Welcome to the MacNN Forums.

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

You are here: MacNN Forums > Hardware - Troubleshooting and Discussion > Mac Notebooks > sd card slot...why?

sd card slot...why? (Page 2)
Thread Tools
ginoledesma
Mac Elite
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 10, 2009, 09:34 PM
 
Originally Posted by schalliol View Post
The thing is that pros usually have CompactFlash cards, like if you have a Canon 5D MkII or something like that. I thought only consumer cameras used SD, but that might not be the case.
With Sony adopting microSD in the near future, this should make the SD card slot a little more useful, although I agree having an EC slot would mean more flexibility.

The inclusion of the SD card slot makes me think: Time Machine backup (not a good idea for stolen property, obviously), or something similar to Vista's ReadyBoost.
     
CharlesS
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Dec 2000
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 10, 2009, 10:31 PM
 
Originally Posted by amazing View Post
if the main things the expresscard slot is good for is as a card reader or a 3G card
But it's not. ExpressCard can be used for an amazing variety of things, including storage standards such as eSATA, FireWire (for a second FW bus, or to upgrade to future versions of the standard), or USB (ditto), but also including such things as upgrading to future versions of wireless standards, adding high-end sound cards, and even external GPUs (on the PC side, anyway). They can also be used to hook up solid-state drives directly to the laptop, and do plenty of other things I haven't thought of, because ExpressCard is pretty much the most versatile connection that there is for a laptop. Anything that can be connected to a laptop, probably can be connected via an ExpressCard.

Ticking sound coming from a .pkg package? Don't let the .bom go off! Inspect it first with Pacifist. Macworld - five mice!
     
amazing
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jan 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 12:08 AM
 
Originally Posted by CharlesS View Post
Anything that can be connected to a laptop, probably can be connected via an ExpressCard.
provided they work, which my eSATA cards don't.
     
Cold Warrior
Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Polwaristan
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 01:21 AM
 
Originally Posted by mduell View Post
Can I use SDIO (Secure Digital Input Output) cards?

No.
Apple's answer is abrupt but could this be enabled via a firmware update?
     
ginoledesma
Mac Elite
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 02:22 AM
 
Originally Posted by Cold Warrior View Post
Apple's answer is abrupt but could this be enabled via a firmware update?
Given that Apple seems to have gone out of their way and explicitly mention that SDIO cards will not be recognized, then the slot itself is just SD (which they advertise it as), as opposed to being SDIO (which can take either SDIO/SD devices).
     
Spheric Harlot
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: 888500128, C3, 2nd soft.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 02:40 AM
 
Originally Posted by amazing View Post
provided they work, which my eSATA cards don't.
Get one that works.

FirmTek, for example, works fine.

Having bought crap hardly disqualifies the standard as a whole.
     
Spheric Harlot
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: 888500128, C3, 2nd soft.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 02:48 AM
 
Originally Posted by amazing View Post
I think the reason the expresscard slot went away is that Apple noticed how flaky it is with eSATA. There are tons of reports of kernel panics, all of which match my own bad experiences with eSATA expresscards.
There are tons of crappy cards.

There are also plenty of cards that will slip out of the slot far too easily - though this appears to have improved with the unibody machines.

Originally Posted by amazing View Post
So, from Apple's viewpoint, if the main things the expresscard slot is good for is as a card reader or a 3G card, why not just dedicate that space to a card reader--and save some space that can be used for firewire 800? After all, people can always use a 3G USB interface. And everyone's been bugging Apple about a card reader, and they're cropping up on lots of the competition.
As posted above, an SD card reader and a 3G modem is something *most* people might be using it for, but *either* of those can be handled via USB (as is, in fact, the internal SD slot), meaning that MOST people don't need a slot at all.

The "Pro" is NOT about "MOST" people. It's about ****ing professionals making their ****ing living off these machines, and having five-figure sums invested in a standard that isn't obsolete by anybody's measure except Apple's.

It's the whole no-Firewire-in-the-13"-MacBook debacle all over *again*.

Exact same situation, except with fewer people with less time to fight about the subject on internet forums.
And no excuses to be made about market positioning. It's Apple that insists on calling the damn things "Pro".

