[Mastrap]

Originally posted by Zimphire:

Yes you are right, I don't know what every instance is about. But I do know the deception and mocking is real.

[/b] Limited? give me a break.
[/b] You answered your own question.For some reason, people feel think you have to look at things through worldly knowledge to understand. Simply not true. Esp when talking about spiritual matters.
[/b] And you are entitled to your opinions.

I don't care about religion. No one needs religion. The only thing one needs is beliefe that Jesus was the son of God, and that he died for your sins. His main concern is to get people to think this isn't important. That and to think he doesn't actually exist, and that there is no such thing as hell.

I agree it has caused trouble, that is why he is offering false prophets and such. To confuse and cause problems. Why would he do anything less? [/B]

There doesn't appear to be much of a point to carry on with this conversation.

It's your opinion that my knowledge is what you call "worldy". While I am very tempted to challenge you on this statement specifically I can't see any benefit arising from it.

[Zimphire]

You'll only understand the Holy Spirit through the Holy Spirit. No matter how many intellectual books you read on the matter. That is all I am saying.

[Mastrap]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
You'll only understand the Holy Spirit through the Holy Spirit. No matter how many intellectual books you read on the matter. That is all I am saying.

You're assuming. You're assuming, Zim. Assumption, as we say, is the mother of all ****-ups.

I consider myself a very spiritual person. Please don't try telling me what I am and what I am not. I told you repeatedly that I respect your way to communicate with the divine.

I'd appreciate it if you could do the same for me.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Mastrap:
You're assuming. You're assuming, Zim. Assumption, as we say, is the mother of all ****-ups.

I consider myself a very spiritual person. Please don't try telling me what I am and what I am not. I told you repeatedly that I respect your way to communicate with the divine.

I'd appreciate it if you could do the same for me.

You gave me a list of books and such you have read on the matter. Those books deal with the matter in a worldly way. You claimed because you read such books you were in the know. I only made a comment that reading those books will not IMHO give you any insight as to what is going on in the spiritual world. As far as you respecting my views or whatever, I guess your comments on my "limited knowledge" of such a thing is being respectful? Obviously I have a bit more than a limited knowledge of the matter. No hard feelings Mas, really.

[Mastrap]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
You gave me a list of books and such you have read on the matter. Those books deal with the matter in a worldly way. You claimed because you read such books you were in the know. I only made a comment that reading those books will not IMHO give you any insight as to what is going on in the spiritual world.

They don't. The vast majority of these books research the spiritual aspect and background of glossolalia. Either you didn't read my posts or you're refusing to take my arguments seriously.

I'd be genuinely interested to hear about your knowledge about the spiritual world with specific relevance to this discussion.

[Chuckmcd]

Originally posted by Lerkfish:
um...hate to break it to you, but ca$h was being serious.
He has a real obsession for christian-bashing. Just wait, and pretty soon he'll start accuse specific christians of being child molestors and get banned again.

I haven't got time to read this whole thing, but let me just say...
<sniffle>I love you Lerk</sniffle>

The thing that confuses me on the poll resultas that started this whole thing is that I don't see it. Obviously the results are there but I tend think it's alot more lip service than a true "great awaekening". I don't see this vast majority of Americans behaving like evangelical Christians. Not on the whole, and not on "grass roots" level here in my corner of the world. I'm much more concerned, as an evangelical, with an individuals personal behavior than I am with their voting record.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Mastrap:
They don't. The vast majority of these books research the spiritual aspect and background of glossolalia. Either you didn't read my posts or you're refusing to take my arguments seriously.

I did read your arguements, and I did take them seriously. Doesn't mean I have to agree as to where they are getting their information from does it? :/

Again, me not agreeing with you does not = me not understanding you, or me not paying attention to your posts. It just means I don't agree with you. If you don't like me not agreeing with you, I don't know what to tell you.

I'd be genuinely interested to hear about your knowledge about the spiritual world with specific relevance to this discussion.

I've told you, to understand spiritual matters, you have to be in tune with the spirit. Even the Bible says as much. Otherwise, it just wont click. Does that make any sense?

[imafreak]

Originally posted by Zimphire:

Yes everyone

You are projecting now Cash.

Simply propaganda you are spreading. Guess what, I have been and lived in the places you talk about. Most AREN'T religious. Most worship at the alter of NASCAR and velvet Elvis paintings and Budweiser.

You are showing your naiveness now. [/B]

So you know the truth?

