy the iPhone, wait patiently for it to be released and see what happens. All of this bickering is fun to touch on, but after a month of it, it gets old and tired. Sure I can just ignore it all, but I'm just trying to make a point. And I've babbled on so much I think I've lost any point I had, so I think I'll just shut up now.

::maroma:: · Feb 16, 2007, 04:49 PM

This is fairly interesting. If it holds true, its great news:

Cingular iPhone Ad Leaked: Rate Plans Revealed | Apple iPhone Review » Your source for everything iPhone

icruise · Feb 16, 2007, 04:59 PM

The surprising thing here is that they are actually subsidizing the iPhone's price. This is VERY surprising, because I can't figure out why Apple wouldn't have used these prices as the iPhone's price, considering you can *only* get the iPhone with a contract through Cingular. It doesn't make sense, since the number one complaint I see is "$600 for a cell phone?!" So that's the main thing setting off warning bells for me. It's funny that we live in a world where people would take the time to fake a cell phone company's ad, but it's entirely possible.

I think calling/data plan prices are realistic. Even a tad disappointing, since we're still talking about $60+ a month with voice and data.

parsec_kadets · Feb 16, 2007, 05:13 PM

I call shenanigans on that add. It's been rumored in many different places that Apple won't allow Cingular to subsidize the phone. Also, considering Cingular has what seems to be a hundred different unlimited data plans, depending on what phone you have, I highly doubt this is the one you would get. All the other smart phone users seem to have to pay $40/month.

icruise · Feb 16, 2007, 05:19 PM

Originally Posted by parsec_kadets

All the other smart phone users seem to have to pay $40/month.

$40 a month for what? This plan has $40 for voice and $20 for data, for a total of $60 minimum.

::maroma:: · Feb 16, 2007, 07:54 PM

I notice the ad states "Choose from one of Cingular's existing rate plans such as $39.99 a month..."

Does this mean that there will be other voice plans, possibly less minutes for cheaper? Or do you think this is the lowest price available?

I don't know if this ad is credible or not, I too kind of doubt it. I would think that Apple and Cingular would've worked out the plans and prices well ahead of the announcement of the phone with the prices quoted by Steve himself.

But damn, I hate all these rumors! There is still a hell of a long time to go before this phone is available, and I'm already overwhelmed with rumors. Its making my brain all numb (well more numb than usual). I think I just have to start ignoring it all and wait until just before its released and catch up on all of it. This is all too much for me.

molarszbt18 · Feb 16, 2007, 08:23 PM

that add doesnt seem right. The black back ground with the apple stuff yet a white back ground with the cingular crap. Its fake no designer would do an add like that.

mduell · Feb 17, 2007, 02:05 PM

Originally Posted by ::maroma::

I notice the ad states "Choose from one of Cingular's existing rate plans such as $39.99 a month..."

Does this mean that there will be other voice plans, possibly less minutes for cheaper? Or do you think this is the lowest price available?

$30-40/mo is typically the lowest tier for postpaid cellular plans in the US; below that usage you're usually better off with prepaid anyway.

slugslugslug · 11:55 AM

The image that ::maroma:: posted is apparently from a marketing survey. Off the top of my head, I think the firm conducting it was Pinecone Research, and I don't think it's been confirmed one way or the other whether AT&T commissioned the survey.

So the meaning of the image is unclear, but it's neither an actual ad nor a Photoshop prank.

parsec_kadets · Feb 19, 2007, 09:27 PM

Originally Posted by icruise

$40 a month for what? This plan has $40 for voice and $20 for data, for a total of $60 minimum.

I mean that their data add ons go as high as $40/month for unlimited data. That's in addition to what you pay for a voice plan.

mduell · Feb 19, 2007, 11:23 PM

Originally Posted by parsec_kadets

I mean that their data add ons go as high as $40/month for unlimited data. That's in addition to what you pay for a voice plan.

$75/mo for a pda data access plan with the "right" to tether to a computer on Cingular.
Compare to T-mobile for the same thing at $20/mo.

xMetal · Feb 20, 2007, 05:27 PM

I can say is that $60/month total would be great, and I would not hesitate to jump on it for that price.

I can also say that it would take me all of 5 minutes to photoshop that ad together from scratch...

::maroma:: · Feb 20, 2007, 05:41 PM

Originally Posted by xMetal

I can also say that it would take me all of 5 minutes to photoshop that ad together from scratch...

