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License suspended, WTF?
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Rumor
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Jul 20, 2011, 03:24 AM
 
So I got a DUI in Michigan 10/03, was convicted 11/03. Renewed my California DL in 5/06, no problems. Got a speeding ticket two or three years ago, no problem. Did traffic school. Within the last 12 months I got a ten or six year print out from the CA DMV for a potential job, came back clean. I went to renew my license in 6/11 and today got a letter saying it was suspended since 10/03. How is this even possible? The letter says I require a SR-22 filing to keep my license, but I no longer own a vehicle. Also, up until less than two years ago, I had a car and it was insured. State Farm, Farmers, and Geico never informed me that I had a suspended license.

This is now almost eight years old now. Did someone screw up?
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ghporter
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Jul 20, 2011, 07:06 AM
 
Sounds like a visit in person to the DMV is in order. Something has gotten messed up, either before your new job print out or fairly recently. I'd take all the records you have showing that you had a clean report from CA's DMV within the past year. They need to explain how you were able to renew your license in 2006 if it was suspended in 2003...

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andi*pandi
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Jul 20, 2011, 07:21 AM
 
That is indeed messed up. Suspensions don't last for 8 years, even if it was suspended in 03 why should it be now?
     
The Final Dakar
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Jul 20, 2011, 09:03 AM
 
That's impressive.
     
Laminar
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Jul 20, 2011, 09:54 AM
 
I had a similar-ish thing happen. I lost my license in '03 for speeding, and when my license was revoked, my right to have a car registered in my name was revoked as well (didn't matter, I didn't own a car). I got my license back the next year (it's pretty awesome when your friend's mom hears me getting pulled over on her scanner and since she works as a police dispatcher and was horrified that her daughter had been in a car with me, she petitioned for the maximum suspension of 8 months). A few months later I bought my first car, but had to take a letter from the state into the local DMV to prove that I could register a car. Got the plates, no problem.

Fast forward a year and a half, I'm visiting home from college and stopped in my neighbor's driveway to return her blown-away trash cans when the local small-town police officer "pulls me over" in the driveway I'm parked in and proceeds to tell me my registration is expired. After sitting on the radio for a while, he tells me my car was never legally registered and gives me a ticket for expired registration.

Turns out when I went to show the letter and pick up my plates, they never "authorized" it, so my car was never legally registered, so I never got a registration renewal notice in the mail. I went in to the local DMV and was forced to pay full registration and a $16 fee for having a lapse in renewing my registration. They tried to uphold the expired registration ticket but I played the poor college kid card and since I had already paid the fee they dropped it, while maintaining that I was definitely still guilty.
     
Rumor  (op)
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Jul 20, 2011, 12:33 PM
 
I talked to the CA DMV and they told me that I have to get proof that when I got a DUI it was on a MI license. Otherwise, I have to go though CA DUI classes. They said that they only check the national database on renewals and that it was only set up a couple years ago. I applied for a local PD a couple years ago and have some friends that are Feds, they ran my background check (FBI) and it didn't show then either.

I got the feeling I am going to get ****ed by this.
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Rumor  (op)
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Jul 20, 2011, 12:53 PM
 
Ug, MI says I owe $2k as part of something called the responsibility act. CA said if I get a printout from them that shows it wasn't my CADL then I would be okay. I have the feeling that CA is blowing smoke up my ass but I'll play along for now. There is no way I can pay that back right now as I am paying student loans and still have yet to find a "real" job.

This ****ing sucks.
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imitchellg5
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Jul 20, 2011, 12:57 PM
 
Wow. That's completely insane. It boggles my mind that they let your renew your license in 2006.
     
bstone
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Jul 20, 2011, 01:06 PM
 
I guess this is the penance one pays for being as completely irresponsible as to drink and then drive. Sorry but I have zero sympathy.
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turtle777
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Jul 20, 2011, 01:35 PM
 
That really sucks. Typical government moneys, screw things up, and make you pay to fix it.