[imafreak]

Originally posted by Lerkfish:
statistics? demographics? data?

so far, the only thing you're using to prove your contention is your own bigotry...I agree that's proof you're a bigot, but little else.

Do you have statistics, demographics or data to prove CASH$ wrong

[Lerkfish]

Originally posted by imafreak:
Do you have statistics, demographics or data to prove CASH$ wrong

read the whole thread.

but regardless, I wasn't the one making the assertion, the burden of proof is not on me.

but later in the thread, since cash refused to, I did post some links.

[Mastrap]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
I did read your arguments, and I did take them seriously. Doesn't mean I have to agree as to where they are getting their information from does it? :/

Again, me not agreeing with you does not = me not understanding you, or me not paying attention to your posts. It just means I don't agree with you. If you don't like me not agreeing with you, I don't know what to tell you.


I've told you, to understand spiritual matters, you have to be in tune with the spirit. Even the Bible says as much. Otherwise, it just wont click. Does that make any sense? [/B]

To disagree with me is fine - to disagree with my sources without apparently knowing much about my sources is an intresting way to conduct an argument. Have you read and understood any of the books I referenced? If you have, please accept my apologies. If you haven't, with respect, you have no right to criticize them.
What I am saying is that I am very well in tune with the spirit, as you call it. I am not arguing that you are not, btw.

To repeat my earlier question, I'd be genuinely interested to hear about your knowledge about the spiritual world with specific relevance to this discussion. I hope you'll find yourself willing to share your personal experiences and opinions.

[Zimphire]

Mas I don't have to read or know the sources. Their words tell me a lot. There reasonings do as well.

[Mastrap]

So, what do they tell you?

To repeat my earlier question, I'd be genuinely interested to hear about your knowledge about the spiritual world with specific relevance to this discussion. I hope you'll find yourself willing to share your personal experiences and opinions.

I am not trying to wind you up btw. As you can probably tell, this is a subject that is of genuine interest to me. I don't know many people who share your convictions so any clarification would be most welcome.

[Zimphire]

Mastrap if you are truely interested in what I believe as far as spiritual matters go, feel free to email me, or message me on AIM, username Zimphire. I will be more than willing to talk all you want.

[AKcrab]

Score:
Mastrap: 1
Zim: 0

Play ball!

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by AKcrab:
Score:
Mastrap: 1
Zim: 0

Play ball!

Is this supposed to be humorous?

Neither of us proved each others reasonings in any way. There was no way NO ONE could "win"

How silly.

[Mastrap]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Mastrap if you are truely interested in what I believe as far as spiritual matters go, feel free to email me, or message me on AIM, username Zimphire. I will be more than willing to talk all you want.

Thanks for the offer. I would like to keep this discussion public. I know that a couple of others are reading this with interest. Don't you feel comfortable discussing these issues in a public setting?

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Mastrap:
Thanks for the offer. I would like to keep this discussion public. I know that a couple of others are reading this with interest. Don't you feel comfortable discussing these issues in a public setting?

Obviously I feel more than comfortable talking about such things in public. I just question your motives. If it is just you truely wanting to know, then my options would suit you just fine. For some reason, I knew you'd not want to email or message me about it. Do you not want to know that bad? Do you see why I question your motives?

I am not so sure you want to continue, just because you want to know what I think on the matter. And if it's not for that reason, then there something trollish usually going on.

Thanks for not dissapointing me.

[Mastrap]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Obviously I feel more than comfortable talking about such things in public. I just question your motives. If it is just you truely wanting to know, then my options would suit you just fine. For some reason, I knew you'd not want to email or message me about it. Do you not want to know that bad? Do you see why I question your motives?

I am not so sure you want to continue, just because you want to know what I think on the matter. And if it's not for that reason, then there something trollish usually going on.

Thanks for not dissapointing me.

As I've told you before, I'd like to keep this discussion public. My reasons are that Lerk, boots, Thunderous Funker and others are reading and participating in this thread with interest.

I find your accusation of me being a troll both unfounded and bizarre. Where did I do anything to give you that impression? Please tell me, I'd like to know.

If you don't want to discuss these matters in public for whatever reason you just have to say - I respect that. If this is not the case I, and others, will be be looking forward to your reply.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Mastrap:
As I've told you before, I'd like to keep this discussion public. My reasons are that Lerk, boots, Thunderous Funker and others are reading and participating in this thread with interest.

That wasn't the reason you gave me Mastrap. You said YOU was interested. And now you are changing your story.

I find your accusation of me being a troll both unfounded and bizarre. Where did I do anything to give you that impression? Please tell me, I'd like to know.