Originally Posted by amazing View Post
One other real question is why Apple didn't put in a dedicated eSATA port--that would've been real handy.
eSATA won't come to Apple machines as a standard until it supports bus power - the standard has approved a powered connector, but nobody's using it yet.
     
Simon
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: in front of my Mac
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 03:32 AM
 
Originally Posted by amazing View Post
I think the reason the expresscard slot went away is that Apple noticed how flaky it is with eSATA.
I don't buy any of that.

If that had truly been Apple's concern they could have fixed it. Either improve the kernel extensions, supply drivers or support the companies developing them, or actually sell the card themselves, like you know, their USB modems.

There would have been ample ways to fix issues with 'flaky' eSATA via EC.

Apple dropped EC because they though they thought they could drop it and get away with it. The rest of the industry OTOH hasn't and isn't dropping it.
( Last edited by Simon; Jun 11, 2009 at 03:59 AM. )
     
Simon
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: in front of my Mac
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 03:36 AM
 
Originally Posted by olePigeon View Post
I think I'd rather have seen one more USB port instead, just let people use a dongle.
Absolutely. A built-in SD slot is superfluous. If indeed they ended up with extra space and didn't want to use that to increase battery size even more they could have at least used the space for something versatile. Like an extra USB port. Instead they add something three people asked for.

As I said earlier, they fixed a problem that never existed in the first place.

Any bets on how many generations the SD slot will remain there?
     
Simon
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: in front of my Mac
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 03:39 AM
 
Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot View Post
eSATA won't come to Apple machines as a standard until it supports bus power - the standard has approved a powered connector, but nobody's using it yet.
IOW it might just never arrive. By the time bus-powered eSATA becomes prevalent, USB3 will have become ubiquitous.

It would be just so Apple to point at USB3's theoretical bandwidth and claim that that's more than enough for any external disk (while of course neglecting the bridge/performance and cost issue).
     
Spheric Harlot
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: 888500128, C3, 2nd soft.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 03:45 AM
 
Originally Posted by Simon View Post
IOW it might just never arrive. By the time bus-powered eSATA becomes prevalent, USB3 will have become ubiquitous.

It would be just so Apple to point at USB3's theoretical bandwidth and claim that that's more than enough for any external disk (while of course neglecting the bridge/performance and cost issue).
Actually, they would be right to focus on USB3 - simply because USB is actually a versatile and useful protocol. It's not a *good* protocol, but it is versatile, and might be a lot more useful come version 3.0.

eSATA is for storage. Period. End of Story.
     
Simon
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: in front of my Mac
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 03:50 AM
 
Umm, storage is what I was talking about.

Even if USB3 reaches 400 MB/s real-world throughput it still won't necessarily be the ideal bus for external storage. And eSATA might still be desirable. And if that's the situation we actually arrive at, I won't be the least bit surprised if Apple goes USB-only.
     
Pierre B.
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 04:06 AM
 
Good points raised here. Of course an SD slot is not a replacement for an EC one. The former is just storage (which can be used as external boot volume, very nice and handy), but the latter is expansion and superset of the former. So, in the case of the 15" model we talk about downgrade actually. This is clear.

But the 13" model is another story. No mac portable of this size since the iBook era ever had a slot of any kind other than the optical one. So, in this case the SD slot is more than welcome and it fits well the size of the computer.
     
P
Moderator
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Gothenburg, Sweden
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 07:38 AM
 
Are there any technical advantages to CF cards? I know SD is smaller, and that's nice for compacts, but why do high-end cameras stay CF still? It seems that everything up to and including mid-range DSLRs are SD, and the top of the line support both, but there's a segment inbetween that is ruled by CF. Why?
The new Mac Pro has up to 30 MB of cache inside the processor itself. That's more than the HD in my first Mac. Somehow I'm still running out of space.
     
jokell82
Professional Poster
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Hampton Roads, VA
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 09:29 AM
 
Originally Posted by Simon View Post
I don't buy any of that.

If that had truly been Apple's concern they could have fixed it. Either improve the kernel extensions, supply drivers or support the companies developing them, or actually sell the card themselves, like you know, their USB modems.

There would have been ample ways to fix issues with 'flaky' eSATA via EC.