-t
     
andi*pandi
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Jul 20, 2011, 02:11 PM
 
Originally Posted by bstone View Post
I guess this is the penance one pays for being as completely irresponsible as to drink and then drive. Sorry but I have zero sympathy.
I'm assuming he paid his fine and did his time back then. Pennance paid. Now they want to fine him retroactively? Or double-dip across state lines? In no way is this fair. This is a glitch. A yummy tasty glitch for the revenue dept.
     
imitchellg5
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Jul 20, 2011, 02:28 PM
 
Originally Posted by bstone View Post
I guess this is the penance one pays for being as completely irresponsible as to drink and then drive. Sorry but I have zero sympathy.
I too have zero tolerance for drinking and driving, but I also would have zero tolerance for having a suspended license and no one even having the courtesy to tell me, and then the state taking my money to renew my license.
     
Rumor  (op)
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Jul 20, 2011, 03:32 PM
 
Originally Posted by bstone View Post
I guess this is the penance one pays for being as completely irresponsible as to drink and then drive. Sorry but I have zero sympathy.


I had just turned 21 and made a mistake. I learned from it and moved on. I fullfilled all my requirements the court ordered. Have never driven drunk since. Have you never made a mistake?

For the record, no accident was involved. I wasn't even pulled over for suspicion of drunk driving. I made a left where I wasn't supposed to.
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bstone
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Jul 20, 2011, 03:36 PM
 
Originally Posted by Rumor View Post
I had just turned 21 and made a mistake. I learned from it and moved on. Have never driven drunk since. Have you never made a mistake?

For the record, no accident was involved. I wasn't even pulled over for suspicion of drunk driving. I made a left where I wasn't supposed to.
I have made plenty of mistakes. I've also worked on an ambulance as an EMT and seen the horrors that drunk drivers cause. You are lucky that you didn't murder anyone. If it was me I would have suspended your license for 10 years and jailed you for 5. Incredible that you didn't get more than you did. Your suspension and fines is like being slapped with a wet noodle.
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The Final Dakar
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Jul 20, 2011, 03:37 PM
 
     
Rumor  (op)
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Jul 20, 2011, 04:04 PM
 
Originally Posted by bstone View Post
I have made plenty of mistakes. I've also worked on an ambulance as an EMT and seen the horrors that drunk drivers cause. You are lucky that you didn't murder anyone. If it was me I would have suspended your license for 10 years and jailed you for 5. Incredible that you didn't get more than you did. Your suspension and fines is like being slapped with a wet noodle.
I am fully aware of what could have potentially happened. I was young, made a mistake, haven't done it again. If I was a repeat offender, I could understand a harsher penalty. Believe me or not, I wasn't driving erratically or speeding. Shit, I wasn't even cited for making an illegal turn.

Eight years have passed and I only have been pulled over once. I am a very safe driver. The only time I had a car in an accident it was parked and someone hit it.
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sek929
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Jul 20, 2011, 05:19 PM
 
I fell asleep at the wheel once and tanked into a tree at 50. Many studies have shown tired driving is worse than drunk driving.

So bstone, would you jail anyone for 5 years who yawns while driving?

He made a mistake and paid for it, you're just being a judgmental dick and you know it.
     
Waragainstsleep
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Jul 20, 2011, 06:14 PM
 
I'm with bstone. Its nothing personal but drink driving penalties are rarely as harsh as they should be.

There was a guy a few years back who ran into a family standing at a crossing. One little girl was killed, the other lost her legs as well as her sister and her mother. The guy got a measly 3 years or so IIRC.

Driving tired is an error in judgement. Everyone gets tired and its not always obvious when its going to happen in a way that could affect your driving. Driving while drunk is rarely a 'mistake'. People get into cars knowing full well they are over the limit all the time. If you are drunk enough to forget its against the law, chances are you'll never even manage to get the key in the ignition before you pass out. People don't take it seriously enough and even the courts seem to think of it as an extenuating circumstance as evidenced above.
That guy should have been charged with two counts of manslaughter and GBH instead of dangerous driving or driving under the influence.

