[jaquarat]

would installing a 7200rpm drive on a powerbook void the warranty, and/or void the possibility of getting applecare?

and, how much do such drives run, approximately?

i'm asking this because, if i got a stock powerbook, i could return it if its lcd had dead or stuck pixels, whereas if i were to get a bto powerbook, then i would have to keep it if that happened.

right?

[iREZ]

If you install it yourself, your warranty will be over with and you'll be stuck without applecare. I have heard that if you go to a local Apple tech and have them install it, then it wont hinder your Applecare warranty in the slightest. Whether or not its true is another story, if someone can answer that, I'll appreciate it because my stock 40g HD is getting cramped and I know Apple is against the 7200RPM HD, but a 5400RPM 80g HD would be quite the upgrade for me, and I dont wanna bother with external drives.

[kuzelnik]

That is incorrect. The hard drive is "user installable". I have one go bad on me a few weeks ago and Apple sent me a new one in the box-- with a Torx and everything so I could swap it out myself.

[Paul Huang]

I don't know about the new plastic-clip-sh_t aluminum units or the 12" PowerBooks, but on all the Titaniums, you are able to replace the hard drive without voiding the warranty--if you don't cause any damage in the installation process.

[Paul Huang]

DO NOT, I repeat, DO NOT open the PowerBooks (any model other than the Titanium) if you don't have the right tool. The philips screw head is extremely slender and soft. Although I am not certain whether it voids the warranty (see the previous post re: Titanium), the 12.1" PowerBook (or iBook of any size) is really difficult to disassemble and assemble. The aluminum things are just as strong as aluminum cans.

[rag on a muffin]

Originally posted by Paul Huang:
The aluminum things are just as strong as aluminum cans.

yeah, the screws on my powerbook are on the verge of being stripped right from the factory.

[voodoosand]

Has anyone done this? How's the computer holding up afterwards? I would like to do it just for general speed reasons, but I think my 12" would overheat or something.

[spullara]

Here are the docs on how to open the machine that I used:

http://www.xlr8yourmac.com/systems/P...ake-apart.html

They were very good. Just make sure you are careful popping the hooks in the DVD slot, thats the hardest part. Swapping the drive is simple.

Sam

[Toyin]

Originally posted by Paul Huang:
I don't know about the new plastic-clip-sh_t aluminum units or the 12" PowerBooks, but on all the Titaniums, you are able to replace the hard drive without voiding the warranty--if you don't cause any damage in the installation process.

Yeah the aluminium PBs are really pieces of crap.

I replaced the HD in my 12" PB. It's not for the faint of heart. Working with the internals isn't easy, but much more difficult then working on desktops. It is essential that you get the right tools. And yes it does void your warranty unless it's done by a certified Apple technician (and the folks at the Apple store won't do it).

The upgrade was significant from the 4800rpm unit, but I haven't felt a need to upgrade the 5400 in my 15" PB

[flypenfly]

You will VOID your warranty if you replace the HD on AL PB's. Ti PB's have the HD as a user servicable part.

[jedi1yoda1]

I upgraded my hard drive in my original TiBook a year and a half ago to a quieter and faster model. It wasn't that hard. Apple provides instructions for all user installable parts. If HD is not listed on their user installable page for your model, then it will void your warranty.

If yours is a Titanium Book, then it does not void the warranty (I checked this with Apple before I did it). It looks as if it will void the warranty on the newer Aluminum books.

The Apple warranty will no longer cover your old or new hard drive and any damage it does to your machine (or any damage you do while installing it), but if your cd drive dies and it's unrelated, it's still covered.


Apple User Installable Parts

With that, I just wish that I could order a Powerbook w/o a hard drive and install it myself. My TiBook's Hard Drive was the loudest part of my computer and while in my room or office when it was quiet, it was ridiculous. I was happy with my replacement and had no side effects from it.

(This is with the original 400mHz G4 PowerBook, i'm making no claims that any of this will apply in your case)

P.S. Apple will not allow you to exchange your powerbook (stock or CTO) if you have a couple of dead pixels. (I guess you could just do the 10-return thing if it was stock, a lot of hassle for probability though). Mine came with 2, no dice. My 23" cinema display came with one as well. It's a part of owning an LCD display. It has to be a significant amount, they have a standard, but that's a whole other topic of discussion.

[piwozniak]

I have done it.

Takes a long time, and it's pain in the butt to put it together without any gaps after all.