Apple dropped EC because they though they thought they could drop it and get away with it. The rest of the industry OTOH hasn't and isn't dropping it.
Phil actually mentioned a number in the keynote about how many people actually used the EC slot. It was less than 1% (and I think it may have been less than .5%, but I can't remember nor watch the video at work). My guess is that Apple weighed how many people used it (not many) vs. how many people would use an SD slot. I have a feeling the latter is a much higher percentage.

All glory to the hypnotoad.
     
turtle777
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: planning a comeback !
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 09:56 AM
 
Originally Posted by jokell82 View Post
Phil actually mentioned a number in the keynote about how many people actually used the EC slot. It was less than 1% (and I think it may have been less than .5%, but I can't remember nor watch the video at work). My guess is that Apple weighed how many people used it (not many) vs. how many people would use an SD slot. I have a feeling the latter is a much higher percentage.
Bah, lies, damn lies and statistics.

How many people have used SD card readers ? 0.03% ?

-t
     
turtle777
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: planning a comeback !
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 09:57 AM
 
For me, the question is this: IF Apple had included a CF card slot, would that have made the 15" MBP significantly more expensive ?

I'm certain it would have added cost to the BOM, but how much ?
How much premium would people have been willing to pay ? $30 ? $50 ? $100 ?

-t
     
Spheric Harlot
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: 888500128, C3, 2nd soft.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 10:10 AM
 
Originally Posted by Simon View Post
Umm, storage is what I was talking about.

Even if USB3 reaches 400 MB/s real-world throughput it still won't necessarily be the ideal bus for external storage. And eSATA might still be desirable. And if that's the situation we actually arrive at, I won't be the least bit surprised if Apple goes USB-only.
The point is that plain storage is nice, but there are FAR more important uses for EC slots beyond storage, for which there is simply no replacement other than EC 2.0, which is in the wings.
     
Pierre B.
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 10:13 AM
 
Originally Posted by turtle777 View Post
Bah, lies, damn lies and statistics.

How many people have used SD card readers ? 0.03% ?

-t
Statistics can be sometimes subtle to play with, but judging from the new MBP review in this PC-centric site, and in particular from the comments on the SD slot, I would think otherwise.
     
jokell82
Professional Poster
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Hampton Roads, VA
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 10:34 AM
 
Originally Posted by turtle777 View Post
Bah, lies, damn lies and statistics.

How many people have used SD card readers ? 0.03% ?

-t
Depends on the market. A better question would be how many MacBook Pro owners (or potential owners) also own a camera or other device that uses an SD card.

I guarantee that number is much higher than the EC users.

Also, I completely agree that adding an SD slot and removing the EC slot is not in keeping with the "Pro" part of the name. However I also think that the trend in sales for Apple is that the type of people buying the MBP is no longer just the professional market, and Apple needs to make sure that the majority of their users are satisfied, not cater to the tiny percentages.

All glory to the hypnotoad.
     
mduell
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Houston, TX
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 02:34 PM
 
Originally Posted by P View Post
Are there any technical advantages to CF cards? I know SD is smaller, and that's nice for compacts, but why do high-end cameras stay CF still? It seems that everything up to and including mid-range DSLRs are SD, and the top of the line support both, but there's a segment inbetween that is ruled by CF. Why?
Legacy.

And a bit of performance; I don't think you can get 45MBps SD* cards.
     
Spheric Harlot
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: 888500128, C3, 2nd soft.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 02:44 PM
 
Originally Posted by jokell82 View Post
Also, I completely agree that adding an SD slot and removing the EC slot is not in keeping with the "Pro" part of the name. However I also think that the trend in sales for Apple is that the type of people buying the MBP is no longer just the professional market, and Apple needs to make sure that the majority of their users are satisfied, not cater to the tiny percentages.
I agree that this is what Apple is doing.

I disagree that this is what Apple *should* be doing (from my industry's point of view). It's probably sensible market politics from their point of view.

But the problem is that actual "pros" who depend on ExpressCard in many cases do not have the option of switching to something else except at severe cost or performance penalty, which they now sacrifice for the convenience of the non-pro market.

And that, simply, sucks donkey balls.