I never called you a troll Mastrap. I said depending on the reason, there might be something trollish going on. You know, baiting?

If you don't want to discuss these matters in public for whatever reason you just have to say - I respect that. If this is not the case I, and others, will be be looking forward to your reply.

No, that isn't the case. I think my past speaks for itself. I have no problem talking about my faith. Again, I am just concerned with your motives. If you truely was just interested like you originally said, you'd have no problem messaging me on AIM. Would you?

Or were you not being sincere when you said that?

[Mastrap]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
That wasn't the reason you gave me Mastrap. You said YOU was interested. And now you are changing your story.
[/B]

I am not sure if you read all my posts. To quote myself:

Thanks for the offer. I would like to keep this discussion public. I know that a couple of others are reading this with interest.

So, no, I didn't change my motives.

Anyway, if you'd like to talk about this further I would welcome it. For the reasons given above (twice now) I would like to keep the conversation public. If you feel uncomfortable about that that's fine. Tell me and I will not bother you any further.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Mastrap:
I am not sure if you read all my posts. To quote myself:



So, no, I didn't change my motives.

No, what you originally said, what I responded to you with the email/AIM response was

To repeat my earlier question, I'd be genuinely interested to hear about your knowledge about the spiritual world with specific relevance to this discussion. I hope you'll find yourself willing to share your personal experiences and opinions.

And I said I would be MORE THAN willing. You can email me or msg me on AIM.

Anyway, if you'd like to talk about this further I would welcome it. For the reasons given above (twice now) I would like to keep the conversation public. If you feel uncomfortable about that that's fine. Tell me and I will not bother you any further.

It's not that I feel uncomfortable about it Mastrap. For one, I have been asked not to take bait anymore from one of the mods. Now you say you are truely interested, I say sure good deal, msg me, we will talk about it. But for some reason you want it kept in here. Telling me your main objective is because you want to honestly know how I feel, but er, only if you post it in the forum that is... says a lot to me.

[Mastrap]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
No, what you originally said, what I responded to you with the email/AIM response was

[/b]

And I said I would be MORE THAN willing. You can email me or msg me on AIM.



It's not that I feel uncomfortable about it Mastrap. For one, I have been asked not to take bait anymore from one of the mods. Now you say you are truely interested, I say sure good deal, msg me, we will talk about it. But for some reason you want it kept in here. Telling me your main objective is because you want to honestly know how I feel, but er, only if you post it in the forum that is... says a lot to me. [/B]

It looks like we have to agree to disagree here. I do not want to take this conversation private, for reasons given above.

I am finding it truelly bizarre that you are accusing me of baiting you. I have just read this thread again, trying to see if and where I did, I can't find any occurance. If you disagree please point me in the direction of my transgression.

I have asked you a very simple question which for some reason or other, that you haven't given, are unwilling to answer.

[Zimphire]

Mastrap the fact that you want me to answer your questions, BUT ONLY if it is in the lounge has me suspect.

How about we do this. Get everyone that wants to know about this, into a AIM room and talk about it. We will name it MacNNTongues That way, it will fill your desire, and mine too.

Deal?

[Mastrap]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Mastrap the fact that you want me to answer your questions, BUT ONLY if it is in the lounge has me suspect.

How about we do this. Get everyone that wants to know about this, into a AIM room and talk about it. We will name it MacNNTongues That way, it will fill your desire, and mine too.

Deal?

Neither Lerk, not TF, nor boots are online right now. If you're unwilling to discuss this issue in public, I think we should just drop it.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Mastrap:
Neither Lerk, not TF, nor boots are online right now. If you're unwilling to discuss this issue in public, I think we should just drop it.

No, I think I just called your bluff

We can set a time, for everyone to get together. That way we will all be online. This will fill your needs and wants on the matter. And it will mine too. Deal?

[Mastrap]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
No, I think I just called your bluff.

I am finding you constant personal attacks and accusations against me deeply disturbing.

I have treated you with nothing but fairness. I have repeatedly invited you to point out any potential transgression I might have commited and offered to make amends.

What it comes down to seems to be that you're unwilling to discuss this issue in a public place. That is, of course, your right.
Your reason for this appears to be that you're accusing me of misdemeanors I haven't commited.


Let's call this conversation finished.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Mastrap:
What it comes down to seems to be that you're unwilling to discuss this issue in a public place. That is, of course, your right.
Your reason for this appears to be that you're accusing me of misdemeanors I haven't commited.
Let's call this conversation finished.

