[lothar56]

I bought a B&W G3 and wanted to put more RAM in it, so I pulled 256 (out of a total of 512) from my Beige G3 MT/266 running 10.2.8. I had installed a 400MHz processor, overclocked it to 450MHz, and added a fan. I also have 6gb and 2gb hard drives in it. Ever since I pulled the RAM, the Beige G3 tends to lock up after a few minutes. It the spinning ball shows up and then nothing moves, the ball stops spinning, and the mouse won't work. I added a spare 64MB to bump it up to 320mb, un-overclocked it, and I guess it waits a bit longer before freezing, but it still locks up. I really really want this RAM for my B&W but I can't have the Beige G3 locking up. Is there something else that could help this? It never locked up before I upgraded the RAM last year. So it shouldn't lock up now that i put it back to where it used to be. Any help?

[OreoCookie]

Judging from the story, I suspect it might be bad RAM or a bad cpu. If you're lucky, the cpu cooler doesn't sit perfectly on top of the cpu, so the cpu shuts down after getting too hot (a tiny layer of air could cause this).

1. Undo all overclocking and put the old 266 MHz cpu back in.
2. Check the RAM (and the whole system) with Apple's Hardware Test. Get memtest for OS X and let it run a few times. Then swap the different 256 modules and repeat the procedure.
3. If the computer works fine till now, put the faster cpu back in and clock it at 400 MHz. Double-check the cooler. If it has been taken off, get some silver grease, e. g. by arctic cooling, put in a tiny, tiny amount (works well when you apply it with the head of a small screwdriver) and put the cooler back on. Having a fan does not help at all when the cooler does not sit perfectly on top of the cpu!

Try a load test, just launch one or two apps that will max out the cpu really fast (e. g. SETI or whatnot). Watch the cpu temperature with appropriate tools: does it rise beyond a critical temperature?

Well, this is all for now. Just get back here after you checked your system.

[lothar56]

Since I overclocked it, it hadn't overheated in my room, but I gave it to a friend to borrow whose room is significantly warmer and she set it next to a small fridge. So about once a week (it never gets shut off, it's my server) the screen would go gray and it would tell me i need to restart in all the different languages. I'll try the RAM thing and I do have some thermal paste somewhere, so I can try all of those. Thanks!

[OreoCookie]

I don't understand your first sentence.

Since I overclocked it, it hadn't overheated in my room.

Did you take off the aluminum cooler? Yes or no?

BTW, what OS are you running?

[lothar56]

10.2.8.

What i meant was that ever since I overclocked it, added thermal paste, and added the cpu fan last spring, it didn't overheat in my room. But when I moved it to a much warmer environment a month or so ago, it started overheating about once a week. I haven't done anything to it yet, the old processor and thermal paste are getting dropped off today (i'm at college now, and most of my old stuff is at home).

[lothar56]

Also when I bought it last spring, I had it overclocked from 266 to 333 with a cpu fan, no thermal paste, and 256 megs of RAM. It ran perfectly for several weeks before I added another 256 megs at the beginning of the summer when i installed the new processor. Now that I took the RAM out, it's suddenly freezing.

[OreoCookie]

First of all, many people put too much thermal paste on it. This paste is not a very good conductor of heat, but it is much better than air. What it is supposed to do is fill small gaps of air to ensure a better thermal connection. Too much of it can in fact be harmful.

Did you go through my list to diagnose the problem yet?

[lothar56]

Not yet. I had the processor and paste dropped off today and hopefully tomorrow afternoon I'll be able to get over to my friend's room and check it out. I just checked via VNC and it's been up for 21 hours so far. And now that i think about it, it's been about 21 hours since I un-overclocked it. I'll run the itunes visualizer for a while and see how it takes it. If it still has problems, I'll run through everything tomorrow. Thanks!

[lothar56]

Okay, I realize it's been a while, but I finally got a chance to play around with it. It turns out the computer would work fine until my friend would use Safari or NeoOffice. I put the original processor back in, but couldn't put it all the way down to 266MHz, as I am missing my other jumper block, so I'm short one jumper, so it's down to 300 now. I know it's not the RAM, as I swapped in 3 128 chips I knew were good and the same thing happened. At this point, it will turn off, i.e. the monitor acts as if there's no signal and I don't get any response from keys or mouse, but I can hear everything spinning and the light's still on. Ctl-Apl-Delete won't restart either, I have to use the button on the front. I'm trying to update to from 10.2 to 10.2.8 but every time it tells me that update wasn't installed correctly. I don't believe the G3's are capable of telling me the temperature. But it just froze again. The processor was maxed out downloading the update and surfing with IE at the same time, and it just locked up.