For the record: Personaly, I'm way, way stoked, since I *much* prefer a 13" 'Book, absolutely require Firewire, and am not invested into ExpressCard expansion. The new 13" MacBooks are as close to perfection for my needs as I'm likely to ever get. But my friend who has thousands of dollars into external DSP and a Magma expansion chassis was dismayed and rushed, in panic, to buy the very last 2.66 GHz 15" MacBook with ExpressCard the local store still had in stock.
     
turtle777
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: planning a comeback !
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 02:55 PM
 
Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot View Post
But my friend who has thousands of dollars into external DSP and a Magma expansion chassis was dismayed and rushed, in panic, to buy the very last 2.66 GHz 15" MacBook with ExpressCard the local store still had in stock.
How much was the price difference between the old MBP 15" and the new MBP 17" ?

-t
     
CharlesS
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Dec 2000
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 03:09 PM
 
Since there have reportedly been $400-$500 discounts on the old models, probably about a grand.

Ticking sound coming from a .pkg package? Don't let the .bom go off! Inspect it first with Pacifist. Macworld - five mice!
     
Spheric Harlot
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: 888500128, C3, 2nd soft.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 03:24 PM
 
Originally Posted by turtle777 View Post
How much was the price difference between the old MBP 15" and the new MBP 17" ?
€700.
Which is not quite fair, since the old model was *heavily* discounted (€650!), and he could have got the lower-end one at €900 less than the price of the current 17".

You do make a good point about the 17" price having come down €200, but that still puts a €500 premium over what you *used to* have to pay for the cheapest Mac with an ExpressCard slot.

More importantly, though, the 17" MacBook Pro is simply out of the question. He needs a portable machine for touring that will also take his Magma expansion when needed. There is no really feasible way to take a 17" MacBook on tour unless it's a dedicated (i.e. second) machine that travels in the pelican case with the gear, rather than in your backpack.

He is, from what I've seen, pretty representative of much of the audio engineering industry in that regard.
     
Salty
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Winnipeg, MB
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 04:08 PM
 
This is why Apple should come out with a NOT thin laptop that rules the roost performance wise. Uses the highest end Intel chips, highest end graphics cards, costs a boat load, has 7200RPM HDs, perhaps even a bay where you can install another battery or a hard drive, where Battery life is considered but not paramount, that has a blue ray drive and everything else people bitch about. Make it an inch and a half thick, and put out an optional ruberized case for it.
     
Spheric Harlot
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: 888500128, C3, 2nd soft.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 04:49 PM
 


*sigh*
     
jokell82
Professional Poster
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Hampton Roads, VA
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 08:15 PM
 
Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot View Post
€700.
Which is not quite fair, since the old model was *heavily* discounted (€650!), and he could have got the lower-end one at €900 less than the price of the current 17".

You do make a good point about the 17" price having come down €200, but that still puts a €500 premium over what you *used to* have to pay for the cheapest Mac with an ExpressCard slot.

More importantly, though, the 17" MacBook Pro is simply out of the question. He needs a portable machine for touring that will also take his Magma expansion when needed. There is no really feasible way to take a 17" MacBook on tour unless it's a dedicated (i.e. second) machine that travels in the pelican case with the gear, rather than in your backpack.

He is, from what I've seen, pretty representative of much of the audio engineering industry in that regard.
I agree that the 15" is the best form factor for the road, but a 17" is hardly impossible. I no longer tour full time, but I have a friend on the road right now who tours with a 17" in his backpack with no problems.

All glory to the hypnotoad.
     
Eug
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Caught in a web of deceit.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 11:14 PM
 
So, Class 6 SD is probably sufficient (minimum 6 MB/s, but often much higher), but does the Apple slot support Class 10?

Anyways, I am kinda disappointed not having Compact Flash support. It would have been nice to have both a CF slot and an SD slot.

Note also SD --> CF converters exist. Unfortunately, you can't do the reverse (at least not practically).
     
turtle777
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: planning a comeback !
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 11, 2009, 11:28 PM
 
Originally Posted by Eug View Post
Note also SD --> CF converters exist. Unfortunately, you can't do the reverse (at least not practically).
Well, if we talk about converters, Express Card could do both and more.

I'm just glad we got FW back, I could care less about SD.

-t
     
amazing
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jan 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 12, 2009, 12:46 AM
 
One thing we can say about the new models is that Apple responded quite quickly to the market. They brought prices down with the new models, replaced a feature like expresscard with a SD slot that would appeal to a higher percentage of users, and brought back another feature, firewire, whose absence had generated a substantial amount of protest.