No, what it comes down to is, the reasons you gave me aren't the real ones. As I was offering you a way to not only fullfill the desires you wanted, but mine also. It was a win win situation You gave me two different reasons as to why you wanted to know, The way I offered to tell you would have fullfilled BOTH.

It's setting off my "dishonest" alarm. Like you aren't being honest about why you want me to respond, or the way I offered would have been just fine. Because it covered the reasons you gave me.

Mastrap It's pretty obvious I am not shy about offering my opinion on the matter in public I mean my history speaks for itself. I am just questioning your motives, and from your reactions here, they are in question for good reason.

Get all offended you want, I think my reasonings are justified by you responses.

[Mastrap]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
No, what it comes down to is, the reasons you gave me aren't the real ones. As I was offering you a way to not only fullfill the desires you wanted, but mine also. It was a win win situation You gave me two different reasons as to why you wanted to know, The way I offered to tell you would have fullfilled BOTH.

It's setting off my "dishonest" alarm. Like you aren't being honest about why you want me to respond, or the way I offered would have been just fine. Because it covered the reasons you gave me.

Mastrap It's pretty obvious I am not shy about offering my opinion on the matter in public I mean my history speaks for itself. I am just questioning your motives, and from your reactions here, they are in question for good reason.

Get all offended you want, I think my reasonings are justified by you responses.

Your "dishonesty alarm" is going off? So, now you're calling me a liar?

What have my motives to do with you giving your opinion? I told you my motives. What gives you the right to question them?

[BlackGriffen]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
No, what it comes down to is, the reasons you gave me aren't the real ones. As I was offering you a way to not only fullfill the desires you wanted, but mine also. It was a win win situation You gave me two different reasons as to why you wanted to know, The way I offered to tell you would have fullfilled BOTH.

No, read it again. He gave you the reason he wanted to know, and he also gave you a reason why he wanted to keep it in the lounge. Two separate reasons for two separate things.

This is just you being hyper-defensive because, well, you've probably got good reason to be that way by now. What with all of the heated debates you've put yourself at the center of, you've become overly wary.

I, too, have been following the thread, though I've been less vocal because I didn't have anything new to contribute. I'll read with interest if you post anything, but it won't ruin my day if you clam up either.

BlackGriffen

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Mastrap:
Your "dishonesty alarm" is going off? So, now you're calling me a liar?

What have my motives to do with you giving your opinion? I told you my motives. What gives you the right to question them?

What gives me the right to question them? You told me what your motives was. I provided a way to fullfill them, AND fullifll mine at the same time. But you STILL didn't want to do it that way. So what is the reason? I was fullfilling your motives and desires you had on the subject in hand, yet you still rejected it. What is your motive of wanting it in the FORUM only?

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by BlackGriffen:
No, read it again. He gave you the reason he wanted to know, and he also gave you a reason why he wanted to keep it in the lounge. Two separate reasons for two separate things.

And I provided a way to fullfill those reasons he had, He still rejected it.

This is just you being hyper-defensive because, well, you've probably got good reason to be that way by now. What with all of the heated debates you've put yourself at the center of, you've become overly wary.

I don't believe I am being defensive. I have decent intuition. What could his reason be for it being in the forum only? Even when I gave him a way to fullfill what he wanted? If he was TRUELY interested in what I had to say, he would want to hear it no matter what. This tells me he really isn't THAT interested.

[Mastrap]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
What gives me the right to question them? You told me what your motives was. I provided a way to fullfill them, AND fullifll mine at the same time. But you STILL didn't want to do it that way. So what is the reason? I was fullfilling your motives and desires you had on the subject in hand, yet you still rejected it. What is your motive of wanting it in the FORUM only?

Zim, you keep on asking me questions while not answering any of mine. Do you consider this fair?

I don't. In your last post you effectively called me a liar. You have neither apologized for nor retracted your statement.

I've given you my reasons why I want to keep this in the lounge. There are several people I know off who are interested in reading this. Probably even more who are lurking. One of the things I like about forums is that they allow me to think before typing, making for a better discussion. I don't often use AIM apart from for chatting with friends.

I've also told you that I'd respect it if you'd decide not to discuss this any further here. All you have to do is tell me.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Mastrap:
Zim, you keep on asking me questions while not answering any of mine. Do you consider this fair?

When except for this last time have I not answered you Mastrap?

I don't. In your last post you effectively called me a liar. You have neither apologized for nor retracted your statement.

I said I suspect what you said was dishonest. My alarm was going off, I never said you WAS lying. I mean you could be telling the truth for all I know, it's just not making sense.