Not super-hard if you're careful, but not as easy as replacing a HD in good old tibooks.

[echosphere]

jaquarat,

I have an AlPB 15" installed the 7200 myself. The right side of the screen went dark after wake up from sleep. Called Apple and told them and they sent a box, one day to repair and back to me. They changed the inverter board, no worries.

NOW, if I had told them that my laptop kept freezing for some strange reason, or god forbid, stupid enough to say I was having troubles with my HD, this would a different story. If they didn't know what was wrong they would do a diagnostic, say "See, you installed unauthorized parts, regardless, we cannot repair it" it and send it back. So, all I would need to do is uninstall it and send it in again for repairs.

What this means, is that Apple has no way of knowing what is installed in your machine. Originally, by me giving my serial number and the info about the dark screen, the techs already know that the inverter needs replacing, it's a common issue that they all know, and can fix it in an hour.

Two, Apple techs are NOT policemen or work for Homeland Security, the quicker they can get their work done the better. Um, looks like a bolt is loose, better call in the investigative squad, no way!

Install the drive, which IS a pain the ass, btw. (use a credit card to pry the top plate off around the CD drive area, if you use a screw driver, you'll scratch it, you'll see) Then, if you need repairs, such as the screen, or something having nothing to do with the physical HD (though this might be far and few....) send it in and don't worry too much (plus sooner or later, Apple will have 7200 as a BTO option, then no one cares). If you like to punish yourself, take it out and swap the old one back in before repairs (remember, Apple uses about 5 different HD sizes and brands in the AlBooks anyways...). If worse come to worse, Apple will send it back cause they found the 7200 drive. Either take it out, and send it back, or, just lie and say you got it installed at an Authorized Apple dealer in Finland while going to school there, I would imagine that not too many of them speak Suomi or will contact servicer in Finland.

Whew, hopes this helps. Anyways, to fin(n)ish, I've got the 7200 and a new inverter board, and a cool shipping box left over after Apple sent my repaired PB back to me.

~Echo

[maxdecibel]

... and the fan kicks in more often than before. A fully charged battery lasts about 1.5 hours. It's definitely faster, especially noticeable while operating in OS-X.
I had the right tool(s) - a T8H torx wrench and a tweezer - and it took me about 10 minutes to replace the old and dead HD.

[jaquarat]

although i'm still where i started - whether to get the 5400 bto and risk a bad screen or no. i'll probably do the bto and cross my fingers.

[jstein]

Originally posted by jaquarat:
although i'm still where i started - whether to get the 5400 bto and risk a bad screen or no. i'll probably do the bto and cross my fingers.

Well, that changes everything. If your Apple laptop is BTO and there is a problem, you should not have any problems at all receiving another laptop. The only thing is that it may take a bto a little longer to arrive that is all. Now on the other hand which your inital post was indicating, was that you were going to install the HD yourself, that is totally different. That may or may not lead to warranty issues. So if you want to go with a 5400 HD as a bto, you will not have any problems if something goes wrong. This only negates you taking your laptop back to an Apple Store because they are only going to have the stock models in their inventory.

My question is have you ever thouhgt of buying your laptop as it is and then purchasing an external HD to go with it?

[sbc]

I don't understand Apple in this aspect. Why doesn't the user have the option to get a different harddrive? Why isn't the machine built so the harddrive can be removed from the bottom (like most machines)? After spending 2500+ dollars, if someone wants a larger or quicker hdd, it shouldn't be a issue that affects the warranty. So what happens when you harddrive dies, do you have to purchase another laptop?

[Paul Huang]

Apple is just like these DSL/Cable companies: If you have a third-party part (router/hard drive), those things are immediately at fault.

One time I had a brand-new OS X 10.3.2 CD. I put in a new hard drive inside the PowerBook G4 (Titanium) and started installing 10.3.2. It stopped at one spot. I looked at the CD and noticed that there was a very fine scratch. I tried it on two more desktop G4s and they all ended at the same spot and gave me the same error message. Clearly it was the CD.

I called Apple Edu. support. As soon as she heard that I replaced the HD, she said that "because you replaced the hard drive yourself" (I didn't tell her that I was/am a certified Apple Tech), you are experiencing the installation problem. I told her that I did the same with two other desktop G4s. She replied (buckle up, you may fall off of your chair):

Did you replace hard drives in the two desktop G4s?

I explained to her again, but she just wasn't listening. I had to say: LISTEN, YOU BITCH. Get someone else on the line if you don't understand it. The CD is the problem, NOT the hard drive I installed. Just send me a replacement CD.