I could say that about any print ad, real or not.

icruise · Feb 20, 2007, 08:13 PM

Originally Posted by mduell

$75/mo for a pda data access plan with the "right" to tether to a computer on Cingular.
Compare to T-mobile for the same thing at $20/mo.

When I had T-mobile, I tethered my PowerBook and PDA to the phone, but I got the impression when setting it up that it was taking advantage of a loophole of some sort in T-mobile's service and that they didn't actually intend people to be tethering devices for that monthly fee. Do you know if that's still the case?

And with Cingular I was also able to tether my computer and PDA using their $20 a month plan, so I'm not sure the distinction you're drawing is a valid one.

mduell · 09:17 PM

Originally Posted by icruise

When I had T-mobile, I tethered my PowerBook and PDA to the phone, but I got the impression when setting it up that it was taking advantage of a loophole of some sort in T-mobile's service and that they didn't actually intend people to be tethering devices for that monthly fee. Do you know if that's still the case?

And with Cingular I was also able to tether my computer and PDA using their $20 a month plan, so I'm not sure the distinction you're drawing is a valid one.

Yes, T-mobile allows tethering for internet access with the $20/mo BlackBerry (actually generic PDA) unlimited data plan. I called them when I first tried it because I was getting an error, and the customer service helped me make it work.

From Cingular's user agreement:
FURTHERMORE, UNLIMITED PLANS (EXCEPT FOR DATACONNECT AND BLACKBERRY TETHERED) CANNOT BE USED FOR ANY APPLICATIONS THAT TETHER THE DEVICE (THROUGH USE OF, INCLUDING WITHOUT LIMITATION, CONNECTION KITS, OTHER PHONE/PDA-TO-COMPUTER ACCESSORIES, BLUETOOTH® OR ANY OTHER WIRELESS TECHNOLOGY) TO LAPTOPS, PCS, OR OTHER EQUIPMENT FOR ANY PURPOSE. (emphasis mine)

Plans you can tether with: $20/mo DataConnect 5MB, $30/mo DataConnect 10MB, $40/mo DataConnect 20MB, $80/mo Blackberry Tethered Unlimited
Plans you can't tether with: $10/mo SmartPhone Connect 5MB, $20/mo SmartPhone Connect Unlimited, $45/mo PDA Connect Unlimited

tutelary · Mar 8, 2007, 03:45 AM

Originally Posted by f1000

DSL died on the vine because it couldn't be rolled out as quickly as cable modem.

...except DSL is still very lively. I've had dsl for a good many years now. My service is excellent and my provider is a major name (Bellsouth).

your comment makes no sense.

I've tried cable, and had nothing but inferior experiences.

brokenjago · Mar 8, 2007, 04:00 AM

Two new interesting bits about the iPhone:

Jobs Using iPhone Already? - The Unofficial Apple Weblog (TUAW)

Suggestion of iPhone savings - The Unofficial Apple Weblog (TUAW)

What do you think? I really don't see how Jobs could be using the iPhone yet, as it hasn't been approved for use by the FCC.

icruise · Mar 8, 2007, 07:16 AM

As I said before, you don't have to have FCC approval to use a device -- just to sell it to the general public. Obviously they have to be able to use the device when they are testing it. And Steve Jobs said to an interviewer that he was going to be using the iPhone as his personal phone after the launch.

f1000 · Mar 9, 2007, 01:38 AM

Originally Posted by tutelary

...except DSL is still very lively. I've had dsl for a good many years now. My service is excellent and my provider is a major name (Bellsouth).

OK, I was exaggerating for dramatic effect.

King Bob On The Cob · Mar 13, 2007, 12:03 AM

Well... that plan still sucks.

Sprint is giving me 500 minutes and
unlimited...
Data Access on my phone
Night and Weekend (starts at 7)
Mobile to Mobile

for $30... (if I wanted to push it, I could get another 15% off, but I'm lazy and they're already giving me a deal)

Something tells me Cingular won't match it

icruise · Mar 17, 2007, 12:03 PM

Originally Posted by ::maroma::

And the Chinese don't let us down:

VR-Zone : Technology Beats - China Made iPhone Look A-Like Surfaced

Took em long enough.

Remember this iPhone knockoff? Turns out it isn't even going to be a phone when (and if) it is released outside of China. Just a media player. I wonder if this is an attempt to avoid getting their pants sued off.