That said I think 5 years if you don't cause an accident or anything sounds a little harsh. It would be a good deterrent though which is the important thing.
If it were up to me, drink drivers would have their vehicles confiscated permanently. If they were driving someone else's car then they should be liable to pay the owner for it.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
mduell
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Jul 20, 2011, 06:24 PM
 
DUIs are expensive. It sounds like the glitch was CA issuing a license.

Originally Posted by Rumor View Post
The letter says I require a SR-22 filing to keep my license, but I no longer own a vehicle.
Ownership of a vehicle is orthogonal to obtaining an SR-22: If you are required to obtain SR-22 insurance, even if you no longer own a car, you must obtain a non-owner SR-22 policy. Non-owner SR-22 is specifically designed for individuals that do not own a vehicle, but need auto insurance in order for their privileges to be reinstated. (source)
     
CollinG3G4
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Jul 20, 2011, 07:23 PM
 
Seriously, five years in jail for a first offence with no accident, injury, or death? The drunken bastard that killed my friend’s mother, driving on the wrong side of the road, only got 14 years and wasn't charged with murder. Extended Jail time is no more of a deterrent for illegal activity than the death penalty or life in prison. Handing out harsh sentences to people like Rumor, who obviously had the capacity to learn for his mistake, accomplishes what exactly?

I do agree though. Drunk driving is not taken seriously enough. Recently, my state passed new DUI laws and there were provisions a regarding a 5th DUI. Personally, I think a person’s license should be permanently revoked after the third infraction and extremely difficult to get back after the second. Save the jail time for the repeat offenders.
     
ghporter
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Jul 20, 2011, 07:44 PM
 
The State of California is telling you that they didn't bother with due diligence before, so now YOU have to jump through hoops? I think they are in the wrong, especially since you completed your punishment for the offense in Michigan.

Still, it would be interesting to learn just when your license was entered into the system as being suspended, and of course why they didn't bother to inform you of that action. You might tell them that the Michigan State Police need the date of that action before they will validate the whole "which state's license" issue.

This brings up the ex post facto issue; if your license was suspended retroactively, without you being notified, there is a major problem at CA DMV. Can you say "investigative TV reporter"? Sounds like juicy fodder, and certainly not what the state needs right now.

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
ghporter
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Jul 20, 2011, 07:57 PM
 
To get back onto the topic, I suggest that, instead of being judgmental about a person who was apprehended and has served his punishment, that you consider that at least he GOT a punishment. Michigan has consistent enforcement of its DUI/DWI statutes. Here in Texas, it depends on what county you drive drunk in and what the local DA decides to do with you. There are people with multiple DWI convictions, including for violations that involved accidents, who are driving around with misdemeanor records, while in other areas folks who blow "near" 0.08 have their licenses suspended and do time in the county jail with felony convictions. This is plainly wrong.

Rumor did his sentence and has not reoffended. Let's now get back to what sort of glitch California experienced, and whether or not Rumor is going to get raked over the coals for the subject at hand, which is apparently retroactive suspension of his license.

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
bstone
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Jul 20, 2011, 08:56 PM
 
Originally Posted by sek929 View Post
I fell asleep at the wheel once and tanked into a tree at 50. Many studies have shown tired driving is worse than drunk driving.

So bstone, would you jail anyone for 5 years who yawns while driving?

He made a mistake and paid for it, you're just being a judgmental dick and you know it.
No, only 5 years for those who are as extremely reckless as you. Tired driving is never a good idea and can be fixed by a cup of coffee. DUI is horrifying and never excusable and cannot be fixed by a cup of coffee.