Given how long it's taken Apple in the past to change models, that's a pretty good thing.
     
Simon
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: in front of my Mac
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 12, 2009, 02:48 AM
 
I agree with you that it's good they reacted to the economic situation. But IMHO it actually took them quite a while to do so. Remember the iMac and MP intros not so long ago? They actually jacked up prices at that time. We're talking March here.

Even though that was already smack in the middle of the crisis it took them another three months to figure out that prices have to come down or at the very least not go up. I know technical changes usually can't be made at the last minute, but final pricing is not something that needs to be decided on six months in advance.
( Last edited by Simon; Jun 12, 2009 at 03:20 AM. Reason: typo)
     
Big Mac
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Los Angeles
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 12, 2009, 02:53 AM
 
^^ Completely right. Apple has been raising prices rather than lowering them prior to WWDC and has been slow to respond to economic conditions. I think Laptop Hunters is to thank for this more competitive pricing, and I hope it's followed up by Desktop Hunters.

"The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield and government to gain ground." TJ
     
Simon
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: in front of my Mac
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 12, 2009, 03:24 AM
 
I'm really wondering if Laptop Hunters was more powerful than everybody thought. The economic situation was known to Apple long before LH and they had ample time to react but they didn't. Only now -- after LH -- we finally see them budge. I guess we'll never know what eventually made their blood pressure go up.
     
freudling
Banned
Join Date: Mar 2005
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 12, 2009, 03:32 AM
 
I have used the ExpressCard Slot! For example, I have a Vodafone 3G EC modem that worked great with my MacBook Pro. Yes, I can tether my iPhone, but when I am abroad, I just use local sims in x countries and buy pay as you go with my EC. It would be cumbersome to have to swap out the sim in my iPhone every time I wanted to connect to the 3G network with my computer....
     
Spheric Harlot
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: 888500128, C3, 2nd soft.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 12, 2009, 03:38 AM
 
Bad example, though.

     
Spheric Harlot
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: 888500128, C3, 2nd soft.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 12, 2009, 03:40 AM
 
Originally Posted by Simon View Post
I'm really wondering if Laptop Hunters was more powerful than everybody thought. The economic situation was known to Apple long before LH and they had ample time to react but they didn't. Only now -- after LH -- we finally see them budge. I guess we'll never know what eventually made their blood pressure go up.
I seriously doubt that Laptop Hunters had anything to do with the new generation of MacBooks and their pricing.
     
iampivot
Junior Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 12, 2009, 05:26 AM
 
Here's another theory; What if the SD slot is a signal of things to come?

It's not hard to see that SD sticks easily stores more data than both CDROMs and DVDs, even double layer DVDs. Maybe Apple is coming out with a tablet that doesn't have any optical drive in it?

It's not hard to see that in the future you might want a MBP without any optical drive. How often do you use yours? I use mine about once a month, yet I still have to carry it with me whenever I move my MBP around.

It's easily the largest component inside, and removing it would be natural in the long run.
     
Spheric Harlot
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: 888500128, C3, 2nd soft.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 12, 2009, 06:05 AM
 
Originally Posted by iampivot View Post
Here's another theory; What if the SD slot is a signal of things to come?

It's not hard to see that SD sticks easily stores more data than both CDROMs and DVDs, even double layer DVDs. Maybe Apple is coming out with a tablet that doesn't have any optical drive in it?

It's not hard to see that in the future you might want a MBP without any optical drive. How often do you use yours? I use mine about once a month, yet I still have to carry it with me whenever I move my MBP around.
You're forgetting the "P" of the "MBP".

I use the drive daily.

It'll be years before I won't need to read and write optical media on the road.
     
iampivot
Junior Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 12, 2009, 06:11 AM
 
Maybe a poll is in order.
     
Spheric Harlot
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: 888500128, C3, 2nd soft.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 12, 2009, 06:21 AM
 
Do you really care?
     
Andy8
Mac Elite
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hong Kong
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 12, 2009, 06:42 AM
 
It is a shame that the MB Air does not have an SD slot.
     
Pierre B.
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 12, 2009, 09:50 AM
 
Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot View Post
You're forgetting the "P" of the "MBP".

I use the drive daily.