Sometimes they are just asking for trouble.

[bcaslis]

Changing the drive in any aluminum PowerBook (not the Titanium) WILL void your warranty. If you change and don't cause a problem, Apple probably won't care, but they can tell if you installed one yourself, there are Apple specific lables and firmware in the drive they provide.

Having said that I have changed the drive in a 17" (not the one I currently have) and would have to say strongly go for the 5400 BTO. I've read lots of reviews by people that have changed the drive and gush how great it is but I have to disagree. The 7200rpm didn't use noticably more power or make more heat, but I tried the Hitachi E7K60 which made a horrible buzzing vibration through the whole PowerBook and a Hitachi 7K60 which didn't vibrate but had a bad high pitched whine which was at just right frequency to drive me crazy.

On performance if you have 1GB or more memory (so swapping doesn't happen much) the performance boost compared to a 5400rpm is negligable. Boot up was 1 second faster. Normal operations I couldn't tell the difference unless I was copying a file at least 10MB or more in size. And even then it had to be about 100MB or more before the difference was enough to care.

Originally posted by jaquarat:
although i'm still where i started - whether to get the 5400 bto and risk a bad screen or no. i'll probably do the bto and cross my fingers.

[h00ligan]

Originally posted by piwozniak:
I have done it.

Takes a long time, and it's pain in the butt to put it together without any gaps after all.

Not super-hard if you're careful, but not as easy as replacing a HD in good old tibooks.

i actually thought in teh long run it was easier then the tibook. As far as warranty.. well they have to be able to tell it was take apart.. one thing i noticed is that there is a small piece of sticky silicone sort of binding the hdd cable.. if you do it carefully you can replace that silicone if needed, or you can buy a rubber patch kit.. liek for my air mattress.. same stuff.

here are pics of the install, in case you want to see how much you have to take apart.

http://digitalinterplay.com/12inch

[h00ligan]

oh and that's another question, if you yourself are a certified apple tech and you do it, is your warranty void?

[Paul Huang]

Originally posted by h00ligan:
oh and that's another question, if you yourself are a certified apple tech and you do it, is your warranty void?

Of course not. However, death and taxes are inevitable, but everything in between is negotiable. Apple sure can blame your hard drive replacement as the source of the problem, but if you push hard, the warranty is not an issue at all. Don't try this at home. Over the years I have handled enough cases to know that you need to state facts in certain ways to get your way.

[h00ligan]

wondering cuz i am going for my certified apple tech license (so we can buy parts and stop sending machines out) and I was just thinking about whether that would help in the event anything went bad.

[JKT]

Originally posted by sbc:
I don't understand Apple in this aspect. Why doesn't the user have the option to get a different harddrive? Why isn't the machine built so the harddrive can be removed from the bottom (like most machines)? After spending 2500+ dollars, if someone wants a larger or quicker hdd, it shouldn't be a issue that affects the warranty. So what happens when you harddrive dies, do you have to purchase another laptop?

No, you just have to take it to a shop with a certified tech to get it (the HD) replaced by them which does not void your warranty... and unless you're really unlucky, by the time a HD dies on you, your PB is likely to be out of warranty anyway and thus this is a moot point.

Edit - not that I am arguing against the ability to be able to do this yourself, but in the case of laptops, these things are not so easy to accommodate. Having taken a look at the internals of the PB's in the Service Manuals for them, it isn't necessarily a practical thing for Apple to offer the opportunity to easily remove the HD in the AlBooks (The 15"HD is located beneath the trackpad for what it's worth).

There is also a security consideration - an easily removed HD is also an easily stolen one.

[slimmy]

I tried to open up my PB15" AL with all the right tools, the service manual, and just could not get the clip inside the CD slot to release the top case. An hour of fiddling. Ended up paying 119.00USD to have a tech shop do it. $#%&@!

Slim

Originally posted by echosphere:
jaquarat,

I have an AlPB 15" installed the 7200 myself. The right side of the screen went dark after wake up from sleep. Called Apple and told them and they sent a box, one day to repair and back to me. They changed the inverter board, no worries.

NOW, if I had told them that my laptop kept freezing for some strange reason, or god forbid, stupid enough to say I was having troubles with my HD, this would a different story. If they didn't know what was wrong they would do a diagnostic, say "See, you installed unauthorized parts, regardless, we cannot repair it" it and send it back. So, all I would need to do is uninstall it and send it in again for repairs.

