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You are here: MacNN Forums > Community > MacNN Lounge > Halo 2 on Legendary = HARD

Halo 2 on Legendary = HARD
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UNTeMac
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Dec 21, 2004, 03:49 AM
 
Oh my god....hardest game ever. I used to love trouncing elites with ease in the original Halo on Legendary but Halo 2 is harder times ten. I can't believe how careful and near-perfect you have to be just to advance a checkpoint. I'm still stuck on one of the hangars in the initial mission. Anyone else overwhelmed?
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Dec 21, 2004, 03:52 AM
 
I find normal rather challenging towards the end.
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Luca Rescigno
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Dec 21, 2004, 03:54 AM
 
Hell, I tried playing it on Heroic and could only get just past the first section of the second level in a few hours. I have to try Legendary, but I'll probably try to beat it on Heroic first. That'll take a while but I do have Christmas break now.

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UNTeMac  (op)
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Dec 21, 2004, 03:56 AM
 
Playing for an hour or so on Legendary makes Heroic look like a walk in the park for the first few levels. It's good practice.
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entrox
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Dec 21, 2004, 07:14 AM
 
Most modern computer/console games are way too easy IMHO. It's good to hear that there are some which actually pose a challenge.

I've been playing DoDonPachi for a few months and I still can't beat it with one credit.
     
jcadam
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Dec 21, 2004, 08:43 AM
 
Originally posted by entrox:
Most modern computer/console games are way too easy IMHO. It's good to hear that there are some which actually pose a challenge.

I've been playing DoDonPachi for a few months and I still can't beat it with one credit.
Yes, but is it the right kind of harder?

What I mean is, does the computer increase the difficulty by increasing the quantity of bad guys, or the # of shots needed to take one down (wrong way), or it does it actually increase the quality of the AI (right way).

Most FPS become easy once you figure out how the (usually simplistic) AI operates (i.e., patterns)
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entrox
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Dec 21, 2004, 10:00 AM
 
Originally posted by jcadam:
Yes, but is it the right kind of harder?
Dunno, I haven't played Halo 2

What I mean is, does the computer increase the difficulty by increasing the quantity of bad guys, or the # of shots needed to take one down (wrong way), or it does it actually increase the quality of the AI (right way).
Having a better AI is certainly more attractive, but it is the most difficult option by far. You want baddies to become 'smarter' as the difficulty increases and not just let them aim better (e.g. Xaero in Quake 3 on nightmare). But if you've managed to pull that off, you certainly don't want to waste that effort by only having smart enemies on the higher skill settings.

Most FPS become easy once you figure out how the (usually simplistic) AI operates (i.e., patterns)
Perhaps that's true for FPSs, but games like Radiant Silvergun or DoDonPachi are all about patterns and they're challenging no matter what. I know every enemy in the first few levels, but I still die occasionally. It's fun trying to top your previous high-score
     
Ghoser777
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Dec 21, 2004, 10:30 AM
 
I can slowly beat everything on Legendary, but I haven't tried the ending yet - that Tartarus guy is a pain in the butt to kill on Legendary from what I've seen my brother attempt.
     
ort888
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Dec 21, 2004, 10:37 AM
 
Originally posted by jcadam:
Yes, but is it the right kind of harder?

What I mean is, does the computer increase the difficulty by increasing the quantity of bad guys, or the # of shots needed to take one down (wrong way), or it does it actually increase the quality of the AI (right way).

Most FPS become easy once you figure out how the (usually simplistic) AI operates (i.e., patterns)
No, it's the wrong kind of hard. While the bad guys are smarter (and tougher) they made the game challanging by making you weaker. You can pump a clip and a half of ammo into an elite and he'll turn around and waste you in 2 seconds. It's annoying. The marines that run about and help you can actually take more shots than you can. It's pretty cheesy.

I beat the game on heroic, but have no desire to try on legendary.
( Last edited by ort888; Dec 21, 2004 at 11:13 AM. )

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Luca Rescigno
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Dec 21, 2004, 10:49 AM
 
If I were to try it on Legendary, I'd probably eventually give up once I got to a boss battle. Those are stupid and I have no desire to defeat a "boss" (sheesh, just the word is ridiculous) on the highest difficulty. I wish you could just skip 'em like cutscenes.

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threestain
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Dec 21, 2004, 11:18 AM
 
You should try Ikaruga - hardest game bar none.
     
ort888
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Dec 21, 2004, 11:34 AM
 
I love Ikaruga. I used to be able to get to the level 4 boss without having to continue but from there it got messy. Now my skills are all gone. Whats really scary are the people who can play it AND get chaining combos to beef up their score. Thats's nuts. There are a lot of "perfect run" Ikaruga videos online and they are insane.

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Dec 21, 2004, 12:39 PM
 
The AI in Halo 2 is the best I have ever seen. They are seriously smart little bastards.
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PJW
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Dec 21, 2004, 12:49 PM
 
If you're having trouble getting past the hangar levels, here's some advice. The weapons you should be using are plasma pistol and battle rifle. To clear out those hangar areas, you need to take down all of the Grunts first. This makes it a lot easier to kill the Elites, since the Grunts can do nasty things like chunk plasma grenades while you're not looking (and they NEVER miss). Always go for headshots on the Grunts, since you can waste close to a clip of ammo by shooting them in the body.