It'll be years before I won't need to read and write optical media on the road.
Daily use of optical drive is rather the exception than the rule. I believe that for some professionals it is a necessity. But this is the consequence of the fact that the vast majority of many types of data/software/content is distributed through optical media. Although we cannot know beforehand, I see no reason for this to continue when the price of SD cards (or whatever cards use that kind of storage technology) becomes sufficiently low.
     
Spheric Harlot
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: 888500128, C3, 2nd soft.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 12, 2009, 10:21 AM
 
Universality is an issue.

I work in audio. None of the people I work with has an SD card reader. SD card is utterly worthless to me, except as a quick recovery boot disk with DiskWarrior or such.

What's not done on optical media is either done on external hard drives or USB sticks.
     
turtle777
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: planning a comeback !
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 12, 2009, 11:22 AM
 
Originally Posted by iampivot View Post
It's not hard to see that SD sticks easily stores more data than both CDROMs and DVDs, even double layer DVDs. Maybe Apple is coming out with a tablet that doesn't have any optical drive in it?

It's not hard to see that in the future you might want a MBP without any optical drive. How often do you use yours? I use mine about once a month, yet I still have to carry it with me whenever I move my MBP around.
I think this is a very good point.

5-10 years from now, who will still use physical media ?

* Audio CDs - nobody, all digital downloads
* DVDs - probably not, digital downloads or smaller memory media
* software CDs - again, probably not, digital downloads or smaller memory media

Spheric, it's like asking musicians 10 years ago if they could live w/o minidisk. The answer would have been no. Nevertheless, MD died. And so will CD and DVD.

-t
     
amazing
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jan 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 12, 2009, 11:45 AM
 
Books were supposed to be dead long ago. They're not dead. Question is whether optical disks are more like books. I think the answer is yes: at least for now. Optical disks convey music and movies to a lot more devices than just computers--that market will drive optical disk retention for quite some time.
     
turtle777
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: planning a comeback !
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 12, 2009, 11:50 AM
 
Originally Posted by amazing View Post
Books were supposed to be dead long ago. They're not dead. Question is whether optical disks are more like books. I think the answer is yes: at least for now. Optical disks convey music and movies to a lot more devices than just computers--that market will drive optical disk retention for quite some time.
I think this is a really bad comparison.

With books, the media is at the same time the viewer.
That's completely different with music and video, where the media is independent from the viewer (iPod, laptop, TV).

-t
     
Spheric Harlot
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: 888500128, C3, 2nd soft.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 12, 2009, 11:53 AM
 
Originally Posted by turtle777 View Post
Spheric, it's like asking musicians 10 years ago if they could live w/o minidisk. The answer would have been no. Nevertheless, MD died. And so will CD and DVD.
If you're really talking about ten years down the line, you're very likely right.

But the MacBook Pro (such as it might still exist) of ten years in the future will probably be a completely different animal from today's machines in many surprising ways.
     
turtle777
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: planning a comeback !
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 12, 2009, 11:58 AM
 
Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot View Post
But the MacBook Pro (such as it might still exist) of ten years in the future will probably be a completely different animal from today's machines in many surprising ways.
I agree, but let's not forget that Apple sometimes really is waaayyy ahead of everyone else.

Remember the original iMac, introduced 11 years ago w/o a floppy (*gasp*).
Well, you heard al those people whine, complain, belittle Apple for the decision.

It is possible that Apple once again took a look into the future.

-t
     
thibaulthalpern
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Feb 2008
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 12, 2009, 11:58 AM
 
Originally Posted by amazing View Post
Apple removed firewire on the MB and that was progress.

Apple restores firewire on the 13" MBP and that's now the "new" progress.

Think "Mobius-strip-progress" and you'll be OK.

Alternatively, just call it the MacBook Semi-Pro. It's only because you're fixated on the "Pro" expectation that you're bothered. Once you think of it as "Semi-Pro", what's to complain about?
*LOL* This is so funny. I love your insight MacBook Semi-Pro...guffaw!
     
 
Thread Tools
 
Forum Links
Forum Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Top
Privacy Policy
All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:58 PM.
All contents of these forums © 1995-2017 MacNN. All rights reserved.
Branding + Design: www.gesamtbild.com
vBulletin v.3.8.8 © 2000-2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.,