[lothar56]

Also, when I started up from the 10.2 CD and ran disk utility on the startup disk, under "checking multi-linked files" I had four errors: Orphaned indirect node temp196304, 321331, 321333, and 321341. The volume bit map needed a minor repair, and there was an invalid volume free block count. It says the repair was completed, so these problems should be fixed. I really don't know what else to do, as I did everything in your original list, minus hardware test, because I don't have the hardware test for the beige G3, any idea where I could get one?

edit: I tried installing 10.2.8 again. It picked up where it left on downloading after it froze the last couple times. When it finally got around to installing, it said this:
"The installation ahs encountered a problem. None of the checked updates were successfully installed. To try again..."
Is this because it stopped then picked back up a couple times or something else?

edit #2: after that installation failed, I restarted and re-downloaded the 100MB update. Once again, just like every time before, about halfway through the monitor just shut off and nothing would respond. I made sure every energy saving option is off and everything, I don't know what's causing this.

edit #3: i successfully ran everything on my nearly identical G3 desktop. I used the same RAM, same OS X cd's same internet connection, same hard drive brands...I suppose it comes down to the motherboard and processor differences. Next week, i'll pick up another beige G3 and see if I can combine the two. I don't want to jinx this working desktop by messing with the processor.

[lothar56]

I found something interesting. I put the 400 MHz processor back in but left it clocked at 300 MHz, so overheating shouldn't be a problem. I noticed that every single time I tried downloading the 100mb 10.2.8 combined update, it shut off at exactly the same points: just before half, and about 9/10 done. Every single time. So this isn't just a random overheating problem, but something else. Any ideas?

[jcadam]

Beige G3s are quirky as hell when running OS X.

[lothar56]

But it worked absolutely perfectly until I swapped out that RAM module, then everything went crazy. And my Beige Desktop runs perfectly too.

[reader50]

Try leaving 'top' running in a Terminal window while the download proceeds. Launch it with the command:
top -s 10

This causes top to update once every 10 seconds, otherwise it is something of a CPU hog. Watch the PhysMem line in the header area, the last entry is the amount of free RAM.

From your description, it may be locking up just as free RAM runs out. The system starts paging out when physical RAM runs out, which suggests a HD or VM-related problem.

I'd also suggest downloading the standalone 10.2.8 update on a stable system and transfer it across. Don't trust any download that was interrupted by a system crash.

[lothar56]

Originally Posted by reader50

Try leaving 'top' running in a Terminal window while the download proceeds. Launch it with the command:
top -s 10

This causes top to update once every 10 seconds, otherwise it is something of a CPU hog. Watch the PhysMem line in the header area, the last entry is the amount of free RAM.

From your description, it may be locking up just as free RAM runs out. The system starts paging out when physical RAM runs out, which suggests a HD or VM-related problem.

I'd also suggest downloading the standalone 10.2.8 update on a stable system and transfer it across. Don't trust any download that was interrupted by a system crash.

Thanks for the info. Once I get through these next three test (grr for college) I'll give this a shot, probably this weekend.

[lothar56]

Arg...double post. No more coffee for me, makes for a spastic trigger finger.

[JoshuaZ]

I had the exact same issue with a Beige G3 a couple of summers ago. No idea. I tried everything, and eventually trashed it as it was only like $5. Trying to run OS X on a Beige G3 is really tough. Some will work fine, some will just flake out on you.

[lothar56]

now whenever i run the installer it will tell me there were problems with the installation and to try again. This is on a fresh drive even. I'll pick up another beige g3 for $2 tomorrow and see if i can combine the two.

[lothar56]

I got three more G3 DT's for $5 total today, so come this weekend I'll have some fun!

[JoshuaZ]

Good luck. Beige G3s are just a lot of trouble these days.

[lgtmvt]

Are you installing onto a partitioned drive or a drive larger than 8GB. OSX on a beige needs to be on a 8GB or less drive or partition and that partition needs to be the first partition. I have had similar trouble and that solved it. Also I have had trouble with OSX and SCSI drives don't know why????

[lothar56]

It turns out the problem was a bad RAM chip. I tossed that one and all (four!) of my Beige G3's are running great. It's not that they're quirky, you just have to know the quirks and bypass them. I've got my tower running Tiger without too much trouble.