Then, charge up the plasma pistol and fire at one elite. While the charged-up plasma blast is heading towards the Elite, quickly switch to the battle rifle and take it out with a headshot as soon as the plasma blast hits it. Don't wait too long or the Elite will simply hide and recharge.

If you're still having trouble with this, don't forget that you don't always have to run around. Try walking while crouched to sneak up on an Elite and tag them with a plasma grenade, or bash them in the back of the head with a melee attack.

Don't worry about having trouble on this level. The first two levels in this game are some of the hardest on Legendary. You'll love it when you meet the jackal snipers in the next level.
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nforcer
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Dec 21, 2004, 01:37 PM
 
Originally posted by ort888:
No, it's the wrong kind of hard. While the bad guys are smarter (and tougher) they made the game challanging by making you weaker. You can pump a clip and a half of ammo into an elite and he'll turn around and waste you in 2 seconds. It's annoying. The marines that run about and help you can actually take more shots than you can. It's pretty cheesy.

I beat the game on heroic, but have no desire to try on legendary.
I agree. It is extremely annoying that a marine with almost no armor can take several shots from an enemy sniper on legendary, yet if you get hit in the toe from that same sniper, you die instantly. It's also annoying how much more damage enemies can take, where you pump entire clips into them and nothing happens.

What they should have done is kept weapon damage and enemy health constant for all difficulty levels, and instead tweaked AI-related things, like enemy reaction-time, accuracy, field of view, distance vision, etc. Then it simply would be harder to run up to people in the open and kill them or pull off risky beatdown moves, but it would keep the ridiculousness and annoyingness to a minimum. Every time they change damage and health rates, you have to relearn how many particular shots of something and where the shots must be applied to kill an enemy, and how many hits you can take.

My friend and I have been playing legendary co op, which is, in my opinion, the hardest way to play that game. There are more enemies, and if just one player dies, both go back to the last checkpoint. Over the course of a few afternoons, we managed to get to the 3rd to the last level (Uprising) and were about halfway through it when we just lost all motivation to play. As it stands now, legendary is too much of a trial and error experience that confines player choice by having enemies that are overwhelmingly hard to take down and able to kill you all too quickly.

I like a good challenge, but when you are challenged by basically having the computer "cheat", it becomes kind of pointless to do.
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Disgruntled Head of C-3PO
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Dec 21, 2004, 01:46 PM
 
So how does that last "boss" get any harder on legendary?
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scaught
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Dec 21, 2004, 01:54 PM
 
Originally posted by ort888:
I love Ikaruga. I used to be able to get to the level 4 boss without having to continue but from there it got messy. Now my skills are all gone. Whats really scary are the people who can play it AND get chaining combos to beef up their score. Thats's nuts. There are a lot of "perfect run" Ikaruga videos online and they are insane.
http://ikaruga.co.uk/download/an/ch4.php

ikaruga video for DL there. 57MB avi file. plays in mplayer.

pretty sick stuff.
     
UNTeMac  (op)
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Dec 21, 2004, 03:40 PM
 
Originally posted by PJW:
If you're having trouble getting past the hangar levels, here's some advice.<snip>
Yeah, I figured out the plasma pistol/battle rifle combo when it thought about a similarly effective combo from Halo 1. My problem is that there are so damned many elites and they're smart enough to outflank you in a second. Grr....it's gonna be heroic for awhile methinks.
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Dec 21, 2004, 03:59 PM
 

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UNTeMac  (op)
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Dec 21, 2004, 04:28 PM
 
Originally posted by ort888:
It's soooo easy. See.

http://files2.bungie.org/CMCairoSpeed.mov
Not bad...but I don't think that's legendary... I know there's another wave of covenant in that pre "Athens" hangar fight.
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Disgruntled Head of C-3PO
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Dec 21, 2004, 05:07 PM
 
Originally posted by ort888:
It's soooo easy. See.

http://files2.bungie.org/CMCairoSpeed.mov
My lord I almost got turned on watching that!
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ort888
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Dec 21, 2004, 05:43 PM
 
Originally posted by UNTiMac:
Not bad...but I don't think that's legendary... I know there's another wave of covenant in that pre "Athens" hangar fight.
It sure doesn't seem like Legendary to me either, what with the ease he tears through everyone, but at the beginning of the video he clearly chooses legendary when selecting the difficulty. Watch it again.

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UNTeMac  (op)
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Dec 21, 2004, 11:42 PM
 
Originally posted by ort888:
It sure doesn't seem like Legendary to me either, what with the ease he tears through everyone, but at the beginning of the video he clearly chooses legendary when selecting the difficulty. Watch it again.
Wow..ok. Just watched it on my mom's emac vs. my older iMac and the video is much cleaner. It is legendary because the shield recharge rate matches the one on Legendary in the actual game. Pretty amazing play. I learned a lot from it though.
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