I've given you my reasons why I want to keep this in the lounge. There are several people I know off who are interested in reading this. Probably even more who are lurking. One of the things I like about forums is that they allow me to think before typing, making for a better discussion. I don't often use AIM apart from for chatting with friends.

And as I said, anyone that wanted to join could. I think before I type in AIM, I don't know about you. BTW this is reason #3, how many more are there going to be?

I've also told you that I'd respect it if you'd decide not to discuss this any further here. All you have to do is tell me.

And I told you, I will discuss it with you ALL you want. If you are SO eager to know how I feel about the matter, then what is the problem? You know, if I wanted to pick someone's brain, and they offered me a chance to, I would take any chance I got. That is, if I really wanted to know what they thought. Otherwise, I'd not bother. My point is, you obviously don't really care too much about how I feel on the matter, or you'd have been messaging me on AIM by now.

[Zimphire]

BTW Mastrap, just so you know, I am not the only one that thinks something is fishy, I had gotten a pvt message when you kept asking me to do it in the lounge, to not take your bait. I guess there are more paranoid people in this forum than I.

[BlackGriffen]

If he were as dishonest as you portray him, Zim, he would have accepted your intial offer, logged the conversation, and posted it to the lounge anyway.

"Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." You should have a little more faith in people (though admittedly not much), and you'll find that people are usually willing to reciprocate.

BlackGriffen

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by BlackGriffen:
If he were as dishonest as you portray him, Zim, he would have accepted your intial offer, logged the conversation, and posted it to the lounge anyway.

No, then there would be no doubt as to the troll. Too obvious. Again, if he was so curious as to what I thought, or was honestly interested, he would have messaged me.

"Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." You should have a little more faith in people (though admittedly not much), and you'll find that people are usually willing to reciprocate.

BlackGriffen

I have faith in people, somewhat, I know man doesn't have the best track record. I have in the past, learned that trusting your intuition usually pays off as well. You also don't know what has been said to me behind the scenes about this matter, and things like it.

[Mastrap]

I can't see what all the fuss is about.

I was interested in a conversation about glossolalia in this forum, not in proving to Zim that I am not a liar or have any obscure motives re. this discussion.
I consider the request to take the conversation out of the context of this thread truly strange. I consider Zim's personal attacks against me even more strange.

The thread is derailed enough as it is, I am bowing out until anybody has anything relevant to say.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Mastrap:
I can't see what all the fuss is about.

That is what I am wondering,

I was interested in a conversation about glossolalia in this forum, not in proving to Zim that I am not a liar or have any obscure motives re. this discussion.
I consider the request to take the conversation out of the context of this thread truly strange. I consider Zim's personal attacks against me even more strange.

The thread is derailed enough as it is, I am bowing out until anybody has anything relevant to say.

No, you said you was interested ONLY if it took place in the lounge. Which makes me think, you really aren't that interested at all.

[Lerkfish]

I will probably live to regret this, but here goes....

If I may, allow me to comment on the Mastrap/Zim exchange with hopefully something enlightening that both sides can take away which may help to smooth things over (or not). Admittedly, I'm going to be making assumptions here which may be flat wrong concerning either of your POV, but please accept it as an attempt to approach harmony rather than discord.


ON ZIM'S SIDE.

I don't know zim's particular denomination, but just gleaning from conversations I'd place it fairly close to a congregation I attended while at college. In light of that understanding, let me address Mastrap's question as I understand it:

It would be difficult to quantify exactly how the spirit speaks to those who consider they have been spoken to by the spirit. To some, its a still small voice, to others, its "slaying in the spirit" where their entire body locks up while they are receiving information. I won't get sidetracked into which is more or less valid, just saying there is a range of what people consider communication from the Holy Spirit.
Also, full gospel churches are content with unsolved mysteries, and accept them as a valid phenomenon without needing to investigate them much further. In fact, that might be misconstrued as blaspheming the Holy Spirit to call anything into question concerning it (depending on the individual congregation attitudes) So, therefore, it might be hard for zim to give Mastrap any kind of answer that he would find satisfactory.
This does NOT necessarily mean, though, that zim is prevaricating or avoiding the issue or stonewalling or whatever. It might just be he is answering as honestly and as forthrightly as he can, within the framework of he can understand or is willing to allow himself to investigate. I say this with no disrespect.
Likewise, when Zim says that knowledge from the spirit cannot necessarily be understood or accepted by an empirical mind, he is not only correct, but biblically sourced in saying so. This is also no disrespect to the empirical mind. An analogy might help: in that the empirical mind might have a USB port and the spiritual source might be firewire. It looks like it might fit, but no matter how you jam it in, it aint gonna work. It won't work until the empirical mind adds on a firewire port, or the source transmits on USB.