What this means, is that Apple has no way of knowing what is installed in your machine. Originally, by me giving my serial number and the info about the dark screen, the techs already know that the inverter needs replacing, it's a common issue that they all know, and can fix it in an hour.

Two, Apple techs are NOT policemen or work for Homeland Security, the quicker they can get their work done the better. Um, looks like a bolt is loose, better call in the investigative squad, no way!

Install the drive, which IS a pain the ass, btw. (use a credit card to pry the top plate off around the CD drive area, if you use a screw driver, you'll scratch it, you'll see) Then, if you need repairs, such as the screen, or something having nothing to do with the physical HD (though this might be far and few....) send it in and don't worry too much (plus sooner or later, Apple will have 7200 as a BTO option, then no one cares). If you like to punish yourself, take it out and swap the old one back in before repairs (remember, Apple uses about 5 different HD sizes and brands in the AlBooks anyways...). If worse come to worse, Apple will send it back cause they found the 7200 drive. Either take it out, and send it back, or, just lie and say you got it installed at an Authorized Apple dealer in Finland while going to school there, I would imagine that not too many of them speak Suomi or will contact servicer in Finland.

Whew, hopes this helps. Anyways, to fin(n)ish, I've got the 7200 and a new inverter board, and a cool shipping box left over after Apple sent my repaired PB back to me.

~Echo

[sbc]

I understand your point and it makes sense to me. However, after having to spend such a large sum of money, I think to have to potentially pay more money for a simple HDD change is excess. Exchanging HDDs seems to be such a common task, all the "extra" things required are not very practical, IMHO. Nonetheless, PB's are still the most solid machine out there. No one can win it all

Originally posted by JKT:
No, you just have to take it to a shop with a certified tech to get it (the HD) replaced by them which does not void your warranty... and unless you're really unlucky, by the time a HD dies on you, your PB is likely to be out of warranty anyway and thus this is a moot point.

Edit - not that I am arguing against the ability to be able to do this yourself, but in the case of laptops, these things are not so easy to accommodate. Having taken a look at the internals of the PB's in the Service Manuals for them, it isn't necessarily a practical thing for Apple to offer the opportunity to easily remove the HD in the AlBooks (The 15"HD is located beneath the trackpad for what it's worth).

There is also a security consideration - an easily removed HD is also an easily stolen one.

[echosphere]

"There is also a security consideration - an easily removed HD is also an easily stolen one."

That happened to me, terrorists broke into my house late at night and slipped the HD out of my PB. I found out they were from the "Free Porn Front" or some radical faction like that.....

[whop]

well i just recently got the "click of death" on my 15" ti pb, and was going to purchase this HDto replace it, http://www.essencompu.com/nupplysingar.asp?ID=5566 which i am assuming is going to work, even though the platform says windows.

so from what im hearing, i think i should have a tech install it. my computer is about 2 years old and not under any warrenty. but ive never had any experiance with the internal hardware and defianlty dont wanna screw anything up. any more advice about this?

[echosphere]

Sorry, got off subject...

Similar to what bcaslis wrote about the "Enhanced" 7,200RPM drive, it's starting to drive me crazy and it does vibrate the machine, which in turn, makes a humming sound from the desk it's on.

I'm actually going to put the original 4,200 drive back in.... I really didn't find that much of a difference in speed, but then I'm not moving mass amounts of data and I've got a Gig of RAM. Plus, I like having more HD space (80 Gig).

[amazing]

Originally posted by whop:
well i just recently got the "click of death" on my 15" ti pb, and was going to purchase this HDto replace it, http://www.essencompu.com/nupplysingar.asp?ID=5566 which i am assuming is going to work, even though the platform says windows.

so from what im hearing, i think i should have a tech install it. my computer is about 2 years old and not under any warrenty. but ive never had any experiance with the internal hardware and defianlty dont wanna screw anything up. any more advice about this?

Whop: The Titanium HD is user installable and it's very easy to do. You'll find directions with photos on Apple's Support website and also at xlr8yourmac.com. As for any 2.5" HD that you're looking at, just check the prices on pricegrabber.com, You'll find speed tests and recommendations at barefeats.com

If you yourself install any HD in an AlPB and if Apple techs can tell that you did it (say, you get sloppy), then you've voided your warranty. No doubt about it. You won't be able to argue with them. It is not a user installable part--if you doubt your tech skills, you're better off having an ASP do it. The local independent Apple shop estimated $80.