You seem to be under the impression that there are no consequences to your actions. That is false. The consequences will be with you forever. That includes having your license suspended, revoked or otherwise screwed with. Accept the consequences and stop complaining.
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andi*pandi
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Jul 20, 2011, 09:29 PM
 
tired driving cannot be fixed with a cup of coffee. I used to work 3rd shift. I drank a lot of coffee. Still had difficulty driving home at 7am. Still drove into a ditch.
     
Rumor  (op)
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Jul 20, 2011, 10:07 PM
 
Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep View Post
I'm with bstone. Its nothing personal but drink driving penalties are rarely as harsh as they should be.

There was a guy a few years back who ran into a family standing at a crossing. One little girl was killed, the other lost her legs as well as her sister and her mother. The guy got a measly 3 years or so IIRC.

Driving tired is an error in judgement. Everyone gets tired and its not always obvious when its going to happen in a way that could affect your driving. Driving while drunk is rarely a 'mistake'. People get into cars knowing full well they are over the limit all the time. If you are drunk enough to forget its against the law, chances are you'll never even manage to get the key in the ignition before you pass out. People don't take it seriously enough and even the courts seem to think of it as an extenuating circumstance as evidenced above.
That guy should have been charged with two counts of manslaughter and GBH instead of dangerous driving or driving under the influence.

That said I think 5 years if you don't cause an accident or anything sounds a little harsh. It would be a good deterrent though which is the important thing.
If it were up to me, drink drivers would have their vehicles confiscated permanently. If they were driving someone else's car then they should be liable to pay the owner for it.
I'm pretty sure out here that would be vehicular manslaughter, DUI, and a host of other charges. It would put someone in for a long time.
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Jul 20, 2011, 10:09 PM
 
Unfortunately, it sounds like the OP needs to hire a lawyer.
     
Rumor  (op)
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Jul 20, 2011, 10:11 PM
 
I had a year probation, hefty fine, legal costs, community service, random screenings, license supension for six months, and had to take an alcoholic assessment. I plead guilty and didn't try to fight it. I told the judge I made a mistake and have to face the consequences, which is why my penalties weren't as bad as they could have been. Also, I didn't have a criminal record.
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bstone
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Jul 20, 2011, 11:25 PM
 
Originally Posted by andi*pandi View Post
tired driving cannot be fixed with a cup of coffee. I used to work 3rd shift. I drank a lot of coffee. Still had difficulty driving home at 7am. Still drove into a ditch.
Also worked third shift. Would get home at 7-8am every morning. Coffee worked every time. Maybe you needed to switch to a stronger blend?
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sek929
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Jul 20, 2011, 11:46 PM
 
Originally Posted by bstone View Post
Also worked third shift. Would get home at 7-8am every morning. Coffee worked every time. Maybe you needed to switch to a stronger blend?
Coffee is not a miracle cure for being exhausted. I've been tired enough plenty of times where coffee does nothing but make me jittery.

The conscious act of not getting enough sleep leads to crashing asleep behind the wheel. It's just as dangerous as drunk driving and, even more importantly, more accepted by people like you.

I don't condone drunk driving, but your stance is fairly over the top.
     
bstone
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Jul 20, 2011, 11:58 PM
 
Originally Posted by sek929 View Post
The conscious act of not getting enough sleep leads to crashing asleep behind the wheel. It's just as dangerous as drunk driving and, even more importantly, more accepted by people like you.
Nope, I don't condone tired driving. Notice how I said to drink coffee in order to wake up, then drive. If you're falling asleep at the wheel then pull over and sleep for 20 minutes or until you're able to drive safely. There is no reason to drive impaired- drunk or tired. Just don't do it. If you then be prepared to live with the consequences.
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brassplayersrock²
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Jul 21, 2011, 12:23 AM
 
Booze alters your state of mind.
Coffee (caffeine) alters your state of mind.

I still don't see how a caffeine boost could lead you out of a jam.
     
bstone
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Jul 21, 2011, 12:24 AM
 
Originally Posted by brassplayersrock² View Post
Booze alters your state of mind.
Coffee (caffeine) alters your state of mind.