ON MASTRAP'S SIDE:

Mastrap is correct the he has done nothing but ask questions in a calm and respectful manner. However, in light of the above, there are certain questions or framing of certain questions that are going to run headlong into the differences between you in such a way as to reach an impasse. Mastrap wants to know a definitive answer in an empirical language so that he can understand the answer. Zim is answering, but not with Mastrap's parameters. Therefore, to Mastrap, it seems he is beating his head against the wall, and to Zim, it appears Mastrap is trolling in his repeated attempts to get an empirical answer, or one that he can be satisfied with.

The reality is that to a certain extent, Mastrap's questions are difficult to answer, by anyone. And to a certain extent, zim is going to be hard pressed to even view the question in the respectful tone it was offered because of an inclination to chafe at the parameters of the question.

I would find it difficult to answer what is the empirical or seminal basis for the spiritual communication zim (or anyone) considers messages from the Holy Spirit.
I personally have heard a small, still voice that could not have come from me, that directed me in a positive direction at a moment of crisis or decision. I consider it to have been spiritually generated, but if you asked me how it manifested itself or asked me to prove it or describe it, I'd have a very hard time. I can say that I was praying, and that everything became very still, and that the voice said an enlightening thing that cut through my dilemma like a hot knife through butter. Yet I could not prove that to you, nor could I reasonably expect you to understand it.

well....perhaps I've done nothing but muddy the waters further here...but I think you two were speaking past each other a bit and that ego(s) got too involved, or perceived offense too blinding for each other to see what seemed apparent to me from the outside.

[Zimphire]

You are right Lerk, I don't have all the answers. And yes I agree with most of your post. I think this is a very spiritual issue, and I didn't want it to turn into a flame fest. Usually I find such topics in here easily turn into that. And recently, I was asked by a MacNN mod, to avoid such things in the lounge, hence the reason I was trying to get it OUT of the lounge.

[Mastrap]

Originally posted by Lerkfish:
I will probably live to regret this, but here goes....

Thank you Lerk. Oil on troubled waters and all that, you're right.

I do have a tendency to get involved with a question, especially if I get the feeling that the question asked is being dodged. Blame my school for this, we were rather trained to not ever accept what could be considered a side tracking of the issue at hand. Zim's refusal to discuss a very inoffensive subject in the Lounge struck, and still strikes, me as bizarre especially as he doesn't give any reasons for his request.

My interest in glossolalia stems from an interest in communication between man and God. Before I even started to turn to Buddhism for my personal expression of spirituality I studied religious philosophy (as well as fine art). One of the more interesting subjects we examined in that course was the connection between the various religions on this planet and the semantics of their expression. My professor was a Jesuit priest who encouraged us to think and research for ourselves. To this day I highly respect that man.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Mastrap:
Zim's refusal to discuss a very inoffensive subject in the Lounge struck, and still strikes, me as bizarre especially as he doesn't give any reasons for his request.

Read above.

[Lerkfish]

Originally posted by Mastrap:
Thank you Lerk. Oil on troubled waters and all that, you're right.

I do have a tendency to get involved with a question, especially if I get the feeling that the question asked is being dodged. Blame my school for this, we were rather trained to not ever accept what could be considered a side tracking of the issue at hand. Zim's refusal to discuss a very inoffensive subject in the Lounge struck, and still strikes, me as bizarre especially as he doesn't give any reasons for his request.

My interest in glossolalia stems from an interest in communication between man and God. Before I even started to turn to Buddhism for my personal expression of spirituality I studied religious philosophy (as well as fine art). One of the more interesting subjects we examined in that course was the connection between the various religions on this planet and the semantics of their expression. My professor was a Jesuit priest who encouraged us to think and research for ourselves. To this day I highly respect that man.

well, I would say that one man's "inoffensive" is another man's "offensive" I think you are both right, just coming at it from different POVs.

[Mastrap]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Read above.

Well, why didn't you just say so? It's a fair point and gladly accepted.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Mastrap:
Well, why didn't you just say so? It's a fair point and gladly accepted.

I didn't want to say "I am just doing this because I was told to"

And that was only partly the reason. I didn't want to cheapen it through the lounge's sarcastic silliness.

That and I was curious as to why you wanted it lounge only.