At the very least, you'll have to reinstall the original HD when you want Apple to work on the AlPB. That means ;you've opened the case twice, then once again when you get it back.

[h00ligan]

Originally posted by echosphere:
Sorry, got off subject...

Similar to what bcaslis wrote about the "Enhanced" 7,200RPM drive, it's starting to drive me crazy and it does vibrate the machine, which in turn, makes a humming sound from the desk it's on.

I'm actually going to put the original 4,200 drive back in.... I really didn't find that much of a difference in speed, but then I'm not moving mass amounts of data and I've got a Gig of RAM. Plus, I like having more HD space (80 Gig).

You know, in my tibook i think i noticed it more.. but in the al book i don't notice it at all... i think teh shock absorbtion is better in teh albook.. it's in ther ea lot tighter.. the way it presses up against.

[Daniel Bayer]

Originally posted by h00ligan:
You know, in my tibook i think i noticed it more.. but in the al book i don't notice it at all... i think teh shock absorbtion is better in teh albook.. it's in ther ea lot tighter.. the way it presses up against.

I put a 7200 in my 1.33 17 the first night I had it. I move 5-20GB of data around regularly as I am a photographer. I also work with Photoshop files that average 60MB and easily go as high as 200MB on a daily basis. It is not uncommon for a scratch size from a single file to hit 2 GB!

I found the rewards of the faster drive a huge benifet over the warranty risk factor...I simply have work to do and have no time for apple's policy on the Al's.

Much, MUCH faster when working in the pro arena!

Btw, I was a pro at swapping ti-book drives, I could do them in about 15 minutes. The Al books are much more complex. I took a leisurely 2 hours on mine as to not mar it in any way.

Search my posts for more details.

[iREZ]

Quick question, what can a 7200RPM internal HD offer that a 7200RPM external HD doesn't other then the obvious? I usually do all my intensive work at home but when I'm on the go with my PB, its usually being used for word processing, Halo, iTunes, etc......

[Daniel Bayer]

Originally posted by iREZ:
Quick question, what can a 7200RPM internal HD offer that a 7200RPM external HD doesn't other then the obvious? I usually do all my intensive work at home but when I'm on the go with my PB, its usually being used for word processing, Halo, iTunes, etc......

Well that is simple, I do all the high end stuff on the go too.
It is not uncommon for me to be seen at a starbucks pushing 100-200MB of processed photos to an FTP site.

I need all to be fast, internal, external.

It simply works better that way.

[Toyin]

Originally posted by iREZ:
Quick question, what can a 7200RPM internal HD offer that a 7200RPM external HD doesn't other then the obvious? I usually do all my intensive work at home but when I'm on the go with my PB, its usually being used for word processing, Halo, iTunes, etc......

When I upgraded my 4800rpm drive in my 12" PB there was a significant speed in all disk intensive activities (ie start up, finder updates, Launchbar, disk permission repair, application launching...etc)

[rockhaus]

Originally posted by kuzelnik:
That is incorrect. The hard drive is "user installable". I have one go bad on me a few weeks ago and Apple sent me a new one in the box-- with a Torx and everything so I could swap it out myself.

I have a TiBook 667 that I put an IBM Travelstar 60GB and non-Apple RAM into. I didn't buy the them from Apple. Both are very easy to install and I'll repeat if needed.

I need to send TiBook to AppleCare to get just the FireWire port fixed.

Should I reinstall original 30GB Apple drive and RAM to avoid warranty issues or 'popped case' charges?

I need FireWire to use the original drive in its external enclosure, though I needed to replace enclosure as all FW ports blew in all devices except camcorder.

Though the new internal drive isn't 7200RPM, it is fine for editing DV and seems slightly louder, it clicks normally in recognizable R/W patterns I now recognize and appreciate.

[amazing]

Originally posted by rockhaus:
I have a TiBook 667 that I put an IBM Travelstar 60GB and non-Apple RAM into. I didn't buy the them from Apple. Both are very easy to install and I'll repeat if needed.

I need to send TiBook to AppleCare to get just the FireWire port fixed.

Personally, I'd put the 30 GB back in, because you can consider that you've now got your complete "backup" in your own hands, rather than in Apple's lap. You were planning on backing everything up before sending it in, right? Knock on wood that nothing goes wrong, but be prepared...

Also, it's much better not to confuse the poor techies: Give them a straightforward repair, with no decisions or judgments for them to make.