I still don't see how a caffeine boost could lead you out of a jam.
Foods in general alter your state of mind. Some makes things more erotic, some make you sleepy, some make you awake and alert, some will give you intense psychadelic trips (magic mushrooms).
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tightsocks
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Jul 21, 2011, 01:01 AM
 
Originally Posted by Laminar View Post
lost my license in '03 for speeding
Details please.
     
Waragainstsleep
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Jul 21, 2011, 05:05 AM
 
Originally Posted by Rumor View Post
I'm pretty sure out here that would be vehicular manslaughter, DUI, and a host of other charges. It would put someone in for a long time.
Should have been yes. But this is the UK for you. Being drunk actually seems to make it easier for a court to forgive you over here sometimes.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
Big Mac
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Jul 21, 2011, 06:15 AM
 
I don't really understand how people get many moving violation tickets. I've been pulled over around four times in my life, but I've never gotten a ticket as a result. Maybe I'm just very lucky in that regard, but in my experience if you're polite you're most likely going to be let off.

"The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield and government to gain ground." TJ
     
ghporter
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Jul 21, 2011, 06:42 AM
 
I wish you were right, Big Mac. I was ticketed for rolling through a hidden stop sign when I could very plainly see the police car - because it was Thanksgiving and the officer appeared to be upset about having to work that day. That ticket was dismissed when I showed the municipal judge photos of how the sign was hidden by a tree.

The last time I was stopped, the officer was waiting at the bottom of a hill; I braked at the top of the hill because the car behind me was getting really close, but the officer seems to have assumed that I was braking because I saw his car. Despite my extremely polite behavior, he issued a ticket. (It turns out that this particular section of access road happened to have a lower speed limit than just about any other access road in the area, and the signage was unclear. One "Defensive Driving" class and almost as much cost as paying the fine got that ticket dismissed.

In my experience, large departments' officers who spend a lot of time on traffic enforcement seem likely to be unhappy about that assignment, and they appear to "share" that unhappiness with motorists. In contrast, Texas' state police are always professional, and always pay attention to the context of a particular motorist's driving. My wife was tailgated by a delivery truck in Austin, at significantly higher than the speed limit on I 35. A DPS officer pulled my wife over and, instead of ticketing her, he asked if she'd testify about the truck driver's actions. A few minutes after the officer finished talking to her, she drove past where he had pulled that truck over, and was at that moment going over the driver's manifest. Sometimes life is sweet...

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
Laminar
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Jul 21, 2011, 08:25 AM
 
Originally Posted by tightsocks View Post
Details please.
Came around a blind corner on a back highway and a police car was going the other way. He said I was doing 96 in a 55, I knew I was doing 105 a few moments earlier so I kept my mouth shut.
     
turtle777
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Jul 21, 2011, 09:46 AM
 
Originally Posted by Big Mac View Post
I don't really understand how people get many moving violation tickets. I've been pulled over around four times in my life, but I've never gotten a ticket as a result. Maybe I'm just very lucky in that regard, but in my experience if you're polite you're most likely going to be let off.
I don't think that experience is the norm.

Many communities rely on the income from speeding tickets. Without it, they'd had to cut or fire people.
Therefore, policemen better fulfill their quotas and bring in enough tickets to help the budget.

In most cases unlikely that you just get out of it, since they do this for money and not safety in the first place. It really boils down to you vs. the cop's career.

-t
     
andi*pandi
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Jul 21, 2011, 10:04 AM
 
It also could be the timing of your pullovers. If I recall, some officers will allow you one warning per year. At least, that's what I was told when I got a warning once. He said they still marked down the warning on your record so other officers could see.

The thing is about falling asleep at the wheel is you don't realize you are. You dream you are still awake and driving straight. There is a point when coffee doesn't help. Loud radio doesn't help. Cold breeze doesn't help. Coffee doesn't help. Knowing the fine line between "tired" and "too tired" would help, but there's no breathalyzer for that.
     
   
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